Where is the line?

Rach21

Some friends of mine are fundraising for in-vitro. I personally have problems with fundraising for something like that, but what'evs. I'm biting my tongue.  So today, they put an update on their FB page. They've received a bunch of donations already—and she just had a BFP on a pee stick before even doing the round of treatments this month. She goes on to say that her HCG levels were low and it's probably a miscarriage (which totally blows), but... even though miscarriages are awful, isn't that kind of proof that she doesn't necessarily need IVF? And... in her posts she said that her health condition would make it a high risk pregnancy if it was a successful pregnancy. So in my mind, I'm wondering why she is asking friends, family, strangers on FB, to donate for IVF that she may not need in order to have a pregnancy that could possibly harm her or the baby? I know they "don't feel in their hearts that they're ready to give up" but... I just have a huge problem with this.

FWIW, DH and I are TTC and he had to go get his counts checked today. I guess DH and I have a line in the sand where we'll let it go if it doesn't happen for us. I just don't know if I would ask friends for $$$ for something that could potentially end in disaster...

thetheisens

They aren't forcing anyone to give them money. If you don't agree, don't donate, it's that simple. 

LuckyDad

It's tacky to ask your friends to pay for your IVF.

I wouldn't give them money.

Otherwise, I wouldn't stress the details. If other people want to give them cash, hey, it's their money.

PunkyBooster

I side eye fundraising for IVF.

beachgirl1977

I hope it is successful for them, but then do they give the money back?

Rach21

I guess I'm wondering if she becomes pregnant without IVF and she is able to carry the baby to term, is she going to give back the donations? They still haven't received the full amount for the IVF, but they've received a bunch. The couple themselves are not necessarily being pushy about receiving donations, but we go to the same church and I'm just hearing a lot about the fundraiser from a lot of avenues. Maybe that's what's making it seem so "hey, have you donated yet?" KWIM?

Rach21

Idani said:

I don't think the fact that she "can" get pregnant means they won't have to have IVF.  We struggled with infertility and many of the people we came into contact didn't have trouble getting pregnant just staying pregnant. 

I'm not very familiar with IVF, so I wasn't aware about that aspect of it.

SunnyMeg1

I'm probably a hypocrite because I don't like the idea of soliciting for IVF donations but I would gladly donate to an adoption fund if I knew the couple was providing a stable, loving home for a child to grow up in.

ASmallWonder

Rach21 said:

Idani said:

I don't think the fact that she "can" get pregnant means they won't have to have IVF.  We struggled with infertility and many of the people we came into contact didn't have trouble getting pregnant just staying pregnant. 

I'm not very familiar with IVF, so I wasn't aware about that aspect of it.

Interesting.  What is it about the IVF process that helps keep a woman pregnant?  Does it have to do with some drug combination they give or something else?

RayRay007

1. Fundraising for IVF is tacky and I wouldn't donate.

2. If this pregnancy is successful they should return all donations.

3. Getting pregnant without IVF isn't proof that they do not need IVF.

4. Because she may be high risk doesn't mean she shouldn't try to get pg, even if they are relying on other people's money. 

CinemaGoddess

CTGirl30 said:

I have a friend with secondary IF - getting pg is not the problem. 6 mc's later...it's the staying pg.

Would IVF help in these situations, tho?  

pinkiemo

I have a problem with fundraising for IVF on FB.  If you want to go to close relatives (ie parents) and say we need help doing this, then fine.

FWIW, I have a friend on FB who is going through fertility treatments and has been for several years.  He often posts comments about how it upsets him that so many "friends" can get pregnant so easily and don't know how good they have it.  It irks me when he does this.

I'm really just not a fan of oversharing on FB.  I didn't announce either of my pregnancies there.

 

pinkiemo

Sterling13 said:

pinkiemo said:

I have a problem with fundraising for IVF on FB.  If you want to go to close relatives (ie parents) and say we need help doing this, then fine.

FWIW, I have a friend on FB who is going through fertility treatments and has been for several years.  He often posts comments about how it upsets him that so many "friends" can get pregnant so easily and don't know how good they have it.  It irks me when he does this.

I'm really just not a fan of oversharing on FB.  I didn't announce either of my pregnancies there.

 

Why does this irk you? Do pregnancy/kid posting equally irk you?

If they were constantly posting comparing their pregnancy/kid to their friends' pregnancy/kids without actually knowing anything about their friends' pregnancy/kids, then yeah that would irk me too.

theseaword

I'm surprised so many folks wouldn't donate. I totally would for a friend.

s0ulchicken

I think it is pretty tacky. That being said, I understand the sheer desperation of TTCAL. (I am assuming that she has had losses previously, to be considering IVF. Though the two are not mutually exclusive) I would donate. Probably no more than $50, but I would do it.

CinemaGoddess

GhostMonkey said:

TwilightMV said:

I'm surprised so many folks wouldn't donate. I totally would for a friend.

This. I wouldn't for an acquaintance, but people do fundraisers for a number of things- why not this as well?  Harassing people is a no-no, and asking every person you have bumped into twice your whole life, but a close friend/family, sure.

This is why I don't think it should necessarily be posted on FB.  I don't know a whole lot of people who only have close friends and relatives on FB.  There are people you know from work, people you know from school, people you know through other people.  

Sending an email saying "Hey, this is what's up." is more acceptable in this instance than a FB wide post.

I don't mind being solicited for monies for various causes.  I'll donate where I want to.  

jmcdionne

We draw the line as follows-

If we can't have kids naturally and we can't afford IVF on our own = we are not having kids. The end.

CinemaGoddess

GhostMonkey said:

I wouldn't bitch about it being on FB though. Is it really any worse than people selling Scentsy, 31, or whatever other crap people are selling these days?

I see it as different.  You're not selling a product with the IVF.  The donors will not receive a piece of the baby in return for handing over monies.  They do not get naming rights.  They do not get the right to dictate where or in which manner the child will be born.  

If you want to do a kindness and give some money to someone who needs it to complete their family, fine. 

But let's not compare donations to IVF to Scentsy.  

CinemaGoddess

jmcdionne said:

We draw the line as follows- If we can't have kids naturally and we can't afford IVF on our own = we are not having kids. The end.

Are you currently pregnant and due in April?  

CinemaGoddess

GhostMonkey said:

CinemaGoddess said:

GhostMonkey said:

I wouldn't bitch about it being on FB though. Is it really any worse than people selling Scentsy, 31, or whatever other crap people are selling these days?

I see it as different.  You're not selling a product with the IVF.  The donors will not receive a piece of the baby in return for handing over monies.  They do not get naming rights.  They do not get the right to dictate where or in which manner the child will be born.  

If you want to do a kindness and give some money to someone who needs it to complete their family, fine. 

But let's not compare donations to IVF to Scentsy.  

But in the case of some, they do...

But not in this case, I'm assuming. 

LuckyDad

TwilightMV said:

I'm surprised so many folks wouldn't donate. I totally would for a friend.

Maybe I will feel different if we buy a house and fund our retirement. I wish we could support every noble cause.

CinemaGoddess

GhostMonkey said:

Mackalien13 said:

CinemaGoddess said:

GhostMonkey said:

I wouldn't bitch about it being on FB though. Is it really any worse than people selling Scentsy, 31, or whatever other crap people are selling these days?

I see it as different.  You're not selling a product with the IVF.  The donors will not receive a piece of the baby in return for handing over monies.  They do not get naming rights.  They do not get the right to dictate where or in which manner the child will be born.  

If you want to do a kindness and give some money to someone who needs it to complete their family, fine. 

But let's not compare donations to IVF to Scentsy.  

But in the case of some, they do...

I am in your side in this argument as I don't see it as that bad. But I think you are stretching here.

Oh, you weren't around for the Bumpie that was going to sell naming rights to her child on eBay to fund her IVF?

And Oprah yo.

Oh, I remember her.  That was a hilarious day.  

CinemaGoddess

Mackalien13 said:

You know what bothers me more than people fundraising on FB? People that are overly judgemental

You don't know my lyfe.  

jmcdionne

Moidonna said:

Sterling13 said:

We draw the line as follows- If we can't have kids naturally and we can't afford IVF on our own = we are not having kids. The end.

Since you have kids I'm assuming this isn't a decision you actually had to make. It's definitely not as easy as you're making it for most people who have been there, but good for you for making this imaginary decision for yourself.

This is what I was thinking too.  Easy to say when you have kids and everything worked out for you.
That's right, I've never had to make that decision, though I have dealt with infertility.
If I could not afford IVF, no, I would not expect someone else to fund it for me. The fact that I have 2 kids does not change that.

jmcdionne

GhostMonkey said:

jmcdionne said:

Moidonna said:

Sterling13 said:

jmcdionne said:

We draw the line as follows- If we can't have kids naturally and we can't afford IVF on our own = we are not having kids. The end.

Since you have kids I'm assuming this isn't a decision you actually had to make. It's definitely not as easy as you're making it for most people who have been there, but good for you for making this imaginary decision for yourself.

This is what I was thinking too.  Easy to say when you have kids and everything worked out for you.

That's right, I've never had to make that decision, though I have dealt with infertility.
If I could not afford IVF, no, I would not expect someone else to fund it for me. The fact that I have 2 kids does not change that.

Jesus Fuck your siggy is obnoxious.

And it's pretty evident that you do not get it at all.



Wow. Where did THAT come from? My signature is almost 2 years old and I can't even see it from my phone. I actually thought it had disappeared with the new format.

But thanks for the very kind words.

There is nothing to GET. The title said "Where is the line?" I stated where our line was. I don't expect people to dish out money for us.

jmcdionne

Lol I just looked at my signature from my actual computer and it is pretty strange!
Not sure how to remove the badges.... When I put them on there, everybody else from TB was putting them too. It was a long time ago.
And the weight loss.... Yeah, I wish.

SunnyMeg1

TwilightMV said:

I'm surprised so many folks wouldn't donate. I totally would for a friend.

Yes, if it was a close friend, I would be glad to help them because I'd assume they'd have confided in me. If I found out by Facebook status they were fundraising for IVF, I would be turned off. I don't know why, I just would. Like I said, I'm a hypocrite, because I would probably more readily donate to someone looking to adopt. Maybe it's because my nieces are adopted and DH and I face the very real possibility that we will be taking that route so it hits closer to home, but I see that more as helping to provide for a child that already exists. Not the most sound logic, but that's just my feelings.

LoveActually4

IvF was recommended to us after my 4th m/c. We chose to keep trying and luckily had DS1 on the next try. They are now able to extract DNA from the embryos, determine which embryos are healthy and only implant the healthy ones into you to avoid a miscarriage as a result of chromosomal abnormality.

I find it a bit tacky. I'd love to say I would never do it but after our struggles with recurrent miscarriages I would have done ANYTHING for a baby. So I can't judge, I might have done the same if it was my only option.

kwitt22

I would probably donate for a friend. I can understand having a fundraiser bc IF sucks, and is expensive. Although I don't know if I would have the balls to post it in FB.

Kitiara5512

GhostMonkey said:

I wouldn't bitch about it being on FB though. Is it really any worse than people selling Scentsy, 31, or whatever other crap people are selling these days?

Those people get hidden a lot, and if they keep messaging or inviting me to stuff, they get unfriended too. I don't tell people on my fb page where I work, I don't really want to be a customer to them either.

nanabanana06

Honestly, I see nothing wrong with fundraisers for IVF. It's like fundraisers for adoption.Either way your helping them raise funds for a child. That shits expensive and so many people have to turn to one or the other. I don't see a big deal with it.

nanabanana06

Brandi Bee said:

I don't think funding an adoption is the same at all. Because parentless children is a real problem that can affect everyone. The world shouldn't have to care about someone's desire to be pregnant. And that is really what it's about.

The thing is though that adoption isn't always an option. Not everyone can go through foster care to find their children and deal with the issues they may have, just like some people don't want to go through the pains of one failed infant match over the other. Either way people are asking for funding to have children. Period.

pinkiemo

It's funny to me that soliciting people on FB for donations to fund getting pregnant would be fine but a shower for a second baby for close friends and family is tacky/taboo.

Maybe I've just been waiting for the "I don't want to pay for your life choices" finger wagers to come out of the woodwork.

nanabanana06

Also, depending on other factors, IVF is sometimes the cheaper option.

LoveActually4

Brandi Bee said:

Are you really throwing rape in there with IF?

Gross. I'm done.

You're ridiculous BB. She is isn't comparing them, she simply listed heartbreaking issues that people suffer with in silence.

Stop trying to pick fights and go home.

SunnyMeg1

This is why IVF should be covered by all insurance, IMO.

SunnyMeg1

Mackalien13 said:

For instance people don't adopt new borns to save a child. There is a market for newborns, so to speak. Those kids don't have trouble getting adopted by good families

I could kind of disagree. My brother and BIL adopted two newborns (sisters). The mother was not fit to raise children. I do feel like her deciding to go through with adoption (which wasn't her intention until she was into her 3rd trimester) allowed those little girls to be "saved" from a really unstable home life with drugs and violence.

I get what you're saying that the demand for adoption of older children isn't like it is for newborns, though.

*Edit: I should add my brother and BIL didn't have plans to adopt a newborn specifically. They would have adopted an older child, but it was just the way it worked out that they brought the babies home.

SunnyMeg1

fredalina said:

But no one should adopt from a desire to "save" a child. Ultimately you adopt because you want to grow your family. Some people are called to adopt as a means to grow their family, and they may feel that it is doing good in the world to adopt from whatever situation appeals to them, and that's cool. But the savior complex of "I saved you from a horrible life and you should feel grateful to me" is a good way to fuck up a kid.

Right. I completely agree it's not a reason to pursue adoption. I'm just saying that in many cases it is true that the child was spared an undesirable upbringing. It's not something for the parents to hang over the child's head, that's for certain. I'm with you on that.