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Babies: 9 - 12 Months
There are children in GITMO
This discussion has been closed.
Re: There are children in GITMO
Charles Manson orchestrated a horrible killing spree in which a pregnant woman and her unborn child were murdered - HE HAS NOT BEEN TORTURED.
Ted Bundy killed several women, and possibly more than are known - HE WAS NOT TORTURED.
Timothy McVeigh, an American, masterminded the Oklahoma City bombing - HE WAS NOT TORTURED.
Serial killers and murderers also kill innocent people, yet they ARE NOT TORTURED. Are you saying that we should start, because clearly - they killed innocent people, which was their goal, so their human rights "go out the window".
This is appalling. Seriously appalling.
p.s. they can hate your government & maybe be men and have a real war w/ armies instead of blowing up civilians left and right.
You're the kind of person who says that a victim of rape must have been dressed?provocatively, or that they're now "damaged goods", arent you? ?
Saying that a child who was?basically?FORCED to commit horrific acts is no longer human lead me to the conclusion that you are either mentally ill or that you are lacking in any sort of moral ?compass. I am much more disturbed by YOUR thinking than I am by almost anything else in these posts.?
You obviously feel very strongly about this, and I can respect that. To say that they are no longer human....that I do not respect.
Wouldnt that "real war" with armies include NOT BRAINWASHING CHILDREN TO DO THEIR DIRTY WORK?? ?
I am shocked by some of the responses. But i shouldn't be.
Terrorism is a phrase coined for the convenience of a government. Some would consider barging into a country and bombing schools and homes terrorism, especially without cause warrant or support of the UN.
But you know best. You're American. You decide the rights and the wrongs. You decide what murder is terrorism and what murder is brave and noble and worthy of funding and badges of honour.
Fact is. Its just not that simple. They're fighting a war too. Somehow, with rocks and homemade bombs and bodies filled with explosives, they're fighting a war too. Only when they bomb you, you call it terrorism and you tell them there's no hope for their children.
Thep eople terrorizing children in GITMO are heroes. The children fighting you are hopeless subjects worthy of the worst of your armed forces.
Lanie - 2 things I want to say - for starters a 15 year old is NOT a child. At that age, you do have an understanding of consequences.
Also, I used to see things in balck and white, right and wrong - very similar to what you are saying. I used to belive that everyone wanted the same thing for their children and why can't we all just get along & agree to disagree....then they flew 2 planes into the buildings right beside me. I was stuck downtown NYC until long after the towers fell and I thought I might die or get blown up. Seeing evil hit home does change your perspective.
I fully belive the 15 year old at Gitmo would comtinue on his path of trying to do us harm. He is not a child.
No...I am not that kind of person. Those children may be victums...but at the same time they're also murderers. They are not forced. They go into it willingly. They are raised and bred for this. You would be far less "disturbed by my thinking" if you had someone close to you be blown up by a 14 yrld.
I'm pretty late to this debate, but here's my two cents. I think all individuals at Gitmo should be held accountable for their actions through a fair trial. That being said, I firmly believe Gitmo should be closed and all persons being held there should be given the due process that they have so far been denied ASAP.
I think in the case of the teenagers being held there that they were likely subjected to a fair amount of brainwashing and propoganda in their home countries. They should still be held accountable for their actions. I just don't think holding these people indefinitely at Gitmo is going to address the larger issue out there, which is there are many more young people who are still being subjected to the propoganda and brainwashing in their home countries and will likely continue to perpetuate the cycle.
that's exactly what I'm saying...
Yes. Just because they are Americans doesn't excuse them. Why should they receive basic human rights? They took those rights away from others.
But no, I'm not saying that we should torture them for the fun of it. I don't really think we should torture anyone. I just don't think that GB prisoners should be brought to the US for trial.
There are certain things that set a person apart from an animal and those people are missing these things.
Oh, I see. They are willingly born, choose the way they are raised and choose not to seek education beyond the small world they're given access to. And I have lost someone to a crime committed by a child. ?
You do realize the only reason why the US holds prisons/trials outside of the US in countries like Cuba is to escape the Geneva convention right?
You get that? Because it sounds like you don't get it. The only reason they exist is to torture. They don't conduct trials. People are there for years and years without even receiving a charge.
That is inexcusable. If the US wants to get involved in punishing world criminals, they need to do it on their own soil.
Serial killers are not holding valuable info on more serial killings. Once they're caught you can be pretty sure they wont kill more people while in custody. Same cannot be said for terrorists. They are part of larger organization of murderes and may have info that if obtained can save thousands of lives. I guarantee you that some of the info obtained at GITMO may have kept one of your flights from blowing up w/o you ever knowing it.
Are soldiers missing these things? Is that what you're saying? Or just the people who don't like the US?
Sounds like you're missing some things. Anyone who believes children should be tortured for any reason, are missing things.
Lanie, I get it. I really do. But that doesn't change my opinion about basic human rights. There are many things about GB that I disagree with, but I think with some changes and policies and procedures the basic idea works.
Why should the US endanger its citizens by bringing these people on to our soil? We are trying to punish world criminals that want to hurt us. Should we just let them go to continue to plan horrendous acts against our country?
Like I said, its tragic how their lives turned out. Its very sad that they had no choice and no childhood. BUT...what's done to them...is done and now they're no longer children. They are trained murderers. They cannot be those children again.
All this talk of "innocent' people cracks me up. Who is innocent in war? You've said the children aren't. So are your soldiers?
the US has bombed schools. So I imagine you think its ok to torture US soldiers about the plans to bomb more schools?
Come on.
No country should have to harbour the people who hate you. Why should cuba have to keep all the american terrorists. Doesn't even make any sense since they don't exactly have you on their love love speed dial.
And yes PP, I definitely am implying, by not torturing children, I mean I should adopt them and do finger painting with them. ::taps head: makes sense.
My understanding is they would be brought here and placed in prison, like the one they are in at GB, sans the torture. We're not putting them up at the local Howard Johnson. Just like they're not walking around setting off bombs at the Cuban houses near GB, they're not going to come here and use their magic terrorist powers to bend the prison bars and wreak havoc.
I think we're missing the bigger point here. If the US is permitted to hold people indefinitely without charging them and denying them due process and any other civil liberties that are afforded to them via our Constitution (for US citizens being held there) or via the Geneva Conventions, this means they can do it to anyone. Period.
I know the people being held there likely committed terrible atrocities against civilians and military personnel, however; that doesn't mean we get to treat them like animals. These people can and should be held accountable for their actions and we have laws and judicial processes to ensure that happens. If allow our government to continue to deny these people their rights, we have just opened the door for them to do the same thing to you and me.
Yes, soilders just go around bombing schools. Obviously you don't know anyone who is a soldier. You make this so black and white......US bombs school=US is bad. There is so much more to the story than the liberal media doesn't tell you. My husband is that terrible soldier you speak of and I can tell you RIGHT NOW you don't know everything (or really anything for that matter) about what goes on over there...
Wow...i'm not reading all of this, but 14 yr olds should NEVER be tortured...never. They should not be in GITMO either. They should be in a juvenile detention facility if necessary.
However...and I'm sure I will get flamed for this, but I don't care. If they ever do catch Bin Laden...yeah, I'd be ok with torture to get information from him. I don't care how inhumane it is. The problem is that the line can't be drawn anywhere clear so you start torturing a guy like bin laden and somewhere down the road, some 14 yr old kid is being tortured. So really you have to have a no-tolerance policy all around.
The end
FWIW, I know several soldiers and I also know that some soldiers are sadistic. Nobody is making sweeping generalizations about our soldiers or any other group of people. The point is that you shouldn't torture people or create/maintain prisons for the sole purpose of getting around rules created by your own government to prohibit torturing people.
I'll agree with this. Based on what my dad does for a living (not that I have any realy clue since he can't talk about it) ... but that's what he and other people in his line of work (whether they be military or not) get paid to do. Make the tough call on who has information that needs to be 'gotten'. Of COURSE no one wants to torture kids (on ANYONE for that matter) ... but if a 14 year old kid had info that would have prevented 9/11 ... what would you have them do?
Yes, there are CRAPPY things that go on in the world, and yes, places like GITMO shouldn't exist ... but they do. ALL OVER THE WORLD. And I for one am glad that I don't know about half of them. And I'm glad that I don't have to make the tough calls that some do.
The Mouse ~ 06.12.08 | The Froggy ~ 02.23.11
Please come back when you've got an intelligent, logical thought to add, thanks.