September 2015 Moms
LoveLee85
member
sleep training again, still not working..
LoveLee85
member
okay. I'm doing all naps and bedtime in Ferber. Checking every 5, 10, 15, 20 min. NOTHING is working. This IS day one. I have tried this method 2 other times, and it got worse with each passing day. He just stands on the crib rails and cries. We are almost 11 months of zero sleep in this house UNLESS he is co sleeping....then I don't sleep because of him in bed. I have tried other ways of sleep training. Nothing works. When I go in and check I repeat the following:
no talking.
wipe is face off.
lay him down.
cover him in blanket.
rub his back or tummy.
walk out.
I am consistent.
I HAVE to start sleeping. I need to be myself again. I need to save my marriage(haven't snuggled my own DH in almost a year), I have gained weight from stress and am just all around miserable.
At at what point do I quit because it isn't working? He won't even transfer to a crib because he wants to physically be snuggling mommy. I'm a mess, he's a mess. I just want to feel any emotion other than crabby, exhausted and miserable. It's so bad, I honestly don't want more children because I can't sign up for this again, knowing how miserable it is.
no talking.
wipe is face off.
lay him down.
cover him in blanket.
rub his back or tummy.
walk out.
I am consistent.
I HAVE to start sleeping. I need to be myself again. I need to save my marriage(haven't snuggled my own DH in almost a year), I have gained weight from stress and am just all around miserable.
At at what point do I quit because it isn't working? He won't even transfer to a crib because he wants to physically be snuggling mommy. I'm a mess, he's a mess. I just want to feel any emotion other than crabby, exhausted and miserable. It's so bad, I honestly don't want more children because I can't sign up for this again, knowing how miserable it is.
Re: sleep training again, still not working..
the first night we hardcore decided to do Ferber, I muted the monitor and just watched him. We did intervals. And the last I remember was looking at the clock at the 45 minute mark and I closed my eyes for a brief moment. I woke up 6 hours later (insert embarrassed face here). I have no idea how long he cried for. No idea how dramatic he was. But I swear the second night was easier and the third night even easier. That first night sets the tone. Now I still feed him before bed and hold him til he falls asleep, but he's thru the night til about 6-7 am consistently now. And I like those pre-bed snuggles so I'm gonna keep doing it.
So I guess my message here is, he cried. He lost his shit. To what extent I don't really know thank goodness. But he is fine. He is happy. He sleeps better than he ever did before so he is healthier. And DH and I finally feel like we have our sanity back. It's AMAZING.
Obv you can't just leave him in there to cry. It's heartbreaking. I'm the asshole that did it on accident and still feel bad. But it worked. You can get thru this. It's what is best for you, DH and your little one to keep trying to find a solution.
So far I've not managed a week as it was disturbing my other son who had school the next day, also I was on my knees with exhaustion. Now it's the holidays so I'm going to try my hardest to nail it. She did advise that I'd be even more sleep deprived than I am already (just what I wanted to hear) but with persistence it will work. It certainly doesn't feel like that when I'm up for the 6th time, and it's only 3am!!
What happens when he's asleep with you? will he go in his cot then when in a deep sleep? or does he wake as soon as you put him down? I can get away with an hour or so if I do this, but it pisses me off, as I know that what I'm doing isn't right. I also give Jake a 4oz bottle when he wakes, I find that helps knock him out for a bit. I nurse him in bed, and then pop him back in his cot once he's nodded off again. I've been told at his age he should be able to go all night without a bottle, but like you I'm trying my hardest and at the end of my tether.
Please don't let this put you off having anymore babies love. Believe me, they're not all like this when it comes to sleeping. Our first born was a fab sleeper. Slept through from 3/4 months in his cot. No problem with teething. In fact, I wondered what everyone was taking about saying the first year was the hardest. Now I get it! All I can say is hang in there mama. You're not alone! a d you're doing your best! Also try to nap when you can. Leave your baby with daddy or a family
member whilst you catch up on some sleep. It will make you feel better mentally and physically. I went through a depressed stage too over it, however I lost weight, which is the only bloody good thing to come out of it.
Keep your chin up sweetheart. I'm always here if you want to get it all out. We could thrash it out together. Big hugs from across the pond.
My baby girl is a decent sleeper. On nights where she doesn't want to go back down in her crib, I don't give in. I will hold her until she gets sleepy and then put her back down. She starts to cry, I try to pat her butt and sing to her and if that doesn't work within a minute or 2, I pick her back up and try again. I keep repeating this until she sleeps in her crib. Even if it takes hours. Yes it's exhausting and the next day I'm a zombie but I feel it has helped her understand nighttime sleep is crib only and not to know that there's even another option. But then again, we never bed shared. She was in a Moses basket next to our bed before she went to her own room around 5.5 months. So I don't know how helpful this suggestion would be to you.
The key seems to be not putting her down fully asleep. If she's tired enough, she opens her eyes a bit, snuggles up next to her bumpers and goes to sleep. We have short fluffy bumpers---got them a month or so ago and they've made a big difference in her comfort in the crib. So I just cuddle and bounce her, occasionally nurse her until sleepY, then she's put down. It takes a while for her to give up and just go to sleep. But I feel better not letting her go crazy crying her eyes out.
i will occasionally give her a big bottle in her crib and just wait until she finishes it (watching with the monitor), and many times she will drink it, throw it aside and sleep, when she doesn't, I use the above method.
I've never read any sleep training books, CIO or no cry solutions, so I'm definitely no expert. And I'm aware all children are different and what works for one may not work for another. Just thought I'd share in case it helps.
Good luck. Hope you start resting soon. It's tough going parenting on little sleep.
BFP September 2013 - MMC at 12 weeks
BFP February 2014 - early loss/CP at 4.5 weeks
BFP May 2014 - MMC/ complete molar pregnancy at 11 weeks
BFP December 2015 - DD born 8/18/2015
BFP November 2016 - pending...
I lay my boys down in seperate rooms, give them a bottle on their boopy pillow & walk out. I dont walk in unless they cry & all i do is make sure theyre not hurt & walk back out. I check on them every 10 min with out them seeing me. &. Sometimes they are in the room babbling & standing in the crib. The longest its taken them to fall asleep is 30 min but because DH is in the room talking & playing with them
Maybe hes hot? Here in Denver its been hot @ night so leaving them in a onesie, having the fan on them& giving them a bottle with water has been my savior. Maybe try intervals. Leave him be for 15 min in the crib. The next 20 or 25. Then half an hout. Leave him longer & longer until it works.
Just dont give in momma. I could not imagine not cuddling with hubby for so long! Good luck.
@dmbfan46835 don't feel too bad, I've done this too. I always shut the monitor off when I go into to the nursery and I've woken up once or twice having forgotten to turn it back on. I don't think DS cried but I still felt bad
Also, not sure if it makes a big difference but Ferber says to do they same time intervals each night, increasing each day. So, for example, night 1 check on baby every 5 minutes. Then, night 2 check on baby every 7 minutes, etc. until you get to 20 mins on night 6 or 7. Usually by that point they are asleep well before 20 minutes anyway.
If if you are on Facebook, there is a great group called Respectful Sleep Training/learning that has lots of great files and mamas going through the same thing as you. It's a great place to get info, advice, and encouragement. I learned in there that if the baby is standing in the crib, it is recommended to only lay them down one time. After that, it is up to them to learn to lay down on their own. Otherwise, it can become a game to them and they will cry and stand up to get you to come back in to lay them down.
Here's my biggest issue: when he co-sleeps, I don't sleep. He flips and flops and cries out of he isn't touching me in some way. I'm awake every 15 minutes from something and worried he I'll fall off the bed!! I'm a light sleeper. My DH sleeps deep. Our son sleeps I between us. We even moved the crib into our bedroom around 7 months to see if he would transfer or sleep in there with us. Nope. Didn't help. I just thought we would be past this at almost a year old?!
My DH works nonstop so I can stay home with LO(daycare would take 3/4 of my paycheck). So, it's me. Help isn't here. I would be golden if I could actually sleep at night. Sadly, I hardly eat anything and still am gaining for the first time in my entire life!! Lost all of what little baby weight I had...then around December it all started creeping back. So frustrating.
Our LO will sleep all night in our bed, but I don't. I can only truly get sleep if he's not laying next to me.
I was soooooooo against any form of CIO until a few months ago. I still hate it and cave and give up. But this time he isn't teething...so it should be doable. But he just stands up and screams. And for heavens sake he's almost a year old!! I love him more than anything and would never do anything that would hurt him. I have so many friends that swear by CIO and say once LO sleeps, I will feel like a new woman.
My LO also never took a pacifier...haven't even tried one since 4 months old. He doesn't self sooth at all. Probably my fault for running to save him at every whimper! What do I do?? I feel like it's all my fault and I'm so annoyed with myself. I thought about buying one of those turtles that are soft and project stars at the ceiling/plays soft music. I always use a noise maker!
Gentle - pick up put down, sssshhh pat the bum until they sleep. These will take longer and are more physically exhausting for you. My friend had success with the standing by just going in laying her son down over and over until he went to sleep. The first night she did it over 50 times. It gradually got better and now he doesn't stand at all when it's nap time.
With a faster approach that will involve crying, I personally found my babe got more worked up when I checked on her. So, I just didn't but looked at the monitor. One night she cried on and off for 1.5 hours. It is very common for it to get worse 3/4 nights in. You have to be soooo consistent - every single time you have to do the same method. If you let them cry for 30 mins and then go in, the 30mins is wasted.
Finally, what is your day nap schedule like? Is there enough time between last nap and bedtime or is there too much time? Does your babe nap at the same times each day. There are common sleep windows for putting babe down around 9/9:30 and 1/1:30 then between 6/7. This is when their bodies start to naturally prepare for sleep.
Also, have you heard of a lulla doll? It mimics your heartbeat and breathing and people have had excellent results transitioning to a cot using them.
its supposed to be the miracle sleep toy.
also, I bought a dock a tot https://dockatot.com/collections/dockatot-grand and I love it. You could put LO in it in your bed, then use it to transition him to his crib. And then eventually his big boy bed. I love it. DS snuggles up on the sides and doesn't flail around in his crib. It cradles him.
Im telling you all of this because I was in your shoes and it's awful and I want to help you! We were so desparate that we finally decided to hire a sleep consultant. We didn't think it would really work because we'd attempted to do Ferber in the past and just like you, it never worked. I have to say that this was the best money ever spent and I only wish we'd done it sooner. Just having someone there with us to walk us through it all was all we really needed. Because honestly we have the tools, but it's scary to hear your baby crying and to think its never going to stop. And I probably would have run in to save my baby from crying if she wasn't there to tell me it's gonna be ok.
Since the sleep consultant came, my son has been sleeping 12 hours a night AND taking two naps a day. I can't even express how crazy this is after believing that he was a horrible sleeper. I can walk you through everything that she taught us if you want. It worked for us immediately. The night she left he fell asleep at 8 and slept until 7. Then everyday after he's slept from 7-7. Just let me know if you want me to tell you how she did it and I'm happy to go through it!
Cause then you can stick your arm in the crib to soothe baby while he cries himself to sleep. Then once he gets to where he'll sleep on the crib with your arm in it you can scoot the crib away father and father and eventually have him sleep in his crib in his own room by himself.
It'll take time but maybe it's the more gentle transition your kiddo needs.
Does your baby spend much time in his crib? I slowly introduced my baby to the crib by leaving him there briefly when he was wide awake and happy and I was right there doing something near him. Then I'd leave him for longer and longer, then we started naps in the crib and then we moved to nighttime sleeping in the crib.
I see that someone else suggested the doc a tot. Maybe that could be your first transitional move. Baby would still be in bed with you, just not touching you. Then once he learns that's ok you can try moving him to the crib or if you can put your mattress on the floor and his crib mattress on the floor next to you, you can start scooting the doc a tot with him asleep in it on to his mattress. Basically getting him to sleep without touching you and then his own space and then later work on the crib.
My baby initially wouldn't sleep without being on me, so we started with him on me, then him next to me, then him in bed but not touching me at all, then bassinet next to the bed and then into the crib.
Here's the thing. I don't know one set of parents who has a sweet newborn baby and says "I'm so excited to listen to my baby cry in his crib, I just can't wait to CIO!". As you have seen on this board and maybe other places, sleep training is usually the result of desperation. Moms and Dads who have gone 8,9,12 months without decent sleep. Babies are unique, some sort out sleep on their own, some only need a little help to figure it out but some need serious training. Kind of like how some toddlers sail through terrible twos with few issues and some are little nightmares.
I'm part of an amazing sleep group but I can give you the general "rules" for setting up a successful CIO with LO.
1. Good naps-work on bedtime first, then worry about naps. An overtired baby will struggle harder so do whatever you can to ensure decent naps.
2. An appropriate amount of wake time before bed. In general for babies this age its about 4 hours. Baby should be tired enough but not overtired.
3. White noise and monitor
4. No feeds or coming out of the crib until after midnight. Any "MOTN" soothing that occurs too close to bedtime can essentially reset all your hard work. After midnight all bets are off and there should be no issues if you want to continue nursing/feeding etc. I still feed DS2 some nights and he falls asleep on the bottle around 4 or 5 am. You don't need to put them down awake MOTN, bedtime is enough.
I know that it is so, so hard. I never wanted to hear my baby cry, I was like you! I ran to DS2 any time I heard a whimper and TBH I probably would have postponed sleep trying as well if I hadn't been so exhausted and emotional around 8 months (Surprise pregnant!). However, I'm so happy I did. My days are so much less stressful, bedtime is relaxing and enjoyable in a house with a brand new 3 year old and a one year old- and I can do it for both of them easily by myself if I need to! It's so worth it, you seem so exhausted and stressed
I tried the crib next to the bed, it wasn't helpful.
Naps are OK. Two, 2 hour naps most days. I rely heavily on the MammaRoo, not going to lie. Or, he's sleepy enough to fall asleep on me and I lay him down somewhere other than he crib now(because after CIO he instantly wakes and freaks...then he won't fall back to sleep for the nap. Bedtime is my issue.
I would LOVE and be grateful for anything that sleep coach said or did... @Bellarose212
Should I put his crib back in his room?? Or is it okay in our bedroom?
Again, I'm no expert and this could be terrible advice but 4 hours of daytime sleep seems like a lot to me.
BFP September 2013 - MMC at 12 weeks
BFP February 2014 - early loss/CP at 4.5 weeks
BFP May 2014 - MMC/ complete molar pregnancy at 11 weeks
BFP December 2015 - DD born 8/18/2015
BFP November 2016 - pending...
I also read somewhere that a mom recorded herself "shh-ing" over white noise and played that all night for her baby. That way when the baby woke he heard mom and thought she was in the room.
And I've seen online, not sure if it was a pajama or a sleep sack, but it had something sewn in over the chest area so it's a bit heavier and baby thinks your hand is on his chest. If your baby is a stomach sleeper, I saw on Pinterest to fill a winter glove with rice or beans or something and sew it shut really well, and place on baby's back after you put him down so he feels the weight and thinks it's your hand.
Maybe a combination of the shh-ing white noise, your scent on the blanket, and the weighted glove would make baby think you're still there. And if effective, you could slowly drop one item at a time. It sounds like such a big science haha but every baby is different and what works for one baby may not work for another. Personally, CIO or Ferber does not work for my son. He will cry until he's purple and tear-streaked for any amount of time, and fall asleep instantly the second I pick him up from the crib. So I rock him to sleep, put him down with the blanket and some white noise, and sometimes we're lucky enough to make it to morning. Sometimes not!
I really hope I helped and I hope you find something to work for your family.
Our LO has always been a good sleeper, but for the first almost 10 months, we would lay him down completely asleep. Then that stopped working, and we had to figure out the drowsy but awake thing, which did involve some crying. I've never been a fan of CIO, but we basically did the Ferber method and went in to check on him in 10 minute intervals, but he always fell asleep within 15-20 minutes. It worked, and within a few days he was falling asleep on his own without even crying, but I know I would have had a really hard time staying strong if he put up more of a fight, so I can totally understand why you're having a tough time!
If your husband is able to help, I found that my LO would fall asleep faster when DH laid him down for bed and went in to check on him because LO is a huge momma's boy and more clingy with me. If he's able to help, even for the first few days, it's worth trying! I also had to find something to distract myself in those minutes when LO was crying so I didn't go crazy just staring at the monitor.
Hope you can find something that works! Hugs!
Ps- can I ask how expensive a sleep trainer is? I didn't even know this was a thing. I'd have hired one MONTHS ago!! Lol