Circumcision

Telyco

They just did a little story on the Today Show about it. What does everyone think about this? Did you have it done, do you plan on having it done?

They said 55% of Americans have it done (in addition to the Jewish and Muslim cultures). Which is down from 90% in the 70s.

We had it done...I wasn't opposed to it (for the reduced cancer and STD risks) and basically left the final decision to DH. He had the typical "I want DS to look like me" response, which I think is sorta stupid. I never sat and compared Vs with my mom. We also talked about which is more "attractive".

What do you think?

mrsoc

We ended up not having it done. I left it up to my DH too.  He did some research on it, and found that removal of the foreskin, removes a large portion of the sensation for sexual pleasure.  We figured that it was not a necessary procedure.  I definitely believe that it is a personal choice for parents and there are pros and cons to both sides of things. 

On a light note, we were at the OB/GYN about a week after delivery (which is when my office would perform it) and the receptionist asked us if it was "his big day" and we said that we were not having it done.  She said that she understood, even though her nephew who was not circ. got an infection when he was 2 and she had her 2 boys circ. , that it was like cutting the tail off of a dog.   DH and I thought that was a interesting way of looking at it....

MrsWhiteonWhiteSt

I'm so glad you posted this- I just was watching it! The guy who was like "baby plastic surgery is horrible, I hope my son doesn't hold this against me". I'll be 100% honest- we did it b/c it's the norm and it looks better. I am a little weirded out by the look of uncirc. penises. Our Dr said that Justin had his paci and barely fussed- I don't think it's "genital mutilation" like someone said on the today show.

jewelsonu

We had it done.  Never really considered not having it done. I missed that segment on the Today show since we were watching Mickey Mouse.

day194

We had it done.  I also left it up to DH.  I didn't have a strong opinion either way.  I saw the pros and cons on both sides. 

Cutemin

We didn't do it.  When I first brought it up to DH, he asked why wouldn't we?  I asked he why we should??  His first concern was that DS would 'look' different from other men, I shared with him that it was about 50/50 these days so he would be different from about half the boys which ever way we went.  Then send him off to research and make an informed decision.  A couple weeks later, he came back and said no circ.  I was sort of proud of him for this decision.  Like MrsOc said, removal of the foreskin removes a good amount of sexual pleasure.  I think what appealed to DH was that sex could actually be better, and the issues over slight mutations (crooked) and possible decrease in length. 

I also learned later that many of my IRL friends also chose not to circ.  One friend is totally anti circ, she had to fight her husband and his family over it.  Now, I haven't researched it a whole bunch because there just seems to be a lot of junk science web resources about it, but according to her it became common place in the US in attempts to make sex less pleasurable for men so they would be less premiscuous(sp) and decrease prostitution, masterbation and whatnot.

I don't know about the argument over which way looks 'prettier'.  For one, do you think a man would care more about having more sensation, or having his penis look pretty?  Plus it is subjective.  It is not a common practice in Europe and I bet European women have a different notion of 'pretty' in terms of a penis.  Also, is it really a big difference?  I once knew a guy from Germany in an intimite way, I didn't know much about circ at the time and didn't notice one way or the other.  In hindsight, he probably wasn't circ'ed and I didn't even notice the difference!

I know the arguements that intact boys are more likely to get a UTI, that an African study showed that intact men are more likely to contract STDs, and that there may be complications later in life where the surgery may be necessary.  But to me, it is subjective.  First, I don't put much of anything into the STD study, show me one from Europe and I will think about it.  The chance of a UTI does go from 1/1000 to 1/100, still doesn't call for surgery in a newborn to me.  And yeah, he may need to have it done later in life, but that isn't likely either. 

And you know what, if my 12 yr old comes to me and wants it done.  That is his choice, and I would call the doc and have it done. 

BelhurstBride

I've done a ton of research on this. I'll have to find the peer reviewed articles I found (for DH to read through) when I get home and post them here.

It's on the decline- especially in educated populations. (Where as few as 30% have the procedure done.) The STD risk is simply not true and the recent research that came out was from Africa. Good hygiene and safe sex is good hygiene and safe sex whether a man is cut or not.

Something that I found thought provoking? The reason why circumsions came about is officials felt that it would help stop boys/young men from "playing" with their penises.

Again, I'll try to find the articles and post them when I get home.

Telyco

BelhurstBride:

Something that I found thought provoking? The reason why circumsions came about is officials felt that it would help stop boys/young men from "playing" with their penises.

I saw this too - that some think it started to make sex less pleasurable on purpose....so men would be less likely to cheat and masturbate...and decrease prostitution. I think that theory is bunk.

JenJar

I'll be honest and say we didn't do too much research on this issue.  DH wanted to have it done, so we did.  I didn't fight him on it. 

BelhurstBride

Telyco:

BelhurstBride:

Something that I found thought provoking? The reason why circumsions came about is officials felt that it would help stop boys/young men from "playing" with their penises.

I saw this too - that some think it started to make sex less pleasurable on purpose....so men would be less likely to cheat and masturbate...and decrease prostitution. I think that theory is bunk.

Oh it totally is! Clearly didn't work at all. So why are people still selecting this option? And why is the gov't not putting it out there that they goofed and parents should stop performing an unncessary procedure on their newborn? But, I guess that's why it's on the decrease in educated populations.

Telyco

BelhurstBride:

Telyco:

BelhurstBride:

Something that I found thought provoking? The reason why circumsions came about is officials felt that it would help stop boys/young men from "playing" with their penises.

I saw this too - that some think it started to make sex less pleasurable on purpose....so men would be less likely to cheat and masturbate...and decrease prostitution. I think that theory is bunk.

Oh it totally is! Clearly didn't work at all. So why are people still selecting this option? And why is the gov't not putting it out there that they goofed and parents should stop performing an unncessary procedure on their newborn? But, I guess that's why it's on the decrease in educated populations.

I guess I didn't make myself clear....I think the THEORY is bunk, not the practice.

Telyco

BelhurstBride:

Telyco:

BelhurstBride:

Something that I found thought provoking? The reason why circumsions came about is officials felt that it would help stop boys/young men from "playing" with their penises.

I saw this too - that some think it started to make sex less pleasurable on purpose....so men would be less likely to cheat and masturbate...and decrease prostitution. I think that theory is bunk.

Oh it totally is! Clearly didn't work at all. So why are people still selecting this option? And why is the gov't not putting it out there that they goofed and parents should stop performing an unncessary procedure on their newborn? But, I guess that's why it's on the decrease in educated populations.

And I think the education point that you are trying to make, if true, is fine...but when you take away the religious/cultural/personal beliefs that parents have.

olivia_eve

If/when we have a boy, we will not circumcise.  DH and I talked about it when I was pregnant and agreed that in our opinion, it's unnecessary.  It's not going to be rare for a kid in the US to be uncircumcised, so I feel like teasing isn't as much of an issue now.  Also, LOL to the matching comment- I never thought of it that way, but it's so true!

Two*True

I'm really undecided on this issue.  I'm really bothered by that fact that as a nation we get pissed when countries/cultures/religions in Africa and other locations circumcise females and yet we still willingly do it to males.  I do understand that the procedures are much different and one is far more severe than the other.  But still I can't help that think we tell other cultures not to do it and yet here we have no problem with people circumcising males under the notion that it's for culture/religious purposes here within our own borders.  

abba916

We're going back and forth with this and DH is leaning toward circ. I haven't done any research really about it (bad mommy)- guess i should get on this..

June4bride2be

There isn't enough evidence that it ISN"T needed, I see more people mention "they know someone" who had to have it done later in life due to problems.

We did, and I am glad...as it may not be unusual for it not to be done down the road, it will still be the "norm" to have it done.

The kiddo I watch who is 3 does not have it done, honestly it bothers me and has since he was born. I can't get used to it. As far as pleasure.....how many guys do you know complain about lack of pleasure?  They all seem to enjoy sex just fine!

It is really a personal decision. I wasn't about to jump on the un circ wagon just because it "everyone else is doing it". I needed actaul proof, and our pedi couldn't give it to us.

Telyco

June4bride2be:

There isn't enough evidence that it ISN"T needed, I see more people mention "they know someone" who had to have it done later in life due to problems.

We did, and I am glad...as it may not be unusual for it not to be done down the road, it will still be the "norm" to have it done.

The kiddo I watch who is 3 does not have it done, honestly it bothers me and has since he was born. I can't get used to it. As far as pleasure.....how many guys do you know complain about lack of pleasure?  They all seem to enjoy sex just fine!

It is really a personal decision. I wasn't about to jump on the un circ wagon just because it "everyone else is doing it". I needed actaul proof, and our pedi couldn't give it to us.

I think the less pleasure stuff is due to the fact that un-circ has more surface area and therefore more nerve endings. Just the same as how I have more nerve endings than a skinny person (hehe!) People make it seem like all nerves have been removed or something.

Cutemin

Found a good website on this topic.  Talks a lot about the history of circumcision.

https://www.historyofcircumcision.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=category&sectionid=8&id=73&Itemid=52

 

xKimx

Charlie is circ'd and I still kind of regret it. Ultimately I left the decision up to DH (since my beliefs on so many other topics were much stronger) and he went with the "look like daddy" argument which I personally think is a load of bull. If the next one is a boy, I'm making him watch a video of a circ. being done...

KonnubialKat

I was and still am completely against this, but it was one of the battles I chose not to fight because I'm not a man, nor have I ever been a teenage boy in a locker room.  What really really really pi$$ed me off though was when they came in to do the procedure on Bambino, DH hadn't even made it to the hospital yet.  I felt like I was handing him off to the henchman.  And yes, I even had to sign the consent papers.  In hindsight, I should have refused.

From a woman's perspective, my experience was very different with an "intact" man. 

KonnubialKat

I also think that (not) "comparing Vs with (your) mom" is different.  You're comparing something external with something internal and it's not quite the same thing, IMHO.

Telyco

KonnubialKat:

I also think that (not) "comparing Vs with (your) mom" is different.  You're comparing something external with something internal and it's not quite the same thing, IMHO.

I never compared my breasts to hers either...better analogy? 

But DH did mention to me that he thought it would be confusing to teach DS how to clean an uncirced penis when he himself had no experience with it. So I guess that is better than the whole "not looking like me" reason.

BelhurstBride

Telyco:

I guess I didn't make myself clear....I think the THEORY is bunk, not the practice.

I was agreeing. The theory that circumsizing would prevent "playing" proved a failure, young men still "play" regardless of whether they're cut or not.

Here was some of the stuff I saved for DH to look through. I can't find a lot of the original research I read that helped me make up my mind.

https://www.cirp.org/library/normal/aap/

https://www.coloradonocirc.org/files/handouts/Circumcision_and_the_Foreskin.pdf

https://www.circumstitions.com/Clean.html

https://www.mothering.com/discussions/forumdisplay.php?f=44

 And a goofier, possibly more male friendly POV: 

The Penn and Teller video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIZLna_uzLQ

Part II:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzBJoW-iJ6E&NR=1