Hi everyone. I have been on and off of this board since our MMC back in March of this year. I haven't been terribly active, but have followed some stories and discussions, and often thought of you all and hoped you are doing well. I took a break for about a month, and just recently started logging back in.
I am just having a hard time today and wanted to vent a little and see if you all had any experience with this type of thing. We are on our 2nd month TTC since the miscarriage. Last month we tracked, used OPKs, and had plenty of sex when we were supposed to, and BFN. Right now, I am about 3 DPO (cycle day 20). Lately, I have had something that I am struggling with while TTC, and just am not sure how to handle it. It's mostly having friends who don't understand. I don't talk about it with many friends, but one of my closest friends who I do everything with just never seems to understand my concerns, and it often makes me feel crazy. She wasn't even too excited for us when we found out we were pregnant the first time (she doesn't have much of a motherly instinct, self-admitted, so she doesn't get too excited about that kind of thing). Connected to this, is something I have struggled with, the idea of "drink til it's pink." My friend group drinks a lot. It's always been a big thing of ours, having wine, beer, etc. Going out dancing. Whatever. Since we have been TTC, I have been cutting down, obviously, but there are times when an event will be happening and I want to have a drink or two still. I will have that drink or two, but then when I don't want to continue on past that, my friends (well, that one inparticular) makes me feel like I'm being ridiculous over it. Last night, for example, when I told her I was taking it easy because I was in the TWW, she flat out said that she didn't get it and thought I was being overly cautious and shouldn't worry about it. Just keep drinking anyway. She understands the process because she has had some sisters go through it, but yet she still makes me feel like I'm being ridiculous for not wanting to mess anything up. I know I am doing the right thing by cutting down after ovulation, but it's so hard when someone so close to you makes you feel like you are crazy. I don't think anyone can quite understand how bad it feels to have a miscarriage until they have had one themselves. I know I didn't. I know that nothing I did caused the first one, but I want to do what I can to help next time be better, and it's so hard when you have friends who either a) don't understand or b) don't care. And to make you feel like you are wrong for it. My husband is wonderful about it, and says I should tell her how it makes me feel, but I'm not very confrontational, so it's hard.
I guess I just wondered if any of you have had experiences like this and how you dealt with it. I don't want to say anything and make a big deal about it, so just trying to figure out how to process it myself since I know I am doing the right thing. Thanks for any advice, ladies.
Me: 31 DH: 32 Married April 2014 TTC since December 2015 1st BFP: February 8, 2016; MMC at 7 weeks, 3 days; Discovered at 10 weeks; D&C March 25 2nd BFP: June 20, 2016; CP June 22, 2016 3rd BFP: August 13, 2016!! Fingers crossed!!
Hey. I'm sorry for your loss and I'm sorry you aren't finding support from your friend group, in particular your one close friend. It sounds like your relationship with her hinges a lot on activities that are easier (but not impossible) without children, and maybe this is threatening to her. Maybe she feels like you conceiving will damper your ability to have fun with the friend group. Just some thoughts.
I haven't run into your situation in particular, but I keep one thing in mind if I'm up against any barrier to my conceiving a healthy child and that is this: If I had a living child right now...if either of my children would have lived...I would have fought to the death for them to have a happy and healthy life, and that includes prior to birth! I'm not a confrontational person either, but when it comes to my children (in heaven or those who I hopefully will have here on earth), don't mess with me. You aren't picking a battle against your friends. You are choosing to be healthy for a future child, whether or not you actually conceive each cycle. You have nothing to be sorry for. In fact, if I had friends that acted like yours or said the same things, I'd pretty much tell them to shut up about drinking or pound salt. It sounds like your group, and the one friend in particular, is quite immature. (Not sure your/friend's age, that may play a role.)
DH and I pretty much entirely gave up drinking together for TTC purposes as well as general health. We did get some questions from our friends (some knew we were going to start to try, some didn't) and we calmly told them we just don't drink anymore, and that it was a personal health choice. Our friends didn't question it, and were super supportive. That's what caring, mature friends do. (and this was a friend group who had wine and whiskey tasting parties quite frequently!)
I would sit this friend (and maybe the whole group down) and tell them how you feel and what's important to you. Maybe suggest a social activity that's not centered on drinking. If they don't understand, it may be time to get some friends in your life who do. Your husband is right. When you are feeling weak, think about your baby and the future baby(ies) you want to have. Life is too short to try to cater to everyone else at your own detriment. Hopefully having a heart-to-heart fixes your ability to maintain this friendship.
I hope this helps. I'm sorry if this came off mean in any way. I'm actually really fired up about how this friend is treating you.
Is the alcohol thing an example of things that bother you about the relationship, or is the main issue? No one should be pressuring you to drink for any reason (and you can decline to drink for any reason, not just TTC), so I would respond something like, "I'm good, but you go ahead" and not make it about TTC. I agree with @Wishilivedinflorida's suggestion of suggesting some social activities not geared around drinking to try to interact with these friends away from alcohol.
About me: /loss mentioned/ TTC#1 July 2014 dx: MFI (morphology) IUI #1 w/Clomid + Ovidrel Sept. 2015 ~ BFN IUI #2 w/Clomid + Ovidrel Halloween 2015 ~ BFN IUI #3 w/Clomid + Ovidrel Thanksgiving 2015 ~ BFP!! hb 146 bpm at 7w5d 1/28/16 ~ began to say goodbye to our beautiful baby at 11w d&c, followed by cytotec TTCAL April 2016 IUI #4 w/Clomid + Ovidrel Apr. 2016 ~ BFN IUI #5 w/Clomid + Ovidrel ~ CP IUI#6 w/Clomid + Ovidrel ~ BFN
I'm sorry your friends aren't being very supportive about this. While I haven't had this exact experience I do find that people can be weird about alcohol/drinking in general. My husband is sober and has been since before we met. The reactions I have witnessed when he turns down a drink are mind boggling. Almost like people think him saying no is a judgement on them or something.
I personally don't think you have to explain anything. I think saying no is enough and if they don't understand that's on them. I married much earlier than my peer group and obviously matured and changed my lifestyle during that time and that just didn't mesh with some of my friends. Everyone is in their own time zone and your priorities are just different than hers at this point, you do you girl! Whatever sits good with you works. Good luck!
Hi Ive been in similar situations because my friend group also drinks a lot. People are a lot less weird about it with us though because we are in our later 30s and most of us have good friends who have been through all this. Plus Ive been pretty open about my losses.
I just want to add some information about drinking while TTC. There is a great blog called www.expectingscience.com where a blogger actually reviews the studies on TTC, MC, pregnancy and tells you what the research actually says. I was really surprised to learn that there is actually research that shows drinking prior to ovulation can mess up meiosis of the egg, meaning it can cause an egg to have chromosomal abnormalities. I had no idea. There actually NO evidence that drinking during the TWW increases the risk of MC or Fetal alcohol syndrome. Before a pregnancy test turns positive, there is not a lot of risk associated with alcohol intake. Of course, the CDC recommends abstaining from alcohol completely because most women don't find out they are pregnant at 11 DPO like us crazy ladies and there is risk of drinking alcohol after the 5th week...perhaps the 4th week of pregnancy.
Knowing this, when we start to TTC again, I'm actually going to abstain from alcohol WTO and drink only lightly during the 10-11 days between when I ovulate and when I test.
I wish I would've know this before TTC. H and I went on a bender on our honeymoon the 2 weeks before we conceived our first loss. Of course I ovulated a bad egg.
I opened up to a friend recently about the ttc process. Big mistake. People that don't have to work to get pregnant just do not get it. It's not even in the realm - ykwim?
This friend knows about my miscarriage and I opened up about trying again and she told me it would take 6 weeks for the BCP to get out of my system and that I should wait for July.
I blew her away when I said, no. I was on the mini pill, I chart my BBT, check my cervical mucus, my cervical position, and take OPKS 3x a day. I ovulated yesterday and had well timed intercourse.
She was floored. She popped out 3 kids effortlessly and had her tubes tied. She has never had to time intercourse since all 3 kids were unplanned and didn't believe that I could pin point ovulation to the day.
Anyway, my point is people don't get it. After doing all I just mentioned above, there's no way I'm drinking. I'm also not in the drink til it's pink camp. As far as I'm concerned I treat the 2ww like I'm PUPO just in case.
As for the alcohol issue, can you suggest other things to do together? A movie? Brunch? Something less centered on drinking ?
But, also what others have said, you don't owe anyone an explanation. Just turn down the drink and party on, Garth.
Okay, I got a little carried away with the Waynes World reference lol.
@chloe97 thanks for sharing that web site. I checked it out briefly and could see myself getting sucked in to reading for hours!
@iceandsnowflakes29 you are right, people don't get it. My mom keeps trying to offer me lame advice like "just relax and it will happen" or "have sex on day 14" even though I don't O on day 14 she still won't listen. It's easy for people to spout off lame advice when they've never had a problem or even a second thought about getting KU.
Thanks to you all for the responses. Sorry I'm just now getting back to responding today...busy day yesterday.
@chloe97 thanks for sharing that site, I am definitely going to check it out. It's good to see any extra info on this type of thing, just to make sure we are seeing the whole picture!
@Wishilivedinflorida I think you are right in that the friend is worried that once I have a baby, it will change things. And yes, it will be different, but it seems like such an immature way to be. It's definitely not age...I'm almost 31 and she'll be 34 this year. A lot of our friend group activities have revolved around drinking for years now...I think because not many of us have children yet. I have, in recent years, tried to make plans that aren't alcohol centric, for general health reasons, but somehow it always circles back around to it. The majority of our friend group is completely understanding and supportive when I don't want to drink at events, but this one friend for some reason always makes me feel like I'm being ridiculous (even though she does it from time to time herself to try to lose weight).
I just think overall this one friend doesn't realize the way she sounds when she talks about the whole TTC process with me. Even though she "understands" it, she doesn't get it, like you said @iceandsnowflakes29. She's always telling me I shouldn't try to "science" the getting pregnant process (charting, etc.)..."just let it happen." It's great if that is the way she wants to do it, but she shouldn't try to make me feel bad about it. (Also, I loved the Wayne's World reference...
And yes, @BornReady, the responses sometimes are ridiculous when we say we aren't drinking at an event. I don't understand it. Clearly we are trying to pass some kind of judgement on those who are drinking... (being a little sarcastic here!)
I appreciate all your responses. It makes me feel better to just see the support. Honestly, it has been hard for me to turn down that extra drink at get-togethers, etc., because it is something that has been a big part of our social life for a long time now, but I know that it is the best thing for myself and future children. I might talk to the friend at some point more about it. I talked to her a little bit yesterday, but didn't get into it a lot. Hopefully the next time we hang out won't be the same as Friday night!
Me: 31 DH: 32 Married April 2014 TTC since December 2015 1st BFP: February 8, 2016; MMC at 7 weeks, 3 days; Discovered at 10 weeks; D&C March 25 2nd BFP: June 20, 2016; CP June 22, 2016 3rd BFP: August 13, 2016!! Fingers crossed!!
@chloe97 what a fascinating article. Thank you for sharing. Of course now I'm a bit paranoid. I guess you could say I "binge drank" all weekend, to the point where I woke up with a hangover today. I'm waiting to O, so now I'm wondering if I've done some sort of irreparable damage to my egg(s).
@natsfan2442 I haven't yet experienced this since I haven't abstained from alcohol since my pregnancy. But now I'm considering cutting way back, and I'm sure it would be met with some confusion if I explained it to my friends (also big drinkers). If they're pressuring you to drink even after you've shared your reasons, I'd start minimizing time with them for now. Or firmly explain, once again, that you're making a decision for your body and that you're not interested in discussing it any further. Hopefully they'll get the message and leave it alone.
@shae86 thanks for the advice. I think for now I might just limit time with them when I know I'm in my TWW. I am so busy with work and other family stuff it probably makes sense anyway! I too drank a lot more than I should have during the time leading up to ovulation, and worried once I read that article. When I worry, my husband reminds me that we survived the 60s, so I am trying not to stress too much. All we can do is adjust next month (if this one doesn't work out!)
Me: 31 DH: 32 Married April 2014 TTC since December 2015 1st BFP: February 8, 2016; MMC at 7 weeks, 3 days; Discovered at 10 weeks; D&C March 25 2nd BFP: June 20, 2016; CP June 22, 2016 3rd BFP: August 13, 2016!! Fingers crossed!!
the other ladies covered what I was going to say but i agree your friend seems to be a little threatened. I also think you should do whatever your gut is telling you and if this friend isn't being supportive then it's her loss because it will probably lead to you wanting to spend less time with her. I hope she comes around and shows you more support.
@chloe97 thanks for the article, it was so interesting!
TW*** Child and loss mentioned Married 10/12 DS 11/14 Ectopic 2/16 PCOS/Ovulation Dysfunction 11/16 IUI x 3- BFN Laparoscopy 3/17 Endo and tubal damage IVF- 4/17- 40 eggs retrieved, 10 blasts, 7 pgs tested embryos FET- 6/17- BFP! Due Feb 15, 2017
@natsfan2442 Don't you love when people tell you to "just let pregnancy happen..." Unless a woman has been through what we have, she just won't get it. I have personally found myself at a bit of an odds with my best friend- she and her husband are not kid people. He had a vasectomy when he was 26. I went to visit her in February and she had a full on alcohol- themed weekend planned, and I was 6 weeks pregnant and had to say no thank you and she kind of gave me a hard time about it. I think most of us here are that the same crossroads of waiting on that first baby, and it really puts a cataclysmic shift in the social dynamic. I find myself getting closer to my friends from law school who have little kids and babies, and further away from my friends who aren't there and more than likely won't ever get there.
Re: Need to vent/get some opinions
I haven't run into your situation in particular, but I keep one thing in mind if I'm up against any barrier to my conceiving a healthy child and that is this: If I had a living child right now...if either of my children would have lived...I would have fought to the death for them to have a happy and healthy life, and that includes prior to birth! I'm not a confrontational person either, but when it comes to my children (in heaven or those who I hopefully will have here on earth), don't mess with me. You aren't picking a battle against your friends. You are choosing to be healthy for a future child, whether or not you actually conceive each cycle. You have nothing to be sorry for. In fact, if I had friends that acted like yours or said the same things, I'd pretty much tell them to shut up about drinking or pound salt. It sounds like your group, and the one friend in particular, is quite immature. (Not sure your/friend's age, that may play a role.)
DH and I pretty much entirely gave up drinking together for TTC purposes as well as general health. We did get some questions from our friends (some knew we were going to start to try, some didn't) and we calmly told them we just don't drink anymore, and that it was a personal health choice. Our friends didn't question it, and were super supportive. That's what caring, mature friends do. (and this was a friend group who had wine and whiskey tasting parties quite frequently!)
I would sit this friend (and maybe the whole group down) and tell them how you feel and what's important to you. Maybe suggest a social activity that's not centered on drinking. If they don't understand, it may be time to get some friends in your life who do. Your husband is right. When you are feeling weak, think about your baby and the future baby(ies) you want to have. Life is too short to try to cater to everyone else at your own detriment. Hopefully having a heart-to-heart fixes your ability to maintain this friendship.
I hope this helps. I'm sorry if this came off mean in any way. I'm actually really fired up about how this friend is treating you.
/loss mentioned/
TTC#1 July 2014
dx: MFI (morphology)
IUI #1 w/Clomid + Ovidrel Sept. 2015 ~ BFN
IUI #2 w/Clomid + Ovidrel Halloween 2015 ~ BFN
IUI #3 w/Clomid + Ovidrel Thanksgiving 2015 ~ BFP!!
hb 146 bpm at 7w5d
1/28/16 ~ began to say goodbye to our beautiful baby at 11w
d&c, followed by cytotec
TTCAL April 2016
IUI #4 w/Clomid + Ovidrel Apr. 2016 ~ BFN
IUI #5 w/Clomid + Ovidrel ~ CP
IUI#6 w/Clomid + Ovidrel ~ BFN
I personally don't think you have to explain anything. I think saying no is enough and if they don't understand that's on them. I married much earlier than my peer group and obviously matured and changed my lifestyle during that time and that just didn't mesh with some of my friends. Everyone is in their own time zone and your priorities are just different than hers at this point, you do you girl! Whatever sits good with you works. Good luck!
I just want to add some information about drinking while TTC. There is a great blog called www.expectingscience.com where a blogger actually reviews the studies on TTC, MC, pregnancy and tells you what the research actually says. I was really surprised to learn that there is actually research that shows drinking prior to ovulation can mess up meiosis of the egg, meaning it can cause an egg to have chromosomal abnormalities. I had no idea. There actually NO evidence that drinking during the TWW increases the risk of MC or Fetal alcohol syndrome. Before a pregnancy test turns positive, there is not a lot of risk associated with alcohol intake. Of course, the CDC recommends abstaining from alcohol completely because most women don't find out they are pregnant at 11 DPO like us crazy ladies and there is risk of drinking alcohol after the 5th week...perhaps the 4th week of pregnancy.
Knowing this, when we start to TTC again, I'm actually going to abstain from alcohol WTO and drink only lightly during the 10-11 days between when I ovulate and when I test.
I wish I would've know this before TTC. H and I went on a bender on our honeymoon the 2 weeks before we conceived our first loss. Of course I ovulated a bad egg.
ETF Words and making sense.
This friend knows about my miscarriage and I opened up about trying again and she told me it would take 6 weeks for the BCP to get out of my system and that I should wait for July.
I blew her away when I said, no. I was on the mini pill, I chart my BBT, check my cervical mucus, my cervical position, and take OPKS 3x a day. I ovulated yesterday and had well timed intercourse.
She was floored. She popped out 3 kids effortlessly and had her tubes tied. She has never had to time intercourse since all 3 kids were unplanned and didn't believe that I could pin point ovulation to the day.
Anyway, my point is people don't get it. After doing all I just mentioned above, there's no way I'm drinking. I'm also not in the drink til it's pink camp. As far as I'm concerned I treat the 2ww like I'm PUPO just in case.
As for the alcohol issue, can you suggest other things to do together? A movie? Brunch? Something less centered on drinking ?
But, also what others have said, you don't owe anyone an explanation. Just turn down the drink and party on, Garth.
Okay, I got a little carried away with the Waynes World reference lol.
@iceandsnowflakes29 you are right, people don't get it. My mom keeps trying to offer me lame advice like "just relax and it will happen" or "have sex on day 14" even though I don't O on day 14 she still won't listen. It's easy for people to spout off lame advice when they've never had a problem or even a second thought about getting KU.
@chloe97 thanks for sharing that site, I am definitely going to check it out. It's good to see any extra info on this type of thing, just to make sure we are seeing the whole picture!
@Wishilivedinflorida I think you are right in that the friend is worried that once I have a baby, it will change things. And yes, it will be different, but it seems like such an immature way to be. It's definitely not age...I'm almost 31 and she'll be 34 this year. A lot of our friend group activities have revolved around drinking for years now...I think because not many of us have children yet. I have, in recent years, tried to make plans that aren't alcohol centric, for general health reasons, but somehow it always circles back around to it. The majority of our friend group is completely understanding and supportive when I don't want to drink at events, but this one friend for some reason always makes me feel like I'm being ridiculous (even though she does it from time to time herself to try to lose weight).
I just think overall this one friend doesn't realize the way she sounds when she talks about the whole TTC process with me. Even though she "understands" it, she doesn't get it, like you said @iceandsnowflakes29. She's always telling me I shouldn't try to "science" the getting pregnant process (charting, etc.)..."just let it happen." It's great if that is the way she wants to do it, but she shouldn't try to make me feel bad about it. (Also, I loved the Wayne's World reference...
And yes, @BornReady, the responses sometimes are ridiculous when we say we aren't drinking at an event. I don't understand it. Clearly we are trying to pass some kind of judgement on those who are drinking... (being a little sarcastic here!)
I appreciate all your responses. It makes me feel better to just see the support. Honestly, it has been hard for me to turn down that extra drink at get-togethers, etc., because it is something that has been a big part of our social life for a long time now, but I know that it is the best thing for myself and future children. I might talk to the friend at some point more about it. I talked to her a little bit yesterday, but didn't get into it a lot. Hopefully the next time we hang out won't be the same as Friday night!
Married April 2014
TTC since December 2015
1st BFP: February 8, 2016; MMC at 7 weeks, 3 days; Discovered at 10 weeks; D&C March 25
2nd BFP: June 20, 2016; CP June 22, 2016
3rd BFP: August 13, 2016!! Fingers crossed!!
@natsfan2442 I haven't yet experienced this since I haven't abstained from alcohol since my pregnancy. But now I'm considering cutting way back, and I'm sure it would be met with some confusion if I explained it to my friends (also big drinkers). If they're pressuring you to drink even after you've shared your reasons, I'd start minimizing time with them for now. Or firmly explain, once again, that you're making a decision for your body and that you're not interested in discussing it any further. Hopefully they'll get the message and leave it alone.
Me: 29, DH: 34
Married April 2014
TTC since December 2015
1st BFP: February 8, 2016; MMC at 7 weeks, 3 days; Discovered at 10 weeks; D&C March 25
2nd BFP: June 20, 2016; CP June 22, 2016
3rd BFP: August 13, 2016!! Fingers crossed!!
@chloe97 thanks for the article, it was so interesting!
Married 10/12
DS 11/14
Ectopic 2/16
PCOS/Ovulation Dysfunction 11/16
IUI x 3- BFN
Laparoscopy 3/17 Endo and tubal damage
IVF- 4/17- 40 eggs retrieved, 10 blasts, 7 pgs tested embryos
FET- 6/17- BFP!
Due Feb 15, 2017
Don't you love when people tell you to "just let pregnancy happen..." Unless a woman has been through what we have, she just won't get it. I have personally found myself at a bit of an odds with my best friend- she and her husband are not kid people. He had a vasectomy when he was 26. I went to visit her in February and she had a full on alcohol- themed weekend planned, and I was 6 weeks pregnant and had to say no thank you and she kind of gave me a hard time about it. I think most of us here are that the same crossroads of waiting on that first baby, and it really puts a cataclysmic shift in the social dynamic. I find myself getting closer to my friends from law school who have little kids and babies, and further away from my friends who aren't there and more than likely won't ever get there.