::: Lori ::: Excess Lipase Questions

MrsNicole&Brian808

Hi Lori!  I suspect my BM has excess lipase in it!  For months now, I just thought LO didn't like drinking from a bottle.  If I'm out, he'll only manage to choke down about an ounce before completely refusing the bottle.  Since I am home with him for a year, he really never needed to take stored BM so it wasn't really a big deal.  Today, we were going to a funeral and I decided to defrost some frozen BM last night and take a bottle with me, in case I couldn't nurse him.

The BM I defrosted was from November, so about 4 months ago.  I decided to sniff it to see how it smelled and it smelled soapy.  I stuck my finger in it and gave it a taste and it was awful!  I'm wondering if all of my frozen BM tastes that way!

I think I'll defrost some milk I froze last week and see how it tastes to confirm that I have excess lipase.

What did you do with your frozen stash when you found out you had excess lipase?  Did you just throw it all out?!  And whenever you pump, do you scald your milk even before refrigerating it?  Does the hot milk go straight into storage bottles (plastic?) and then straight into the refrigerator?  Or straight into the freezer?  I go back to work in October.  I'm not sure if we'll still be BF'ing by then, but it's something for me to keep in mind.  I might need to take a hotplate to work or something since we don't have a kitchen at my office.  TIA!

MrsNicole&Brian808

One more question (sorry there are so many!): Do you warm your BM to a certain temperature? For a certain length of time? How do you know when it's "scalded"?

vanilla15

it is funny you asked this b/c I was thinking the same thing this morning.  LO will take bottles (fresh or frozen) but I find the frozen ones smell & taste awful.  I have been using fresh milk for her bottles but taking the frozen milk out for mixing with cereal.  I am using the frozen milk from early january so just 3 months and to me, they just seem yucky.  I guess I am lucky b/c LO is a piglet and will eat whatever we give her, but I was wondering if it was the excess lipase giving it that taste & smell.

mrspresley

i'm sure Lori will chime in w/lots of help and answers to your specific Qs but here's a helpful link that I used when i was trying to figure out if I had the same problem or if she just hated bottles (turns out she just hated bottles!)

 

MauiWedding08

vanilla15:

I guess I am lucky b/c LO is a piglet and will eat whatever we give her, but I was wondering if it was the excess lipase giving it that taste & smell.

Just wanted to let you know that J is like this too.  Some batches were worse than others but he would take them no matter what so I let it be after finding numerous online sources that said it was ok (making sure of course that the milk wasn't actually "spoiled" but I knew I handed all mine in strict accordance with the storing guidelines) and running it by my friend's mom that is a hospital LC.

Even recently I unfroze some that was nearing the 3mo mark (since I don't pump much anymore) to see if he would take it b/c I have 2 work trips coming in the next couple of weeks.  Yep, slurped it down and when I smelled his shirt after he dripped some it was pretty soapy. 

Married2MrWright

Hi, sorry for chiming in late...I've been UBER busy with work projects!

What did you do with your frozen stash when you found out you had excess lipase?  Did you just throw it all out?! 

Yes, I dumped mine. I only had about 40 oz. at that point. Some babies will take the "off" milk w/out issues...others wil take it stired into food, so some mamas keep it and use it anyway. 

And whenever you pump, do you scald your milk even before refrigerating it?  Does the hot milk go straight into storage bottles (plastic?) and then straight into the refrigerator?  Or straight into the freezer?

Yes, all pumped milk gets heat treated. Usually, i heat in on the stove in a 1 L Corningware Visions pot (it's Pyrex glass and has a handy pour spout...I got it on eBay for $20). I heat it to 170 F, using a digital food thermometer I got from Target for $5. Then I pour it into a clean Medela bottle and pop it in the fridge. Once it's cooled, Libby will take it in a cup when I am away. If there's more than she'll drink in a 5-6 day period in the fridge, it goes into Lanisoh freezer bags in the fridge. Libby won't drink previously frozen BM, even if it's been scalded, but the adopted baby I've been donating my frozen milk to takes it just fine.

I go back to work in October.  I'm not sure if we'll still be BF'ing by then, but it's something for me to keep in mind.  I might need to take a hotplate to work or something since we don't have a kitchen at my office.  TIA!

When I am traveling I use a Rival Hotpot (32 oz) to heat my milk...I got it from Walgreen's for $15. Thankfully, I've always had access to a refrigerator, but if not, you can use ice to cool the scalded milk.

Here's two links that helped me:

https://www.kellymom.com/bf/pumping/lipase-expressedmilk.html

and

https://forums.llli.org/showthread.php?t=297&page=4

On this second one, some mom's have had good luck scalding their milk using a Munchkin Bottle Warmer. I tried it and it only got my milk to 160 F and that wasn't hot enough to kill off the lipase. For my milk, 170 F is the magic number. You can experiment with yours...some say 160 F works, some need 165 F or 170 F. As long as you don't go over 180 F, it's fine.

MrsNicole&Brian808

Thanks for the input everyone!  I've already checked out the Kelly Mom and LLLI links before and found the info to be helpful.

I think we've confirmed that my milk tastes awful.  Both MH and I tasted previously frozen milk from November and another batch from last week.  We compared it with freshly expressed BM so we know how it should taste.  I gagged big time after tasting the previously frozen milk.  It has a really spoiled aftertaste.    I'll try offering LO freshly expressed milk in a bottle and see if he'll take.  It could be that he just doesn't like the bottle, as well.

MrsZiz

MrsNicole&Brian808:

I think we've confirmed that my milk tastes awful.  Both MH and I tasted previously frozen milk from November and another batch from last week.  We compared it with freshly expressed BM so we know how it should taste.  I gagged big time after tasting the previously frozen milk.  It has a really spoiled aftertaste.    I'll try offering LO freshly expressed milk in a bottle and see if he'll take.  It could be that he just doesn't like the bottle, as well.

My frozen milk always smelled and tasted awful to me too and to Ryan. Yep we all tested it out I always offered Bella fresh milk first when I had it but since I only work 3 days a week, there were many days, I didn't have fresh milk on hand. She would take the frozen stuff though and we ended up using all of it. We did have bottle issues too though. 

Does anyone know if you had excess lipase once, will you always have it? I'm curious to hear/read about this... I will start pumping once DS is 4-6 weeks old to get a freezer stash started.  

Married2MrWright

MrsZiz:

MrsNicole&Brian808:

I think we've confirmed that my milk tastes awful.  Both MH and I tasted previously frozen milk from November and another batch from last week.  We compared it with freshly expressed BM so we know how it should taste.  I gagged big time after tasting the previously frozen milk.  It has a really spoiled aftertaste.    I'll try offering LO freshly expressed milk in a bottle and see if he'll take.  It could be that he just doesn't like the bottle, as well.

My frozen milk always smelled and tasted awful to me too and to Ryan. Yep we all tested it out I always offered Bella fresh milk first when I had it but since I only work 3 days a week, there were many days, I didn't have fresh milk on hand. She would take the frozen stuff though and we ended up using all of it. We did have bottle issues too though. 

Does anyone know if you had excess lipase once, will you always have it? I'm curious to hear/read about this... I will start pumping once DS is 4-6 weeks old to get a freezer stash started.  

I have no idea. I also have no idea what causes it. That said, you can do a little test...pump milk and leave some on the counter and some in the fridge. Taste test it every hour (both batches) and once it turns, notate how long it took. For me, it took about 2 hours on the counter and 4 in the fridge. That's how I knew I needed to scald right after pumping. Some moms can pump all day at work and then take their milk home and scald it in one big batch. Everyone is different. After the next baby, I'll test my milk again...I expect I'll still have excess lipase (which is fine for baby, it helps them digest the fats in your milk) and if so, know what to do before we introduce the bottle (I think that's where we may have gone wrong with Libby...giving her "off" milk by bottle probably killed it for her).

Nicole -- if you cannot get Hank to take a bottle, you can always give him milk by cup. That's what we've been doing for Libby since she was about 8 weeks old. There's a video on my blog, if you're curious to see how J did it with her. The good thing is we never had to wean from a bottle, she's always used a cup. And now, at 14 months is very good at it...we don't use sippys or straws, just small cups. She has a few acrylic ones and one enameled metal one with a handle that are perfect for her toddler hands.

MrsNicole&Brian808

Married2MrWright:

.... you can do a little test...pump milk and leave some on the counter and some in the fridge. Taste test it every hour (both batches) and once it turns, notate how long it took. For me, it took about 2 hours on the counter and 4 in the fridge.

Great idea.  I'll do this and see how it goes.

Lori, did you notice that your "off" milk looks any different?  I pumped some milk for Hank earlier this week to thin out his baby food.  I know the fat separates from the whey portion of the milk and you just swirl to recombine it, but after a few days, the whey portion started looking really watery and the fat wasn't mixing back with it very well.  Weird.

Married2MrWright:

Nicole -- if you cannot get Hank to take a bottle, you can always give him milk by cup. That's what we've been doing for Libby since she was about 8 weeks old. There's a video on my blog, if you're curious to see how J did it with her. The good thing is we never had to wean from a bottle, she's always used a cup. And now, at 14 months is very good at it...we don't use sippys or straws, just small cups. She has a few acrylic ones and one enameled metal one with a handle that are perfect for her toddler hands.

I checked out your video!  I'll definitely give it a shot.  We have some Avent bottles (which he took just fine w/stored BM in the early weeks) and I think the caps will work.  I also bookmarked a few websites with tips for cup-feeding.  We have a hard time nursing in public. I can never get Hank into a good position and he's always so distracted.  Being able to bottle or cup feed will make outings so much easier!

MrsNicole&Brian808

Married2MrWright:

.... you can do a little test...pump milk and leave some on the counter and some in the fridge. Taste test it every hour (both batches) and once it turns, notate how long it took. For me, it took about 2 hours on the counter and 4 in the fridge.

Great idea.  I'll do this and see how it goes.

Lori, did you notice that your "off" milk looks any different?  I pumped some milk for Hank earlier this week to thin out his baby food.  I know the fat separates from the whey portion of the milk and you just swirl to recombine it, but after a few days, the whey portion started looking really watery and the fat wasn't mixing back with it very well.  Weird.

Married2MrWright:

Nicole -- if you cannot get Hank to take a bottle, you can always give him milk by cup. That's what we've been doing for Libby since she was about 8 weeks old. There's a video on my blog, if you're curious to see how J did it with her. The good thing is we never had to wean from a bottle, she's always used a cup. And now, at 14 months is very good at it...we don't use sippys or straws, just small cups. She has a few acrylic ones and one enameled metal one with a handle that are perfect for her toddler hands.

I checked out your video!  I'll definitely give it a shot.  We have some Avent bottles (which he took just fine w/stored BM in the early weeks) and I think the caps will work.  I also bookmarked a few websites with tips for cup-feeding.  We have a hard time nursing in public. I can never get Hank into a good position and he's always so distracted.  Being able to bottle or cup feed will make outings so much easier!