Who is using the CIO method or what are your routines? Sorry if this has already been a post...

lightninglarose

Are you letting your LO CIO or is this just terrible to do. I want to hear some opinions on this. I feel like all night time feedings are becoming one long night time diner. I'm not complaining or anything about not getting enough sleep, I know a lot of us are going through similar night time dramas right now. But what is everyone doing to make it work. What are your routines? Mine has been nursing to sleep then if I am lucky lay LO down soft and quiet enough to not wake him back up. If he does wake up it's just turning into some kind of game. But anyways I'd love to hear everyones night time routines. 

nbcarlson

PharmDMom

Use the search feature please and thank you. There are tons of threads about this.

kimbo1216

Okay.  Because I've btdt with DD1 and might be there again with dd2, I'm going to give my genuine opinion whether this is a dead horse or not.

Okay.  First, I would not call it the CIO method.  There are different ways of doing it.  The king of CIO is Dr. Ferber.  If you are interested in this method, it can be a very effective method for those that do it right and are consistent. I would get his book. Solve Your Child's Sleep Problems.  He has studied children's sleep extensively and will give you the reason behind why you are doing what you are doing.  He suggests graduated intervals. 

There are plenty of other books out there you may read.  The most important thing is to research whatever you're doing and know why you are doing it.  A no-cry answer may be Elizabeth Pantley's No Cry Sleep Solution.  It didn't work for us with DD1 as we were already too tired, we both worked, and couldn't catch up on sleep any other time.  Her method can work for many I think, but it is going to take way more long-term patience imo.

Another gentler method you might try is: Good Night Sleep Tight.  I know someone who had a lot of sucess with this.  It would not have worked for us because in this method the parent stays in the room with baby and slowly leaves.  DD1 would cry more, harder, and longer if we were in the room with her.  But this may not be the case for you.  It may be a good one.

I know there are other books and methods out there.  These are just 3 I'm personally familiar with.

What we ultimately did was pretty much the Ferber method.  I never actually read Ferber's book.  But by the time we did our own version of CIO, I had done a ton of sleep research and had heard a lot of his method from women on my first bmb.  So, after attempting the NCSS unsuccessfully, we eventually went with a CIO (or Work-It-Out as I prefer to say) method.

Basically, we just put DD down in her crib (she was 6m old when we did this and in her crib since 5m, just FYI) with lots of hugs and kisses and a very normal bedtime routine before then.  The bedtime routine is important for signaling sleep time.  Anyway, we put her down in her crib and left the room.  We gave her 10 minutes to WIO/CIO.  After 10 minutes, one of us went back in, patted and shushed her (laid her back down if necessary), and left agian.  Rinse and repeat.  The first night took 1 hour for her to finally be asleep.  The second night took 15 mintues (only 1 check) and the third, 5 minutes (no checks).

If she woke in the motn, we gave her 10 minutes to WIO before getting up to check on her.  Many times, a check was not necessary.  Other times, it was.  By this point, she was not eating in the motn though.  If she had been, I would have set a time that I would have fed her (say 4am).   If she woke well before then, we'd do the 10 minute routine.  If she woke close to then, I get up and feed her.

DD2 is just over 4 months, almost 4.5 months.  If her sleep does not improve on it's own in the next couple of weeks, we will most likely go ahead and sleep train her the way we did DD1.  But I would not sleep train any baby before the age of 5 months (4m minimum according to Ferber). 

For me, it depends on the readiness of both parents and baby.  I fought and fought sleep training dd1 because I was so torn and didn't want to scar her.  But by the time we ST'd her, she had been fighting sleep since 10 weeks old and was crying what felt like all the time.  After we finally took charge and gave her the gift of sleep, she was a much happier baby and we were a much happier household.  The funny thing is, that during the 3 days it took to ST her (I'd say a week before we really had a routine down pat and no issues), she cried less than she did in any single day leading up to that point.  And today, she is a happy and healthy 2.5 yo that can go to sleep on her own.   FYI...I should also say we have had to re-use those old ST tools over time when she has gotten off due to uncontrollable circumstances--traveling, teething, colds, etc...  It was great having those tools in hand because when we did have to use them it was much easier each subsequent time.

Whatever you choose, do what you feel is right for your family.  Go into it knowingly.  And most importantly, BE CONSISTENT!!!!!!!!!!!!  This is key.  I cannot tell you how many times I've seen someone say "oh we tried Ferber and it just didn't work".  Usually, they only did it one night, or a few hours, or maybe even a few days and gave up.  Or they didn't follow the plan.  I don't mean to sound ugly, it's just the truth.

Good luck whatever you decide!

EmJ&B

lightninglarose said:

Are you letting your LO CIO or is this just terrible to do. I want to hear some opinions on this. I feel like all night time feedings are becoming one long night time diner. I'm not complaining or anything about not getting enough sleep, I know a lot of us are going through similar night time dramas right now. But what is everyone doing to make it work. What are your routines? Mine has been nursing to sleep then if I am lucky lay LO down soft and quiet enough to not wake him back up. If he does wake up it's just turning into some kind of game. But anyways I'd love to hear everyones night time routines. 

It's not a game. He's a tiny baby. He can't play sleep games with you.

hartsl01

EmJ&B said:

lightninglarose said:

Are you letting your LO CIO or is this just terrible to do. I want to hear some opinions on this. I feel like all night time feedings are becoming one long night time diner. I'm not complaining or anything about not getting enough sleep, I know a lot of us are going through similar night time dramas right now. But what is everyone doing to make it work. What are your routines? Mine has been nursing to sleep then if I am lucky lay LO down soft and quiet enough to not wake him back up. If he does wake up it's just turning into some kind of game. But anyways I'd love to hear everyones night time routines. 

It's not a game. He's a tiny baby. He can't play sleep games with you.

yep... jbbb

kimbo1216

wedding06 said:

@kimbo1216 out of curiosity did your dd use a pacifier to get to sleep? And if she did and woke in the MOTN did you replace it? Our RN told us to try not to replace the pacifier. I haven't really let him cry, just fuss and then I replace but I wonder if I should let him fuss longer.

@wedding06, yes.  She did.  If she woke and put herself back to sleep before 10 minutes, then we clearly didn't touch it.  If she woke and was still fussing after 10 minutes, then we'd replace it.

My feelings on the pacis: keep it if it's a solution.  lose it if it's a problem.  So if I were you, I'd only take it away/not replace it LO was waking up multiple times just for the paci.  But tbh, after a time, we would put extra pacis in her crib so she could find one on her own.  But if she lot one, we wouldn't buy new ones.  Eventually, she dwindled down to just 1.

shelley1002

Wtih DS1 we did the Ferber method.  It worked well for us.  I waited until DS1 was 7 or 8 months to do it.  This method is not for everyone and a lot of people don't like it.  DS1 was an awful sleeper and is just now starting to STTN at 2.5 years old.  He was up once or twice a night until recently.  We more used it for him to put himself to sleep at bedtime.  During MOTN wake-ups I'd snuggle him, or sit on his bed and rub his back, or bring him in bed with me.  It varied what worked each night.

Some babies are just bad sleepers.  They all get the hang of it eventually.

huntjul

Four days ago we started sleep "training".  After doing some research I chose to do a combo of techniques.  I do our bedtime routine and nurse her for ~15 minutes (longer than she needs just for nutrition since she can drain a boob in 5 minutes), then transfer her to her crib drowsy.  Previously I was nursing her until she was comatose, then putting her in the crib and praying she didn't wake during the transfer--not working so well lately.

Now if she's fussing but not wailing, I let her fuss it out.  At any point if she is strongly crying like where you can hear her voice catch in between when she's breathing or she sounds like she's getting really upset, then I go in, regardless of when it is.  I give her some kisses, shush, replace a paci if needed, and I've been putting an ipad in her crib with the FP app that has sheep and fish that play music.  That totally mellows her (at least for now).  If she's still really upset, I pick her up and soothe until she's breathing normally and calmed again, then lay her back down.  I don't nurse her again.

It's a pretty gentle sleep training, but it does seem to be helping already.  She's waking fewer times and bedtime is getting easier.

huntjul

@natalie2290 - so do you.

MangoMama82

I'm going to thank you, @kimbo1216, for OP for giving a thoughtful and detailed answer. I learned some good points from what you had to say

kimbo1216

@jgslr‌, if you are going to sleep train, you have to be consistent. If not, you are only sending mixed signals to baby.

When you sooth, no picking up. Just shush and pay and leave again. You should not be in the room long at all--like 30 seconds or less. You are just going in to reassure them you are still there.

If short checks aren't working for you or only upsetting her more, you may try long checks (we did 10 min) or the graduated checks like Ferber suggests. Check after two minutes, then 3, then 5. Then the next night, lengthen those checks. Start with 3, then 5, then 8. Each time increasing. I'm not sure what the max is though according to Ferber. Again, we just did 10 minute checks every time.

Eta: for naps, they should not fuss.cry more than 30 min. If they do then get them up and try again later.