Perspective - Mom problems
polooo27
member
I know this is long so here's the short version - My mom is constantly making comments about helping, or us not seeing them, or some conflict that could have easily been avoided, but when I try to make her happy she acts like she doesn't care that much. It's one of those only happy when I have something to complain about personalities. The big blow came when they extended their vacation after our twins were born rather then coming home like I thought they said they would to help. We needed lots of help and other people stepped up big time to help us. Now that they're back we're getting more guilt trips about how we didn't let them help.
Okay guys, I don't often ask these kinds of questions, but I'm kind of at a loss with my mom right now. Lady lurkers feel free to answer as well. I'm just posting here because I'm a stranger to all the other boards.
First, a bit of history: I've been married 4 years and have a 3 year old and newborn twins. I have a feeling most of the problems stem from me getting married and my mom no longer being the only woman in my life. I really think she would have been perfectly fine with me never getting married. I was also homeschooled, by the way. No particular reason. I think my mom just didn't want to send me away. The reason for my schooling choice seems to change all the time too.
Before marriage I had zero issues with my mom, but after marriage there are in-laws and you really start to make decisions with your spouse and not with your parents. I think my mom had a hard time with that and didn't know how to deal with it.
The first issues we started having were around the holidays. My in-laws tended to set a time and date early and whoever could come came. My wife has 3-brothers with 2 out of town so they needed to know early to plan accordingly. My mom would wait until the last minute. I would even give her my mostly empty weekend schedule in advance. She tended to plan holidays around my sister and when her only open time-slot conflicted with my only booked time slot I would somehow be made out to be the bad guy. Something similar to this would happen about every major holiday. I swear I tried to offer suggestions and give advance notice to our schedule and would ask what the plans were, but I always ended up being the bad guy. My mom has gone as far as suggesting alternating each holiday with my in-laws. We all live 5-miles apart from everyone. We're not going to miss the in-laws where my son gets to play with all his cousins and go to my mom's where it's just my sister and her husband. We can do that any day of the week. With just a little effort we can come up with a plan that works for everyone.
The second issue involves my son. When he was first born my mom would offer to watch him while my wife ran errands. My wife never took her up on it because it was just easier to take him with her. My wife stays home so it's not like we need much help. So now my mom reminds us of how we never let her help when he was little. The times we did ask them to babysit my dad would be entertaining him when we picked him up and my mom wouldn't even be in the same room. A couple times she wasn't even home. One time she was asleep on the couch (10pm). It's really frustrating when someone is nagging you about helping and when they get the chance they don't even seem to care about what is going on. I thought maybe she just wanted to see our son so I would invite her to the park with us, but she kept canceling last minute. What she ultimately wanted was to have him alone. I think that's weird and it's a bit hurtful because I would think she would want to see me as well.
I don't want to keep rambling about the history any longer. There are lots of other stories to the same tune. I think the key point is she will make little comments about not getting to help, or not seeing us, or we didn't stay long enough but then when we give her the opportunity she either flakes out or doesn't seem to care that we're trying to make her happy. Or worse yet, 2-weeks later she'll be complaining again like we never did anything in the first place. Like it never happened.
Current situation. They go on vacation about 10-hours away through July and August. Our twins were due on August 1st so they decided to go mid-June and come back mid-July and said if something happened they could come back early.
3-days after they left my wife was told she had to stay in the hospital after one of her monitoring sessions. Fine, maybe it'll just be a day or two. I took some time off work to watch our son. Then she was told she had to stay indefinitely. I thought there might be a chance my parent's would come back, but it wasn't something I would expect since nothing major is happening and they just left. 6-days of this and the twins were born. I expected them to come back right away because that's what I would have done, but they told me they were going to stay until the end of July because they had paid to that point (The twins would be 6-days old when they would see them for the first time). I was disappointed, but I tried to understand and the babies were in the NICU and we were managing.
The babies are healthy now, but due to a blood thing (don't want to get detailed) they each needed 4 blood transfusions during their stay. It was really stressful even though the chances of them being ok were high. We also knew they would be in the NICU for 3-4 weeks so not a short term stay. My wife couldn't drive for the first 2-weeks and my son wasn't allowed back in the NICU because he wasn't old enough. The day before my parents were supposed to come back (end of July now) my mom asked if we still needed their help because they were just getting settled in. I told her I would like them to come back (implied for me because it's nice to have your parents around during these type of events for support) and that we could use help watching our son because we were going to the hospital twice a day and had to find a place for him. I was thrown off guard because I didn't think that was even a possible question. The next day I was sent a text that they paid to stay one more week. I was really upset. I didn't respond to it and didn't return the couple phone calls my mom made later that day.
The next day I was sent an e-mail rationalizing their decision and the text. Saying they didn't want to come back to just watch my son a couple times and thought they would be more useful when the twins came home. I replied that that wasn't true. That my wife can't drive and we're having to drop our son off so much and it would be nice if someone else could watch him as well. I also wanted them back just to have some support for me. It was really stressful. I also said that once they come home we wouldn't need the help like we need it now and would also probably rely more on the people (in-laws) who are helping us now. My mom said I was being selfish and childish when I told her these things.
Once my parent's came back they saw them in the NICU twice during the last 2-weeks they were in the NICU (They could have gone anytime they wanted) and my mom made us one meal. Once home my mom and grandma came over. My mom said they would stay for 30-minutes, but after 45 minutes my wife needed to nurse and we had a doctor appointment we needed to go to that I told my mom about. After numerous hints I finally had to tell my mom I have to kick them out now. The next time my parents came over I said 1:30-2 would be a good visit. I think she was offended that I made it an actual time, but we had so much to do I thought it would be easiest.
Yesterday my mom called me to ask when they could see them again. I said you can come over in a little bit because they're about to nurse. Then she asked if I was still upset with them and when I would get over it. I said I was still upset and it would probably take some time (I sure wasn't not upset yet). She went on and defended their decision to stay and said she didn't feel sorry for it. I told her that was fine she felt that way, but that her decision will affect the way I handle future situations. I want my children to be around people who really care about them and not people who only care when it's convenient for them. Then she went on to tell me I've become a control freak because I made her leave for my wife to nurse (we were late to the doctor appointment because of it too) and that I gave them a time slot to come visit. Then she went on to say that we haven't let them help at all. I then had to explain to her that we didn't need help now and that we needed help then. She still didn't get it. I then went into all the history (explained above) to try to get her to get that she isn't interested in helping, but more interested in complaining about not helping.
My mom also told me it's the parent's responsibility to make sure their kids see their grandparent's. I think that's weird, but in a way I have done that because we drop by if we haven't seen them in over a week. I'm not sure what else I could do.
Oh, and my dad has somehow stayed completely out of this. I have no idea what he thinks. My son loves him and when he's around he's great (my son is indifferent to my mom which is saying something because he gets along with pretty much everyone). It's good that he's not in the mix of the drama, but I kind of wish he would speak up. I think he could at least talk my mom down from this, but I'm not for sure if he's trying to do that or if he has the same opinions, but just standing on the sideline while my mom makes the comments
Ok, in conclusion. I don't know what to do. I'm really upset and don't want to be around my mom. I still want my kids to have a relationship with them though. If I try I still get comments. If I don't try she gets mad. I'm constantly getting reminded that we didn't let them help, yet we get no concrete offers of help. It's just well, if you need anything let us know. Then she gets mad if we didn't let them know. Do I just wait for my mom to do something (tried it before) do I try to talk it out calmly (tried it before) do I just go about my life and what happens happens (kind of what I've been doing yet I'm still getting guilt trips). I really feel like there's nothing I can do or not do to avoid these conversations with her.
Re: Perspective - Mom problems
It's not a tricky thing to do since you're apocalyptically busy at the moment. Wait a few months with no contact and see what happens. At the very least the bad habits or poor manner of others wont be transferred to your children.... or in my case they wont be exposed to Alcoholism
I have no problems telling my parents that we have something already scheduled and they know that my ILs come first since their main social engagements have been going on for over 50 years and are scheduled the same year over year. Around Christmas, my ILs do invite my parents over for Christmas.
I think it is time for you to start setting boundaries with your parents and tell them how you really feel. If they care about you then they will try to be better.
My brother is the same way about scheduling things so a lot of times I stop asking since it doesn't do any good. If we can participate we will but we don't count on them. That being said, if we do give my parents enough of a warning, say a month, they can usually help babysit or do other things.
I have tried talking to my mom and helping her out with whatever issue she has, but she'll eventually just say, well this isn't going anywhere or I don't want to talk about it anymore. She's not willing to come up with a solution with me. She just wants me to admit fault and when the conversation doesn't go in that direction and she realizes she's in the wrong she'll want to change the subject. Then a few months down the road the same conversation will happen again. So I finally blew up and called her out on everything all at once.
Her response was I don't even know this guy anymore. You're becoming a control freak and are being selfish. Each event I called her out on she didn't have a reason or an apology, just some sort of excuse how it was my fault. Then I gave her examples of how it wasn't my fault and told her how I have tried to make her happy. So once again she realized she was wrong and wanted to end the conversation without an apology or anything. Yesterday she offered to make us dinner in her attempt to make me forget about what happened. I'm guessing we'll have the same conversation yet again in a couple weeks and she'll mention that she tried to help and doesn't realize why I'm still upset about everything. I don't want dinner. I want her to realize how her behavior is affecting us and would like some change.
Thanks so much for your post. This is essentially what we have done. For probably the past year we have just ignored the comments and tried to take all emotion out of it.
What sparked a reaction this time was when we announced my wife was pregnant she started making comments about how we didn't let her help with our first. I finally broke down and sent her an e-mail that my wife stays at home and taking care of just one was easy and we didn't really need help, but that she could see him anytime she wanted. She just had to call. I also told her we would probably eventually need more help when the kids get older and into activities.
She said she understood, but not once did she make any effort to see my son after that. It was all the same stuff. She didn't change at all and it's like the conversation never happened.
What hurt was that they extended their vacation a week after the twins were born even though I said we actually needed help and would like her to come back. It's really hurtful when your mom has pestered you about not getting to help for the past 3-years, but when you really need it she's not willing to help.
Basically, she wants to help when it's only convenient for her, which tends to be in a way that is not convenient to us. Then she has the nerve she still complain about it when I point it out to her.
We both want my family (mum inclusive) to be involved but we are not sure that it will be enough for my mum. She really does want control and can't cope with not being my number 1.
This is very true to the situation I described above. If your mom is like mine there isn't much you can do. I sometimes think my moms tries to create situations where she can be hurt. Like waiting until the last minute to schedule for a holiday so when I can't make it she can say she's always put second. Or she'll not call for 2-weeks and then complain that she hasn't seen me. Then say it's also my responsibility to call and makes me feel like the problem. So I'll invite her to stuff and she'll either come and not act excited or cancel because she's tired. So I'll give up and then the guilt trip of me not doing anything starts over again. It's a no win situation.
As far as what you can do. Maybe your mom is different and you'll have better success than me. I really thought my mom was going through a phase and would come around, but it's only become worse. Like others have said try to take your emotions out of it. Keep your mom involved, but don't let her craziness get to you. Do what's best for your family. Let your kids see her so they have an opportunity to form a relationship. Don't beat yourself up if your mom makes you feel like you're not doing enough.
Thank you for this response. Your situation was the same as ours. Wife was on bed rest for a week before our babies came 6 weeks early (4-weeks in the NICU). I really wanted my parents there, but understood they just left and probably wanted to stay a little while. It was really upsetting to me when I told my mom I was upset they extended their vacation because she thought they would be more help when the babies came home and not while they were in the NICU. I even explained to her that we needed more help while they were in the NICU and explained why. She still said she wasn't sorry and told me I was acting selfish and childish for being upset. It was really hurtful. Then when they got back my mom made a comment about not letting her help. I said we didn't need the help now and that I had already explained that. Between the stress of the babies, being exhausted, and these comments I let my emotions take over.
I think I'll do as you say and go with the canned response. Mom, you can see the kids whenever you want, you just have to call. Then change the subject. The thing with the pleasant surprise is that there's nothing more frustrating than an on again off again parent. It's becoming too much for me to say my mom has been really good lately and then she does something to ruin it and I'm down again about her. It's also crazy how to keeps finding new thing to complain about.
The first time she visited from vacation my wife needed to nurse before a doctor appointment. We kept hinting that we needed to feed them, but she wouldn't leave. I finally told my mom I have to kick you out now so they can eat. She still didn't get it or move fast. Next time I talked to her she asked me what's the deal with we can't be there when they eat. I told her my wife was nursing and wasn't comfortable doing it in front of people yet. She still didn't really get it. Most people just say ohhhhhh, but I feel like I have to explain every little thing to my mom.
I say keep doing what you are doing. Just be honest with yourself and even when she commits to helping - take it with a grain of salt because you know you can't count on her. Things have come to a head with my mother a couple of times where I was prepared to cut off contact if I had to. Usually when she would see I wasn't backing down she'd back off. Sounds like she needs to play the role of victim so you get to be the villain - you can't win, doesn't matter what you do. Look after you and your kids first.
Try not to take her crap personally, its not about you. Its about her, everything clearly is. She will always justify her actions and when she repeats her excuses enough she will start to believe it. My mom does it all the time - I call her the Queen of Revisionist History.
I suspect that you are right and she resents that with all your new responsibilities ( wife and kids) you can no longer cater to her need to manipulate you. Sounds to me like she is dangling a carrot trying to make you beg for her help - you don't need that crap.
Good luck and sorry you are going through all this. Hope your family is doing well and its good to hear you have support from others you can count on.
You basically nailed it. It's a bit comforting to know other people deal with this same thing and maybe it's a fairly normal crazy mom thing. It's just rough because for the first 25 years of my life I had no clue my mom would be like this. Up until I got married my mom didn't have any "competition" so there was no need for this side of her to ever come out.
Does she blame her own childhood at all? My mom likes to do that when she gets cornered on something...
@juniper75 - That's exactly why it's hard. Throughout everything I still wanted my mom to be there when our babies were born. There was just a strong urge for her to be there. It's hard to explain, but I hope you know what I mean.
Maybe it's unintentional self absorption. She was used to getting her way for the past 25 years and never had to work around anyone's schedule but her own. Now she just can't adjust to the new role of sharing and working around other's schedules. I kept telling myself it was just a phase and she would figure it out, phases don't last for 4 years though.
Childhood is very interesting. She has never blamed it, however a couple times I have tried to think maybe it had something to do with it. Her dad left when she was 16 and has basically been uninvolved in any family even though he still lives in town. She was mostly put in charge of her 4 younger siblings, but she doesn't seem close to any of them as an adult. My dad isn't close to his 2 brothers either, but I don't know if that has anything to do with this. Not sure how to relate these 2 situations because neither of my parent's have ever really talked about their childhood.
@Ausdad - The part where she is bringing this up to family members is the worst part to me and is a huge sign that it's her problem. She is looking for people to back her up by only telling them one side of the story. You're put in a very unfair position because of this.
My dad basically stays out of this. I don't know if he sides with my mom, with me, or no one. This is sort of a good thing, but it would be nice if he just didn't stay on the side lines. It wouldn't fly if my dad told me to fix it. Why doesn't your dad fix it. Why can't he be the voice of reason. You're obviously not being listened to.
You trying to fix this with your mom might work right after the conversation, but in my experience it always goes back to the same. If your dad wants it fixed he should be the one doing the fixing, not you.
@polooo27 Looks like everyone is saying similar things, and as a child of a Crazy Lady mom, its comforting to know that I'm not alone. I guess my mom was always a little like what's being described when I had girlfriends, but it turned on full blast when I got married and had my first daughter. At first she was ok, but as time wore on, it got worse and I couldn't count on her. Heaven forbid I called her on that, it had to be my fault or miscalculation or non-communication. Friction started between her and my first wife and like a good negotiator, I tried to fix it...bad news there. Learned a big lesson that I carried into my current marriage. (To be clear, my first marriage had its own major problems, my mom was but a small part)
I think drawing some lines and not shutting your mom out is a good plan. She is still your mom, and I remind myself of that weekly. I only shut my mom out completely when she directly attacks my family. She can say what she'd like about me, I am a full fledged adult, who she birthed, and I let it slide off. But she may not talk in a derogatory fashion about my wife and kids. Its happened a few times, and after a few months, I try to slowly build things back. Its never the same, the lines don't move and I make them clear to her.
We talk and text a few times a week. Not enough for her, but I don't want to take the chance of a "hard right turn" and not talking at all. I try to keep the conversations about the positive and don't really go to her with negative things. I still ask advice and keep her tuned in to most of what's going on. As long as she stays clear of the boundaries I have set for my family, we're good. I do miss my mom from when I was younger, but we do grow older, and I suppose we all change.
One piece of advice, don't compare your mom to your grandmother, even if you are pretty sure she is changing into your grandmother (or what you remember of your grandmother). That pretty much starts a fight right away.
@AusDad - I know what you mean by "leaving the family". My sister drew some hard and fast boundaries when she was in her early 20's and I was supportive of my mom and didn't draw those same lines then. I think that this made it harder for me when I was married with a child (late 30s) and also enabled my mom to keep acting unproductively. I think you can draw boundaries without being a jerk. These need to be healthy boundaries that support your family, and at the end of the day, you don't have to explain why to anyone except your wife.
I think people respect those choices and I hope for both you and your families, your extended (not living with you) families do respect your choice to support your wife and kids!!
sorry for such a long reply. I could probably write much more....I'll leave it at this.
I agree. I can't expect them to come back from vacation, but it sure hurts when your parents choose more vacation time over something like this. It really changed how I view them. I've basically decided to take things as they come. I'm not preventing them from seeing us, but I'm sure not going out of my way. I'm just going to enjoy my family and the people who want to be involved will find a way to be involved.
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@MickeyM04 - Thanks for the reply. It means a lot to know someone else is in the same spot. Nothing has really changed since that first post and I haven't really done much thinking about it. We spend so much time raising our kids and making sure their needs are met I just don't feel like I need to put in the effort to please my mom when nothing I've done in the past has really pleased her.
I think she's starting to catch on that she doesn't have a relationship with my son and that he's really timid around her. I feel like she blames me for this. I can't help her out though. She's had lots of opportunities to get to know him. He loves my dad and he sees my dad just as often as my mom. He loves my sister and he sees her far less than my mom. My mom rarely acknowledges him when he's around, but expects him to talk to her like everyone else. It's like she wants results without putting in the effort. When she does acknowledge him it's usually in the form of parenting (wash your hands, pick up your toys etc.). It drives me nuts and it's probably weird for him.
I also don't think she appreciates the effort it is to raise twins. It's hard. Really hard. Yet she has still asked us to drop by like it's easy for us to create 3 hours in our day. She also tells me upfront that she won't be feeding us. So we have to try to get everyone fed, go over there, and then come up to try to feed everyone again. A 2-hour visit to my mom's wipes out our whole day so it's tough when she doesn't act like she appreciates that effort.
Yeah, I'll end it there. I'm tolerating her from a distance. I answer when she calls, I'll abide by requests if it's convenient, but I've stopped going out of my way thinking it might stop her from complaining. Nothing changes and it just makes me an enabler.
I'll add a story as well.
We bumped into my mom at Costco while we were looking at the 93" teddy bears. My mom said she thought of me when she saw those so it was funny I was right there looking at them. I made a little small talk and then she asked my son if he got good Halloween candy and something else. He didn't really respond and I wasn't going to force him.
Then I got him out of the cart so he could look at the bears. I think I said something dumb like I was going to throw him in. I didn't throw him in but I let him peak over the box they were in. Anyway, I didn't hear this exchange, but after my throwing comment my wife told my mom, "did you drop him on his head". It was just a joke, my mom replied with, "he's not the boy I raised". My wife didn't know how to respond and didn't say anything.
When I turned around next I saw my mom walking away. My wife didn't even realize she had started walking away. No bye or anything. We don't know if she was mad or what. Just very strange.
I don't know if her comment was a joke or not because she has said something similar to me in a previous conversation when I was mad about their response to the NICU situation.
Anyway, that's the story.
I'm hoping it doesn't get to that point. About a week and a half before Thanksgiving my mom called to make Thanksgiving plans. This was actually good for her. She mentioned she'd like to see us before Thanksgiving. I said, "sure, give me a call when there's a good night for you". I left it completely up to her. I never received the call and nothing was ever mentioned of it. Thanksgiving day went ok.
I feel like the relationship isn't stressing me out as much because I've started to keeps things simple and not engaging in her complaints. If she ever complains about not seeing us I say, "just call". I've done it twice now and haven't received a call.
The only pitfall to this is I'm a bit more distant and don't feel as open as I would like to be. It's hard to find the right balance.
Maybe your mom is a daytime person and gets tired in the evenings, and that's why she wanted him to visit while your wife ran errands, because it was during the day, and shorter durations, perhaps 2-3 hours. Also the times you've asked them to babysit, if it was mostly for evenings maybe she was tired, or for longer durations (it takes 4-6 hours depending on the event when my husband and I get babysitting for dates, etc.), and if you arrived and your dad was still playing with your son, maybe he took the second "shift" and your mom had already played with him first, or for a shorter duration. I can understand an older woman being asleep at 10 p.m. after playing with a child. It's OK if she's not home while your dad watches him, maybe it wasn't the most convenient time for her.
Also maybe your parents don't have enough money for a nice vacation very often, and they got caught up in having fun and wanted to stay. That may hurt you, but think about how your mom may have been hurt repeatedly for up to 3 years that she didn't get the time she wanted or needed with her grandson during the daytime for shorter durations, during time that your wife ran errands. Something seems off in that what your mom really wanted was some daytime visits for short durations during errand-running, but you guys didn't fulfill that request, which was what she really wanted, because it was more convenient just to take him? Why deny her that over a 5 minute out of the way drive. I used to drive 30 minutes one way in heavy traffic to take my child and drop them off for my husband's mother so she could visit with him or her, I rotated kids so she could see one at a time since that's what she requested.
You're wondering what you could do now? How about offer to drop off the grandson for the daytime visits she wanted over the last 3 years? Or other visits alone?
If things don't improve you both may need counseling.
@Slappytrout - That's really rough. Sorry. Things have actually gotten better, I think, time will tell. My mom has never been mean to our son and the last few times we've seen my parents my mom has been a little more involved.
The only thing that ever bugged me much is she would sometimes act like the parent (take charge of having him wash hands for example). That's really pretty minor, but bugged me in that was the only way she was interacting with him. Nothing life scarring like you went through though. I'm glad you've recovered and figured out it was their issue and nothing about you.
It's my MIL that's crazy, same thing she'd be happy if my partner never found me and stayed single all his life. She can't handle any of my opinions and what were deciding for the baby.
My partner and I had very different up bringings and MIL has made it very clear that apparently my up bringing and how my parents raised me wasn't good enough. Unfortunately that's how my partner and I have decided to raise the baby.
We live 5 mins from his family and all mine is 2 hours away. Yet my family already make so much more of an effort now than they do.
The only thing I can do is bite my tongue and be polite. And I just won't let myself become a crazy MIL or mum!
@almakie - You should go into more detail about the differences between you and your husbands upbringing. It's interesting that your MIL doesn't like your upbringing, but your husband (her son) likes it more than his own upbringing.