Secondary IF

Repeated FET failures after successful FET/Pregnancy/Birth

For those who have went through an entire IVF cycle with success ... and then experienced secondary IF afterwards: is this common?

We've done ALL sorts of testing during this time (ERA, Karyotype, SHG, numerous ultrasounds, etc.) and we're still using high-quality embies from the same retrieval as the one we had success with. We've had 5 FET with BFN in the last 12 months - with a total of 8x5-day embies. I'm just at a loss because there are no apparent reasons for these repeated failures. I've even gone back to my OB to try a few rounds of Femara, hoping that somehow it *might* work now because we only have 4 embies left and I'm terrified. Also, no insurance coverage so I can't even imagine going through that again (even after the $15,000 we've already spent since last July).

Has anyone been through this or have any insight or positive stories? (I know, I know, it's a secondary IF board ... just hoping for *some* hope) :smile:
**History in Spoiler**
Me-35, DH-36 - TTC since 08/10
Me - anovulatory, non-Insulin PCOS, DH - low end of "normal" sperm count
   IUI#1   - 02/15 - Cancelled due to scrubbed sperm count <1MM
   IVF#1  - 08/15 - 13x5-day blastocysts (ranging from AA-BB, most are 5 or 6), not PGS, on ice
   FET#1 - 10/15 - 1 emb - BFP (DD 07/16) (estrace + PIO sesame oil + prometrium)
   FET#2 - 07/17 - 1 emb - BFN (estrace + PIO sesame oil + prometrium)
   FET#3 - 08/17 - 1 emb - BFN (estrace + PIO sesame oil + prometrium)
   FET#4 - 10/17 - 2 emb - BFN (changed to estrace + prometrium because of allergic reaction to PIO sesame oil)
ERA Testing - 12/17 - window moved (-1 day)
   FET#5 - 03/18 - 2 emb - BFN (estrace + prometrium, ERA-timing used)
Karyotype Testing - 04/18 - Negative (we're ok)
   FET#6 - 06/18 - 2 emb - BFN (estrace + prometrium, ERA-timing used)
   FET#7 - 10/18 - 2 emb - BFN (estrace + prometrium, ERA-timing used)
   FET#8 - 11/18 - 2 emb - BFP; looks like one baby is going to make it, DD is due 8/16 (though likely to be 8/9)


Re: Repeated FET failures after successful FET/Pregnancy/Birth

  • I haven’t done IVF (yet) but I really hope you are successful soon. It’s terrible that insurance doesn’t cover this.
    TTC#1 since Jan 2015
    BFP 2/19/15  •  MMC found at 9 wks  •  D&E at 11 wks (age 36)
    BFP 8/29/15
      •  CP (age 37)
    BFP 11/18/15  •  DD born at 41 weeks <3(age 37/38)

    TTC#2 since May 2017
    BFP 10/18/17  •  MMC found at 8 wks  •  Misoprostal at 10.5 wks (age 39)

    BFP 2/16/18
      •  CP (age 39)
    BFP 4/13/18
      •  CP (age 39)
    BFP 5/07/18  •  MMC found at 10.5 wks  •  D&E at 11.5 wks 
    •  Testing showed it was a girl with Trisomy 22. (age 39/40)
    9/5/18 Diagnosed with diminished ovarian reserve (4-5 follicles, one ovary had none and was very atrophied)

    RE says the low egg count is likely causing my recurrent pregnancy loss. Less eggs results in more aneuploidy.

    BFP 9/24/18  • 
    CP (age 40)
    BFP 5/11/19  •  Fraternal twins  •  MMC found at 10w5d (Baby A 6w, Baby B 10w)  •  Misoprostal at 11 weeks (age 41)













    MamaK225projectalice
  • @MamaK225 So sorry for your struggles over the past year. I can't offer much help but do you happen to know what the grades of the BFP embryo was vs the others? It's possible (though unlikely) that that one BFP embryo was "the one" (euploid) and the remaining were abnormal. Usually the best are transferred first, so your most high quality embryo would have been the first one transferred and this is what resulted in the pregnancy. The embryos afterwards may have been significantly less quality. I don't think this is likely as you had so many of them for this to continuously happen so there are other factors likely at play here. Diet, infections, or lifestyle choices can have an influence as well. Think back if anything has changed since 2015? 
    I am Embryoman - your friendly neighborhood embryologist!
    **Removed for TOU violation**
    MamaK225
  • Loading the player...
  • @embryoman - We had 5x5AA (one was successful), 4x5AB, 3x4AA, 1x4AB. Overall, 13 really good-looking embryos, which is why we didn't opt for PGS. With such a good turnout (25 follicles, 24 fertilized, 13 embryos), we were of the mindset that since they looked so good it would do more harm to test than to forego it. So, no, there was no discernable difference between #1 and #2-5 (and minimal difference with #6-9). No change in diet or exercise (if anything, it's gotten better) ... I've even cycled out all "toxic" chemicals out of the house, I get more/better quality sleep, and have changed jobs (*much* less stress). If anything, all things only further highlight and embolden *WTF.* Hence, the frustration :(

    Starting with the 3rd attempt after the success, my doc was finally OK with doing 2 embryo transfers, so FET#4 (4&5), FET#5 (6&7), FET#6 (8&9) were multiple failures. I even did ERA testing (resulting in moving the window) so that 6&7 and 8&9 were on this schedule. I did have to switch to Prometrium-only with the Estrace - replacing PIO - because I began to have allergic reactions to the medium, but that was done for those last 3 transfers (#4-9). Doc maintains the two protocols are perfectly interchangeable, not to be concerned about that. We've even gone so far as to do Karyotype testing on my husband and me - to see if there is something underlying we could have transmitted to the embryos (it was negative for both, aka "normal").

    I do appreciate you taking the time to consider ... any thoughts or suggestions are very helpful! :) 
    **History in Spoiler**
    Me-35, DH-36 - TTC since 08/10
    Me - anovulatory, non-Insulin PCOS, DH - low end of "normal" sperm count
       IUI#1   - 02/15 - Cancelled due to scrubbed sperm count <1MM
       IVF#1  - 08/15 - 13x5-day blastocysts (ranging from AA-BB, most are 5 or 6), not PGS, on ice
       FET#1 - 10/15 - 1 emb - BFP (DD 07/16) (estrace + PIO sesame oil + prometrium)
       FET#2 - 07/17 - 1 emb - BFN (estrace + PIO sesame oil + prometrium)
       FET#3 - 08/17 - 1 emb - BFN (estrace + PIO sesame oil + prometrium)
       FET#4 - 10/17 - 2 emb - BFN (changed to estrace + prometrium because of allergic reaction to PIO sesame oil)
    ERA Testing - 12/17 - window moved (-1 day)
       FET#5 - 03/18 - 2 emb - BFN (estrace + prometrium, ERA-timing used)
    Karyotype Testing - 04/18 - Negative (we're ok)
       FET#6 - 06/18 - 2 emb - BFN (estrace + prometrium, ERA-timing used)
       FET#7 - 10/18 - 2 emb - BFN (estrace + prometrium, ERA-timing used)
       FET#8 - 11/18 - 2 emb - BFP; looks like one baby is going to make it, DD is due 8/16 (though likely to be 8/9)


  • @MamaK225 just wanted to reach out because I am in a very similar situation.   We had 16 frozen embryos, all PGD normal.  We had a successful transfer first time around with that cycle and I had my amazing son as a result.  He was born via emergency c section and I'm told there were no complications etc.  C section was the result of a poorly done/improperly done induction.   I went back to my IVF doctor when my son turned one with the hopes of giving him a sibling.  My doctor did an ultrasound exam and said all looked good for another go.  I walked out thinking this was great, this will work awesome.  I didn't have one thought of an unsuccessful cycle.  Perhaps I was too confident? IDK.... we did a transfer two months later and it cam back very LOW BPF- ultimately a chemical.   I figured that's ok,  maybe it's just my body needed to get used to this and did a second transfer the month after that....negative.  then a third transfer negative....my doctors words of wisdom?  Cant control nature. I wanted to scream and throttle him (via his nurse of course)…..  No suggested change of course.  SO I went to another doctor at same clinic for a second opinion.  HE did all the test,  leaky gut and all and all results were fine.... Then I did an endo biopsy which came back with positive for signs of a polyp.  And my doctors response was I don't think that's anything.  HE wanted me to just keep going with another cycle.  At my instance i'm having a hysteriscopy to see if there's anything in there that shouldn't be.   I"m hoping that's it, the procedure will reveal something and we can solve the problem and ulitimatly give my baby boy a sibling.   
    Perhaps worth you doing a biopsy?  I've read that sometimes all of the estrogen can cause polyps in the uterus.

    I wish you good luck, success and happiness.   My thoughts are out there for your next BFP!!!  

  • I am so sorry. This scares me. 
    I am 26 years old. Have pcos. Started ttc at 22 years old. Went to a specialist and started iui 
    Second try was successfully (who knew how blessed we are) this was with 13 injections of menopur 50iu. 

    So fast forward to now. We have tried iui again 2 times. But my resistance to hormones is worse. (I need 24-30 injection to start making a folical)

    My last cycle ending in a "chemical pregnancy" (hate the term because it feels like a loss to us)
    This was with femzole 5mg for 5 days while taking, menopur 75iu and puregon 50iu. They also had to trigger. My poor tummy and emotions after this cycle. 
    The miscarriage left me with 2 large corpus luteum cyst so if these are gone when AF arrives we will try IVF as the doctor has said iui is not for us. Thankfully we can afford 1 try. But that's all.  

    I am not sure why I need so many hormones now... I am also so afraid I don't get any eggies or they are all poor quality... But I know I would regret it more if we didn't try.

    It is really difficult when doctors can't give you answers as when I asked why they reply with age... Aggg
    I am sorry for your struggle and hope you get your BFP soon  xx
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