TTC/Work Related Vent

lgsdesigner

Let me preface by mentioning I work in an environment that is mainly all men. There are only 4 women in the entire building. The women that work here are frowned upon if they have to leave early to take their children to appointments, call off if their child is ill, or if they go on maternity leave.  Some of the women are even talked to about it. If the men leave for any of this, nothing is said to them. Extremely sexist. 

Yesterday, I had a sit down with my boss and the HR manager (both men, of course) about me needing time off in September for my honeymoon. After discussing the basic attendance info, the HR Manager starts asking me about my fiancé. Asking where I met him,  and if he had any kids of his own. I told him he didn’t have any, and he gives my boss a look then me a look like “Are you going to have more kids??” He then says “Does he want any more kids?” (in other words…indirectly asking me if I am going to have any more). I smiled and said “We already have two. We shall see.”

He then smiles unsatisfied with my answer, and the meeting is over.

Today—my boss comes to me and tells me he is going to be hiring on another designer. I then asked him if the designer would work under my supervision and what the designer would be doing. He tells me that the designer will be designing a large website by themselves for a big brand name company, and would work independently from me. Now—that is normally MY job. I look at him and say “Is there any reason why I wouldn’t be able to design this myself?” He goes “Well….you are very busy right now with other things we are working on, and who knows what the future brings and when you might need time off. So…this person would just be a fill in.” He then smiled awkwardly and walked away.

Now- my thoughts are A) They are going to fire me because I am a women that may reproduce, or They are trying to get a man in here so they can get rid of me and not worry about any possibility of maternity leave/childcare issues,  or C) They are trying to fill a spot in case I get pregnant and need to go on leave.

I am leaning towards A. I don’t trust them, and this is really unsettling and sudden. They never hire ANYONE around here, and to suddenly do that for a job I can do? Ummm…something is up.

Radiantly

Oh what a stressful situation!! Is there someone in HR that you can talk to in private?

Austrogermokee

Don't go to HR. Do not pass go, go directly to a lawyer to discuss your options. This is discrimination based on gender and family status, and it's against the law.

lgsdesigner

@Radiantly- No. That was the HR Manager that was questioning if I was going to have any more kids. He is the head honcho.

@Austrogermokee- I think you're right. For them to find out that I *might* have more kids, and then to start automatically hiring new people that are doing MY job? Red flag.

mdogan29

Omigosh!! What a-holes!!!!!!!!!! You don't think there's any way they saw any of your posts (like monitoring your computer -- or do you post using your phone?) and know you don't plan on coming back when you do have #3? Definitely lawyer, that is not even a legal line of questioning is it? It's not like they were buddy-buddy w/ you before, were they (to be asking such personal questions)??

hooligans4

Lawyer up lady

lgsdesigner

@mdogan29 - I mainly post on my phone and my iPad (my personal iPad).

Even if I do use the work computer, I delete my history. They also don’t monitor our computers…just our work phones.

And no—they were never buddy-buddy with me. My boss is intimidated by me, though. That could have a lot to do with it. He also doesn’t like when I take ANY time off (even for a doctor’s visit).

Austrogermokee

I would get a lawyer, and if they start questioning you again, just say something like, "I'm sorry, but it is not appropriate to ask me personal family questions. My dates off will be XYZ, and here is what I am planning to do so the work is covered during that time." I know you felt stuck and flustered the first time, but it helps to have stock responses ready.

lgsdesigner

@Austrogermokee - I will talk to a friend of mine who is a lawyer and see what he says. I am pretty sure I will have a case. Especially if they let me go....a definite lawsuit.

Good call on the "stock answers". I will do that next time they get nosey. 

Thanks for your help.

Austrogermokee

My husband is a lawyer, and I had to file an EEOC complaint at my former job due to disability discrimination. I didn't win much cash, but my former boss was disciplined and her reputation is shot. So I'll count that as a victory.

marijaa333

Document EVERYTHING. Times, names, conversations, emails, phone records.

This makes me SO MAD.

My female manager put out a feeler to me as well - she's a single woman in her 50s and basically an ego maniac. I'm looking to switch teams asap but it will take time.

lgsdesigner

@marijaa333 - I am definitely documenting everthing. They just can't get away with this bullcrap.

Why do you think I started my own side design company in the first place? To get away from corporate America! So. Done.

danieleandwayne

Those questions they asked are SO FREAKING ILLEGAL!!! 

I agree with the document everything and the lawyer up comments. ILLEGAL ILLEGAL ILLEGAL!!!

marijaa333

And then researchers wonder why we don't have more women in the CXO corner offices. THIS IS WHY, you bunch of head-in-sand academics! (No disrespect generally to academics, especially as I'm writing up my PhD thesis this summer, LOL, only those who "struggle" to find the reasons for persisting gender inequality in the workplace.)

TAT2MAMI

-+

 

 

What a load of crap @lgdesigner! I agree with PP. Document everything and get some legal advice. I'm sorry this happened. Those numb nuts were WAY out of line!!

 

 

 

 

 

KirstenAlecia

oh my gosh some people. 

When i had my daughter i came back from maternity leave to find a new manager in charge at the job i held way back when. He was a known sexist asshat. When i cam back i was treated bad and downright bullied. So much so that i filed a complaint and won a transfer request. I wish i had been older and wiser and filed a lawsuit……..that same manager was fired the next year for the same thing. Too many complaints from too many women.

marijaa333

While we're trading donkey stories, I was given a bad mark on an essay for not welcoming a professor's advances in grad school (I gave him the trademark female "you are disgusting" look instead of whatever he was hoping for). I am not one to complain about getting bad marks but it was a damn good essay, full of timely, original research on the WTO, and I knew it and he knew it; he then asked me to re-write it, which I did, making it even better, but he never increased my grade. The grade stuck out like a sore thumb on my transcript. Nothing like this had happened to me before or after. Thankfully the graduate director (also a male, but with a different moral code) caught on and strongly supported my application for further grad studies. The following year, the professor in question was fired for sexually inappropriate behavior with students. So in a sense the situation was rectified.

I'm not saying @lgsesigner's manager is in the same category, just that sexist behavior runs rampant. We all do need to do something of consequence to stop it whenever it's possible.

Davie813

Ugh--so sorry you're dealing with this! 

I'm not sure it actually is illegal for him to ask you (as you're an existing employee, not an interviewee), but it's definitely inappropriate, and it's obviously illegal for him to discriminate against you based on your reproductive status.  PPs have given great advice--document, document, document!

(I hope things never come to the point where you have to use any of the material you're collecting, of course.  Good luck!)

marijaa333

I agree, the illegal bit would be the firing (or some excuse that amounts to firing). I think signs point to that possibility, although he's not technically doing anything wrong yet. The questions/behavior is just annoying at this point; if he wanted to really only cover for her during mat leave, he could say, ("hey, that's amazing and we really value your well-being and your expertise; let's work together to find the best way to handle your workload while you're away, if you do decide to have a child").

Davie813

marijaa333 said:

While we're trading donkey stories, I was given a bad mark on an essay for not welcoming a professor's advances in grad school (I gave him the trademark female "you are disgusting" look instead of whatever he was hoping for). I am not one to complain about getting bad marks but it was a damn good essay, full of timely, original research on the WTO, and I knew it and he knew it; he then asked me to re-write it, which I did, making it even better, but he never increased my grade. The grade stuck out like a sore thumb on my transcript. Nothing like this had happened to me before or after. Thankfully the graduate director (also a male, but with a different moral code) caught on and strongly supported my application for further grad studies. The following year, the professor in question was fired for sexually inappropriate behavior with students. So in a sense the situation was rectified.

I'm not saying @lgsesigner's manager is in the same category, just that sexist behavior runs rampant. We all do need to do something of consequence to stop it whenever it's possible.

Eeeeww.  I got hit on by a professor once, too. I didn't get to experience the added bonus of a bad grade or any other kind of retaliation but still--Just.  So.  Gross.

lgsdesigner

Thank you ladies for all the advice, encouraging words and info. I will definitely use all of this to do what I have to do when it comes down to the wire.

I am contacting my lawyer friend when he gets back from vacation to see what can be done, if anything. My assumption is he is going to ask me to document everything and then we can build a case.

We will see what happens when I do get pg. It could get very interesting around here.

This place is a place that NO woman should ever work for. They should be happy I have stuck around for as long as I have…

marijaa333

In addition to the legal route, there is also the media... The issue is quite topical these days.

lgsdesigner

@marijaa333 - I can't really afford to lose my job (yet, anyways), so I think I will just talk to a lawyer first, and then see what my options are. But-- if that gets nasty, they can still let me go. (sigh)...why does life have to be this hard? All I want to do is bring home money and pay my bills! I don't need this sexist crap.

Sherby613

Wow. You would think that any HR person with any common sense would know some topics and questions should not be brought up. I agree with everyone and so glad to hear that you are going to make contact with your lawyer friend. Document it all and in the mean time - just do your job as you always have and keep your eyes and ears open. 

URMySunshine77

Sherby613 said:

Wow. You would think that any HR person with any common sense would know some topics and questions should not be brought up. I agree with everyone and so glad to hear that you are going to make contact with your lawyer friend. Document it all and in the mean time - just do your job as you always have and keep your eyes and ears open. 

@lgsdesigner: Your boss's response and awkward smile makes me sick. I agree with the PPs. Be sure to document those conversations and dates and keep documenting. 

@Sherby613: In a job interview once, I was asked about my family and what they do. The HR representative warned me ahead of time that the non-profit president sometimes asks inappropriate questions. Some people are ignorant.

C_Girlie

So sorry u work with jerks. I agree with pp #lawyer

kindershlitz

Holy Guacamole that's not cool.

Document, document is such good advice.  Getting that stuff in email/writing is always good when possible.  

rose_archangel

Saw this article today and thought of your situation...you are in my T&P

CML11

Wow, so inappropriate. Technically they can't ask you anything like this. I'm glad your not just being passive about it and your actually taking steps to do something about this discrimination. Good luck to you and keep us posted.