potty training boys - from sitting to standing

greyt00

If taught to pee sitting first, how do you transition to standing?  Right now I am thrilled that DS1 is using the potty so I have no desire to change anything. But I'm just wondering because he sits for everything, and it's going well.  

Also, this sort of ties into DS2....  Apparently, he has peed in the potty at day care but is doing it standing up.  I have qualms about this because my nephew learned to pee standing up and then he had HORRIBLE problems sitting on the potty to go #2.  He was also constipated a lot so maybe that was the whole source of the problem.  Anyway, DS2 has a really tiny pee-thing.  I'm starting to wonder if something is wrong (like it is not growing with the rest of him).  I will ask at his 2 year check-up.  He is really fat down there and looks totally different from DS1.  Both were circ'd by the same dr.  They seemed to indicate at day care that standing up was easier because it couldn't be directed well (because it's so small).  I need to get more details but I'm not the one who drops off/picks up most of the time.  I would like for him to pee sitting down.  He asks to go potty at home but won't sit long.  I have not pushed it.  He usually asks to go and then poops right afterward in his diaper.  What should we do?  I guess for DS2 this is not special needs (yet) so I apologize for the 2-pronged post....When DH gets back home we can make more of an effort to keep him on the potty and entertain him so he sits longer.  And have him watch DS1 pee in the potty. 

MirandaHobbes

I'll be watching this thread. My guess is that it will have something to do with a social story. DS learned to pee sitting down and now (age 6) refuses to stand up. Well, he won't refuse- he will when I tell him to, but he won't when he goes on his own, which is 99% of the time. His reasoning is sound- it's easier, and more comfy. He's a couch potato at heart so looks forward to any excuse to have a seat, so to speak. When he stands he gets really anxious about accidentally peeing on the seat. I tried telling him that in kindy all kids stand, hoping that his rule-abiding nature would kick in, but it never did because they use private bathrooms and no one is around to enforce it. We need to nip it in the bud before he starts using public bathrooms at school.

My husband also needs to enforce this. DH is a pee behind closed, locked doors kindof guy and despite his occasional gentle reminders to tell DS to stand, I think he could work on it a bit harder.

No idea on question #2!

greyt00

I haven't asked the BCBA on the sitting vs. standing routine.  I figure for now we will just enjoy the fact that he is using the potty.  It is wonderful.  I was very tired of his nasty poo diapers.  Besides, he's sick right now so no need to change anything in a hurry.  He probably should get more established first.  

I wish I could see a picture of a normal, 2-year old "little soldier."  I realize that is not going to happen and there are good reasons for it, LOL.  But I have a good reason for wanting to see!  Blah.  I don't think I can wait until his 2-year appointment.  It's 7 weeks away.  He was at the doctor only 2 weeks ago.  Grrrrrrrrrrrrr.  I'm annoyed with DH for not being more interested in this issue.  Hello, you *have* one of those stupid things.  They've only been working with DS2 on the potty for a couple of weeks.  They take him 3 times per day.  I don't even know that he has a preference himself at all, I just know if won't be good to have them doing it one way and us another.  And if tiny soldier is the only reason he is standing up, well that's lame.  

I hope your DH will come around to being more helpful on this one. 

bumpuser511563

Yeah, I am going to follow this post.

DS has mastered peeing sitting down and pooping sitting down during the day.

One morning, I saw that he took off his night time pull-up and did not wet the bed. I woke him up and he managed to pee standing up half-asleep.

I can't convince him enough to pee standing up when he is wide awake.

The preschool teacher had DS do it towards the end of the school year. Now he is back to square one. I will start the pee standing up with the new kinder teacher so we can keep at it to get DS to pee standing up.

Hiccup15

DS1 first learned to pee sitting. We were thrilled so we just left it. After about a year, it was the summer before he started preschool. I figured it would be a good time to teach him how to stand so he could start doing it in public restrooms.

It wasn't too bad of a process for us. I told him that public toilets can be dirty and when peeing it's best if you stand. It did take a few months for him to get it. DH also would show him when we were out. Now he pees standing up in public restrooms but at home he still pees sitting down, which I don't mind.

With DS2 I would think it would be easier to direct him sitting down if he has a smaller penis? My DS2 is also smaller than DS1 was. We haven't starting potty training, however, he does pee on the potty before bath time. We have a baby bjorn potty and its pretty spacious so when he sits, it just naturally points at an angle where the pee stays in. The front  of the potty is higher up too so I think it would be pretty hard if they are sitting for it to spill out unless they are pointing it up.

Here is the one we have.

https://www.amazon.com/BabyBjörn-055115US-BABYBJORN-Potty-Chair/dp/B000056J7L

Also, if he is doing fine standing up I probably wouldn't worry too much at this point and just see how it goes. I know of a few boys who were trained to stand to pee right away with no problems. We were the weird ones. So I would think it might just depend on the child. However, if you wanted to you could also just see what he prefers while at home and if it is sitting you could just let them know you noticed he prefers sitting at home so that is what you are doing and you don't want to confuse him so you want him to sit at daycare as well.

Good luck! Potty training is so much fun 

greyt00

I was thinking that when sitting, since they could not direct it (because it is TINY and too short  to drop at all), it sprayed too far out to go in the toilet (it might have sprayed upward).  When standing I am imagining it just arced over into the toilet.  I think their toilets are smaller/shorter.  But I've never seen this phenomenon, so I am guessing. 

I am going to call a pediatric urologist to see if we can bring DS1 in.  I don't want to waste time at the pedi with a "well, he's fat down there" vague/non-answer.  I have very limited time for appointments.  I will go home tonight and try to get a better look at it first, figure out what in the world I am gong to say to these people to get an appointment. 

I will try to get DS1 to sit at home (since he has to sit to poo) and if that starts working will ask them to do it at day care, too.  I won't be able to do much until the weekend. 

greyt00

-auntie- said:

"little soldier"

"pee-thing"

"one of those stupid things"

This is me just expressing frustration at DH for having to go out of town so much.  Last night DS2 said he wanted to go potty so he was sitting there and then DS1 started screaming that HE wanted to go potty.  There is just one of me, I cannot have them both on the potty at the same time.  Blah.  Last month DH was gone for TEN FREAKING DAYS.  Now he's gone for 4.  I'm annoyed.  And right now I'm anxious about what is wrong with DS2's apparatus.  Hey, a new word for it!  ;-P

All kidding aside, this seems really hard for you. I'm sorry, sometimes SN parenting isn't like what we expected it to be. But it's important to get to a place where you can deal with genitalia comfortably because as a SN mom, you will be more involved in this arena and for longer than your garden variety mom.

Don't worry, I told him it's a penis when he asked.  I just don't particularly care to throw these word around online.  And when he pointed to it and said, "that's a big one" i managed not to laugh!

Learning to use the bathroom in the expected manner is critical for boys on spectrum who could invite ridicule, or worse unwanted approaches, by doing something odd, different or unexpected in the restroom. There are all kinds of resources about teaching boys on spectrum the societal norms for the process.

IME, most boys make the transition to a standing position by kindie at the latest. In a lot of mainstream preschools and elementary schools, urination is something of a bonding experience for boys. The kid who won't stand with the others will be teased at best.

OK good to know.  This is only day 14 of potty training for DS1.

A dad, older brother or grandpop can initiate the instruction. I've known single moms who have done Social Stories for their sons to help them understand a simple rubric for when to stand and when to take a seat. 

I think a big part of this lesson is that there are times when you are alone, it doesn't matter what you do. If your son is having success standing in preschool, I think it would be foolish to mess with that. I would also suspect your nephew either ate a diet that didn't include enough fiber/fluids or was withholding his stool- standing to pee doesn't cause constipation.

I know he was constipated, but not sure why. He's always been a better eater (variety) than either of my kids.  And his mom was the picky one, not me, and she got the good eater.  Cute, cute.  Nephew always seemed to have some sort of emotional issues so that could have been related, too.  I just thought that if DS2 likes to pee standing up but doesn't like to sit, he could develop potty poo problems, because it requires sitting.  But if he was willing to pee sitting down then sitting would be come a more positive experience and make it easier to poo. 

DS always really strongly identified as a boy and was absolutely taken with the concept of urinals so making the transition wasn't an issue here. He also enjoyed the novelty of the "pee can" on my dad's boat or "making friends with a tree" as the scouts put it.

LOL....

greyt00

A young relative of mine had something called "hidden penis" (it didn't "pop out") and needed surgery after age 2.  Worried that's where we're headed.  Sounds similar.    He had some extra skin to work with because he was uncirc'd.  No idea how they fix this.  Ack!

thefuturemrskudla

DS learned sitting down, and then he watched DH do it standing. DS thought that was cool and copied him.
Some people use cheerios in the toilet as a game of target practice.
He will pee sitting down now only when he needs to poop, too.

MaxandRuby

I would think it would be confusing for him to be told he has to sit down to pee at home but it allowed to pee standing up at daycare.  Since males, in general, stand to pee I would encourage the standing.  Keep in mind that the special needs I deal with are not what you deal with so I am far from an informed person on this issue). As for sitting to pee (either of my boys), they were taught to point their penis down.  For DS2, I also have him lean forward a little because that keeps the penis pointed into the toilet. 

DS1 (typical child, 6yr) was taught to pee sitting down and he made the transition around kindergarten to standing up.  We did a lot of Daddy showing him how to pee standing up.

DS2 (SN, 4.5yr with CP) sits to pee....but he has to.  There is not much choice because he cannot stand independently.  He is also too short for most bathrooms to stand and pee.  Hopefully he will gain enough skills to pee standing up at some point, but now is not the time.  Shoot, we are a year into potty training and he isn't fully day trained yet (don't get me started, I'm not pleased about it).

greyt00

While I agree it's nice if he stands to pee, the problem with that is he doesn't want to sit on the potty and I don't know if he has ever gone #2 in the potty.  That would require sitting.  His sheets don't indicate any BMs at day care in a long time... which can't be true.  They must not be writing down poops in the diaper.  I have also never seen him pee standing up, so I don't know how they're doing it.  I pick up DS1 from another location so if I want to pick up DS2, I have to bring DS1 in with me, and he runs wild in the room, and by the time I get there, only 1 teacher is in the room (and not even his regular teacher by that time, it's late) and I don't think they can really give me a demo.  It's like I'd have to take part of a day off just to get them to show me what's going on!  When we drop him off in the morning, he's always upset, so we're not going to get it done then.  

He barely has enough of a penis to point.  Maybe he doesn't even have enough (like I said, I've never seen this happen).  Since I can't ever talk to anyone in person, I guess I will have to call and discuss this.  Ugh.  #1 they need to write down if he's pooping and #2 they need to describe this pee in the potty phenomenon. 

PipSqueak0313

Regarding the size issue.....there is a condition called micropenis that is an actual physical issue. Regarding the standing to pee, some time after ds was tall enough to stand and pee in the toilet is when ds1 started standing to pee.

SueBear

DS started standing when he saw boys standing.  It must have been when he moved out of kindergarten (where there were regular toilets) to first grade, where they went to the boys room which had urinals.  And, since urinals don't have doors, he saw all the other boys pee that way.

I would suggest having your H take DS to the bathroom when they are out (at the library, at a restaurant).  Don't have DS go with you.  He will see bathrooms used "the way men do"  (of course, there are still stalls in men's rooms, so DS can use a toilet if he wants).  

Also, if you want him to practice, I have heard (though DS was never interested), that you can have "target practice" by throwing a few cheerios into the toilet and see if he can hit them!

newbee36

DS started doing both sitting and standing versions almost simultaneously. At first he was opposed to standing, and we did not push for it, just told him how convenient it would be in certain situations. It didn't take long, he decided to do that on his own (that's how he functions, he has to figure it out by him self and to be certain that he can do it, and it has to be his decision). I don't know anything about your son's personality (your DS1), but you may try to just talk to him and let him be for a while. He may decide for himself when he is ready. 

d.f

I'm pretty sure DS learned to pee standing up during the summer in the forest and backyard. It was a few years ago so my memory may be off. DH likes his privacy in the bathroom so I doubt he picked it up from him. However, DH has started to really go over the bathroom etiquette with him because he has been insisting on going into the men's room instead of with me when it's just the two of us. He also only has 1 more year of a bathroom in the classroom before he has to use the main one at school.