Clicky: Do you support same sex marriage?

praline

And one more post, because this is very relavent to our conversation:

If we decide to make ourselves anti-religious, we will only lose.

But religious communities must be challenged too. I was in Jerusalem a couple of years ago for Gay Pride. All the leaders of religious communities -- Muslim, Jew and Christian -- were brought together by their mutual animosity toward gay activism to protest the parade. There was the grand patriarch of the Eastern churches, the high rabbi of Jerusalem, the Roman Catholic archbishop, the mullahs, and they were all united in one cause. The police outnumbered the parade participants. One marcher was attacked and stabbed by an Orthodox Jew.

We have to be very clear about male violence within the monotheistic religions. This is a failure within churches and we can't be casual about it. But we can't be casual about the importance of religion either. We need to be both respectful of religion and critical of religion. Otherwise I suspect we won't get very far at all.

kellnbri

If anyone watched Oprah yesterday they had 200 men that had been sexually abused and some of those men were abused by priests.  The last segment with the woman whose husband had recently passed away is actually an old neighbor of mine.  But in that show they talked about how sexual orientation develops around 4 or 5 years old.  This is not something that people just one day wake up and say "hey I think I'm going to be gay!"  They are born with it, just like they are born with any other differences.  Those that oppose gay marriage, do you also oppose interracial marriage?? 

Zenya

PMQ:

Their views on this and many, many other issues is what caused me to leave the Catholic church at a young age and not associate myself with ANY organized religion since. I absolutely respect those of you who stay, hoping to affect change, but I honestly couldn't be bothered.

I left the catholic church partly for that reason, too (and also of course, church sanctioned child abuse ).

goodheartedmommy

I'm pretty sure I got this from this board, but it's something I posted on FB awhile back:

 

12 reasons gay marriage should not be allowed:

1. Homosexuality is not natural, much like eyeglasses, polyester, and birth control.

2. Heterosexual marriages are valid because they produce children. Infertile couples and old people can't legally get married because the world needs more children.

3. Obviously gay parents will raise gay children, since straight parents only raise straight children.

4. Straight marriage will be less meaningful, since Britney Spears' 55-hour just-for-fun marriage was meaningful.

5. Heterosexual marriage has been around a long time and hasn't changed at all; women are property, blacks can't marry whites, and divorce is illegal.

6. Gay marriage should be decided by people not the courts, because the majority-elected legislatures, not courts, have historically protected the rights of the minorities.

7. Gay marriage is not supported by religion. In a theocracy like ours, the values of one religion are imposed on the entire country. That's why we have only one religion in America.

8. Gay marriage will encourage people to be gay, in the same way that hanging around tall people will make you tall.

9. Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to all kinds of crazy behavior. People may even wish to marry their pets because a dog has legal standing and can sign a marriage contract.

10. Children can never succeed without a male and a female role model at home. That's why single parents are forbidden to raise children.

11. Gay marriage will change the foundation of society. Heterosexual marriage has been around for a long time, and we could never adapt to new social norms like we haven't adapted to things like cars or longer lifespans.

12. Civil unions, providing most of the same benefits as marriage with a different name are better, because a "separate but equal" institution is always constitutional. Separate schools for African-Americans worked just as well as separate marriages for gays and lesbians will. 

shopgirl78

I've typed a long reply twice and its been eaten.  Here is the shortened version since I have wasted so much time on this...

I have not voted.  I have swayed on this issue a couple of times.  

Ideologically,  I agree with gay marriage.  There is a lot riding on this: being able to make final life decisions for one's partner, and putting each other on their insurance, etc...

Legislatively, I may or may not agree depending on wording (I would want no open interpretations), costs (you guys know I am Republican!), etc.

I am appalled by some of the attacks on here!  YOU ARE NOT HELPING!   I am also appalled by some of the idiocracy within the same ideology of mine...I beginning to think some live or at least think in a hole! 

I do think gay marriage will be our future.  There was progress between CA prop 8 and CA prop 22. Don't discount that!    I think that even so, there will always be bigotry and homophobia.   Therefore, I don't think legislation will be the be all and end all. 

A few things for those wanting to attack:  I am very educated, I am religious, and my parents have an alternate lifestyle (although not gay).   

 

 

 

 

goodheartedmommy

Shopgirl, I've admitted before I consider myself fiscally conservative, but my social beliefs are so much stronger than my fiscal beliefs that it's "too hell with money" when it comes to something like equal rights. I vote against those fiscally conservative beliefs quite often, because the social right is so much more important (and we're not just talking same sex marriage here). That just doesn't make much sense. Sorry, guys, it's just too expensive to make it where everyone have equal rights, so we just don't do it? WTF? Am I missing your point here?

shopgirl78

goodheartedmommy:

Shopgirl, I've admitted before I consider myself fiscally conservative, but my social beliefs are so much stronger than my fiscal beliefs that it's "too hell with money" when it comes to something like equal rights. I vote against those fiscally conservative beliefs quite often, because the social right is so much more important (and we're not just talking same sex marriage here). That just doesn't make much sense. Sorry, guys, it's just too expensive to make it where everyone have equal rights, so we just don't do it? WTF? Am I missing your point here?

Not that we don't do it but do it a different, more economical way.  I would have chosen the same thing with health care...what I am saying is that I am not going to jump on the first draft just because it gets the job done...

ETA:  I have no idea what all costs could be associated (it was just an example of things I might vote against) but knowing our govn't they'd attach panels and this and that...who knows, the act of gays marrying doesn't effect me personally however the deficit worries me...

Heck, it might be the thing to revive our economy...no one knows the total consequences...