s/o: what if educating the parents doesn't fix the issue?

summerbrideDC

A lot of people say that they think the parents in the case below just need some sort of education.  I personally have a hard time believing that they don't know that feeding their child crap 24/7 isn't good for her.  

So what if the parents are given all kinds of education about nutrition, healthy eating habits, etc, and continue down this same path?

Given that there are no underlying medical conditions causing this girl's weight problem, what then?  I might be a cynic, but I don't think parents who are able to let their child get that heavy and suffer the health issues of high blood pressure and pre-diabetes are really all that interested in their child's well-being.

We are horrified when people beat or emotionally abuse their children, and expect them to be punished for the abuse. I dont' see how this is really any different (again, unless there is some medical condition that can explain it--then I think the parents need to address that issue or they are still neglectful and need to be dealt w/ accordingly).

kittycarr

I 100% agree with you.

bubu

I didn't read the OP you are talking about but I'm assuming it's the overweight 4 year old, I do agree that it is a form of child abuse. The parents should be held accountable.

Brideofranken

agree totally. Today driving home from the gym ( I could WALK, yeah, yeah...)

I saw a little girl at the bus stop eating the most enormous cookie- no biggie- except that she was 4-ish at most and was having trouble walking because of her weight. Like doing this laborious waddle...

it made me mad. I really think that it is a very seldomly recognized form of abuse. Girl didn't BUY herself that cookie.

AnnapolisLari

I agree with you up to a point. Sure, cookies + "fluffy" kids = dumb.

One of the major issues is money. Cheap food is frequently the most processed and bad for you. If the income is limited, the likelihood of that family's children being overweight is increased.

But fresh produce, lean meats, and whole grains don't come cheaply. It's one thing to KNOW that they are best, but when it comes to filling the bellies of the kids on $25 a week, cheap and high calorie are pretty much where it's at. And there are plenty of people whose grocery budgets are around that number.

 

summerbrideDC

AnnapolisLari:

I agree with you up to a point.

One of the major issues is money. Cheap food is frequently the most processed and bad for you. If the income is limited, the likelihood of that family's children being overweight is increased.

But fresh produce, lean meats, and whole grains don't come cheaply. It's one thing to KNOW that they are best, but when it comes to filling the bellies of the kids on $25 a week, cheap and high calorie are pretty much where it's at. And there are plenty of people whose grocery budgets are around that number.

I get what you're saying and agree to a point, but I don't think a 4 year old weighs 80lbs b/c she is living on ramen noodles and kraft mac and cheese at meal times.  I would imagine and 80lb 4 year old has to be exposed to a ton of junk food all the time--replacing some of that junk food and it's cost with a few fruits and vegetables would probably make a huge difference, kwim?   

 

Brideofranken

AnnapolisLari:

I agree with you up to a point. Sure, cookies + "fluffy" kids = dumb.

One of the major issues is money. Cheap food is frequently the most processed and bad for you. If the income is limited, the likelihood of that family's children being overweight is increased.

But fresh produce, lean meats, and whole grains don't come cheaply. It's one thing to KNOW that they are best, but when it comes to filling the bellies of the kids on $25 a week, cheap and high calorie are pretty much where it's at. And there are plenty of people whose grocery budgets are around that number.

 

I also agree with Lari- and it breaks my heart to think about this reality.

BUT- I still think that with effort nutritional basics can be met- but it does take effort- dude- I HATE cooking. it is WORK for me to properly feed my kids- but i do it, because I OWE them. But I hate it. I hate finding balanced foods to feed them 3 times a day! I hate worrying about what is in things, and what is the best choice- so I can see how someone less paranoid than me, or with less money, or with bigger things to worry about or other priorities- might not trouble themself with this- and when you start to see your child physically showing the consequence of this neglect- its time to get serious, I think.

I think that education should be available to break it down as simply as possible- with good meal plans and cheap ideas for people who need help feeding their children.

I would have liked a nice meal plan laid out for me when my kids started solids- I was lost!  We have a groove NOW- but it was a struggle for me to figure out what to give them, how much, when. Nursing was WAY easier!

AnnapolisLari

Some people can seriously not afford it.

Processed food + increased portion sizes + bad parental example + less PE in schools + many hours of TV a day = 82 lb 4 year olds.

https://kidshealth.org/parent/general/body/overweight_obesity.html#a_Causes_of_Overweight

You are a parent who is working lots of hours in a lousy paying job, and your kid is in a sketchy home daycare because that's all you can afford. Your caretaker is also feeding them cheap foods because that's how she can feed kids and still be affordable to the minimum wage earning mom. Kid is parked inside most of the day, because cheap daycares do not equal enriching educational opportunities and lots of exercise...

See where I am going?

DandelionMom

It would be best if the family would have to particiapte with social workers to provide a parenting plan involving exercise, diet, counseling, nutrition classes and things like WIC or other support.  I wonder does CPS do that?

Zenya

I'm going to guess that the food budget for two, 300+lb adults and an 82lb child is pretty significant and could easily be redistributed into healthy calories (although I totally get that crappy food is cheap and I'm not disputing that).

But there is no way they are too poor to be any thinner.  Addicted to junk food?  Yes.  That's a good possibility, I think.

But the sheer number of calories required to maintain that weight is enormous and expensive.  No matter how much ramen you're eating.

AnnapolisLari

DandelionMom:

It would be best if the family would have to particiapte with social workers to provide a parenting plan involving exercise, diet, counseling, nutrition classes and things like WIC or other support.  I wonder does CPS do that?

Sure. WIC provides classes and info on good nutrition. But go back to being that overworked minimum wage mom. Do you have the energy or inclination to go to a class? Or are you going to get a couple more hours of sleep, or God forbid, actually spend more time with your kids?

And there are a LOT of severely lazy people in this country who just don't care.

DandR

Oh, its easy to think that everyone in the world knows that fruit and veggies are the healthy option, but the truth is, not everyone knows that....SERIOUSLY.  There are dumb people when it comes to nutrition and mac and cheese, ramen noodles or hamburger helper are the staples.  Poptarts and Pepsi for breakfast, etc, etc. Snacks---some people think snacks = cookies.  My mom teaches kids who don't know what a pear is....never tried green beans, etc, etc.  A little bit of education for people like this could go a LONG way.....and would be worth a shot before removing kids from people who obviously love them, just don't know how to feed them.

 

AnnapolisLari

DandR, I agree with that part. While there are people who really are that ignorant of good nutrition, for the most part, I don't think that many of the ladies on this board have a true idea of how many, many families in this country live.

The level of poverty in some areas is genuinely like a 3rd world country. From the position of a $75-100K family income and access to Whole Foods and whatever, I don't think that Mrs.GenericBumpie can genuinely wrap their heads around the way the other half lives.

Some of my ex-students came from backgrounds that would make you vomit. I did some home visits to try and get to the bottom of some of the behavior issues, and I wanted to shower when I left their places.

It was very eye-opening.

Amanda&Chris

I agree with Lari and DandR.  No, it's not the situation for all overweight kids, but it is a very real situation.

Nutrition and health are a huge priority for me, but I have been that mom that Lari described.  I worked 3 minimum wage jobs and in the sometimes 15 min that I had to get DS from one daycare to the next and feed him dinner I didn't have the time or energy to make a balanced meal, or let's be honest, argue with him about eating it.  He would eat chicken nuggets that I could microwave in 60 seconds and put in tupperware for him to eat in the car, so that's what he ate.

Thankfully, he never had a weight problem, but he didn't eat well and he watched WAY too much TV.  I was just trying to survive and if someone had told me that I had to go to nutrition classes and do all of those things some of you are suggesting....  well, I would have had to choose between losing my kid and losing my house, I guess.

Now, my kids eat balanced meals, no HFCS, they exercise every day, but now I lead a pretty cushy life.  I'm a SAHM with time to research nutrition and ingredients.  Not everyone has that luxury.

kittycarr

AnnapolisLari:

DandR, I agree with that part. While there are people who really are that ignorant of good nutrition, for the most part, I don't think that many of the ladies on this board have a true idea of how many, many families in this country live.

The level of poverty in some areas is genuinely like a 3rd world country. From the position of a $75-100K family income and access to Whole Foods and whatever, I don't think that Mrs.GenericBumpie can genuinely wrap their heads around the way the other half lives.

Some of my ex-students came from backgrounds that would make you vomit. I did some home visits to try and get to the bottom of some of the behavior issues, and I wanted to shower when I left their places.

It was very eye-opening.

I agree with what you've said, but how many of those very young children were so obese they were about to step foot into their grave?  I think Zenya makes a very significant point that both the 300+ pound parents most likely have quite the expensive grocery bill and that with proper portions, Whole Foods can be where they shop and probably pay less.  I bet a bag of Romaine cost a lot less than five boxes of Ho Ho's.

DandR

yeah, there is a program here called Snack Pack, where they load up backpacks for children in extremely low income brackets bring home a backpack loaded with food and snacks for the weekend.  For most of those kids, its ALL they get to eat all weekend long.  They bring the back packs back to school on Monday and the following Friday it gets filled for them.  These kids get free breakfast and lunch at school M-F.  Most don't get dinners at home at night. 

AND--sad part--(I helped with this program)---the "snacks"...there was a piece or two of fresh fruit, and a couple of the canned fruit cups, but then it was the little single serve cans of Chef BoyRDee (sp??), crackers, fruit snacks, juice boxes, etc...stuff that my kids get (well, not "chef" boyrdee) for treats...not as their entire diet all weekend long......

BUT--without that, the kids wouldn't eat ANYTHING!!!!  Soo, whats worse----feeding them junk that this program could afford and provide??? Or nothing??

Soooo----then you have adults who were raised like that...only ate junk their whole life, but maybe never were "morbidly" obses...but they don't know how to eat fruit or veggies.....and they have money to afford food and thats all they buy.....

AnnapolisLari

Quite a lot of them were overweight. Some pretty seriously.

 

Zenya

Amanda&Chris:

I agree with Lari and DandR.  No, it's not the situation for all overweight kids, but it is a very real situation.

Nutrition and health are a huge priority for me, but I have been that mom that Lari described.  I worked 3 minimum wage jobs and in the sometimes 15 min that I had to get DS from one daycare to the next and feed him dinner I didn't have the time or energy to make a balanced meal, or let's be honest, argue with him about eating it.  He would eat chicken nuggets that I could microwave in 60 seconds and put in tupperware for him to eat in the car, so that's what he ate.

Thankfully, he never had a weight problem, but he didn't eat well and he watched WAY too much TV.  I was just trying to survive and if someone had told me that I had to go to nutrition classes and do all of those things some of you are suggesting....  well, I would have had to choose between losing my kid and losing my house, I guess.

Now, my kids eat balanced meals, no HFCS, they exercise every day, but now I lead a pretty cushy life.  I'm a SAHM with time to research nutrition and ingredients.  Not everyone has that luxury.

My guess is though that you wouldn't have fed him 20 chicken nuggets or an entire box of mac and cheese followed by some ho hos, KWIM?  Let's not forget the sheer VOLUME of food that goes into maintaining such a massive weight.

JoyGotDots

summerbrideDC:

A lot of people say that they think the parents in the case below just need some sort of education.  I personally have a hard time believing that they don't know that feeding their child crap 24/7 isn't good for her.  

I agree with you.  I think the education needs to come in the form of parenting.  Are they overfeeding their child because they don't know what to do when Johnny starts having a fit because he wants to eat 5 ho hos and giving in is "easier" and makes him happy?    Most parents who make poor decisions want to be good parents and want their kids to be happy, they just don't know how to get there.