one or two?

i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake · April 2017

hi everyone! I had my ER yesterday, we have 13 embabies cooking right now with a transfer planned for Sunday. My trouble is, we had planned to transfer 2 all along, probably for the same reason many ppl do (to increase the chance of a pregnancy). But now I'm second guessing this decision. The thought of twins both terrifies and thrills me at the same time. I think the COST of twins frightens me the most. So I've been reaching the internet non stop (naturally) trying to find info on this. And it seems that a lot of it comes down to if our prognosis is "favorable" or not. And my age of course. (you can see my background in signature line)

So if you all wouldn't mind sharing # of embryos you transferred, how you came to that decision, and the overall result (if you've gotten that far) or additional info on this topic, I'd really appreciate it as I'm really struggling with this right now. Thanks - can't wait to hear from everyone!!!

2MomsHoping · April 2017

Hi @i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake

I can tell I'm going to be the real downer of this conversation. I work in a children's hospital and twin pregnancies are no joke for the mom or for the babies. It is risky. Outside of the hospital I know 3 women who made it through delivery only to bring home one baby because the other one had complications and didn't make it (and I don't know a lot of people). I know there are a lot of healthy twin deliveries out there any my friends and work probably have jaded my perspective but I encourage you to look at the health and complications associated with twin pregnancy and talk it over with your doctor. Remember that second embryo can literally "chill" until (s)he's called up for duty. Best wishes with your transfers and a happy healthy outcome whatever decision you land on.

Aera11 · April 2017

@i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake, I am just a few years younger than you and my RE recommended we transfer two. She recommends two for 30-35, that's just her thing I guess and we agreed since we didn't do any PGS testing. Had we tested and known the quality, we may have done just one. But, now I can say we will always do two because I have done two IVF rounds with fresh embryos + assisted hatching and both rounds failed.

It is definitely a personal decision/preference and I don't regret putting two in each time. The cost is a huge thing but I guess at this point, I feel like nothing can sticker shock me after going through IVF OOP.

You'll figure it out and I wish you the best of luck on whatever path you choose

srh18 · April 2017

Hi @i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake

I am 27 and after three ivf cycles that resulted in no blastocysts, we completed a fourth that resulted in two high quality blasts. Our RE said she would support either decision (one or both) as it had become clear egg quality was an issue for me despite my age. After weighing costs (financial and emotional) and truly believing that there was no way both blasts would become babies (but ultimately being okay with the possibility of twins), we transferred both.

**********TW************
Joke was on us because not only did both stick, but one also split and I am now 9w5d with triplets.

My advice is to make the decision carefully. Take your RE's advice. And if you have embryos of excellent quality, only transfer one. We are humbled, excited, and blessed by this turn of events but it isn't something we would have chosen. It wasn't even something we considered as a possibility. BUT it definitely is a possibility.

Aera11 · April 2017

@srh18 your post just made me smile and gave me so much hope! Egg quality is an issue for me as well and I am only 31. I just don't seem to produce many and they haven't been tested yet but I am assuming quality is playing into why I am not pregnant yet. Did you test your most recent embryos? I am about to start IVF round 3 and want to PGS test and do a FET in hopes of putting in better embryos.

Congrats again, what a blessing!!

srh18 · April 2017

@Aera11 Thank you!

We did not pgs test as we only had two blasts and my clinic charges about $5000 to test. We figured we would just transfer both in the hopes that one was good. Apparently both were!

Your plan sounds like a good one! I have definitely heard that sometimes FETs are more successful just because they give your body time to rest too. I wish you the very best of luck with this cycle. Fx that third time's the charm!!!!

Aera11 · April 2017

Yes, I have heard the same thing about FET @srh18. I had a hard retrieval this past time too so I am hoping that we can give my body time to bounce back without a transfer happening at the same time. We have only ended up with two embryos each time so we may bank and do a few ERs, take a break and then FET.

caitb13 · April 2017

I had my transfer today(!!) and we decided to go with just one. We really don't want multiples due to the associated health risks as well as the general craziness that would entail. However, we are fairly young and have some frosties so we decided having the process last a little longer with future FET outweighs the risk of twins. If I was a little older I don't know that I would have made the same decision.

i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake · April 2017

@Aera11 & @srh18 - you both brought up another concern of mine.. frozen vs. fresh transfers. the retrieval yesterday wrecked me - I am still so sore and have a hard time imagining that it would be an acceptable place for a baby to grow. My levels are fine & no OHSS so in those terms everything is a go. I voiced my concerns this morning to the nurse, and while she said that the doc cleared either a fresh or frozen, she thinks that i'll feel exponentially better by the scheduled transfer on Sunday. Would anyone like to chat about this? (maybe we should start a different thread?) I guess my main ? is what are the benefits of a fresh transfer? (other than doing everything in one single swoop and possibly getting a BFP earlier)

@caitb13 - GL to you! If you don't mind me asking, how old are you?

caseyw8784 · April 2017

@i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake - I'm 32 and currently waiting for AF to come to start estrace for my 1st FET. We have 2 PGS *and* PGD tested embryos; DH and I have decided that if insurance allows it, we will be transferring both. We've talked with my RE about the higher risks about both sticking (since they're both PGS and PGD tested) but we've decided it's what we want to do. We are financially stable enough for the cost of twins, and would be ready for the challenge. My RE did mention that there is always the chance that one (or both!) of the embryos may split, but the chances of HOM are still really small.

We are doing IVF because I'm a carrier for a single gene disorder that has a 50% chance of being passed down. Even though I'm only a carrier, this disease can cause issues that affect the carriers - in women, there's a high chance of premature ovarian failure and menopause before the age of 40. There's no way to know if I'll be one of the "lucky" ones until I start having symptoms of either of these. It could happen next year, in 10 years, or I could start menopause at the normal age. DH and I had planned on having a large family, but due the possibly severely shortened "fertile window," we feel that if this is the only chance we have, we would at least have the chance for more than one child.

gwinnyblack · April 2017

Hello!:)
Tomorrow is my 6 weeks scan and I am predicting twins. Honestly, the numbers of my hcg test were screaming twins but no one can be that sure, right? Although I am kind of convinced that it is going to be twins just due to the fact that I had 3 embryo transferred. yes, 3. in the clinic I'm sticking with there's this "rule" that they should transfer up to 3 embryo, their low system allows it and they say that if you are a bit older than average you are gooing to benefit from 3 embryo transfer as it does increase the chances of pregnancy. the pregnancy which is so favorable for many of us.
I am not afraid of raising 2 babies (well, I still do not know if it's twins or not) and I have enough money saved still (and this is amazing how things are going, as I have changed my clinic and managed to save a lot of money for the future of my babies or baby).
well, now I am waiting till I actually see how many of them are still there *__*

AlohaKumu · April 2017

DH and I have decided that we would like to transfer 2, if we are able to get to that point. (We still aren't 100% sure that they will be able to retrieve any sperm from him.) I understand the risks and the issues with complications, plus we are prepared for the costs. I'm also 34 and I know our only shot of getting pregnant is IVF with ICSI, so if we have twins, then we will be done! (One would be great, too.)

MrsJ2410 · April 2017

If we have the option, we are going to transfer two. However, we are still very early in the game, if she recommends just doing 1 we will obviously take that into consideration. We like the odds for transferring two and are ok with having twins. That being said, that doesn't mean I don't get extreme anxiety thinking about two babies and the costs and everything that goes along with it. But I also get extreme anxiety thinking about how much we are spending just for this cycle and for it to possibly not work. We are using some of DH's inheritance from his grandparents and there is a high level of guilt on my part that its "his money" and "my infertility problem". But in the end, I think we will accept the risks for the better odds, we also want a big family and I am 33 with DOR so this could be it for us.

bai-by2019 · April 2017

I am getting ready to start IVF and the hubby and I decided to only ever transfer 1 embryo at a time. The risks are just too high for multiples and the risks that go with it. I totally understand how personal of a decision it is, but for us, it's just too risky to do more than 1. I came to that conclusion after listening to the story of the creator of the "Beat Infertility" podcast. She talks about the loss of her twins and how she strongly suggests only transferring 1.

Best of luck to all! XOXO

lynchy326 · April 2017

I was 29 when I did a fresh embryo transfer, and I had similar stats and about 10 embabies. On the day of the transfer they walked in the room and had a photo copy picture of two embryo's, I looked the dr. right in the eye and said, you are only putting one of those in me, and they looked confused and kept asking if i was sure. I was SURE, I knew in my gut that I only wanted one. I know you're going to be 35 soon, but I think you are still plenty young that you have time. My dr. had also previously stated that the embryo's looked great and he had no concerns, so I felt even stronger that only putting in one was the best decision. And for me it was the right decision...it worked and my son is now turning 5. In the end, you have to go with your gut, but of course consider what your dr. recommends too, everyone's story is different.
I also just had an FET, now 35 and I made the same decision...no matter how many made it through thawing we were going to transfer 1. (we thawed 4, only 1 made it so we didn't have much of a choice and this decision was a little easier....we also had a surprise natural pregnancy after my son...so the FET was for the thrid and final member of our family

I saw that you brought up fresh vs. frozen. I would say that if they clear you for the fresh, then I don't see any reason why that wouldn't be the best way to go. I remember feeling awful right after retrieval but got better within a few days. Best of luck!!!

radmom27 · April 2017

I think this is so dependent on personal situation including age and infertility diagnosis. I would think if you have a diagnosis such as MFI and not necessarily an egg issue, that with ICSI, you would be fine and much safer transferring one. I've always transferred two (5 day blasts) and haven't had success so far (I'm old and my eggs aren't so hot looking). Today I transferred three blasts.
MENTS: I have 17 year old twin boys so I've been down the multiple road before. They were perfectly healthy, but I almost died giving birth to them. I was on bed rest for 11 weeks before they came and was terrified that I'd lose them. I had preeclampsia when I delivered and was on a magnesium drip and in the ICU for a couple of days after their birth. I know people say things like "one and done" and "we'd love to just complete our family" but there are real risks involved. Having said that, it is been the greatest joy of my life raising my guys and I wouldn't have changed a thing. MENTS

i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake · April 2017

So many stories! Lots to think about. Based on my fert report today, I am leaning towards transferring 2...Out of the 13 normally fertilized, 10 have made it to day 2. although i was told that only 2 of those were 4 cell, the rest are lagging behind (2 cells). RE wants to do a 3 day transfer tomorrow instead of 5 day. So for me and this particular situation, 2 seems to be the best way to go.

LoveDontCostAThing · April 2017

@i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake
For my first FET (I was 30, and I am 31 now) I transferred two day 3 embryos...BFN. The next FET I transferred two day 5 embryos...chemical pregnancy. I think that "batch" were morulas...not quite blasts. This last transfer I did a fresh *TW and transferred two expanding blastocysts...BFP...one heartbeat. I always decided to do two because I didn't mind the thought of having twins. This last transfer they were suggesting transferring one because it was a very good one, but we opted for two, and they both ended up being about the same quality. Now, I am even happier we did two because who knows which one made it?!

I think 5 day transfers are best, personally. I heard FET can be better so your body doesn't have all the hormones in it, but ironically, for me my fresh transfer was more successful than my two FETs.

liljoy-2 · April 2017

As others above said, it really depends on age, egg quality in general, whether they are day 3 or 5 and if it's PGS tested. I always say, if it's a PGS blastocyst, go with just one! I did a FET with a PGS normal and it worked. Right now though I'm battling severe nausea/vomiting and I am bed ridden, just with one. Imagine how I would feel with 2! I would probably be in hospital on a drip...For some pregnancy is no joke.

AlohaKumu · April 2017

This thread made me get into hyper-research mode and I ended up reaching out to my doctor to ask about day 3/5 embryos and PGS testing. I know my response is specifically for my situation, but some of you might find it to be helpful when talking to your own doctors:

"If doing PGS (biopsy for chromosome analysis), that is performed on any embryo that makes it to the day 5 stage. Sometimes on day 5 an embryo does not look ready, and if by day 6 it is normal appearing, they will biopsy then as well. If we do PGS, the implantation potential is so high for each embryo that I would strongly recommend transferring only 1. If we were unsuccessful with the 1, maybe we would consider 2 the next time, but I would really/really/really only want to do 1. If we don't do PGS, the implantation potential is not as high, so we may consider 2 to maximize our chances that even one implants."

Since we will definitely be doing PGS with DH's chromosome microdeletion, it sounds like the team REALLY wants us to transfer only one. (Of course, we still need to get to the point of the retrieval for any of this to even be a possibility, but I want to be informed and have lots of time to digest this!) I know that DH and I will need to discuss this, since we had planned on two, but now I'm leaning toward 1.

[Deleted User] · April 2017

@AlohaKumu you know me, we'd be in the same boat... the doctor recommended pgs since I expressed the desire to transfer all. Likely one at a time, like you said.

So we'd still need to talk more about any life-compatible abnormals if it comes to that... crazy tho bc if you don't do pgs we wouldnt know, so we wouldnt have to "decide." sigh... I guess usually they automatically don't keep them if there are normals, too, but maybe we would still hang onto them just in case? Idk

suchaglencoco · April 2017

***lurking, tw (pregnancy, children, and loss mentioned)***

Sorry to jump in. I used to be way more active, but still try to chime in when I have a moment and something to say that may be of value.

After our er, we ended up with 5 embryos, opted out of testing, and did a fresh transfer right away. We had discussed with our re putting in 2 the first time because it was such a process, very expensive, very painful and we were financially stable enough to have twins. I was 28 and we have "unexplained infertility".

Our top embryo was such a high grade that we had to have another discussion because our re was sure both would stick and we'd end up with twins. We told her it would just be a double blessing. Fast forward a few weeks and only one stuck, however it split. We were overjoyed to hear the 2 heartbeats. Our re quickly warned us she didn't know if the embryo split correctly and told us to mentally prepare for a loss. She unfortunately ended up being right and we lost them the day after Thanksgiving.

That following spring, we started the process again. I had to undergo a minor procedure to have my uterus cleaned out due to remnants from our recent mc. When my body finally recuperated, we did a fet. This time our re did not argue about us putting in 2 and told us not to count on twins. Fast forward a couple weeks and 2 heartbeats on the monitor popped up. Both embryos had stuck and ended up staying in it for the long haul.

My pregnancy was not as easy as we had hoped. I had 2 first trimester bleeds that ended up being schs, I was on and off of bed rest, on and off of pelvic rest, had a couple of hospital stays, and ended up delivering at 35w5d due to pre-e. Our twins were in the nicu for 2 and 2.5 weeks, both healthy, but needing to grow, and one of them came home on an apnea monitor. I attempted to bf, but with them being so early and small, it just did not work out. It wasn't how I pictured any of it, but after years of loss and struggles, I was just happy we got there and felt amazingly blessed.

We now budget like never before, have less money to go out and be crazy with, but that's fine with us as now we'd rather be home as a family instead. The diapers and formula can add up, but if you coupon and wait for big sales or gift card deals, it's very doable. We also ended up making most of our own baby food to save on money.

You obviously have to do what is best for you, but once the embryo(s) is in, it has a mind of its own and will do what it can. And I cannot imagine our life with only one of our twins.

Good luck to you and to all you ladies here. Our plan is to use our final embryo this fall and I hope you all won't be around in this group much because you'll be in the pregnant after if group.

LadyMillil · April 2017

We are planning to transfer 1 day 5 or 2 day 3s. Our clinic won't transfer 2 if they've been PGS tested or do 2 day 5s if you're under 35.

In terms of fresh versus FET my clinic has similar success rates (40% vs 38%) so it doesn't seem to matter which you do, although they prefer you do fresh if possible so you don't have to worry about losing any embryos during freezing or thawing

AlohaKumu · April 2017

@BusinessWife - There's just so much to consider in all of this! I guess one step at a time. Hopefully we get the embryos and then we can figure out where to go from there.
@suchaglencoco - Thank you for sharing your story. It's really helpful to hear from someone who actually went through the experience. I can't imagine what it was like to have a loss after hearing those two heartbeats, but I'm glad your story has a happy ending with your twins! I hope all goes well with your final transfer. (I'll probably still be in the group in the fall, since we are going for a retrieval/PGS in August and then a FET in September, if all goes well.)

caitb13 · April 2017

@i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake sorry for responding so late, I just saw your question now. I'm 28 and DH will be 30 in May.

caitb13 · April 2017

@i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake clearly I didn't read through all the posts before replying. It looks like you had your 3 day transfer yesterday with 2! FX for you!!

hbomb513 · April 2017

This is heavy on my mind as well. After retrieving 12 eggs, we're left with 2 good five day blasts, and 2 fair 6 day blasts (no PGS). Twins aren't the worst thing in the world, and I know plenty of people who have carried them to term and have healthy kids, but like @2MomsHoping, I'm a former NICU nurse and have seen my share of the stuff that can go wrong. It's terrifying. Let alone the cost @i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake!

But I'm 36, and time isn't really on my side (relatively speaking). It makes sense to transfer one good embie and one fair and pray one sticks (and then do it again later). If two stick, then I'll be happy and excited for two babies. I'll be freaked out either way lol...nursing isn't good for anxiety! My RE didn't have an opinion one way or another.

@i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake, how did your transfer go?? Mine is scheduled for May 15!

i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake · April 2017

hbomb513 - It went well, thanks! Altho a little confusing, I must say. I was totally freaking out the morn of the transfer - RE called and she was not happy with how our embies were progressing. We had a bunch (10) still in the game but they were slow to grow. On the phone that morning she even mentioned transferring 3! That kinda shocked me. Especially when we spoke with the Embryologist right before the transfer who was kinda acting surprised that we were transferring on day 3 at all. I told her about transferring 3 and she said "I wouldn't do 3, you are still very young". So we transferred 2. And I understand that RE wanted to be conservative and obviously doubted any would make it to day 5, but I think she jumped the gun a bit. Which was confirmed when they called and said we have 3 frosties on day 6. So now I'm in the 2WW so we'll see how it all turns out soon!

[Deleted User] · April 2017

Ahhh! GL OP! So glad you got to transfer plus a few lovely lil frosties ;)

Polythene Pam · April 2017

Lurking and a bit late, I see you already transferred, fingers crossed for you! Just sharing for others debating

(*TW* pregnancy and previous child)

I'm 33, had one natural pregnancy when I was 28 and then found we had a blocked tube so I wasn't getting pregnant again after 2 years of trying. Got 5 embryos, all high quality (we didn't do testing though). Because we know I CAN carry a pregnancy, and that delivery was a traumatic one (excessive blood loss) we didn't want to risk twins. We transferred one (fresh transfer) and it stuck! I'm 13 weeks.

I've got a few other close friends who did IVF. Three of them transferred two embryos, all got pregnant on the first try, two with twins. One of those moms did have complications due to having twins (early bedrest and preterm labor) but everyone is healthy now. The other mom only had one stick and she has a healthy daughter.

As for fresh vs frozen, I just so wanted the ball to keep rolling so we did fresh, but I felt pretty good at that point.

Best of luck to everyone, checking in often to cheer for everyone XO

Hopeful_mom · April 2017

Just curious what everyone had to say....nice to hear some successes and experience!

TW** I always want to transfer more then 1 but the problem is my OH and RE only want me to transfer 1 as I MC twins in Jan of this year at 10wks. I guess compared to others i had a terrible MC and loss a lot of blood yet I still want to carry twins.

lynchy326 You mentioned you lost 3 during the thaw were the pgs tested? A natural pregnancy must've been s great surprise that so nice!

My concern is spending all this time on trying to bank healthy tested embryos and then lose them in the thaw. I got lucky with my fresh transfer and would love to do it again! But to hopefully prevent a MC they want me to test as they dont know why I MC as we know my embryo was healthy. Doing an FET seems like a lot more work when you have to start prepping for it...now to only get back to that process!!

caseyw8784 · April 2017

@Hopeful_mom - is losing embryos during the thaw really that common? both my RE and the genetics clinic (separately) told me that the chances of them not surviving the thaw was about 1-in-200 to 1-in-250. until now i wasn't really worrying about it, or, at least, trying not to worry about it happening to one of my 2 frosties...lol ::shrugs::

And prepping for the FET, to me is easier than doing the stim cycle! 1 pill twice a day instead of 2-3 shots for 12 nights, until next friday...but then the PIO comes into play...eekkkkk

Hopeful_mom · April 2017

caseyw8784 I have read it here and there of people losing embryos during the thawing process however I dont know if they were pgs tested or not. Its another thing to worry about it. It is a concern as certain things keep happening that technically shouldn't be u kno. I know I sound a bit pessimistic about it but just trying to weigh the options. Everything at this point scares me, after each appt i'm always thankful I get to move on.

It seems like each clinic varies a lil in the FET process would love popping a few pills and then just a shot out two for sure

See but that PIO one does not sound fun, I guess O lucked out with not having to take that one, I was on the suppositories instead I believe so hopefully I shall find out sooner then later!!

caseyw8784 · May 2017

@Hopeful_mom - i've heard horrible/yucky things about both the shots and the suppositories, so it doesn't seem like a win either way! I guess i'll find out on friday how the shots feel!

AandDM2014 · May 2017

A bit late but I thought I'd chime in. I transferred 2 embryos 3 times, one was chemical one negative one MMC. We assumed a bad batch of embryos so transferred our remaining 3 to get them done with and move on to a pgs tested cycle. Surprise surprise when *tw* I got a very positive beta and at 5w6d saw three heart beats. My triplets were born healthy at 33w1d and spent 3 weeks, 1 and 2 days in the NICU learning how to regulate temperature and eat. *end tw*

Hopeful_mom · May 2017

AandDM2014 I followed you on PAIF for a while after I believe I found your blog one day. Its really such an amazing story and I"m so thrilled that it has a happy ending!! I wish I was younger to have been able to carry my twins through. You are an incredible force and wish you well with your babies! They obvious have your strength!!

AandDM2014 · May 2017

@Hopeful_mom thanks! It definitely wasn't easy but overall I didn't do too bad and only delivered when I did because someone decided they wanted out. If I had been older I probably would not have chosen to carry all three.

i-wanna-b-the-girl-w-most-cake · May 2017

I really appreciate everyone's input on this. These stories are all so very interesting!
I wanted to just give a quick update...
After xfering 2 on day 3, sadly, neither took. We are now gearing up for a FET in June and will transfer another 2 but this time our embies are 6 day blasts so I'm hoping that will make all the difference.

[Deleted User] · May 2017

Thanks for the update, OP... sorry they didn't the this time... fx for magic sticky beans in June! :)

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