Infertility

Ivf and sperm health, won’t thaw

So I am curious is anyone else has experienced something similar. We are doing ivf due to male infertility, we have been told the sperm is very low count and low mobility. 
 We got 11 mature eggs this morning, which is awesome!!
I just got a call that they thawed two  Vials from the sperm biopsy and there were only 3 living sperm and they looked like they were very unlikely to result in anything. Barley moving, pocket of something around the head of one, etc. but they recommend not even trying to thaw the other 3 vials of sperm Bc the embryologist said if they were that bad out of the two vials, it probably won’t get any better, so we are going to freeze my eggs and work more on his sperm health. 

I am just confused Bc I was under the impression ivf was great for “crap sperm”, you know, the slow and struggling sperm. I thought that was the point, was to be able to do icsi with struggling sperm. Also, is it common to not even try with other frozen sperm samples?? 


I understood they think if we work on his sperm health for A bit more, do another biopsy, and then try the lab with them fresh, instead of frozen, they think there will be more sperm and more movement. But I am just a bit confused and overwhelmed. 

Side note of context- he dosnt produce sperm naturally, that is why I am saying sperm biopsy, we did a testicular biopsy to see if there was viable sperm months ago that was then verified as seeing low motility sperm and frozen to wait for our egg retrieval. 

Re: Ivf and sperm health, won’t thaw

  • The major concern with sperm quality is something they can't see -- DNA fragmentation. Barely moving sperm and only -3- alive from the whole vial is a major red flag that there is something seriously wrong with the sperm, likely major DNA fragmentation. Even if they can fertilize with ICSI (and even for healthy sperm, this isn't a guarantee), there is a very high chance that the embryos will arrest at some point in development. Trust me -- you don't want to waste eggs with potentially non-viable sperm.  It wouldn't have hurt to thaw the remaining vials but it would have likely been a waste of your time and theirs. It's not likely that there would have been any change in the remaining vials.

    There is a tool that labs can use now to identify DNA fragmentation in sperm and separate out the good ones from the bad -- I totally am blanking on the name now though. You can always research that and consider using that plus techniques to improve sperm health -- but if he doesn't produce sperm naturally, I'm not sure how much they will help since most influence the hormones that control the production of sperm and I'm not sure how that would work for him. 
    ~~ Our Story in Spoiler! TW loss/child~~
    Fall 2012 -- started TTC
    Summer 2015 - no BFP yet, labs normal, referred to RE
    Fall 2015 - Summer 2016 - Further testing all normal. 3 IUI's -- BFN. Recommended move to IVF. Planned cycle for fall 2016.
    September 2016 - Surprise natural BFP. MMC @ 8 weeks. RE expressed confidence that we just needed the 'right' embryo.
    Fall 2016 - Spring 2017 -- Break from TTC
    June 2017 - Started IVF; egg retrieval for freeze all cycle. 9 mature eggs retrieved, 5 fertilized. 2 4BB embies on ice.
    August 2017 - FET transfer both embies. BFP.  Twin pregnancy confirmed by ultrasound. EDD 4/28/18
    September 2017 - Twin B stopped developing; Twin A doing perfectly! Graduated from RE @ 10 weeks
    March 2018 - Baby Girl born via C/S due to pre-eclampsia -- strong and healthy!

    TTC #2
    January/Feb 2021 - Freeze-all IVF cycle 
    March 2021 - FET of 1 PGS normal female embryo. BFP! Beta #1 156,  #2 472, #3 1241, #4 5268 EDD 12/5/21 - Christmas baby!


    "When all is lost then all is found."


  • @mbradfo2 Are you thinking of ZyMot? It was mentioned on the TTGP a little while ago and I remember that being and even stricter method for selecting sperm than ICSI.
    *TW* History:
    Me: 34 DH: 36 | Together since 2007 | Married July 2016

    TTC #1 since 7.2017
    Dx: low morph (1%), ANA positive, low decidualization score, high TSH and testosterone, histone antibodies

    IUI #1-3 all BFN
    IVF #1 | 6.11.19 | 24R, 17M, 15F, 6B, PGT-A tested - 5 normal, 3 girls & 2 boys
    FET #1 | 9.10.19 | BFN "I know you, but we've never met. I'm with you, but I don't know your name"
    RPL, Receptiva, & ERA testing | all normal/negative, recommended going on gluten and dairy free diet for next FET
    FET #2 | 3.31.20 | Opted to cancelled due to pandemic, continued diet and tried naturally over the summer
    2nd Opinion with another RE | 8.20.20 | Not immune to measles (received 1 dose); SA results similar to 2 years ago; decided to move forward with FET #2 redo at start of next cycle
    Surprise natural BFP! | 9.22.20 | MC 10.23.20 at 8 weeks
    TTCAL naturally | starting 11.22.20

    Initial consultation with Reproductive Immunologist | 9.14.21
    Decidualization score biopsy | 10.1.21 | abnormal - low score of 1; endometrial scratch recommended and progesterone supplementation
    Saline sono | 10.15.21 | normal
    Bloodwork | 10.21.21 high TSH, high testosterone, positive for anti-nuclear antibodies and histone antibodies, high protein S, multiple genetic mutations
    BFP! | 11.3.21 | EDD 7.14.22 B) | biopsy provided same effect as endometrial scratch; added supplemental progesterone and estrogen, prednisone, levothyroxine, and MTX Support to maintain pregnancy
    DS born 7.19.22 after induction


    TTC #2 begins 6.2023
    Consultation with RI | 6.6.23
    Saline sono, endometritis biopsy, skin & eye check | all normal
    Labs | high TSH, Factor XIII mutation, high %CD56
    Follow up | 8.8.23 | prescribed metformin, prednisone, plaquenil, and levothyroxine
    Repeat labs after 3 weeks on meds
    Follow up | 11.9.23 | Green light!, increase in prednisone, added lovenox
    Repeat labs in 8 weeks
    Follow up | 1.16.24 | Green light continues
    TTC put on pause
  • Loading the player...
  • @inthewoods23
    Yep, that's it! I don't know much about it or if many clinics have access to the technology but I've heard good things from couples with MFI.
    ~~ Our Story in Spoiler! TW loss/child~~
    Fall 2012 -- started TTC
    Summer 2015 - no BFP yet, labs normal, referred to RE
    Fall 2015 - Summer 2016 - Further testing all normal. 3 IUI's -- BFN. Recommended move to IVF. Planned cycle for fall 2016.
    September 2016 - Surprise natural BFP. MMC @ 8 weeks. RE expressed confidence that we just needed the 'right' embryo.
    Fall 2016 - Spring 2017 -- Break from TTC
    June 2017 - Started IVF; egg retrieval for freeze all cycle. 9 mature eggs retrieved, 5 fertilized. 2 4BB embies on ice.
    August 2017 - FET transfer both embies. BFP.  Twin pregnancy confirmed by ultrasound. EDD 4/28/18
    September 2017 - Twin B stopped developing; Twin A doing perfectly! Graduated from RE @ 10 weeks
    March 2018 - Baby Girl born via C/S due to pre-eclampsia -- strong and healthy!

    TTC #2
    January/Feb 2021 - Freeze-all IVF cycle 
    March 2021 - FET of 1 PGS normal female embryo. BFP! Beta #1 156,  #2 472, #3 1241, #4 5268 EDD 12/5/21 - Christmas baby!


    "When all is lost then all is found."


  • @mbradfo2 when I googled it, it is fairly new technology (less than 10 years old IIRC). Might be a while before it's offered everywhere. Maybe someday it will become the standard as I know some clinics do ICSI as their default method for fertilization over the traditional IVF.
    *TW* History:
    Me: 34 DH: 36 | Together since 2007 | Married July 2016

    TTC #1 since 7.2017
    Dx: low morph (1%), ANA positive, low decidualization score, high TSH and testosterone, histone antibodies

    IUI #1-3 all BFN
    IVF #1 | 6.11.19 | 24R, 17M, 15F, 6B, PGT-A tested - 5 normal, 3 girls & 2 boys
    FET #1 | 9.10.19 | BFN "I know you, but we've never met. I'm with you, but I don't know your name"
    RPL, Receptiva, & ERA testing | all normal/negative, recommended going on gluten and dairy free diet for next FET
    FET #2 | 3.31.20 | Opted to cancelled due to pandemic, continued diet and tried naturally over the summer
    2nd Opinion with another RE | 8.20.20 | Not immune to measles (received 1 dose); SA results similar to 2 years ago; decided to move forward with FET #2 redo at start of next cycle
    Surprise natural BFP! | 9.22.20 | MC 10.23.20 at 8 weeks
    TTCAL naturally | starting 11.22.20

    Initial consultation with Reproductive Immunologist | 9.14.21
    Decidualization score biopsy | 10.1.21 | abnormal - low score of 1; endometrial scratch recommended and progesterone supplementation
    Saline sono | 10.15.21 | normal
    Bloodwork | 10.21.21 high TSH, high testosterone, positive for anti-nuclear antibodies and histone antibodies, high protein S, multiple genetic mutations
    BFP! | 11.3.21 | EDD 7.14.22 B) | biopsy provided same effect as endometrial scratch; added supplemental progesterone and estrogen, prednisone, levothyroxine, and MTX Support to maintain pregnancy
    DS born 7.19.22 after induction


    TTC #2 begins 6.2023
    Consultation with RI | 6.6.23
    Saline sono, endometritis biopsy, skin & eye check | all normal
    Labs | high TSH, Factor XIII mutation, high %CD56
    Follow up | 8.8.23 | prescribed metformin, prednisone, plaquenil, and levothyroxine
    Repeat labs after 3 weeks on meds
    Follow up | 11.9.23 | Green light!, increase in prednisone, added lovenox
    Repeat labs in 8 weeks
    Follow up | 1.16.24 | Green light continues
    TTC put on pause
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