I think people should let others parent how they want. If their children are fed, well taken care of and not in danger, let them do what’s best for their family/children. Judgement only causes unnecessary blame and guilt and you never know why someone does what they do.
DS1 was potty trained at exactly 3.5 and DS2 is 3.5 and is potty trained but not using the potty. I’d give you a whole explanation, but I really don’t have to. 🤷🏻♀️
@rox7777 Totally agree you don't have to. And I also believe that those standards don't apply to kids with ASD and other cognitive issues or disabilities. However, I do feel that other peoples' parenting has created a large population of entitled, unrealistic 20-30 year olds who still live with their parents, so I do judge how strangers parent now that I am one.
I think there's also a difference between having an inner opinion that you keep to yourself and being outwardly judgmental. I'd never tell someone their nearly-4 year old looks ridiculous with a pacifier in their mouth, but you can't stop me from thinking it.
**TW**
Me: 35 | H: 40 Married Sept. 2013 DS1: Nov 11, 2016 MMC: 11/16/18 (9w6d) CP: 2/3/19 (5w3d) BFP! 8/24/19 DS2: May 10, 2020
@ruby696 It’s a double edged sword though. We’re extended breastfeeding, cloth diapering, extended rear facing and using car seats longer, skipping the bumbos and walkers and baby wearing and co sleeping more. I’ve heard nothing but nonsense from both MH and my own family on all of those things. I’ve heard that I should just “beat their a**” or “force them to sit on the potty until they go” more times than I care to think about. I feel like if I have to force it, it shouldn’t be done. Mindful parenting is important to some of us and I feel like when you judge people for doing things differently it causes a whole new world of division, especially among women.
Now. I do judge those that barely put forth the effort or shove their kids off on others. BUT I don’t dog them out or make them feel bad. If anything I try to offer advice when it’s asked for and give my own experiences with things. Too many stories about moms abandoning their kids, letting their men kill them or killing them themselves. It makes me nauseous to think about the ones that faced their own harsh judgements and felt they had no other choice.
I should also mention that being in the Bay Area, I see a lot of people with some very interesting parenting styles. Like @shamrocandroll said, I would never say anything out loud, but I sure will think it.
@shamrocandroll@ruby696 Oh yes. I have plenty of opinions, but I would never voice them. I know it only takes one straw to really set someone off and you REALLY don’t know.
@rox7777 I feel like that's an entirely different issue of families feeling entitled to voice their opinions when people do things differently than they did. That does make me angry.
My opinion is more geared towards what I see strangers doing to pacify their children because it's easier than actually parenting. Allowing their five year old to hit them and then still taking them to the movies. Giving a 2 year old a bottle of milk in their crib at night, even though it's terrible for their teeth, because it's too hard to teach them to self sooth. Offering to buy toys for a kid throwing a tantrum, just to get them to stop. Again, none of this applies to special needs kids. But parents of children who do not have special needs, need to suck it up and actually be parents.
People are amazed at how well mannered my kids are. We have never spanked them. We do, however, have expectations when it comes to behavior and we've taught them what is acceptable. Yes, it's really hard. But that's our job as parents.
I'll also say we all choose our battles. DS1 has been fully potty trained and out of diapers since just after he turned 2 (he is now 3), but we haven't night trained him yet. He occasionally wakes up dry, but it's not often, and more often he soaks his night time pull-up. I haven't chosen that battle yet because using one pull-up a day and occasionally having to change his sheets isn't worth the trade off of waking him up in the middle of the night every night to go potty. We might tackle it once the baby is born and we're up in the middle of the night anyway.
**TW**
Me: 35 | H: 40 Married Sept. 2013 DS1: Nov 11, 2016 MMC: 11/16/18 (9w6d) CP: 2/3/19 (5w3d) BFP! 8/24/19 DS2: May 10, 2020
I’m more likely to judge people who clearly just don’t want to parent their children, like my BIL who sits on the couch on his phone or talks to anyone else at family gatherings rather than interact with his own kids. He gets all pissy if he has to get up and actually parent them, but then he’ll act to other adults like he’s the best parent in the world. Meanwhile, H and his other brother are both actually great dads who are equal parenting partners, and you don’t hear them constantly telling other people how to parent. Bruh, they are your kids, get off your a$$ and be a dad.
@ruby696 All in all, we all do what we need to do to get through the 18 years of emotional/mental exhaustion that comes with being a parent. I don’t think it’s fair to expect us all to have perfectly behaved children, because it ain’t gonna happen.
Also, special needs children aren’t the only ones that have needs outside of the norm. DS1 has cancer. You wouldn’t know looking at him, but it’s caused all kinds of issues for him. He’s not “normal”. DS2 had to deal with the fallout of that at age 2. He’s not “normal”. They have circumstances outside of special needs that allow them some leeway. They’re not wild savages and they know how to say please and thank you, but they’re not perfect either. We survive and live to see another day regardless.
I just don’t want to be that parent having a bad day in the store and have other moms giving me the look that says I’m doing it wrong. Because I’m not. My kids are just being kids and I’m not a dictator,
@rox7777 I think social media has done us a disservice as millennial parents. It’s way too easy to compare ourselves to other parents and our kids to other people’s kids, either positively or negatively. In many ways we like to think we’re less judgmental than previous generations, but in many other ways we’re really no better.
@soprano19 Oh, you better believe in 20 years, our kids will be on a forum somewhere complaining about how judgmental we are about how they raise their kids. It happens in every generation. Social media just makes it much more prominent than it has been in the past.
**TW**
Me: 35 | H: 40 Married Sept. 2013 DS1: Nov 11, 2016 MMC: 11/16/18 (9w6d) CP: 2/3/19 (5w3d) BFP! 8/24/19 DS2: May 10, 2020
@rox7777 I generally judge public conduct by the parents' reaction. You can see when some poor mom or dad is doing their best and their kid is just not having it. You can also see when parents are indifferent. My kids aren't perfect. But when they act out, I do my best to get them in line and I assume other people notice that. And if they don't, oh well. I don't care if people judge me, as long as they keep it to themselves. I do find it kind of sad when people feel the need to compliment them in public - especially servers in restaurants. I think that says a lot for parenting in general. Good behavior used to be expected. Now people seem surprised when they see it.
I also think cancer falls within the special needs category. There are many childhood illnesses or diseases that may not be cognitive, but they do impact "normal" growth and development. If my kid had cancer, I assume I would be focused on things more important than potty training.
@rox7777 I think social media has done us a disservice as millennial parents. It’s way too easy to compare ourselves to other parents and our kids to other people’s kids, either positively or negatively. *snip*
^^^^THIS! I removed facefook from my life a few years ago and don't miss it.
Also, I appreciate everyone acknowledging the special needs kiddos/families. DS is 4.5 with ASD, not potty trained, he did kick the binky habit around age 2, but he wears a sensory chew around his neck for when he needs it, he has meltdowns in grocery stores and I've been hit in public more times than I care to admit, but I do my best to soothe him and move on.
I silently judge others as well, but being someone who has a child that doesn't understand or gets overwhelmed easily, you may not say your judgement out loud, but when you dirty look me and my child, you're voicing your opinion quite clearly on your face. Also, autism doesn't have a look like down syndrome for example, he looks like a normal 4 year old (actually he's big, so he looks closer to 6) with a mom that doesn't make him calm down. I've been by myself in the store and seen others having meltdowns, I smile at the parent and keep walking, they don't need me to stare or to offer my assistance.
And now I'll get off my soap box, but we never know what a family is going through.
I definitely was NOT trying to judge or shame anyone with any kind of special needs. My comment was because we had a new parent cocktail hour for DD’s school yesterday. These kids are supposed to be starting in January. Our school has a very strict “you MUST be potty trained to attend” policy. It’s written clear as day, explained at admission, explained AGAIN when you put down your deposit. One family with aforementioned 3.5 year old said he wasn’t potty trained because “he isn’t ready and we don’t believe in making him do things that he doesn’t like”. Then proceeded to throw a fit when the teachers there said they would send him home after two accidents in a day and disenroll him if it went on like that longer than a week. Their reaction just got on my nerves.
@ieles2531 I could definitely see that. My kids have never had to deal with daycare or school outside of kinder and they’re both fully ready by then. I know most of the younger age schools will also help potty train and enforce it. Something kids that are home don’t have to help with the push. My boys were both awesome with public potty training, it’s at home that they like to push their limits. Go figure.
As someone who has worked in the special education and disabilities arena for my entire adult life I thank you guys for saying it doesn't apply to that population, that being said I have to agree with @splashmountain, I have been out with one of my kiddos who at the time was 6 and was having serious anxiety and thus behaviors anytime she left the house, you don't have to say anything but just the looks that are given when a kid is having a hard time are really tough, she is not my kid and people would stare at us when she was melting down like I was allowing her to act like a wild animal. And one woman was kind enough to say "this is why your generation and hers act like this you all allow it" and so that lady I told about herself. The fact is most of the time you do not know what is happening in the kids life or the parents to see behaviors like this. Also having worked with children who went through trauma but are not cognitively behind, I can confidently say I do not judge what I see unless it is out right abuse (and yes I have called the police in stores before based on what I have seen). I am actually the person that walks by and tells another parent they have this and it is hard or asks if I can grab them something to help. We are all (for the most part) out here doing our best and I can't fault someone for doing something different than I would.
Also @ieles2531 I will say my pedi told me not to worry about potty training until 3.5 or so because developmentally they feel it is better to wait. DS was potty trained at 3 but it was a hard fought battle that caused so much stress I wish I had waited a little longer to potty train him, kids are ready at different times.
@mamaj1220 I really feel like the parents/caregivers reaction is more telling than the kid's behavior. A really good friend of mine's son has a severe form of Autism. They are extremely responsive parents and I feel like you can distinguish parents who have a lot on their plate vs parents who don't care. On the flip side, I get equally (maybe more) enraged when a stranger criticizes a parent who is having a hard time without offering to help. Especially parents with infants or parents who look like they want to crawl into bed and never get up again. I have never made a rude comment to a parent, but I have called out people being rude to parents who are having a hard time.
Question to those who have experience with autistic or special needs kids: do strangers make the situation worse? I always want to smile at or try to distract the kid, but I know some autistic kids might not respond well to that, so I refrain. I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on that.
Maybe this is more of a FFFC, but I'm extremely bitter when I hear how other people's babies are sleeping through the night at eight weeks. I fully admit that is 100% because I am jealous. So, so jealous.
@ruby696 DD has never been a sleeper from day 1 in the hospital. She's almost 4. I am also so jealous of people with children who sleep. People keep telling me the second baby will be the opposite and be a sleeper.
@jrouge12 It's a lie! Lol! Actually my second was much easier to put down and would occasionally do 4hr stretches (and a couple 5 hrs!), but she was still not sleeping through the night until she was 10+ months old. I am praying one of these babies is a sleeper. I don't know how I'll handle two that are hard to put down with frequent wakeup. I feel like I haven't slept well in 5.5 years at this point.
@ruby696 in our situation, attention from others makes it worse. If he's hitting or having a meltdown, it's typically just because he's overwhelmed and if somebody tries to talk to him or even discipline him (as crazy as it sounds, it's happened) he fights harder. I try to give the parents an encouraging "you got this" smile and move along.
Thanks @splashmountain. My understanding was meltdowns were often caused by overstimulation or being overwhelmed, and it seems like attention from a stranger would make that worse.
And OMG I can't even imagining trying to discipline someone else's child. People are just.... ugh.
@ruby696 So much yes to what you said about lazy parenting. That is exactly my one sister and BIL. I love my nephew but he is turning into a 4 year old terrorist because they just don’t want to do the hard work of parenting. They give him whatever he wants to keep him quiet so he leaves them alone. They’ll say no at first but he’s learned that if he just whines for a few minutes then they let him do whatever he wants or give him whatever he wants just to shut him up. It’s really unfortunate. Also, this is partly a learned behavior because my sister is also a whiner.
Building moms up for doing the best they can and as gently as they can is where I land on parenting. When I see other moms I just want to tell them they’re doing a good job and to hang in there because this is the hardest job ever. Potty training is hard and we are just getting started at three. He’s not in the minority of those still in diapers in his bmb group either. If mine isn’t fully potty trained in six months I’m not going to beat myself up about it. He will get it eventually and until then I’ll be here to help him out. Taking our time is my privilege and prerogative as his mom and there’s nothing wrong with that choice.
@ruby696 for us it made her more anxious when people she doesn’t know talk to her so I suggest just saying something kind to a caregiver. A good experience with this when we wrrr out was an older gentleman who say her throwing herself and melting down and I was trying to just give her some deep pressure and he walked by didn’t look at her but said to me, I’ve been watching and you’re doing so well, she may not understand but I do keep going. And at that moment I needed to hear it because I was feeling awful that she was so stressed. I know we had to work on it but I’ve been with her most of her life and it’s so hard for me to know I am putting stress on her to help her.
My child is in the 4yo can’t kick the binky camp. I’ve tried gently to get him to get rid of it, he’s a TERRIBLE sleeper, hasn’t slept thru the night in 4 years and I willingly let him have it at bedtime. He asks occasionally throughout the day and depending on the situation at the moment depends on what I do. I do not care what anyone else thinks. I know he’s too old for it, absolutely I know he’s too old for it. But I believe in not pushing him too hard or too fast and if that’s what makes him happy then I’m okay with that. He won’t go to kindergarten with it. Tying their own shoes is another one.... so frustrating and so hard to teach. My older son didn’t learn until second grade and they want them to know how in preschool. Guess what? Eventually he got it and he’s not going to middle school in Velcro. The little guy will ditch the paci at some point and it will be fine then too. Let them go at their own rate, what’s the point in pushing them, making them cry and forcing them to do things when you want them to? Sounds kind of like bullying to me, all kids develop at different rates and each of my sons excel in other areas regardless if they’re behind in something.
I also want to throw out there that you never know what the parents are going through. I say this statement totally unrelated to the child. If you have work problems or health problems or family problems or financial problems or suffer from some sort of mental/emotional problems of your own in some way it can make absolutely everything else you do in your life exponentially more difficult, including parenting. Maybe it’s taken everything you have to get yourself up and out of bed and dressed and out of the house to the grocery store so you can feed yourself and your family, and then having a child to parent through all this might make a seemingly impossible task even harder.
People don’t know what they don’t know. My kids’ health issues aren’t anyone’s business so as far as anyone needs to know my almost 4 year old just isn’t ready to be fully out of diapers. If people want to think I’m full of crap, fine. I’ll happily take that over telling them my kid’s private business.
And I bet most moms of 4 year olds who still have pacifiers agree it looks ridiculous. Some transitions are more traumatizing to some kids than others.
My job as a mom is the well being of my kids, not winning the approval of others.
Re: UO 12/26
Married Sept. 2013
DS1: Nov 11, 2016
MMC: 11/16/18 (9w6d)
CP: 2/3/19 (5w3d)
BFP! 8/24/19
DS2: May 10, 2020
DS1 was potty trained at exactly 3.5 and DS2 is 3.5 and is potty trained but not using the potty. I’d give you a whole explanation, but I really don’t have to. 🤷🏻♀️
Married Sept. 2013
DS1: Nov 11, 2016
MMC: 11/16/18 (9w6d)
CP: 2/3/19 (5w3d)
BFP! 8/24/19
DS2: May 10, 2020
My opinion is more geared towards what I see strangers doing to pacify their children because it's easier than actually parenting. Allowing their five year old to hit them and then still taking them to the movies. Giving a 2 year old a bottle of milk in their crib at night, even though it's terrible for their teeth, because it's too hard to teach them to self sooth. Offering to buy toys for a kid throwing a tantrum, just to get them to stop. Again, none of this applies to special needs kids. But parents of children who do not have special needs, need to suck it up and actually be parents.
People are amazed at how well mannered my kids are. We have never spanked them. We do, however, have expectations when it comes to behavior and we've taught them what is acceptable. Yes, it's really hard. But that's our job as parents.
I'll get off my soap box now. 😬
ETA: words
Married Sept. 2013
DS1: Nov 11, 2016
MMC: 11/16/18 (9w6d)
CP: 2/3/19 (5w3d)
BFP! 8/24/19
DS2: May 10, 2020
Married Sept. 2013
DS1: Nov 11, 2016
MMC: 11/16/18 (9w6d)
CP: 2/3/19 (5w3d)
BFP! 8/24/19
DS2: May 10, 2020
I also think cancer falls within the special needs category. There are many childhood illnesses or diseases that may not be cognitive, but they do impact "normal" growth and development. If my kid had cancer, I assume I would be focused on things more important than potty training.
Also, I appreciate everyone acknowledging the special needs kiddos/families. DS is 4.5 with ASD, not potty trained, he did kick the binky habit around age 2, but he wears a sensory chew around his neck for when he needs it, he has meltdowns in grocery stores and I've been hit in public more times than I care to admit, but I do my best to soothe him and move on.
I silently judge others as well, but being someone who has a child that doesn't understand or gets overwhelmed easily, you may not say your judgement out loud, but when you dirty look me and my child, you're voicing your opinion quite clearly on your face. Also, autism doesn't have a look like down syndrome for example, he looks like a normal 4 year old (actually he's big, so he looks closer to 6) with a mom that doesn't make him calm down. I've been by myself in the store and seen others having meltdowns, I smile at the parent and keep walking, they don't need me to stare or to offer my assistance.
And now I'll get off my soap box, but we never know what a family is going through.
DD #2: May 2020
Baby #3: EDD May 2023; MC October 2022
Question to those who have experience with autistic or special needs kids: do strangers make the situation worse? I always want to smile at or try to distract the kid, but I know some autistic kids might not respond well to that, so I refrain. I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on that.
Eta: fix autocorrect
And OMG I can't even imagining trying to discipline someone else's child. People are just.... ugh.
Eta: damn autocorrect
And I bet most moms of 4 year olds who still have pacifiers agree it looks ridiculous. Some transitions are more traumatizing to some kids than others.
My job as a mom is the well being of my kids, not winning the approval of others.