Closing on home, lost job (NTTGPR)

MrsSept13 · January 2015

Hey guys, I wanted your opinion on this. We're currently in the process of buying a home. We're just waiting on USDA approval and we're set to close on Thursday.

My husband was just laid off yesterday. He is on the loan but they were not taking his wages because he was part time. We can still afford this home without his wages.

We have to be out of our rental by February 1st so we need this to happen. Should I tell the bank or just not say anything since this isn't affecting us financially?

JennyH81 · January 2015

Given that this loan involves the USDA, which is the federal government, you need to look carefully at the documents you have signed/are signing. Many federal documents have a notation on the bottom indicating that providing false information on the document is a criminal offense under 18 USC 1001. So if that is on a form that says your husband has a job and he no longer does, that is technically a felony under federal criminal law. Just something to consider.

(In case the bar is watching me, this is not to be taken as actual legal advice

)

MrsSept13 · January 2015

Well, I feel the reason you must contest nothing has changed is so you can still pay and won't foreclose. We for sure can still afford it. I'm leaning towards not telling them considering his wages were never factored into our approval since he was part time.

JennyH81 · January 2015

14whitney said:

JennyH81 said:

Given that this loan involves the USDA, which is the federal government, you need to look carefully at the documents you have signed/are signing. Many federal documents have a notation on the bottom indicating that providing false information on the document is a criminal offense under 18 USC 1001. So if that is on a form that says your husband has a job and he no longer does, that is technically a felony under federal criminal law. Just something to consider.

(In case the bar is watching me, this is not to be taken as actual legal advice )

I think you should put this in all your posts. Lol

The Man always be keepin' me down.

MrsSept13 · January 2015

I was given both sides of advice and I'm leaning towards one.

ETA: Read all responses before you act like I'm ignoring everyone.

quiltygirl23 · January 2015

I remember having to sign that nothing has changed also. I wouldn't take they risk! (But I'm a square.) Good luck!

MrsSept13 · January 2015

What would happen to the process if we told them? Start over or just a simple thing as taking him off the loan?

lil_diamond_eyes · January 2015

MrsSept13 · January 2015

PowerOfBacon said:

MrsSept13 said:

Hey guys, I wanted your opinion on this. We're currently in the process of buying a home. We're just waiting on USDA approval and we're set to close on Thursday.

My husband was just laid off yesterday. He is on the loan but they were not taking his wages because he was part time. We can still afford this home without his wages.

We have to be out of our rental by February 1st so we need this to happen. Should I tell the bank or just not say anything since this isn't affecting us financially?

If they are not taking his wages into accounting for loan underwriting, then a change in circumstances shouldn't affect your closing. With USDA loans, they generally don't allow part time income to be considered in underwriting, so if you qualified on your income alone, and were approved, it means you qualified under the their guidelines, and the loss of part time income isn't going to change the loan approval.

So basically, make sure that they did the loan underwriting on your income alone. If they did, you are okay to proceed. If they didn't and actually considered his income (which I'd be surprised at), then you just need to make sure you still fit within their debt ratios with your income (29% front end, 41% back end).

The loan officer specifically told me they are not counting his wages to qualify. However they made us both verify our employment. (I'm just being honest so I can proceed the best way possibly).

fancefpp · January 2015

If he's on the loan application, you have to tell them. You will sign a document at closing that states the information on your loan application is accurate and nothing major has changed since you first applied for the loan. You will most likely re-sign the loan application at the closing, as well as one or two more documents that state nothing has changed, you're still employed and you haven't taken out any additional debts, etc. Some banks even make you sign mortgage fraud disclosures. If you don't need his wages to qualify, this shouldn't be a problem.

PrimRoseMama · January 2015

I would inform the bank.

fancefpp · January 2015

osesecret said:

I was given both sides of advice and I'm leaning towards one. ETA: Read all responses before you act like I'm ignoring everyone.
L -O -FUCKING -L Ignore the advice from 2 lawyers and ignore the advice from the person who told you what the legal paperwork she signed less than 6 weeks ago said.

I also do this for a living (not providing legal advice here). If you have an attorney, you should talk to him/her.

butlerfan · January 2015

I would tell them.

icaughtfire · January 2015

icaughtfire · January 2015

SeptNumbers, you should definitely not worry about telling the bank. They don't need to know your lyfe. You know what you can afford, they don't decide what you can afford. Fuck that bank, right??

Since you always argue with logic & sense, that should be the answer you're looking for.

rajahmd · January 2015

Honesty is the best policy.

klburke88 · January 2015

Did not read all the previous replies, sorry if this is repetitive. Tell your loan officer right away. Your loan officer is not in charge of approving or denying your loan. That is the job of an underwriter. It sounds like you may be OK, since they are not using his income for qualifying purposes. Did they do a verification of your husbands employment? If so, they will likely contact his employer a day or 2 prior to closing to verify his employment status. If this is the case, you definitely want to be the one informing your bank, not his employer. Good luck to you!

klburke88 · January 2015

@PowerOfBacon‌ I see someone else works in the mortgage business

I'm a processor!

danascullyx · January 2015

Of you don't tell them, you are committing a crime. It's that simple. And they will probably verify both your employment this week. It is a very common step.

Wine&Cupcakes · January 2015

We just purchased a home in September and for sure had to sign something stating that nothing has changed.

I would tell them ASAP. If you delay, and they find out (which they most likely will) then closing will fall through at the table or you will have major legal issues to contend with or both. Tell them.

ETA - don't use the income consideration issue as justification for not telling them.

cnf2013 · January 2015

MrsSept13 said:

What would happen to the process if we told them? Start over or just a simple thing as taking him off the loan?

This happened to us a few years ago. We told the bank that I lost my job and they required us to bring a larger down payment to the table. That was all. It was not the end of the world and we closed early.

JennyH81 · January 2015

debthelibrarian said:

I am serious. And don't call me Shirley.

rufus426 · January 2015

@MrsSept13 - I used to work as a mortgage originator. If they have him listed as employed on the application, they will complete a verbal verification of employment days before closing. This is because people like you, have lied about employment changes in the past, and mortgage companies don't want to give loans to people, if they cannot pay it back. Just because you know you can pay it back without his income, doesn't mean the mortgage company knows that and therefore should give you hundreds of thousands of dollars, based on inaccurate information. Sometimes they do use part-time income, if they can show a 2-year history of it, so they may be using a small amount of his income to qualify you.

Even if they are not using his income, if they do the verbal and found out that you did not tell them he was laid off, it could create problems because you lied. They may look more closely at other pieces of information that you gave them and require more documentation, which would delay closing.

Tell them. And as others have said, it is mortgage fraud not to tell them.

Scatterbug · January 2015

Tell them. Lying is a huge no no. Not to mention an offence in this case.

SunShineWoman · January 2015

As most others have said, I would tell them.

Remylove1011 · January 2015

I agree with PP's that you have to tell them. We built a house last year and MH changed jobs about a bit before we closed. We had done the entire application on my income as MH was a contract employee at the time and still had to tell them as it was a change in employment. It wasn't a hassle for us (more for the mortgage people to do but nothing extra for us really).

They did make a sign something right before closing stating that nothing had changed. It's a felony, so I guess your choice.

Donna Paulsen Sarah Rafferty animated GIF

chipsfordinner · January 2015

I get that @MrsSept13‌ is on all our post its, but tbh I see why she is confused. And I actually disagree with most of the PPs.

When we bought our house, we were preapproved on my salary alone (I make more.) The loan agent even suggested we put the house in my name only, as she had had a horrible divorce and thought I should protect myself. I told her I wasn't that pessimistic about the future.

Should I have only put myself on the title though, then my husband's income would be irrelevant. OP, is this the case with you? Is it just you on the title? If so, I would not disclose what's going on with the hubs.

ETA: well shit, I see he is on the loan. You have to tell because they are assuming that if you lose your job, you still have his income.

MrsSept13 · January 2015

chipsfordinner said:
I get that @MrsSept13‌ is on all our post its, but tbh I see why she is confused. And I actually disagree with most of the PPs.

When we bought our house, we were preapproved on my salary alone (I make more.) The loan agent even suggested we put the house in my name only, as she had had a horrible divorce and thought I should protect myself. I told her I wasn't that pessimistic about the future.

Should I have only put myself on the title though, then my husband's income would be irrelevant. OP, is this the case with you? Is it just you on the title? If so, I would not disclose what's going on with the hubs.

ETA: well shit, I see he is on the loan. You have to tell because they are assuming that if you lose your job, you still have his income.

-----
Yes I put him on the loan in case something happened to me I didn't want him to have to go through more hassle. So my question at this point is what happens if I tell them? Is it as simple as we just sign some more documents or start the whole process over?

MrsSept13 · January 2015

cjchio said:

MrsSept13 said:

chipsfordinner said:
I get that @MrsSept13‌ is on all our post its, but tbh I see why she is confused. And I actually disagree with most of the PPs.

When we bought our house, we were preapproved on my salary alone (I make more.) The loan agent even suggested we put the house in my name only, as she had had a horrible divorce and thought I should protect myself. I told her I wasn't that pessimistic about the future.

Should I have only put myself on the title though, then my husband's income would be irrelevant. OP, is this the case with you? Is it just you on the title? If so, I would not disclose what's going on with the hubs.

ETA: well shit, I see he is on the loan. You have to tell because they are assuming that if you lose your job, you still have his income.
-----
Yes I put him on the loan in case something happened to me I didn't want him to have to go through more hassle. So my question at this point is what happens if I tell them? Is it as simple as we just sign some more documents or start the whole process over?

If you tell them? Shouldn't that read when I tell them?

Why do you ask for advice? You just do whatever the hell you want anyway. Enjoy Club fed.

-----
I know you think I do what I want because I don't say ok thanks @cjchio‌ and leave it at that but I'm taking in everyone's responses and asking questions. I apologize if that bothers you that I inquire about further information.

fancefpp · January 2015

It depends on your situation. If, like you say, they only used your income and he's on title then it's just more work on their end. Believe me, they want the loan to close too because that's how they make money. If you really do need his income, it gets messier but you can still qualify for a different loan. The process might get slowed down but it's better to be safe than sorry. Most of the documents you sign are signed under pains and penalties of perjury.

MrsSept13 · January 2015

fancefpp said:
It depends on your situation. If, like you say, they only used your income and he's on title then it's just more work on their end. Believe me, they want the loan to close too because that's how they make money. If you really do need his income, it gets messier but you can still qualify for a different loan. The process might get slowed down but it's better to be safe than sorry. Most of the documents you sign are signed under pains and penalties of perjury.

Ok, thank you. That's very helpful.

GypsySoul1112 · January 2015

Please tell your loan officer about the changes in your husband's employment. I remember my husband and I signing off on papers stating our situation has not changed as well. If you are seriously still considering lying to the bank, what do you think the consequences are if the bank found out, which they probably will? Are you prepared to deal with a much larger shitstorm than just your husband losing his job?

fancefpp · January 2015

She came back asking questions, at least she being open minded. It's a very stressful process for anyone, especially when it's not fully understood. It's important to have a loan officer and attorney you trust - they are there to help get the loan. Bottom line, if you're nervous you won't qualify because of this, you probably shouldn't be buying the house. It sounds harsh but there is a reason there are so many laws and regulations in place. Remember when Wall Street basically collapsed?

If you are sure you will qualify on your income only, just tell them now. Shit happens all the time. Maybe you'll need an extension on your closing date but it's better than hanging out with Teresa guidice in prison.

MrsSept13 · January 2015

cjchio said:

MrsSept13 said:

cjchio said:

MrsSept13 said:

chipsfordinner said:
I get that @MrsSept13‌ is on all our post its, but tbh I see why she is confused. And I actually disagree with most of the PPs.

When we bought our house, we were preapproved on my salary alone (I make more.) The loan agent even suggested we put the house in my name only, as she had had a horrible divorce and thought I should protect myself. I told her I wasn't that pessimistic about the future.

Should I have only put myself on the title though, then my husband's income would be irrelevant. OP, is this the case with you? Is it just you on the title? If so, I would not disclose what's going on with the hubs.

ETA: well shit, I see he is on the loan. You have to tell because they are assuming that if you lose your job, you still have his income.
-----
Yes I put him on the loan in case something happened to me I didn't want him to have to go through more hassle. So my question at this point is what happens if I tell them? Is it as simple as we just sign some more documents or start the whole process over?

If you tell them? Shouldn't that read when I tell them?

Why do you ask for advice? You just do whatever the hell you want anyway. Enjoy Club fed.
-----
I know you think I do what I want because I don't say ok thanks @cjchio‌ and leave it at that but I'm taking in everyone's responses and asking questions. I apologize if that bothers you that I inquire about further information.

Excuse me? Everyone is saying the same/ similar things. You still seem stuck on IF I tell them. Why are you asking advice if you don't want to hear a real answer to it?

----
I think you're only reading things that agree with your statements. There were two different answers given by multiple people. I'm gathering as much information as I can and my husband and I are talking about what our next move will be. The biggest fear we have now is we have to be out by feb 1st and if this situation prolongs this then we have to figure out where we will go. There are lots of things we have to think about before this whole thing gets screwed up.

MrsSept13 · January 2015

amq427 said:

MrsSept13 said:

cjchio said:

MrsSept13 said:

cjchio said:

MrsSept13 said:

chipsfordinner said:
I get that @MrsSept13‌ is on all our post its, but tbh I see why she is confused. And I actually disagree with most of the PPs.

When we bought our house, we were preapproved on my salary alone (I make more.) The loan agent even suggested we put the house in my name only, as she had had a horrible divorce and thought I should protect myself. I told her I wasn't that pessimistic about the future.

Should I have only put myself on the title though, then my husband's income would be irrelevant. OP, is this the case with you? Is it just you on the title? If so, I would not disclose what's going on with the hubs.

ETA: well shit, I see he is on the loan. You have to tell because they are assuming that if you lose your job, you still have his income.
-----
Yes I put him on the loan in case something happened to me I didn't want him to have to go through more hassle. So my question at this point is what happens if I tell them? Is it as simple as we just sign some more documents or start the whole process over?

If you tell them? Shouldn't that read when I tell them?

Why do you ask for advice? You just do whatever the hell you want anyway. Enjoy Club fed.
-----
I know you think I do what I want because I don't say ok thanks @cjchio‌ and leave it at that but I'm taking in everyone's responses and asking questions. I apologize if that bothers you that I inquire about further information.

Excuse me? Everyone is saying the same/ similar things. You still seem stuck on IF I tell them. Why are you asking advice if you don't want to hear a real answer to it?
----
I think you're only reading things that agree with your statements. There were two different answers given by multiple people. I'm gathering as much information as I can and my husband and I are talking about what our next move will be. The biggest fear we have now is we have to be out by feb 1st and if this situation prolongs this then we have to figure out where we will go. There are lots of things we have to think about before this whole thing gets screwed up.
------anticipating QBF

It's still fucking illegal. What you're considering doing is illegal.

And I understand that. At this point all I'm doing is gathering information to discuss with MH.

dinodna3 · January 2015

< It's still fucking illegal. What you're considering doing is illegal.

And I understand that. At this point all I'm doing is gathering information to discuss with MH.

---mqf-------

What more information do you need?!

MrsSept13 · January 2015

I get that @MrsSept13‌ is on all our post its, but tbh I see why she is confused. And I actually disagree with most of the PPs. When we bought our house, we were preapproved on my salary alone (I make more.) The loan agent even suggested we put the house in my name only, as she had had a horrible divorce and thought I should protect myself. I told her I wasn't that pessimistic about the future. Should I have only put myself on the title though, then my husband's income would be irrelevant. OP, is this the case with you? Is it just you on the title? If so, I would not disclose what's going on with the hubs. ETA: well shit, I see he is on the loan. You have to tell because they are assuming that if you lose your job, you still have his income.
----- Yes I put him on the loan in case something happened to me I didn't want him to have to go through more hassle. So my question at this point is what happens if I tell them? Is it as simple as we just sign some more documents or start the whole process over?
If you tell them? Shouldn't that read when I tell them? Why do you ask for advice? You just do whatever the hell you want anyway. Enjoy Club fed.
----- I know you think I do what I want because I don't say ok thanks @cjchio‌ and leave it at that but I'm taking in everyone's responses and asking questions. I apologize if that bothers you that I inquire about further information.
Excuse me? Everyone is saying the same/ similar things. You still seem stuck on IF I tell them. Why are you asking advice if you don't want to hear a real answer to it?
---- I think you're only reading things that agree with your statements. There were two different answers given by multiple people. I'm gathering as much information as I can and my husband and I are talking about what our next move will be. The biggest fear we have now is we have to be out by feb 1st and if this situation prolongs this then we have to figure out where we will go. There are lots of things we have to think about before this whole thing gets screwed up.
------anticipating QBF It's still fucking illegal. What you're considering doing is illegal.
And I understand that. At this point all I'm doing is gathering information to discuss with MH.
What is there to discuss? Jesus.

--- I have to discuss what our next move is in the whole process considering he's involved in this. I just wanted more information on what would happen next. We are not criminals so we will do what's legal. There's more than just telling the bank at stake here. We have to figure out now where we will go.

ETA for clarity: I asked my initial question and got answers, majority of them said it was illegal which I had not thought about. Then I asked follow up questions to know what the bank would do once they were told. Thankfully a few people answered that. Now that I have this information I must take it to my husband to discuss since I haven't told him any of what you guys have said. We are very young and new at this so we had no idea what to do. Thank you for all your answers and helpful comments. Now we can know what to expect.

korrito26 · January 2015

Newb here, weird time for my first post but I am cleaning our office and found this in our mortgage document package that we received at closing. In case it's still unclear this is the exact document we signed.

MrsSept13 · January 2015

korrito26 said:

Newb here, weird time for my first post but I am cleaning our office and found this in our mortgage document package that we received at closing. In case it's still unclear this is the exact document we signed.

Thanks! That was really helpful.

butlerfan · January 2015

Also, if it delays closing your landlord may let you stay an extra month or even a partial month if needed.

Closing on home, lost job (NTTGPR)

Re: Closing on home, lost job (NTTGPR)

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