HELP!!! DS' misbehavior

Emerald27

My DS is almost 3, and I'm due with his little brother just one week before his birthday. Lately (like, past month or two) he has really become a challenge for DH and I, and I'm not even sure where to start with discipline for his behavior.

Most of what he does seems to be attention-seeking. He used to be very gentle with the cats, for example, but now will chase and try to hit them. When asked to stop, he giggles and does it even more. Our old solution to not listening used to be having him sit with one of us for a time-in to calm down, but now he giggles and then starts crying, says he's sorry, and goes right back to the behavior after the time-in. We've tried taking toys as well, and leaving places when we're out somewhere, but he really doesn't seem to care about those things. He laughs at all possible punishments, sometimes says "ok, take my toy." or "ok, take me home.", and thinks it's funny when they're being carried out.

I'm not even a fan of "punishments" per se, but DH is completely at his wit's end and insists that punishments must become stricter for misbehavior and not listening. I'm afraid he thinks I'm too lenient and just let DS do whatever he wants.

And the not listening seriously scares me!! This morning, DS was standing by his bedroom window and started playing with the curtain. I asked him to stop, told him that the curtain could fall and tried to redirect him by asking him to bring me a toy. He started giggling and pulling harder on the curtain. I rushed over, telling him to please stop, but by the time I had gotten over there, he had managed to pull the curtain rod off the wall, laughing hysterically. DH is going to be furious about the enormous hole left by the screw that came out of the wall. Ugh!

I have no idea honestly how to discipline my child. This is completely new to me (not listening. I know all kids do this but my DS has always been such a good listener, so I'm stumped). I'm not sure if he's testing boundaries because of the new baby coming or just his age or what. I understand that if his need is for attention, I should be trying to meet that need, but I am home and devoting 100% of myself to him every day. I've tried to over-praise good behavior, but that has not lessened the bad at all. There's very little more that's positive that I can do at this point!

Experienced moms, HELP!!! Please!!! I don't know what to do and DH is leaning further and further away from a gentle approach the worse this gets. (

TiffanyBerry

I spend more time coming to DD at this age.  You really have to ramp up the "you have two choices - do you want A or B?" (and, in these cases, B usually involves me getting involved and stopping things).

It's normal for this age - three can be worse than two in many ways.

LOTS of bonding time (which I know will be tough with #2 on the way), lots of staying close enough to intervene (which I know is tough regardless of anything else!).  

Taking toys and leaving can work, but only if the toy or place is something they want.  If he doesn't want the toy or to stay in the place, well, he's telling you it's not about the toy or the place; he's just wanting attention, and using the toy or his behavior in a place as a tool to get it.

I think it's hard to back up the thought process in these times, because the thought process in the kid  is changing.  It's not always so clear, and is quite often more emotional.

I think each new stage like this - a cognitive shift which negatively impacted behavior - took me a few weeks (think 6-8) to recognize and then work out of.  So, hang in there.  I don't think that punishments are necessary either, but SUPER consistent consequences (calmly on your part) are.  (And I know you know that.  But this is a stage where consistency starts to get harder, and becomes more important.)

And you might reread ahaparenting; I re-read a bunch of stuff there occasionally when I need to rethink my parenting process a bit.

aglenn

Two and a half and three were rough for DD.  DS was born when she was 2.5, so I was never sure how much of it was that dynamic vs. the age, but from what others told me the age has a ton to do with it.  For us, routine and structure became super important at this point.  Knowing what she was doing and what was coming next seemed to help focus her.  Unstructured time generally didn't work well.  I also would often follow the Positive Discipline advice of using action without words.  Rather than telling her to stop doing something I would just not say a word and walk over and lead her away.  For some reason this worked much better and we all stayed more calm.  Hang in there!  It is rough; we are in the thick of it with DS now.  Remember to take time for yourself and give yourself a quick time out when you need to!

AlexandraB2014

When I was 3 my younger sister was born, and I started asking to nurse again and behaving in similar ways as your son. My dad was able to leave work for lunch and take me out for some "daddy daughter dates." My mom was at home like you, so I already received majority of her attention, but some "extra special time" every once in a while might help DS1 remember that just because a new baby is on the way doesn't mean he isn't as important. Maybe emphasizing how exciting it is that he gets to be a big brother will help...like including DS1 in an activity to prepare or make something for DS2. I haven't had to deal with this personally, just some advice I have heard...Congrats and Good Luck.

blu-eyedwife

IME some of this is situational (related to the new baby) and some of it is age.  Most 2/3 year olds I know definitely push the boundaries, test the waters, see how far they can go.  Some (my kid included) ramp up the neediness factor, and it sounds like that's also going on here if if feels like you can never give him enough of your attention (and that's exhausting).  I will say though, that I've noticed that with my expecting friends, their children take these behaviors to a heightened level.

Anecdotal, of course, but I think the arrival of a new sibling is difficult to process at any age, but especially challenging when they don't have the verbal or emotional vocabulary to process it.  It's hard for them to put into words that they're fearful and I think one of the ways they test "your love" is through bad behavior - "will mommy still love me if."  So it's more than just attention seeking.

I agree with the suggestion of logical consequences - so only taking something of value to him, but also taking it at an appropriate time.  (So taking toys away for bother the cats isn't really as meaningful)  And physically moving him from dangerous situations (like the curtain) is appropriate at any age.  Sometimes it's not even about the punishment  - he may not care that he can't play in his bedroom as a response to not playing with the curtain, but at least it keeps him away from the unwanted situation.

Emerald27

Thanks, ladies. This is really tough. Toddler parenting is 1000% harder than infant parenting! I don't want to "damage" my son and hurt him irreversibly with bad discipline (lol - am I crazy for worrying that I'll do this?), and we need to figure something out fast.

I love the natural consequences idea, and I'll try to keep in mind what might be a natural consequence that makes sense in a given situation, and take that approach.

The aha parenting articles are great, but they do affirm my worries about messing this up! Lol ...I just want him to know he's loved, and I want him to listen!!! Sooo much to ask of a 3yo, I know.

TiffanyBerry

It's easy to think that we will mess them up.  But humans are SO very resilient, and letting them see that we are human is valuable too.  You have time to be human, to see something isn't working, think about it, and try other things - and yeah, mistakes will be made along the way, but those are normal!

GillianB32

Very insightful thread. Really like the concept of using action without words suggested by @aglenn Have you read somewhere about it? Would love to learn more!

But - I'm a bit confused on one point... what if they resist? Example with the curtain: you come over and try to take your LO away; LO obviously does not want and shows active resistance. What to do?

GillianB32

"Daddy daughter dates" mentioned @AlexandraB2014 sound amazing but not sure DH will support this idea. Looking forward to what everyone else has to share!

aglenn

Below is a link with a little more about the action without words thing.  Positive Discipline is a whole brand these days with books, flash cards, parenting seminars, etc. but the tools and principles are really good.  Checking out one of the books from the library would give you what you need.

Regarding resistance, if it was the curtain example I would just pick the child up and walk away to another room.  It is also really a helpful tool, though, in just day-to-day stuff.  For example, at times if I said, "OK, time to brush your teeth" that would seem to invite a tantrum and a lot of shouting "NO!!!" whereas if I just talk to the kid about something totally unrelated while leading them to the bathroom and put a toothbrush in their hand, no issue.  Kids are weird, but it seems like the 2.5-3 year old age bracket has a sort of autopilot "no" response to verbal instructions at times.  Hopefully that makes sense.

 

https://blog.positivediscipline.com/2011/05/act-without-words-positive-discipline.html

Emerald27

I've been REALLY trying to think carefully about how I speak to DS when he's misbehaving. Instead of "don't xyz" or "stop xyz" or "if you don't stop xyz, then abc will happen", I've been trying to use more positive direction, such as "can you do this for me" or "can you be my big helper and get me this" or "can you be my good listener and do this?"

He has REALLY responded well to it, whereas if I just get madder and keep telling him to stop, it's like he doesn't even hear me. I'm not sure if it's the redirecting to something else that distracts him or gives him the attention he seeks or if positive language just resonates better with him, but it's WORKING!!

I have also been trying to ask fewer times...the broken record thing just does not work. If he doesn't do what I ask, I usually ask one more time to give him another chance, and then I physically go to him and stop him or take his hand and lead him away or take away whatever it was or whatever...I don't just sit there asking over and over anymore for him to stop. I think this is helping us too, because he doesn't expect me to just keep asking. He knows I'm on my way if he doesn't listen.

Emerald27

I really appreciate all the ideas and encouragement in this thread. You ladies are just wonderful!! :x

GillianB32

@ClaryPax Thanks for explaining that's nearly what I had on my mind...I am just a little worried that if I physically remove a resisting child then it is violating their rights and their free will (and also can provoke a tantrum). It feels both right and wrong at the same time...

GillianB32

@aglenn thanks a million for the link and for your explanations!

Emerald27

GillianB32 said:

I am just a little worried that if I physically remove a resisting child then it is violating their rights and their free will...

Since they're children and don't always know what's best and safest for them, their environment, and those around them, there will be plenty of times that you will need to remove them from a situation, or physically take something away from them.

Not even adults have the right to be wherever they want to be and do whatever they want to do.

As the parent, it's your responsibility to teach your child how to act appropriately, and helping them learn to use their free will rightly...and sometimes this means going to them and moving them (or taking something away), especially if it's a dangerous situation. It's not restricting them unnecessarily. It's your job.

TiffanyBerry

Emerald27 said:

 have also been trying to ask fewer times...the broken record thing just does not work. If he doesn't do what I ask, I usually ask one more time to give him another chance, and then I physically go to him and stop him or take his hand and lead him away or take away whatever it was or whatever...I don't just sit there asking over and over anymore for him to stop. I think this is helping us too, because he doesn't expect me to just keep asking. He knows I'm on my way if he doesn't listen.

I think this is SO very important, and I think it works REALLY WELL, as long as we can be consistent as parents (and some days, that's really hard.... and the only reason I can do it on those days is because I know it will *teach her to not listen to me* if I don't get up).

Glad to hear you are seeing a positive change from all your efforts!

RamaLamaDD

Our LO was getting like this and most "punishments" (including a slight smack on the bum) just made her crack up.

Gotta find his weakness - one time I threatened to put DD in bed if she didn't stop and she stopped immediately! IT WAS AMAZING.

Now DH and I do a "We're going to count to three and if you don't stop you're going to bed because you're acting like a baby who is tired." Usually she counts and laughs for one and two but when we get to three she stops (or right after three when I say alright then get to bed).

This has also worked for when she is throwing a tantrum and crying - it's a miracle cure all.

MagickalNarwhal

Emerald27 said:

GillianB32 said:

I am just a little worried that if I physically remove a resisting child then it is violating their rights and their free will...

Since they're children and don't always know what's best and safest for them, their environment, and those around them, there will be plenty of times that you will need to remove them from a situation, or physically take something away from them.

Not even adults have the right to be wherever they want to be and do whatever they want to do.

As the parent, it's your responsibility to teach your child how to act appropriately, and helping them learn to use their free will rightly...and sometimes this means going to them and moving them (or taking something away), especially if it's a dangerous situation. It's not restricting them unnecessarily. It's your job.

One piece to this that I think is SUPER important is that it is our job to keep them safe NO MATTER WHAT their reactions are, and that it's normal and fine to have a emotional reaction to a no or to being taken away. Our job is also to help them navigate their emotional reactions. Not to prevent them.

Re: free will, the theories that resonate with me most around this are RIE concepts, specifically giving kids a "yes" space, where everything is kid safe and they can have complete freedom. I agree that is important for them to have the experience of being empowered to explore without being barraged with conditions and "no"s but that doesn't mean a total lack of boundaries

GillianB32

Thanks @Emerald27! Really like this piece: "I don't just sit there asking over and over anymore for him to stop. I think this is helping us too, because he doesn't expect me to just keep asking. He knows I'm on my way if he doesn't listen."