Stressing

surfergirlkona

Ok, I will do a follie update later today or tomorrow.  But... at my u/s today, we still have 4 mature and potentially a 5th, but we are not counting on it.  DH & I planned on doing PGS testing.  My peoples at the RE office are sort of trying to say that maybe it isn't the best thing to do in our situation.  The risk of damaging what does fertilize out of the four is possible and could leave us with nothing in the end.  PGS could leave us with nothing in the end.  The argument is that our families have no disease history and we have had a single early loss, which they chalk up to bad luck.  So all in all, I am starting to look at it as if we happened to conceive naturally, obviously nature would take it's course for good or bad - do we take that chance with IVF and just move straight to transfer without testing?  My RE was not in today and we will be seeing him tomorrow to discuss further.  I am 100% torn in two directions at this point.  I just want a baby.  Thoughts to share?

csquared426

I don't have any thoughts on the situation, but I just wanted to say Good Luck!

Clerk9

Oh boy.  That's a rock & a hard place.

I would definitely see if the RE can give you some stats to help you out (like what percentage of tested embryos become damaged, etc.).  In the absence of that information, I guess you're just left to imagine the different worst-case-scenario outcomes (testing--> no healthy embies to transfer vs. not testing --> unhealthy embie after transfer).  I'd see which if these awful scenarios feels "worse" to me & DH.  But my stomach is turning just thinking of having to make that decision.  

((BIG HUGS))   

Are you at a point where you may get more mature follies?  (I haven't gone through IVF, so please forgive me if this is a stupid question.)  And, if I may provide you with a puppies & rainbows moment, it DOES only take one to make a baby!!!  

You're in my thoughts...best wishes & best of luck... 

damabo80

What are your E2 levels? Do each of the 4/5 have an egg in them?

If I was making that choice, I would probably opt to not test, and then have them put back 2 or 3.

Gummybear

I personally would not do the PGD (I think this is what you mean?). Our clinic does the biopsy on day 3, and we always agreed that we would want 6 viable embies on that day. Our situation is a bit different, as our odds were 50/50 for being affected/not tx.

My reasoning is this. The PGD is way more expensive, as it culturing the embryos an extra 2 days. Are you doing ICSI automatically? If you are doing PGD you will probably HAVE to do ICSI, which again is an added expense.

I guess I would rather just go for it. It would be nice to avoid the extra two days waiting for tx. which are horrific and then, of course, waiting to hear if you have any good ones to tx. I can tell you that waiting to hear if there any any good ones on day 5 is THE WORST. And from personal experience, finding out you have nothing to tx. after all that time and money is the worst possible outcome, for me, worse than BFN and m/c of an IVF cycle. You feel like you don't even get in the game.

If ICSI/no ICSI doesn't have to be decided after ER, maybe wait to day 3 to see how many they'd be able to biopsy? If you have all five looking good, maybe it will be an easier decision to do the PGD?

I am thinking of you. We had to make this choice for IVF #4 and we chose to freeze and batch for testing (we had 5 embies). it's the worst. ((hugs))

surfergirlkona

damabo80:

What are your E2 levels? Do each of the 4/5 have an egg in them?

If I was making that choice, I would probably opt to not test, and then have them put back 2 or 3.

waiting for my levels call back, but they have been right on.  It sucks being old  

surfergirlkona

Clerk9:

Are you at a point where you may get more mature follies?  

Not a stupid question at all.  I am the end of my stim round.  Today they said I may have the ER on Saturday, this will be decided tomorrow morning.   

Pixiestx

My 2 cents - I would proceed without testing for fear there would be nothing that made it to transfer.  I think never even getting a chance to get pg after going through the process would be too frustrating b/c I would think what if those were healthy embryos.  If you had numerous losses I think it would be different.  Of course I hope your RE has a recommendation and can give you more information so you can make a decision you are confident about.  Good luck tomorrow!

bbhalphen

Honestly, I think I'm kind of inclined to agree with them that you might not want to do PGS.  Mine recommends it for me and I'm having a hard time making a decision because we don't know that it's chromosomal.  It's so much extra money.  I do think Clerk had a good idea about asking the RE about the stats of something going wrong.

momagain2009

Hi Kona-

I hope you don't mind that I keep posting over here, I'm really pulling for all of you so I like to check in to see what's going on.

I was in the exact same situation, I was a poor responder so we knew we would probably only get 5 or so out of the whole deal.  My RE talked me out of testing any of them because we didn't have any history of genetic disorders and only had the one early loss.  His plan was to put back everything that fertilized and not waste any on testing he felt wasn't really necessary.

DH and I mulled it over and decided that we would go with the RE's recommendation.  Good luck tomorrow!!!

surfergirlkona

Gummybear:

I personally would not do the PGD (I think this is what you mean?). Our clinic does the biopsy on day 3, and we always agreed that we would want 6 viable embies on that day. Our situation is a bit different, as our odds were 50/50 for being affected/not tx.

My reasoning is this. The PGD is way more expensive, as it culturing the embryos an extra 2 days. Are you doing ICSI automatically? If you are doing PGD you will probably HAVE to do ICSI, which again is an added expense.

I guess I would rather just go for it. It would be nice to avoid the extra two days waiting for tx. which are horrific and then, of course, waiting to hear if you have any good ones to tx. I can tell you that waiting to hear if there any any good ones on day 5 is THE WORST. And from personal experience, finding out you have nothing to tx. after all that time and money is the worst possible outcome, for me, worse than BFN and m/c of an IVF cycle. You feel like you don't even get in the game.

If ICSI/no ICSI doesn't have to be decided after ER, maybe wait to day 3 to see how many they'd be able to biopsy? If you have all five looking good, maybe it will be an easier decision to do the PGD?

I am thinking of you. We had to make this choice for IVF #4 and we chose to freeze and batch for testing (we had 5 embies). it's the worst. ((hugs))

Thank you for your input.  We are doing PGD for aneuploidy (or in other words PGS) which isn't the big PGD testing for specific genetic diseases. It still goes on the same protocol of day 3 biopsy with a 24 hour turn around and transfer on day 5.  The reasonings behind this for us is age factor, I am almost 39 and DH is 43.  There really isn't much else driving this other then one unexplained loss.  This is an extra cost of $1800 to us.  

It is undecided at to ICSI, but I am going to ask when RE calls this afternoon.  DH has excellent swimmers, but I don't think that matters in the whole scheme of this.  I assumed it would be part of the deal with testing too.

I appreciate all your points.  I am already starting to stress out and it is only going to get worse as this progresses.  Thank you again. 

babes12

i have no words of advice but wanted to wish you a stress free decision.  GL!!! 

surfergirlkona

momagain2009:

Hi Kona-

I hope you don't mind that I keep posting over here, I'm really pulling for all of you so I like to check in to see what's going on.

I was in the exact same situation, I was a poor responder so we knew we would probably only get 5 or so out of the whole deal.  My RE talked me out of testing any of them because we didn't have any history of genetic disorders and only had the one early loss.  His plan was to put back everything that fertilized and not waste any on testing he felt wasn't really necessary.

DH and I mulled it over and decided that we would go with the RE's recommendation.  Good luck tomorrow!!!

Of course not!  You are always welcome here. 

Everyone's input is helping to put me at ease.  Thank you all for sharing your thoughts.  These are stressful and difficult decisions to make.  DH is just eh ok whatever. 

butterfly843

Sending hugs and good luck your way. I would talk it over with the RE tomorrow and see what he says. I would probably not do the pgs testing because of the risk of having none at the end of the testing.

ColindaP

My RE only recommends PGS/PGD if there is a known hereditary disease you need to exclude or a known translocation, for the very reason that ANY unnecessary manipulation of the embryo (and in particular removing a cell from it) damages it, and he feels it's not worth the risk unless it's a known problem being tested for. My eggs are _shit and he does not recommend it for me. The ones that won't make it, won't make it, and PGD/PGS can't change that.

ERICA21779

surfergirlkona:

momagain2009:

Hi Kona-

I hope you don't mind that I keep posting over here, I'm really pulling for all of you so I like to check in to see what's going on.

I was in the exact same situation, I was a poor responder so we knew we would probably only get 5 or so out of the whole deal.  My RE talked me out of testing any of them because we didn't have any history of genetic disorders and only had the one early loss.  His plan was to put back everything that fertilized and not waste any on testing he felt wasn't really necessary.

DH and I mulled it over and decided that we would go with the RE's recommendation.  Good luck tomorrow!!!

Of course not!  You are always welcome here. 

Everyone's input is helping to put me at ease.  Thank you all for sharing your thoughts.  These are stressful and difficult decisions to make.  DH is just eh ok whatever. 

 

Gotta love that response, I can totally relate.  Kona, I have to say, given all this information I would opt for doing the transfer without the testing based on your low risk, but it's just another opinion and I can't imagine how tough it is trying to come up with a definitive answer.  I hope talking to your RE tomorrow puts your mind at ease about whichever decision you make.  ((((hugs))))

mdm2137

I really don't have any advice, but wanted to wish you luck with your decision.

rjl07

I don't know much about it, but I would be inclined to skip it since you have no known risk factors.  GL with your decision - it sucks that you have even more stress added to this process.

KelinandKevin

I thought about this for a little while and if it were me I would proceed without testing.  Hopefully you have some more follies show up by the time your ready for your ER.  I will be sending positive thoughts to you.  Oh - and I sent you a FB message.

Orchard27

I have no personal experience, but I have a friend going through her 5th IVF.  They had been doing PGD for each cycle, but aren't for this one because they are losing so many embryos each time.  They are testing for a specific genetic d/o, but the docs think they're losing so many because they don't really like to be poked. 

It's a really hard decision and I wish you all the best.

lunatwo

Coming in late on this but I had this same exact situation.  I know you already got a lot of similar responses but I wanted to add that the reason we were planning to do testing was so that we would pick the very best embies to put back in there.  But since I only ended up with 1 fertilized for IVF#1 and 2 fertilized for IVF#2, really what's the point?  I had nothing to choose from and they are better off back in your ute so we put them all back. I think most RE's recommend to skip testing unless you have a lot to choose from and you can be picky.  The best thing to do is not to worry about it because if there is an issue, most likely nature will not allow it to continue anyway.

GL Kona!  I am so excited for you!!  I will be looking constantly for updates!

jcath

I can only tell you from my experience but I would forgo the PGD assuming you only get 3 or 4.  I had 16 retrieved, 11 were mature, only 6 fertilized with ICSI and I only have 1 that survived the wait and the freeze.  That's some pretty big numbers getting small really quickly.  If you get 3 or 4 fertilized that will be plenty for a fresh transfer. My Dr recommended the PGD b/c I've had two miscarriage (one second trimester) and b/c prior to this I have not had a problem getting pregnant - he's worried about my egg quality.