Sleep zzz

jkbrownstein · December 2017

Thanks to this lovely 4 month sleep regression, I'm desperate. What are you guys doing to sleep "train" your LOs? I started SWAP (Sleep With Assistance Plan) last night based on Precious Little Sleep. It's a gentle way of teaching them to self soothe by slowly removing props. Since he usually falls asleep rocking on my lap, I rocked him until he was drowsy, then transferred to the crib and jostled the crib until he was asleep. I'm supposed to slowly reduce the amount of time I'm jostling each night. It took about 30 minutes, some fussing, no crying and he definitely slept better last night. Lets see how tonight goes.

Cynth0104 · December 2017

@jkbrownstein...good luck. Hope tonight goes well!

So so far we are lucky (don’t want to jinx myself!) we have had LO in his crib since 1 week and have always put him down when he was still awake.

CPR79 · December 2017

How's it going @jkbrownstein? Our LO has always been a good night sleeper (but don't get me started on naps) but the past few days he's been horrible. He's cutting 2 teeth so it might be that, could be the 4 month sleep regression, who knows. I just hope it passes quickly!

jkbrownstein · December 2017

Tonight he fell asleep in 5 minutes!! Woke up a little an hour later and was easily resettled. Woke up again at 3ish to eat and did NOT want to go back down. Decided it was, lets try to roll from back to belly time. I rocked him for 30 minutes, gave up. He played alone in his crib for about an hour before he got fussy and I sent my DH in

.

bostonlady-2 · December 2017

We were desperate, LO was up every 45 minutes only bring comforted by me and nursing, and everyone was miserable. So we did the Ferber, go in every 5 minutes and comfort and then leave approach. It was fairly brutal the first night. The longest stretch of crying was about 30 minutes, but he woke probably every hour and cried for at least 5 minutes. By the third night he was sleeping 6 to 7 hours straight. It’s now the 5th night and he doesn’t cry why he goes down, but he does still wake and cry for more than 5 minutes probably twice a night.

i think it would be faster if we spaced out the time periods we console him, but I couldn’t handle his crying. Good luck! Stick with it, I know it will be worth it when we’re consistently getting some rest!

Cynth0104 · December 2017

Ugh. LO does not want to sleep tonight. He has been doing so well this week...until tonight. Up every 3 hours. I just want to sleep!!

jkbrownstein · December 2017

We're still struggling here too. I think once he hits at least 5 months I'll be more comfortable with Ferber. We have our 4 month check up friday, going to see what the dr says.

BusyZee · December 2017

My baby sleeps fine but only if you really spend some time with him, which is a bit of a time suck for me! He sleeps a good amount so I'm wondering if sleep training is something that would work on an otherwise good sleeper. It's just that I have to nurse him to sleep, no one else can make him sleep.

jkbrownstein · December 2017

@BusyZee Sleep training isn't just to get them to sleep through the night, I was still researching different ST methods when my LO was a fabulous sleeper. It's important to me that he can put himself back to sleep. It will help with nights and naps and make him a happier, healthy baby. If you're happy and comfortable with your current set up then continue until it no longer works for you, but sleep training would absolutely work on your LO.

bostonlady-2 · December 2017

How is everyone doing? Despite extremely strict sleep training, we continue to have very variable nights. Many times, LO sleeps until 330 or so, then cries for over 30 minutes, so I ultimately feed him (pediatrician said 10 hrs was as long as we should go without feeding if he was crying excessively). On a good night, he goes back to sleep until 6ish. On a bad night, he’s up every 3 hours, sometimes crying for 45 minutes each time. We’re so tired and feeling a little defeated by the continued crying. Maybe it’s time to switch methods?

jkbrownstein · January 2018

@bostonlady-2 We were hoping to start officially training this week but LO is sick with his first cold so I'm going to wait until he recovers. I have learned that sick baby=no sleep

CPR79 · January 2018

At what age did you guys start sleep training? We haven't done anything yet, he had been doing great at night. Going down awake, falling asleep on his own, just waking up once between 3 and 4 to eat, going right back down, etc. But over the holidays when we were home with him for 10 days he regressed big time. Up multiple times a night, wakes up as soon as you put him back down after settling him. Last night he was great again so who knows. But he's horrible for naps, will only nap while being held. This is at home, apparently at daycare he falls asleep playing and they pick him up and put him in his crib and he's fine.

bostonlady-2 · January 2018

I’ve only done night time training. We started at 4.5 months, training him for max of 8 hours, then feeding and putting down again. He’s had 2 good nights in a row of sleeping from 630-530, I’m so hopeful we’re turning a corner! I think we took longer because we never spaced out our “check ins” more than 15 minutes and because I did a 330 feed for weeks, I don’t think he ever needed that feed, he just wanted the cuddle, and he’s cut it out himself recently. I so hope he continues to do this well!

Good luck! Stay warm for all those on the east coast getting snow.

optbaby2017 · January 2018

We haven't done any true sleep training. I read the No-Cry book and incorporated some of those thoughts. But really, DD has been a pretty good sleeper since the beginning. I watch her clues and bedtime is anytime between 6:00-7:30, she's up once or twice in the night, then up for good between 6-7am. Until recently she would wake up just a little when I put her back in the bassinet (or in the early days, when I re-swaddled), so I think that has helped her know how to put herself back to sleep. She did have a two week stretch ~Thanksgiving where she was awake for an hour in the middle of the night, just talking to herself after she ate, but that has passed. Her new thing is that she rolls onto her tummy and then freaks out badly enough that she needs to be rocked for a few minutes to get back to sleep. But I know this is just a phase, too.

I did read something about daytime sleep begetting night time sleep, and that is definitely true for DD. If her naps are bad, she will be more restless and difficult to get down in general.

jkbrownstein · January 2018

My LO fought sleep day 1, was never ever a 'sleepy newborn'. When he shows tired cues, it's already too late so we follow wake times to make sure he gets appropriate sleep during the day. He used to sleep through the night but I'm also fine with 1-2 wake ups, I'm not fine with the 6 wake ups from 7:30pm-12am. and the screaming every time he's horizontal at bedtime. I can't even rock him to sleep without tears anymore, he fights sleep so hard.

I read all the books and did everything they said, he's just not a good sleeper. Swaddled with white noise as a newborn, transitioned away from rocking, put down drowsy, never fed to sleep, never co slept, consistent routines, still hit with this 4 month sleep regression HARD.

BusyZee · January 2018

My baby was pulling long hours and sleep training worked like a breeze, I had no idea you could make baby wait for eight hours . Is this true for ebf babies that haven't started solids? Is there any literature on this ?

CPR79 · January 2018

@BusyZee what kind of sleep training did you use? My EBF baby has regressed a bit recently, but was having only one night feeding since about 3 months, and often that feeding was 7-9 hours after his last.

jkbrownstein · January 2018

I did night 1 of sleep training last night. Was planning on extinction (CIO) with 1 check but couldn't do it. We did Ferber with a check and soothe (no picking up) at 10 minutes, then 15, then 30. He would calm down then get upset again and me checking him seemed to upset him more so I sent my DH. He was almost asleep at the 15 but was on his belly with his arm stuck in the crib slat so I had to move him. Fell asleep at around an hour, I fed his at 2ish and 5ish. He had 2 wake ups in between that he fussed for a second and fell back asleep. I'd call it a success but still worried about tonight.

CPR79 · January 2018

@jkbrownstein that sounds like a definite improvement! was the problem mostly going to bed initially and middle of the night wakeups weren't an issue? my LO has the opposite problem - he's generally good going to bed but when he wakes up he needs to be held and rocked back to sleep. how did you decide when to feed and when to let him fuss?

jkbrownstein · January 2018

@cpr79 He used to be amazing, now the problem was both. He's scream and roll as I rocked, then wake repeatedly until 10ish. off of previous times. I would always try to soothe without feeding first and he's demonstrated on good nights he can sleep through the night or if not, at least make it to 3. Unless he's sick, I'm going to have him at least wait until 3 for an feed.

Tonight he fell asleep after 45 minutes. He woke up and cried at 11, fell asleep after 20 minutes. Woke up at 3, fed him and woke up at 6, fed him and he was up for the day.

cielaw89 · January 2018

I have no idea where to start for sleep training. LO wakes up every 1.5-2.5 hours every night. He used to sleep through the night and then the sleep regression hit and now he won’t sleep.

We have tried to let him CIO but he only gets hysterical and takes forever to calm down. He could cry for hours if we let him. The longest we let him cry was for an hour. I’ve tried soothing him to calm him down and get him to fall asleep and that doesn’t work either. He sleeps in his crib in our room since we don’t have another room to put him in, so I think he knows we are in there and wakes up because of it.

Generally he he will only fall back to sleep if I nurse him and it usually take about 10 minutes for him to fall back to sleep. I’ve tried giving him his pacifier instead and he goes ballistic on me.

jkbrownstein · January 2018

@cielaw89 You can't sleep train with him in your room unfortunately. My LO is sleeping in what used to be our dining room. We were going to do Ferber but checks got him significantly more worked up.
Night 1-cried for 1.15, slept, woke up at 1 and 4
Night 2-cried 45 minutes, woke up at 12 and 3
Night 3-cried 30 minutes, woke up at 3
set back since we had plans and screwed up his routine and went back to an hour or crying, then 45 minutes
Now we're at 0-10 minutes of fussing, not even crying sometimes a fuss at 10-12, wake up for feed at 3-4.

His cries were HORRIBLE. Growling and hysterical, thought he would never go down and rolled to his stomach which he had never slept there before. When I use rock him, he'd fall asleep while in hysterics so I knew if I just waited, he would fall asleep mid cry. By night 3 he was starting to fuss mid routine and would cry the second he touched the crib. By night 5, he'd roll to his side as I was placing him in the crib and wouldn't make a peep! Now to figure out naps...

Bedtime is wonderful right now, I just have to figure out how to have a life again. We literally hide in our bedroom at 7:30 since he's in our dining room and we have nowhere else to go. We'll be in a 2 bedroom by March so we just have to hold out until then.

bostonlady-2 · January 2018

@busyzee by baby is EBF and sometimes goes 10-11 hours at night without feeding. His typical schedule now is sleeping 630- 4ish. He eats then and sleeps again until 630ish, eats and then is up for the day. We’ve called this a huge success, though I do hope that he outgrows the 4 am feed in the next few mOnths. Sleep training was worth it. We’re better parents when we’re not up every hour, and he’s so happy when he wakes up well rested. I highly recommend it! @cielaw89, first few nights were rough. He has his own room and I agree it would be hard to sleep train in the same room.

CPR79 · January 2018

@jkbrownstein what do you do with the middle of the night wakings? the same thing you do to get him to fall asleep in the first place?

@bostonlady-2 did you end up doing Ferber with the spaced checks?

i've resisted sleep training b/c LO has never been THAT bad, and i still don't know if we're there yet because it's only been a couple days of bad, but i don't know how much longer we can take it. he was up every hour last night. because we're not sleep training, and he's still in our room, if he cries, we pick him up and he usually falls back asleep in a couple minutes and we put him back down. that usually works for awhile but last night it did not. he has his 6 month checkup tomorrow so i plan on discussing options with his pediatrician, but i don't even know where to start. even with all of these wakeups, he falls asleep fine on his own initially. i don't think my H or i are cut out to do full on cry it out, i've looked into the pick up/put down, but i fear it'll just get him more worked up. maybe he's just teething (again, he already got his first 2 back at 4.5 months) and it'll work itself out because he used to be a great sleeper, but i'm not optimistic.

jkbrownstein · January 2018

@CPR79 Exactly. He doesn't really have motn wakings anymore and when he does, he settles in a minute or so. Our biggest struggle right now is he's waking up at like 5-5:30 and doesn't want to go back to sleep but is clearly exhausted.

CPR79 · February 2018

@jkbrownstein you said earlier in this thread that sick baby=no sleep. we're hitting our first dose of that over here. he's been sick before but has slept. the past couple of nights he's not sleeping longer than 45 minutes and he's just so congested no matter how much i sit him in steam or suck his nose. the longest stretch of sleep we got last night was 2 hours with me in the rockeruntil it was time to eat, and mama didn't sleep at all. any words of wisdom??

jkbrownstein · February 2018

@cpr79 I held him upright while he slept and I stayed awake for the first and worst 2 nights

I then let him sleep in the rocknplay until he was better (he was still small enough and not rolling). I tried elevating one side of his crib mattress but it didn't make a difference and he just ended up sideways on the bottom. Keep the humidifier going, have him sit in the bathroom while you shower, and use saline and snot sucker.

Wisdom: Drinks lots of wine and hope he gets better soon.

bostonlady-2 · February 2018

@CPR79 yes. The first night, we went in every 5 minutes, the second every 10, and then every 15. We’ve stuck to every 15 minutes, though he rarely cries that long now,

We also don’t sleep train during illness, so we have had a number of nights of Frieda, humidifier and snuggling,

CPR79 · February 2018

Ok ladies - give me some real talk. Just how bad is crying it out? We've had some major sleep regression lately, but he's also been sick/teething, so I feel like we're not quite at the point to start real sleep training yet, but it's coming. We've been doing a version of pick up/put down, but we're probably holding him for too long. I feel like he's only going to get more worked up by the REAL pick up/put down, or ferber, etc and we're going to have to end up crying it out, which I'm not sure I can handle.

CPR79 · February 2018

jkbrownstein said:

@CPR79 Exactly. He doesn't really have motn wakings anymore and when he does, he settles in a minute or so. Our biggest struggle right now is he's waking up at like 5-5:30 and doesn't want to go back to sleep but is clearly exhausted.

@jkbrownstein Did this waking up at 5-5:30 thing resolve itself or did you do anything to resolve it? We're having similar problems over here. We used to spoil him and just rock him for an hour or so in the morning because he would go back to sleep that way, but now he's not interested in that but also clearly still tired.

jkbrownstein · February 2018

@cpr79 funny, you asked because today I had to wake him at 6:40 so I could feed him before work. He's still waking too early for the most part but we're getting more later wake ups than before. I think the main issue was he was going to bed too late. Because I need to get him up so early, he needs to go to bed by 6:30 so he could have 12 hours of sleep. I've been putting him to bed at 7:30 instead of 6:30 because of where he was sleeping I had no choice (wouldn't have access to my kitchen to make and eat dinner). We're spending a short stint at my parents so now he's in an actually room and I could put him to bed earlier and it's been much better.

bostonlady-2 · March 2018

@CPR79- our first week sucked. But after that, I wished we had done it earlier. You’re giving your baby the invaluable skill of learning how to go self soothe and fall asleep. I’m sure you’ve done tons of reading, but this was my favorite resource. If you’re like me, you’ll be a better (and certainly happier) mom with some sleep. I wish you luck!

https://www.preciouslittlesleep.com/what-you-need-to-know-about-sleeping-through-the-night-part-i/

cielaw89 · March 2018

So I’m not entirely sure what I did, but LO is starting to sleep for 5 hour stretches overnight. It’s been such a relief getting that solid amount of sleep time lol. I’ve been really focused on him giving me his sleep cues. When he’s ready for his naps, I try to get him down quickly. He naps anywhere between 1.5-2.5 hours during the day with 2-3 naps daily.

The difficult part now is getting him to stay asleep overnight after he wakes. Sometimes he has such a difficult time going back to sleep without comfort nursing.

bostonlady-2 · March 2018

How are things going for everyone? We had a fairly good stretch, but now that LO is pulling up to stand, he stands and just cries until we get him and help him lay down. It’s like he’s stuck. Sigh. We’re back to being up 2-3 times a night.

Cynth0104 · April 2018

We were doing well until a double ear infection and ruptured ear drum hit. Then up 5-6x per night! Oof. No fun. Last night finally back to the all night sleeping. 8-6!

@bostonlady-2, I hope LO learns to sit back down soon for you!

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