UO

shellbell3845

It's Thursday! Entertain me with your unpopular opinions!

shellbell3845

BlueDot818 said:

I hate sneakers/tennis shoes. Partially because they make me feel short, and make my legs look stumpy, and mostly because my feet can't breathe in them.

I hate sneakers too!

magentawarped

@BlueDot818‌ Coffee, I'm with you. No sneakers, sushi, or seafood? We can't be friends.

shellbell3845

I have a problem with back to school supply lists. I think parents should only have to provide things that their child will use -- no community crayons/markers/glue, no notebooks for the teacher to use, no Clorox wipes/Kleenex/ziplock baggies for the classroom. If it's something for teacher/classroom use, I think the school needs to provide that.

shellbell3845

DreamingBabies said:

BlueDot818 said:

I hate sneakers/tennis shoes. Partially because they make me feel short, and make my legs look stumpy, and mostly because my feet can't breathe in them.

What do you wear with your yoga pants?

Flip flops, canvas slip ons, or the Skechers slip on sneakery things I have. Or boots in the winter.

magentawarped

shellbell3845 said:

I have a problem with back to school supply lists. I think parents should only have to provide things that their child will use -- no community crayons/markers/glue, no notebooks for the teacher to use, no Clorox wipes/Kleenex/ziplock baggies for the classroom. If it's something for teacher/classroom use, I think the school needs to provide that.

That would be great, if schools could afford it. Unfortunately, all their money goes to silly things like textbooks. A lot of the things you mentioned end up coming out of teachers' pockets if parents don't provide them.

shellbell3845

magentawarped said:

shellbell3845 said:

I have a problem with back to school supply lists. I think parents should only have to provide things that their child will use -- no community crayons/markers/glue, no notebooks for the teacher to use, no Clorox wipes/Kleenex/ziplock baggies for the classroom. If it's something for teacher/classroom use, I think the school needs to provide that.

That would be great, if schools could afford it. Unfortunately, all their money goes to silly things like textbooks. A lot of the things you mentioned end up coming out of teachers' pockets if parents don't provide them.

I know that. I spend a tremendous amount on classroom supplies every year. In fact, this is the first year in four years where my school has supplied things like pens and tape.

I'm just saying...in a perfect world, parents wouldn't be on the hook for that stuff.

I also think there's a lot of money wasted in schools that could go to Kleenex and teacher supplies.

breadpudding

I wasn't sure if this would be UO material or not, but I see so many people doing it.

It annoys me really bad when people say "the parents", "the toddler", "the daughter", "the son". As in... The parents are upset with me because I didn't clean my room. (Why not say "my"?) I have to go dress the toddler. The daughter just turned 16 and got a new car. I guess it just bothers me when "my" could be used instead.

magentawarped

shellbell3845 said:

magentawarped said:

shellbell3845 said:

I have a problem with back to school supply lists. I think parents should only have to provide things that their child will use -- no community crayons/markers/glue, no notebooks for the teacher to use, no Clorox wipes/Kleenex/ziplock baggies for the classroom. If it's something for teacher/classroom use, I think the school needs to provide that.

That would be great, if schools could afford it. Unfortunately, all their money goes to silly things like textbooks. A lot of the things you mentioned end up coming out of teachers' pockets if parents don't provide them.

I know that. I spend a tremendous amount on classroom supplies every year. In fact, this is the first year in four years where my school has supplied things like pens and tape.

I'm just saying...in a perfect world, parents wouldn't be on the hook for that stuff.

I also think there's a lot of money wasted in schools that could go to Kleenex and teacher supplies.

Totally didn't remember you're a teacher.

shellbell3845

car seat said:

magentawarped said:

shellbell3845 said:

I have a problem with back to school supply lists. I think parents should only have to provide things that their child will use -- no community crayons/markers/glue, no notebooks for the teacher to use, no Clorox wipes/Kleenex/ziplock baggies for the classroom. If it's something for teacher/classroom use, I think the school needs to provide that.

That would be great, if schools could afford it. Unfortunately, all their money goes to silly things like textbooks. A lot of the things you mentioned end up coming out of teachers' pockets if parents don't provide them.

Maybe if your country spent fewer billions stockpiling weapons there would be some money for crayons.

Well, that's just too reasonable.

magentawarped

car seat said:

magentawarped said:

shellbell3845 said:

I have a problem with back to school supply lists. I think parents should only have to provide things that their child will use -- no community crayons/markers/glue, no notebooks for the teacher to use, no Clorox wipes/Kleenex/ziplock baggies for the classroom. If it's something for teacher/classroom use, I think the school needs to provide that.

That would be great, if schools could afford it. Unfortunately, all their money goes to silly things like textbooks. A lot of the things you mentioned end up coming out of teachers' pockets if parents don't provide them.

Maybe if your country spent fewer billions stockpiling weapons there would be some money for crayons.

But then how would we blow shit up? Come on now...

shellbell3845

Following up on the school supplies conversation, I guess my other UO is that I think if this country spent more on crayons they wouldn't have to spend so much on weapons. 

But maybe I'm a dreamer. 

magentawarped

LaurLaurLaur said:

DD1 is in a private PreK program which I pay dearly for. I still am asked to bring in baby wipes, community play-doh, community construction paper, crayons paper-towels... I would rather the director charge me an extra $10 a month and not ask me to buy community stuff for her.

I have no UOs. I am so complacent lately.

At a private school, I agree. Public, I expect to provide some communal stuff.

cattuccino

In terms of communal school supplies, I feel like it would make more sense to ask parents to contribute a dollar amount. Then you could pool the money and buy things in bulk or at a discount store and get more for your money. 

shellbell3845

cattuccino said:

In terms of communal school supplies, I feel like it would make more sense to ask parents to contribute a dollar amount. Then you could pool the money and buy things in bulk or at a discount store and get more for your money. 

This probably violates your right to a "free" public education. But this is how the catholic schools I've taught in operate.

TessyMessy

We live in a very diverse school district. Some schools have over 85% of the children coming from poverty. Many of those children aren't getting 3 square meals a day so providing school supplies is out of the question. Some of these schools are struggling to take care of the kids basic needs let alone stockpile pencils and tissues. A few miles down the road a school has mostly children from medium-high income level families.

DS1 goes to a charter school which takes children from all over the district. We received a supply list for the classroom and I know if parents did not provide these items his teacher would be trying to cover this expense. The company I work for makes some products that are commonly on school supplies lists. I make sure to send some extra with DS every trimester.

Its common knoweldge that teachers do not earn a fair rate in the US and I don't think they should be spending their own money on crayons and tissues for my kids' boogie nose. Also, I would much rather supply tissues and hand sanitizer than have my kid bring even more coodies home from school.

Bottom line we need education reform in the US.

cattuccino

shellbell3845 said:

In terms of communal school supplies, I feel like it would make more sense to ask parents to contribute a dollar amount. Then you could pool the money and buy things in bulk or at a discount store and get more for your money. 

This probably violates your right to a "free" public education. But this is how the catholic schools I've taught in operate.

Asking for communal school supplies does that too. Parents will choose if they contribute or not, like everything else I would imagine. 

I'm pretty sure there's no such thing as free education. Public or not. 

shellbell3845

cattuccino said:

shellbell3845 said:

cattuccino said:

In terms of communal school supplies, I feel like it would make more sense to ask parents to contribute a dollar amount. Then you could pool the money and buy things in bulk or at a discount store and get more for your money. 

This probably violates your right to a "free" public education. But this is how the catholic schools I've taught in operate.

Asking for communal school supplies does that too. Parents will choose if they contribute or not, like everything else I would imagine. 

I'm pretty sure there's no such thing as free education. Public or not. 

Oh, I completely agree with no free education.

I think there are ways for schools to provide teachers with basic supplies so that parents don't have to -- and so parents who simply can't don't feel bad about it. Teachers also shouldn't have to shell out their own money for tissues and crayons. I don't mind spending my money on books, bulletin board stuff, CDs, etc.

cattuccino

BlueDot818 said:

shellbell3845 said:

In terms of communal school supplies, I feel like it would make more sense to ask parents to contribute a dollar amount. Then you could pool the money and buy things in bulk or at a discount store and get more for your money. 

This probably violates your right to a "free" public education. But this is how the catholic schools I've taught in operate.

Asking for communal school supplies does that too. Parents will choose if they contribute or not, like everything else I would imagine. 

I'm pretty sure there's no such thing as free education. Public or not. 

Idk if parents would be ok bringing in a dollar amount... what if they can't swing the amount but could go buy some of the supplies listed? I never wrote a note home to parents who didn't bring in everything... I would feel better sending half the supplies, rather than sending in half the money.

It could be an open amount, even 25 cents. 
I see your point either way. I do. 

Maybe they could offer both and parents could choose. I just think with a list it may not help anyone either when every parent decides to pick a box of kleenex and then there's no paint or markers. 

I'm probably overthinking this. 

I went to public school and we were never asked to contribute anything for communal use. 

shellbell3845

@cattuccino‌ I might be wrong, but I think it's a newer thing. I vividly remember having things like paste and markers provided by my teacher, to say nothing of Kleenex and paper towels.

cattuccino

I'm guessing it is a newer thing. 

I guess my UO is that i don't have an issue with it. But to ensure that they school gets a variety of what they NEED and not just kleenex or crayons, asking each parent for 10 dollars makes more sense to me so everything can get purchased, possibly with a discount. 

magentawarped

LaurLaurLaur said:

There should be funny wedding cards. Like why doesn't Shoebox make Wedding Cards? Being married is fun and funny.

And why are cards so freaking expensive now? I don't need appliques and beading and a water feature.

I am going to start making my own cards.

I think Spencer's carries some.

karich

TessyMessy said:

Its common knoweldge that teachers do not earn a fair rate in the US and I don't think they should be spending their own money on crayons and tissues for my kids' boogie nose. Also, I would much rather supply tissues and hand sanitizer than have my kid bring even more coodies home from school.

Bottom line we need education reform in the US.

In my area, teachers make an average of $62,000. They get 2 weeks off for the holidays, a week in Feb, and a week in April. Also summer vacation.
When they retire, they get 80% of their salary and free healthcare for life.

Maybe it's a UO, but that doesn't
sound like an UNfair rate to me.

ETA; I don't think teachers should have to pay for classroom supplies out of their own pockets.

shellbell3845

karich said:

TessyMessy said:

Its common knoweldge that teachers do not earn a fair rate in the US and I don't think they should be spending their own money on crayons and tissues for my kids' boogie nose. Also, I would much rather supply tissues and hand sanitizer than have my kid bring even more coodies home from school.

Bottom line we need education reform in the US.

In my area, teachers make an average of $62,000. They get 2 weeks off for the holidays, a week in Feb, and a week in April. Also summer vacation.
When they retire, they get 80% of their salary and free healthcare for life.

Maybe it's a UO, but that doesn't
sound like an UNfair rate to me.

ETA; I don't think teachers should have to pay for classroom supplies out of their own pockets.

This is a fight I just don't have the energy to fight today.

I'll just say this. I'm a professional. I went to college and university for 7 years. I pay into healthcare and retirement. WhyTF shouldn't I make a decent living?

And I can't even with summer vacation.

karich

$60,000+ isn't a decent living?

It's about what I make. And I too am a professional who went to college for 7 years.

I'm not trying to fight with you. I'm genuinely curious.

shellbell3845

Also? The days of 80% pension are over, at least in my state.

shellbell3845

Also? WhyTF is it anyone's business what teachers get paid? IDGAF how much anyone else makes, so why does anyone else get an opinion on what I make?

karich

I'm going to get flamed for trying to have a conversation?

Ok. This is why I never get involved in UO or board drama.

I never said teachers don't deserve every penny they make.
I don't know what teachers make in other states. That's why I said IN MY AREA.

boogerbearoriginal

I'm going to leave this here:

https://www.npr.org/2014/09/02/345104706/a-lesson-in-how-teachers-became-resented-and-idealized

karich

shellbell3845 said:

Also? WhyTF is it anyone's business what teachers get paid? IDGAF how much anyone else makes, so why does anyone else get an opinion on what I make?

Well, because your salary is tax payer funded.
That's not why I am asking....but it's why people care.

shellbell3845

karich said:

I'm going to get flamed for trying to have a conversation?

Ok. This is why I never get involved in UO or board drama.

I never said teachers don't deserve every penny they make.
I don't know what teachers make in other states. That's why I said IN MY AREA.

1. I don't really see any flaming.
2. Several of us disagree with your UO. It's UO. We're not supposed to agree, and we're discussing why we disagree.

shellbell3845

DreamingBabies said:

karich said:

I'm going to get flamed for trying to have a conversation?

Ok. This is why I never get involved in UO or board drama.

I never said teachers don't deserve every penny they make.
I don't know what teachers make in other states. That's why I said IN MY AREA.

I have to say that I agree with you.  You are saying that the average teacher salary in your area is the same as what you make, and they get additional benefits that you don't receive - like more time off and an pension.  To me it's a fair question as to why people don't consider that a fair living in your area.

Because that's an average. It's not a starting salary. That means there are teachers making significantly less (and significantly more). What's COL in your area? If it's high and a teacher's salary is $30k, that's nothing.

shellbell3845

BlueDot818 said:

karich said:

shellbell3845 said:

Also? WhyTF is it anyone's business what teachers get paid? IDGAF how much anyone else makes, so why does anyone else get an opinion on what I make?

Well, because your salary is tax payer funded.
That's not why I am asking....but it's why people care.

Yes. But i always felt it was BS that my name and salary would appear in the local paper once a year. Sure post the average, or how much a 1st, 2nd 3rd year teacher with xyz degree makes. But does the entire metro area need to know Bluedot makes negative 5000 dollars?

Nope, they do not. Taxpayer funded or not.

TessyMessy

karich said:

Its common knoweldge that teachers do not earn a fair rate in the US and I don't think they should be spending their own money on crayons and tissues for my kids' boogie nose. Also, I would much rather supply tissues and hand sanitizer than have my kid bring even more coodies home from school.

Bottom line we need education reform in the US.

In my area, teachers make an average of $62,000. They get 2 weeks off for the holidays, a week in Feb, and a week in April. Also summer vacation. When they retire, they get 80% of their salary and free healthcare for life. Maybe it's a UO, but that doesn't sound like an UNfair rate to me. ETA; I don't think teachers should have to pay for classroom supplies out of their own pockets.

@karich An income is directly correlated with an area's cost of living. So $60K means nothing to me. Is the average 3 bedroom home over $300K? Below $100K? How much is gas per gallon?

I don't think anyone is flaming you.

Also, Education Reform =/= just pay teachers more. Yes, they deserve to be valued higher but more importantly our government needs to do a better job investing in the country's educational system.

cattuccino

I hate money.

Meghan14

I'm too tired to give my full rant, but here are a few short things to think about.  Many of my friends are oil and gas engineers who make 90K+.  As a teacher I worked far longer hours then they do. As I've said before, 11 hour days were my norm.   I also hold a master's degree while many of them do not.  In almost all states the pensions are disappearing and healthcare is not what it once was for teachers. 

Speaking of supplies, teacher bumpies, PM me for a solution to your tissue problem.  

karich

Ok. So what is my UO?
I never said I thought every single teacher in the whole country was paid fairly.
I don't know where you live or what you make.
I said that in my area, that I think teachers are paid a fair wage.

The average salary was actually $70,000 in the 2011- 2012 school year.

https://profiles.doe.mass.edu/state_report/teachersalaries.aspx

karich

To be fair, I don't think I was being flamed.
Someone said I was about to be flamed, so that comment was regarding the possibility of being flamed.

Quoting fail.

boogerbearoriginal

Average salary doesn't take into account starting wage and the length of time (and required additional education/certification) needed to reach higher wages.  Nevermind that in some areas $60k/yr is crap and in others it's great money.

The days of 100% funded retiree healthcare and 80% pensions are pretty much gone from all districts, so while it may still be a benefit teachers in your area receive, it's hardly universal.  Also, that's something almost all government employees used to get and typically no longer receive.

Regarding vacations, while having extended time off every summer and certain weeks during the year is a nice perk, teachers cannot schedule vacations/etc like most other professions so it's also constricting to only be able to travel, etc on those particular times. And from what I understand while the classrooms may not have students, most teachers have to work during some of those times off on various administrative duties.

What I can't understand is why, in general, people have such dislike for teachers earning a wage comparable to other professionals. How else will schools attract the best/brightest talent to teach our children without competative wage/benefits packages?

karich

boogerbearoriginal said:

What I can't understand is why, in general, people have such dislike for teachers earning a wage comparable to other professionals. How else will schools attract the best/brightest talent to teach our children without competative wage/benefits packages?

I hope you don't think this is what I was saying. I DO think teachers deserve fair pay!!

ALL I was saying is that in Massachusetts, I think teachers are paid fairly.

RondackHiker

I'm not a teacher and I'm laughing at summers off.

Laughing.

If it didn't have her name in it, I'd share photos of a friend's lesson plans she made in her "summer off".