*** UO Thursday ***

babymama619

I also only left no tip once. I was young and broke. I left and accidentally hit the server's car!!! Holy shit, Karma's a bitch!

lamo1210

babymama619 said:

@jamiecallow I tried them because my boss bought them and I actually spit them out. Not something this Preggo does very often!

I am always a spitter.. Sadly.
Idk what you guys are even talking about but I had to say it.

fitmama418

JennOH85 said:

My UO, I secretly judge people who are vegitarians. I don't mean to but meat is so good.

::snip::

On the flip side, I'm a vegetarian who totally secretly judges meat-eaters. My (probably very) UO: eating dead animal flesh is gross, a waste of resources, and unhealthy. Pigs are smarter than most dogs, and I would never consider eating my dog, so how can I justify killing and eating something capable of even more thought and emotion than my pup? ::putting on flame-resistant suit for this one!::

....you lost me at waste of resources (but you were bound to lose me anywhere after that, anyway). How is eating meat a waste of resources but plants and animal bi-products aren't? Do we not plant seeds to get more crops/veggies and such to eat? Do animals not reproduce? Also, what is your basis on meat eating being "unhealthy?" And what about fish?

I'm all for humane methods, grass fed, hormone free, wild caught, etc. Hunting is like A+ in my book; if I can get fresh game, there's nothing better. I just feel like your arguments above are a little poorly founded.

fluttergirlmoonchild79

JennOH85 said:

My UO, I secretly judge people who are vegitarians. I don't mean to but meat is so good.

::snip::

On the flip side, I'm a vegetarian who totally secretly judges meat-eaters. My (probably very) UO: eating dead animal flesh is gross, a waste of resources, and unhealthy. Pigs are smarter than most dogs, and I would never consider eating my dog, so how can I justify killing and eating something capable of even more thought and emotion than my pup? ::putting on flame-resistant suit for this one!:: ETA: I don't mean to say there is a never a situation where eating meat makes sense -- I recognize everyone's situation is different.

The difference is, the pig we eat was bred specifically to become food.  Your dog was not.

CML8413

nciesla said:

JennOH85 said:

My UO, I secretly judge people who are vegitarians. I don't mean to but meat is so good.

::snip::

On the flip side, I'm a vegetarian who totally secretly judges meat-eaters. My (probably very) UO: eating dead animal flesh is gross, a waste of resources, and unhealthy. Pigs are smarter than most dogs, and I would never consider eating my dog, so how can I justify killing and eating something capable of even more thought and emotion than my pup? ::putting on flame-resistant suit for this one!::

....you lost me at waste of resources (but you were bound to lose me anywhere after that, anyway). How is eating meat a waste of resources but plants and animal bi-products aren't? Do we not plant seeds to get more crops/veggies and such to eat? Do animals not reproduce? Also, what is your basis on meat eating being "unhealthy?" And what about fish?

I'm all for humane methods, grass fed, hormone free, wild caught, etc. Hunting is like A+ in my book; if I can get fresh game, there's nothing better. I just feel like your arguments above are a little poorly founded.

See the China Study, or Forks Over Knifes or Dr. Esselstyn's research and book for more information on why people choose not to eat animal and animal products for health reasons.

ranaverde

nciesla said:

....you lost me at waste of resources (but you were bound to lose me anywhere after that, anyway). How is eating meat a waste of resources but plants and animal bi-products aren't? Do we not plant seeds to get more crops/veggies and such to eat? Do animals not reproduce? Also, what is your basis on meat eating being "unhealthy?" And what about fish?

I don't have a particular dog in this fight (I eat sparingly of ethically raised meat, but have been vegetarian for health and environmental reasons in the past) but she's right about meat being more costly to produce.

With plant-based foods, you're out whatever water, soil, fertilizer, etc. is used to produce them, plus the fuels needed to transport and/or prepare them.

With meat, you have all that, plus there's a step between you and the plants.  Basically, it takes a lot more acreage, water, etc. to raise a cow and deal with its shit than it does to raise an equivalent amount of plant-based calories.  Meat is tasty, yes, but it's not a very efficient way to feed people.  (And this is why factory farming happens - it's an attempt to make a messy animal process into something consistent, efficient, and cost-effective - which is at odds with the biological needs of most animals.)

Carry on...

CML8413

CFox815 said:

CML8413 said:

nciesla said:

JennOH85 said:

My UO, I secretly judge people who are vegitarians. I don't mean to but meat is so good.

::snip::

On the flip side, I'm a vegetarian who totally secretly judges meat-eaters. My (probably very) UO: eating dead animal flesh is gross, a waste of resources, and unhealthy. Pigs are smarter than most dogs, and I would never consider eating my dog, so how can I justify killing and eating something capable of even more thought and emotion than my pup? ::putting on flame-resistant suit for this one!::

....you lost me at waste of resources (but you were bound to lose me anywhere after that, anyway). How is eating meat a waste of resources but plants and animal bi-products aren't? Do we not plant seeds to get more crops/veggies and such to eat? Do animals not reproduce? Also, what is your basis on meat eating being "unhealthy?" And what about fish?

I'm all for humane methods, grass fed, hormone free, wild caught, etc. Hunting is like A+ in my book; if I can get fresh game, there's nothing better. I just feel like your arguments above are a little poorly founded.

See the China Study, or Forks Over Knifes or Dr. Esselstyn's research and book for more information on why people choose not to eat animal and animal products for health reasons.

I HAVE AN UO!

I hate when people direct you to some book or source to back up an argument. If you want to make a case for why people should not eat animal or animal products, make it. Don't make me go to Barnes and Noble to figure out what you're talking about. 

Well, in relation to that, we're all about "GOOGLE IT!" here, so I thought I'd save myself the energy.

fitmama418

nciesla said:

....you lost me at waste of resources (but you were bound to lose me anywhere after that, anyway). How is eating meat a waste of resources but plants and animal bi-products aren't? Do we not plant seeds to get more crops/veggies and such to eat? Do animals not reproduce? Also, what is your basis on meat eating being "unhealthy?" And what about fish?

I don't have a particular dog in this fight (I eat sparingly of ethically raised meat, but have been vegetarian for health and environmental reasons in the past) but she's right about meat being more costly to produce.

With plant-based foods, you're out whatever water, soil, fertilizer, etc. is used to produce them, plus the fuels needed to transport and/or prepare them.

With meat, you have all that, plus there's a step between you and the plants.  Basically, it takes a lot more acreage, water, etc. to raise a cow and deal with its shit than it does to raise an equivalent amount of plant-based calories.  Meat is tasty, yes, but it's not a very efficient way to feed people.  (And this is why factory farming happens - it's an attempt to make a messy animal process into something consistent, efficient, and cost-effective - which is at odds with the biological needs of most animals.)

Carry on...
____________________

...and this is how you make an argument without throwing articles out at me (I agree @CFox815...thank you). @Ranaverde thanks for your informative and educated defense. I get it!

babymama619

ranaverde said:

nciesla said:

....you lost me at waste of resources (but you were bound to lose me anywhere after that, anyway). How is eating meat a waste of resources but plants and animal bi-products aren't? Do we not plant seeds to get more crops/veggies and such to eat? Do animals not reproduce? Also, what is your basis on meat eating being "unhealthy?" And what about fish?

I don't have a particular dog in this fight (I eat sparingly of ethically raised meat, but have been vegetarian for health and environmental reasons in the past) but she's right about meat being more costly to produce.

With plant-based foods, you're out whatever water, soil, fertilizer, etc. is used to produce them, plus the fuels needed to transport and/or prepare them.

With meat, you have all that, plus there's a step between you and the plants.  Basically, it takes a lot more acreage, water, etc. to raise a cow and deal with its shit than it does to raise an equivalent amount of plant-based calories.  Meat is tasty, yes, but it's not a very efficient way to feed people.  (And this is why factory farming happens - it's an attempt to make a messy animal process into something consistent, efficient, and cost-effective - which is at odds with the biological needs of most animals.)

Carry on...



Thanks for typing this. I totally agree but was too lazy to respond.

katie.725

CML8413 said:

**snippy snip snip**

Well, in relation to that, we're all about "GOOGLE IT!" here, so I thought I'd save myself the energy.

eta: snips

daniann333

Shying away from the tipping matter (you should always tip) I find there to be nothing wrong with inductions and having no medical problems.  If you are at least 39 weeks and want to be induced, more power to you.  I am in this boat.  I still work full time in the medical field, go to school part time, have a DH and DS.  I am swollen beyond belief, my tennis shoes dont fit and I have not been able to feel my hands for months now due to carpal tunnel.  If LO is not here by nov 4th (39 weeks) he is being evicted.

lamo1210

Could someone direct me to a nice juicy steak?

brandeeteer

daniann333 said:

Shying away from the tipping matter (you should always tip) I find there to be nothing wrong with inductions and having no medical problems.  If you are at least 39 weeks and want to be induced, more power to you.  I am in this boat.  I still work full time in the medical field, go to school part time, have a DH and DS.  I am swollen beyond belief, my tennis shoes dont fit and I have not been able to feel my hands for months now due to carpal tunnel.  If LO is not here by nov 4th (39 weeks) he is being evicted.

CFox815 said:

CML8413 said:

CFox815 said:

CML8413 said:

nciesla said:

JennOH85 said:

My UO, I secretly judge people who are vegitarians. I don't mean to but meat is so good.

::snip::

On the flip side, I'm a vegetarian who totally secretly judges meat-eaters. My (probably very) UO: eating dead animal flesh is gross, a waste of resources, and unhealthy. Pigs are smarter than most dogs, and I would never consider eating my dog, so how can I justify killing and eating something capable of even more thought and emotion than my pup? ::putting on flame-resistant suit for this one!::

....you lost me at waste of resources (but you were bound to lose me anywhere after that, anyway). How is eating meat a waste of resources but plants and animal bi-products aren't? Do we not plant seeds to get more crops/veggies and such to eat? Do animals not reproduce? Also, what is your basis on meat eating being "unhealthy?" And what about fish?

I'm all for humane methods, grass fed, hormone free, wild caught, etc. Hunting is like A+ in my book; if I can get fresh game, there's nothing better. I just feel like your arguments above are a little poorly founded.

See the China Study, or Forks Over Knifes or Dr. Esselstyn's research and book for more information on why people choose not to eat animal and animal products for health reasons.

I HAVE AN UO!

I hate when people direct you to some book or source to back up an argument. If you want to make a case for why people should not eat animal or animal products, make it. Don't make me go to Barnes and Noble to figure out what you're talking about. 

Well, in relation to that, we're all about "GOOGLE IT!" here, so I thought I'd save myself the energy.

Yes. If I wanted to know why I shouldn't eat animal products, I would google it. But you want to present an argument. So present it. I will be eating a bowl of taco meat until then. 

Completely agree - I'll be 39 weeks on the fifth - we have an ultrasound next week to check on things and if all looks good, I  plan on evicting my LO as well. In the meantime, a bowl of taco meat sounds yummy.

amberrrjade

babymama619 said:

\2. Pumpkin flavor is out of control this year. I enjoy a pumpkin spice latte as much as the next white girl in yoga pants, but m&ms? Yogurt? Gross. I even saw limited edition baby food the other day!

You shut your mouth!

lamo1210

mishkaroni said:

lamo1210 said:

Could someone direct me to a nice juicy steak?

Oh crap. I need that nowz.

CML8413

It's not an opinion. Eat whatever you want--I really don't care. I just ate a candy bar and now a cupcake is staring me in the face. Someone upthread mentioned the health reasons as being unfounded, or seemingly unfounded, I was merely pointing out that research exists out there to say otherwise, just like there is pro-animal consumption health research.

"Forks over Knives" is a film. Here you go: https://www.forksoverknives.com/

Esselstyn preaches a plant-based, no oil diet to reverse heart disease. It's the diet President Clinton follows. Some information here: https://www.heartattackproof.com/

Wiki explains the China Study: The China Study examines the relationship between the consumption of animal products (including dairy) and chronic illnesses such as coronary heart disease, diabetes, and cancers of the breast,prostate and bowel.^[3] The authors conclude that people who eat a plant-based/vegan diet—avoiding all animal products, including beef, pork, poultry, fish, eggs, cheese and milk, and reducing their intake of processed foods and refined carbohydrates—will escape, reduce or reverse the development of numerous diseases. They write that "eating foods that contain any cholesterol above 0 mg is unhealthy."^[4]

They also recommend adequate amounts of sunshine exposure or supplements to maintain adequate levels of vitamin D, and supplements of vitamin B12 in case of complete avoidance of animal products.^[5] They criticize low-carb diets, such as the Atkins diet, which include restrictions on the percentage of calories derived from complex carbohydrates.^[6] They are also critical of reductionistapproaches to the study of nutrition, whereby certain nutrients are blamed for disease, as opposed to studying patterns of nutrition and the interactions between nutrients.^[7]

The book is loosely based on the China-Cornell-Oxford Project, a 20-year study – described by The New York Times as "the Grand Prix of epidemiology" – conducted by the Chinese Academy of Preventive Medicine, Cornell University and the University of Oxford. T. Colin Campbell was one of the study's directors.^[8] It looked at mortality rates from cancer and other chronic diseases from 1973 to 1975 in 65 counties in China; the data was correlated with 1983–84 dietary surveys and blood work from 100 people in each county. The research was conducted in those counties because they had genetically similar populations that tended, over generations, to live and eat in the same way in the same place. The study concluded that counties with a high consumption of animal-based foods in 1983–84 were more likely to have had higher death rates from "Western" diseases as of 1973–75, while the opposite was true for counties that ate more plant foods.^[9]

JennyCupcakes01

(I've been lurking) but totally agree on the tipping subject. Never worked in a restaurant, but I worked at a Jamba Juice for a while and even THOSE tips would get me an extra $75-$100 per paycheck. 

Not too long ago, SO and I went to a TGI Fridays and the food sucked so bad (except the appetizer). But our waitress was SO pleasant. She was patient while I was ordering because I just couldn't decide what I wanted, she re-filled our drinks before we even asked and made small talk with us. Despite the food being gross, we left her a nice tip. 

JennyCupcakes01

Oh and my UO.

Marshmallows are disgusting.

LoveOfMikesLife

I can almost promise you that in most restaurants if you don't tip or tip very little and go to the manager to complain, the second you walk out that door everyone of them will make fun of you! Some people have their expectations too high. If you are somewhere that is super fine dining and $85+ a plate, yes expect better service than crappleBees. But don't show up at outback and expect to be treated like a celebrity! Think about where you are before you bitch! Oh and in our restaurant we've actually asked people that complain constantly and don't tip not to come back.

fitmama418

CML8413 said:

It's not an opinion. Eat whatever you want--I really don't care. I just ate a candy bar and now a cupcake is staring me in the face. Someone upthread mentioned the health reasons as being unfounded, or seemingly unfounded, I was merely pointing out that research exists out there to say otherwise, just like there is pro-animal consumption health research.

"Forks over Knives" is a film. Here you go: https://www.forksoverknives.com/

Esselstyn preaches a plant-based, no oil diet to reverse heart disease. It's the diet President Clinton follows. Some information here: https://www.heartattackproof.com/

Wiki explains the China Study: The China Study examines the relationship between the consumption of animal products (including dairy) and chronic illnesses such as coronary heart disease, diabetes, and cancers of the breast,prostate and bowel.^[3] The authors conclude that people who eat a plant-based/vegan diet—avoiding all animal products, including beef, pork, poultry, fish, eggs, cheese and milk, and reducing their intake of processed foods and refined carbohydrates—will escape, reduce or reverse the development of numerous diseases. They write that "eating foods that contain any cholesterol above 0 mg is unhealthy."^[4]

They also recommend adequate amounts of sunshine exposure or supplements to maintain adequate levels of vitamin D, and supplements of vitamin B12 in case of complete avoidance of animal products.^[5] They criticize low-carb diets, such as the Atkins diet, which include restrictions on the percentage of calories derived from complex carbohydrates.^[6] They are also critical of reductionistapproaches to the study of nutrition, whereby certain nutrients are blamed for disease, as opposed to studying patterns of nutrition and the interactions between nutrients.^[7]

The book is loosely based on the China-Cornell-Oxford Project, a 20-year study – described by The New York Times as "the Grand Prix of epidemiology" – conducted by the Chinese Academy of Preventive Medicine, Cornell University and the University of Oxford. T. Colin Campbell was one of the study's directors.^[8] It looked at mortality rates from cancer and other chronic diseases from 1973 to 1975 in 65 counties in China; the data was correlated with 1983–84 dietary surveys and blood work from 100 people in each county. The research was conducted in those counties because they had genetically similar populations that tended, over generations, to live and eat in the same way in the same place. The study concluded that counties with a high consumption of animal-based foods in 1983–84 were more likely to have had higher death rates from "Western" diseases as of 1973–75, while the opposite was true for counties that ate more plant foods.^[9]

Never said "unfounded" at all in my original argument. I just expect people to say more than "___ is unhealthy" with nothing to back it up. @ranaverde covered that though so we're all gravy.

fiddlefern

Jumping off of the tipping thread.... I can't afford how much you are suppose to tip around the holidays.  Money is tight for everyone and I don't get an extra tip for doing my job.  Am I really suppose to tip my garbage man between $10-30 when I always have garbage left in my yard? Or the mailman $30? Or my hairstylist the equivalent of one visit?  I'm sorry, but I can't afford to leave $120 tip!  I try to tip well throughout the year and then throw an extra $10-20 around the holiday, but I feel like I already pay a lot for certain services and if I had more money I would be more than happy to share the love, but I think it is getting a little nuts.  When my mom use to be a stylist she usually got homemade cookies or a small gift from her clients. 

MannaPants

I'm a Libertarian

amberrrjade

DH & I ALWAYS tip. When service is horrendous we will only tip 10% and if service is phenomenal we will tip way over 15%. I just wanna brag about myself, a week before Christmas DH and I went to Chili's for lunch and it was pretty much dead and our waitress was AMAZING. Our bill ended up only being about 25 dollars but I felt so bad that she was stuck with a dead mid-shift I tipped her 20 dollars. We walked out of the restaurant before she came to pick up the check but as we were getting in our car she came running out to thank us. I felt really Christmasy and nice.

My UO isssssss I work in child care and I can not stand parents who call 50 times a day just to check in. No, I'm busy, if something was wrong I'd let you know or you could log your ass into the computer and just watch the damn camera. Also, please write your name on your kid's stuff, I don't feel bad when it gets lost because I asked you 500 times to write their name on it. Too bad soo sad.

amberrrjade

MannaPants said:

I'm a Libertarian

I read librarian and I was like how is this unpopular? hahaha

JennOH85

ranaverde said:

nciesla said:

....you lost me at waste of resources (but you were bound to lose me anywhere after that, anyway). How is eating meat a waste of resources but plants and animal bi-products aren't? Do we not plant seeds to get more crops/veggies and such to eat? Do animals not reproduce? Also, what is your basis on meat eating being "unhealthy?" And what about fish?

I don't have a particular dog in this fight (I eat sparingly of ethically raised meat, but have been vegetarian for health and environmental reasons in the past) but she's right about meat being more costly to produce.

With plant-based foods, you're out whatever water, soil, fertilizer, etc. is used to produce them, plus the fuels needed to transport and/or prepare them.

With meat, you have all that, plus there's a step between you and the plants.  Basically, it takes a lot more acreage, water, etc. to raise a cow and deal with its shit than it does to raise an equivalent amount of plant-based calories.  Meat is tasty, yes, but it's not a very efficient way to feed people.  (And this is why factory farming happens - it's an attempt to make a messy animal process into something consistent, efficient, and cost-effective - which is at odds with the biological needs of most animals.)

Carry on...

@nciesla, for all of the reasons @ ranaverde mentioned plus a few more. 

As far as health, I'll add that according to the Academy of Health and Dietetics, vegetarians have been proven to be at a lower risk for heart disease, certain cancers (including breast and ovarian), diabetes, obesity, and high blood pressure. In addition, factory farming has created an unnatural situation in which animals are often pumped full of antibiotics to keep them alive long enough to put on weight. This has increasingly lead to the overuse of antibiotics (which are then consumed by the people who eat the meat) and a spike in antibiotic-resistant bacteria, which affects everyone's health. The system we have now is simply unsustainable because of the overconsumption of meat.

The farming of fish has disastrous consequences on the ecosystem (shrimp are among the worst -- the way they are often farmed destroys coastal ecosystems) given all of the pesticides and waste. Plus, the contamination is often worse, because the pollution goes directly into waterways. 

It's a broken system that needs to be fixed, for the health of humans even more so than animals. I will continue to choose not to eat meat for moral reasons, but at the same time, I would have much less of a problem with it if the animals were raised in healthy, ethical, and environmentally-responsible ways (which would mean MUCH less meat would be consumed in our country, simply because there wouldn't be as much produced.) 

alexisjo88

JennOH85 said:

ranaverde said:

nciesla said:

....you lost me at waste of resources (but you were bound to lose me anywhere after that, anyway). How is eating meat a waste of resources but plants and animal bi-products aren't? Do we not plant seeds to get more crops/veggies and such to eat? Do animals not reproduce? Also, what is your basis on meat eating being "unhealthy?" And what about fish?

I don't have a particular dog in this fight (I eat sparingly of ethically raised meat, but have been vegetarian for health and environmental reasons in the past) but she's right about meat being more costly to produce.

With plant-based foods, you're out whatever water, soil, fertilizer, etc. is used to produce them, plus the fuels needed to transport and/or prepare them.

With meat, you have all that, plus there's a step between you and the plants.  Basically, it takes a lot more acreage, water, etc. to raise a cow and deal with its shit than it does to raise an equivalent amount of plant-based calories.  Meat is tasty, yes, but it's not a very efficient way to feed people.  (And this is why factory farming happens - it's an attempt to make a messy animal process into something consistent, efficient, and cost-effective - which is at odds with the biological needs of most animals.)

Carry on...

@nciesla, for all of the reasons @ ranaverde mentioned plus a few more. 

As far as health, I'll add that according to the Academy of Health and Dietetics, vegetarians have been proven to be at a lower risk for heart disease, certain cancers (including breast and ovarian), diabetes, obesity, and high blood pressure. In addition, factory farming has created an unnatural situation in which animals are often pumped full of antibiotics to keep them alive long enough to put on weight. This has increasingly lead to the overuse of antibiotics (which are then consumed by the people who eat the meat) and a spike in antibiotic-resistant bacteria, which affects everyone's health. The system we have now is simply unsustainable because of the overconsumption of meat.

The farming of fish has disastrous consequences on the ecosystem (shrimp are among the worst -- the way they are often farmed destroys coastal ecosystems) given all of the pesticides and waste. Plus, the contamination is often worse, because the pollution goes directly into waterways. 

It's a broken system that needs to be fixed, for the health of humans even more so than animals. I will continue to choose not to eat meat for moral reasons, but at the same time, I would have much less of a problem with it if the animals were raised in healthy, ethical, and environmentally-responsible ways (which would mean MUCH less meat would be consumed in our country, simply because there wouldn't be as much produced.) 

While I give you merit, I blame the process not the meat. I tend to eat less meats now out of quality control, but I am all for home raised products and hunted game. While, in the city, it is hard to stay true to my upbringing, I will go out of my way to get farm fresh eggs and produce. Lucky me, I drive through Amish country to and from work.

meabtahi

On the meat - I don't care if you eat it or don't. However, I do have a problem with people who do not eat it because they feel bad about hurting animals and then prance around all day in leather shoes, belts, and purses! So hypocritial.

On the tipping - I was a server throughout college and always tip. However, I also understood that I was providing a service and working for a tip which required a certain level of performance. If I were to be a total ass I don't think I would have expected anything - its not the paying customers fault if they get bad service. Better service = better tips and a server should act accordingly!

thelastunicornxo

daniann333 said:

Shying away from the tipping matter (you should always tip) I find there to be nothing wrong with inductions and having no medical problems.  If you are at least 39 weeks and want to be induced, more power to you.  I am in this boat.  I still work full time in the medical field, go to school part time, have a DH and DS.  I am swollen beyond belief, my tennis shoes dont fit and I have not been able to feel my hands for months now due to carpal tunnel.  If LO is not here by nov 4th (39 weeks) he is being evicted.

100 % agree! I have no problem with it in the 39th week! I'm going to let them strip my membranes at my next app 38 and 3 days.... But if he's not here by his due date he is out of there!

jennifertewart

Everyone should wait tables to see what it is like!!!!!!! I have not left less than 20% (starting point) since I started waiting tables 2 1/2 years ago.... with that I haven't had poor service!  Treat your servers how you want to be treated, a lot of the time service you receive is a reflection of YOUR attitude. (Not saying there can't be bad service for no reason) It is hard to put on a smile and make lively conversation when you walk you to a table and they do not make eye contact with you or treat you like you're below them.

If you can't tip 20% or acknowledge your server's existence eat at home/fast food!!!!

wendy2613

alexisjo88 said:

JennOH85 said:

ranaverde said:

nciesla said:

....you lost me at waste of resources (but you were bound to lose me anywhere after that, anyway). How is eating meat a waste of resources but plants and animal bi-products aren't? Do we not plant seeds to get more crops/veggies and such to eat? Do animals not reproduce? Also, what is your basis on meat eating being "unhealthy?" And what about fish?

I don't have a particular dog in this fight (I eat sparingly of ethically raised meat, but have been vegetarian for health and environmental reasons in the past) but she's right about meat being more costly to produce.

With plant-based foods, you're out whatever water, soil, fertilizer, etc. is used to produce them, plus the fuels needed to transport and/or prepare them.

With meat, you have all that, plus there's a step between you and the plants.  Basically, it takes a lot more acreage, water, etc. to raise a cow and deal with its shit than it does to raise an equivalent amount of plant-based calories.  Meat is tasty, yes, but it's not a very efficient way to feed people.  (And this is why factory farming happens - it's an attempt to make a messy animal process into something consistent, efficient, and cost-effective - which is at odds with the biological needs of most animals.)

Carry on...

@nciesla, for all of the reasons @ ranaverde mentioned plus a few more. 

As far as health, I'll add that according to the Academy of Health and Dietetics, vegetarians have been proven to be at a lower risk for heart disease, certain cancers (including breast and ovarian), diabetes, obesity, and high blood pressure. In addition, factory farming has created an unnatural situation in which animals are often pumped full of antibiotics to keep them alive long enough to put on weight. This has increasingly lead to the overuse of antibiotics (which are then consumed by the people who eat the meat) and a spike in antibiotic-resistant bacteria, which affects everyone's health. The system we have now is simply unsustainable because of the overconsumption of meat.

The farming of fish has disastrous consequences on the ecosystem (shrimp are among the worst -- the way they are often farmed destroys coastal ecosystems) given all of the pesticides and waste. Plus, the contamination is often worse, because the pollution goes directly into waterways. 

It's a broken system that needs to be fixed, for the health of humans even more so than animals. I will continue to choose not to eat meat for moral reasons, but at the same time, I would have much less of a problem with it if the animals were raised in healthy, ethical, and environmentally-responsible ways (which would mean MUCH less meat would be consumed in our country, simply because there wouldn't be as much produced.) 

While I give you merit, I blame the process not the meat. I tend to eat less meats now out of quality control, but I am all for home raised products and hunted game. While, in the city, it is hard to stay true to my upbringing, I will go out of my way to get farm fresh eggs and produce. Lucky me, I drive through Amish country to and from work.

Yes, this. That is why in my OP I wrote about eating meat that has been humainly raised and taken without all the hormones and antibiotics, or hunted in the wild which helps maintaine a healthy balance in nature.

MrsApplelovesMrApple

 

I stopped eating meat when I was 8 years old. My husband and son both eat meat. That being said:

I don't care what people eat as long as I don't have to take a bite of it.

1sloqwen

Not a fan of the "Where's the fox?" craze! I went to a wedding reception and they played that song and I was like wtf?