Snack feeders?/nurse to sleep

misterdonut · January 2015

hey all! My baby's now 9 weeks old. First month she was great about eating every 3 hours during the daytime, but lately she's been snacking-- shell have a big meal about 20 minutes, then an awake time but always needs an extra little snack to go to sleep. I make sure I pull her off before completely asleep though to not get used to my nipple. Anyone experience this and have any tips?

Night time she'll cluster feed every hour till she sleeps a long stretch (also wish she would eat in one go). Overnight she'll eat large meals and go to sleep immediately, thank goodness!

Do your babies need these cap offs or what'd you do to ease out of this?

ssstephanie214 · January 2015

Our pediatrician recommended the "dream feed," a little snack right before bed. I find it does help encourage longer stretches (4-5 hours in our case).

kstirton · January 2015

I'm sure some will hate my response as I don't feed on demand. However - snack feedings lead to more snack feedings, it's just common sense, if they aren't getting a full feeding each time they are going to be hungry sooner. So by encouraging or allowing cluster feeds you are setting yourself up for more cluster feeds down the road. Our LO eats every 2.5-3 hours or 4 if she takes a long nap, and that encourages her to take a full feeding each time. She was sleeping 7-8 hours through the night at 4 weeks old. So take it how you will. This is how my pediatrician advised us to feed and it's worked great for us.

soulcupcake · January 2015

My "tip"? Let her snack/nurse on demand. There's no such thing as forming "bad habits" at this age. Such is antiquated and nonsense talk.

MmmPopcorn · January 2015

I second the "dream feed" advice. Even if DS finished a feeding half an hour before bedtime, I pop him on the boob for a little while to top off in the hopes of getting a slightly longer stretch at night. Snack feedings do not lead to more snack feedings. Evening cluster feeds are totally normal since your supply is lower in the evening and baby may be filling up before that first long night stretch.

jessa1228 · January 2015

+1 for dream feeds and nursing to sleep. And cluster feeding/snacking is totally normal, no need to discourage it.

kstirton · January 2015

https://www.mybabysleepguide.com/2011/12/cluster-feeding.html?m=1

MmmPopcorn · January 2015

kstirton said:

https://www.mybabysleepguide.com/2011/12/cluster-feeding.html?m=1

There is some good info here, but what sources is she using? Also, this blogger recommends Babywise, so I'm a little leery of her perspective.

highbornhunter · January 2015

Yes, I definitely nurse him to sleep and I try to "top him off" at bedtime.

staugustinewedding · January 2015

We are feeding on demand and dream feed. She loves the comfort it gives her right before bed.

deevaswani · January 2015

My LO is almost exclusively formula fed. She has ALWAYS clustered fed in the evening/night in that she'll demand 1-2oz every hour 2-4 times in the late evening and always fall asleep at her last bottle (which it sounds like is referred to as dream feeding). My son used to do the same. LO is 9.5 weeks old and has been giving me a 10-11 hour stretch at night for last 2 weeks. Stretches were 4-6 hours since she was 3 weeks old.

Jatpa003 · January 2015

kstirton said:
I'm sure some will hate my response as I don't feed on demand. However - snack feedings lead to more snack feedings, it's just common sense, if they aren't getting a full feeding each time they are going to be hungry sooner. So by encouraging or allowing cluster feeds you are setting yourself up for more cluster feeds down the road. Our LO eats every 2.5-3 hours or 4 if she takes a long nap, and that encourages her to take a full feeding each time. She was sleeping 7-8 hours through the night at 4 weeks old. So take it how you will. This is how my pediatrician advised us to feed and it's worked great for us.

You are right I do hate your response, every time you have posted recently it has been about making your child wait to eat "full meals". Feeding on demand is very beneficial to keep your supply up when baby is growing. And will help your baby develop the best they can. As a mother I will do whatever it takes to make my baby happy and if that is an inconvenience for me so be it, if that means cluster feeding that's ok, if that means my baby just want to be soothed of put to sleep suckling so be it. Ps snacking does not lead to more snacking and even if it did it just means more time with my daughter, what better things do you have to do? Laundry, dishes and cleaning can wait, MY daughter comes first.

kfo22 · January 2015

I only wish it was still that easy to put my LO to sleep these days. Lately, it takes 3 hours of crying, bouncing, singing, shushing and maybe some medicine. One day she may fall asleep at the boob again.. I dream..

misterdonut · January 2015

OP here. Thank you all! I've been feeling pressure from friends and family that she needs to be sleeping through by now because she "should be"-- and that just wasn't happening. Sometimes I feel like I'm failing with the little fusses and needs for snacks... Thank you for all sharing that cluster feeding is normal and OK at this stage!

smboswell1 · January 2015

WildFlower810 said:
Not to hijack your thread, @Misterdonut, but I have an honest question for you, @kstirton... do you hold to your own feeding plan when providing yourself nourishment? Do you only eat 3 meals a day (as is typical for an American adult) but refuse to eat or drink between meals if you are hungry or thirsty? Do you assure yourself that if you snack you will only snack more and stop eating complete meals? Did you refuse your body's inclinations to eat more frequently when doing the tremendous work of growing a baby when pregnant, and again now as you are providing the food for your baby? Our LOs are gaining weight at an incredible rate right now and are working hard to do so. It would seem that what is good enough for an infant who cannot understand such things as clocks and schedules would be good enough for an adult.

I love this so much.

mommymeg143 · January 2015

Jatpa003 said:

kstirton said:
I'm sure some will hate my response as I don't feed on demand. However - snack feedings lead to more snack feedings, it's just common sense, if they aren't getting a full feeding each time they are going to be hungry sooner. So by encouraging or allowing cluster feeds you are setting yourself up for more cluster feeds down the road. Our LO eats every 2.5-3 hours or 4 if she takes a long nap, and that encourages her to take a full feeding each time. She was sleeping 7-8 hours through the night at 4 weeks old. So take it how you will. This is how my pediatrician advised us to feed and it's worked great for us.
You are right I do hate your response, every time you have posted recently it has been about making your child wait to eat "full meals". Feeding on demand is very beneficial to keep your supply up when baby is growing. And will help your baby develop the best they can. As a mother I will do whatever it takes to make my baby happy and if that is an inconvenience for me so be it, if that means cluster feeding that's ok, if that means my baby just want to be soothed of put to sleep suckling so be it. Ps snacking does not lead to more snacking and even if it did it just means more time with my daughter, what better things do you have to do? Laundry, dishes and cleaning can wait, MY daughter comes first.

=D> =D> =D>

Call me crazy but I honestly could care less if my baby STTN right now. She is an infant and I knew when I got pregnant that once she was here we would be up at night.

Sometimes I wake up before she does and just stare at her hoping she will wake up soon. Why? Because I miss her and can't wait to hold her for a MOTN feeding. She knows that when she wakes up hungry, her mommy will be right there to feed her. The same will be true if she wakes up from a bad dream when she is older, her mommy will be right there to comfort her. That's our job. Someone who will always be there for them. Snuggling with her is way more important than sleeping. We will worry about STTN and schedules when she is old enough.

sweetbabyrahe · January 2015

I find that when LO snacks or has more frequent smaller meals, he actually sleeps better. We feed on demand and some days he spaces out to every 2.5-3 hours but yesterday he wanted to eat sometimes every hour for just 5 minutes. He slept his best stretch yet of 5.5 hours. This time in their lives is so short that I don't mind if it's inconvenient. As our pedi says...my older son is growing a few inches and a few pounds per year, but LO is growing that in a month...they need it and there body knows it. I wouldn't tell my 3 year old that he couldn't have a drink of water or milk because it wasn't on the schedule. End ramble.

MrsDL · January 2015

kstirton said:

I'm sure some will hate my response as I don't feed on demand. However - snack feedings lead to more snack feedings, it's just common sense, if they aren't getting a full feeding each time they are going to be hungry sooner. So by encouraging or allowing cluster feeds you are setting yourself up for more cluster feeds down the road. Our LO eats every 2.5-3 hours or 4 if she takes a long nap, and that encourages her to take a full feeding each time. She was sleeping 7-8 hours through the night at 4 weeks old. So take it how you will. This is how my pediatrician advised us to feed and it's worked great for us.

So my two cents on this - the whole snack feeding/cluster feeding does end. Babies - even this young - have preferences. Just like there are older children who are motivated by food - will sit and eat a whole meal, every bite, 3 times a day, there are also kids who are light eaters, prefer to eat a little bit more frequently. I'm curious as to how you actually get your baby to eat all at once and have long stretches of not wanting to feed if he/she does not want to do this? Do you let your baby cry if he's rooting for food after an hour or two? My little guy will go into hysterics.

DS was a cluster feeder for about 8 weeks - it was miserable and I often cried. But he would then sleep long stretches. My newest little guy is more of a "foodie" as I call him - he does not eat for long stretches, falls asleep, but is genuinely hungry more often when he's crying for food and inconsolable if I don't give it to him - so of course I'm going to feed him on demand because it is what he needs. I don't see the purpose of trying to make him hold off until he's worked-up into a full-on meltdown. I know it will end eventually and the time does fly by. I just don't get how you can "make" your baby follow a schedule at this age (it's not like I haven't tried, but I'm not one for enduring a screaming infant - never have been).

Now - to those who say you can't form bad habits at 8 or 9 weeks - FYI - that's wrong. They do start to form "associations" right about now. Nursing to sleep will become a crutch, and it can be impossible to get your little one down without doing this. Will they outgrow it - yes - but some form other crutches - a paci, needing you to sleep with them, etc often replaces it. I swore I wouldn't fall into this trap with #2 (and I'm realizing we are getting there so I'm trying to reverse it early), but I do have a 3.5 year old who used nursing as a crutch for a year plus, then a paci (to get him weaned), then cuddles and us in bed with him. It's a miracle we found a few minutes to conceive number 2. I'm trying to nurse, play then sleep (and struggling) to avoid this. Just wanted to throw this out there because it's a hard hobbit to break. some don't mind it, I did and we struggle at nighttime with our oldest because of it. The way they go to sleep now is often how they'll sleep long-term - even as adults. So think about crutches and what that looks like for you and your family a few years down the road.

MmmPopcorn · January 2015

MrsDL said:

Now - to those who say you can't form bad habits at 8 or 9 weeks - FYI - that's wrong. They do start to form "associations" right about now. Nursing to sleep will become a crutch, and it can be impossible to get your little one down without doing this. Will they outgrow it - yes - but some form other crutches - a paci, needing you to sleep with them, etc often replaces it. I swore I wouldn't fall into this trap with #2 (and I'm realizing we are getting there so I'm trying to reverse it early), but I do have a 3.5 year old who used nursing as a crutch for a year plus, then a paci (to get him weaned), then cuddles and us in bed with him. It's a miracle we found a few minutes to conceive number 2. I'm trying to nurse, play then sleep (and struggling) to avoid this. Just wanted to throw this out there because it's a hard hobbit to break. some don't mind it, I did and we struggle at nighttime with our oldest because of it. The way they go to sleep now is often how they'll sleep long-term - even as adults. So think about crutches and what that looks like for you and your family a few years down the road.

I promise I read and appreciate your entire response, but I had to point out the hobbit thing. I laughed (we re-watched Desolation of Smaug yesterday).

I do wonder what experts say about newborns forming habits. I just tried to Google it, and I found a lot of forum postings without a lot of reliable sources. I shall continue this search...

Edit: Got rid of the monster quote.

soulcupcake · January 2015

MrsDL said:

say you can't form bad habits at 8 or 9 weeks - FYI - that's wrong. They do start to form "associations" right about now. Nursing to sleep will become a crutch, and it can be impossible to get your little one down without doing this. Will they outgrow it - yes - but some form other crutches - a paci, needing you to sleep with them, etc often replaces it. I swore I wouldn't fall into this trap with #2 (and I'm realizing we are getting there so I'm trying to reverse it early), but I do have a 3.5 year old who used nursing as a crutch for a year plus, then a paci (to get him weaned), then cuddles and us in bed with him. It's a miracle we found a few minutes to conceive number 2. I'm trying to nurse, play then sleep (and struggling) to avoid this. Just wanted to throw this out there because it's a hard hobbit to break. some don't mind it, I did and we struggle at nighttime with our oldest because of it. The way they go to sleep now is often how they'll sleep long-term - even as adults. So think about crutches and what that looks like for you and your family a few years down the road.

My 10, 8 and 5 year are *still* falling asleep with my boob in their mouth (they rotate -- sharing is caring). But they'll surely nix that awful habit by college. If it weren't for all that time they spent being comforted and nursed to sleep. :shakes head:

soulcupcake · January 2015

aragosta said:

And I need to fall asleep with the TV on. That's my "crutch". Like I am trying to be respectful of what works for everyone and not be judgmental but why is cuddling your kid to bed a bad thing?

Yep. I sleep with the TV on or night light (I need some visibility at night). Big fucking deal.

carafern · January 2015

Wanted to add another perspective. I ebf on demand (every 2-3 hours). My ped advised me to feed LESS, more frequently bc LO was spitting up a lot. Since I've started to be more mindful of this (which for me means taking her off when she appears satisfied, and just holding her skin to skin instead of comfort nursing), spit up has decreased. Over time her tummy seems to be able to handle longer feeds.

mommymeg143 · January 2015

aragosta said:
There will be a day when they don't want to cuddle anymore, I promise you that. I can't imagine looking back and saying "damn if only I had cuddled him less and made him be more independent earlier!"

***Runs to cuddle LO and tell her she can never grow up.***

(

ssstephanie214 · January 2015

Confession, when I visit my parents and my childhood home I sleep with my old stuffed animals.... And I sleep SO well #crutch

Carebella · January 2015

WildFlower810 said:
AmyG, I know you already know this... But you are welcome around N14 anytime.

And should be required to join us on our Disney trip!

crizz13 · January 2015

My baby has been in this big, crazy world for 60 days. I'll happily be the crutch to help her fall asleep (or whenever she needs comfort). And guess what, I always will.

mommymeg143 · January 2015

WildFlower810 said:
AmyG, I know you already know this... But you are welcome around N14 anytime.

I agree. You know all the things!!

Carebella · January 2015

@AmyG*‌ talk right now is for summer, 3-4 years from now.

and I'd take the know it all comment(s) from folks as a compliment! I'm a little jealous of your impressive wealth knowledge!!!!

silverwings72 · January 2015

FYI I formula feed but I'm a MAMA now. I AM the crutch. I am happily, gratefully, blessedly my son's crutch. #sorrynotsorry

Richardsmom_817 · January 2015

My son (11 wks) is doing the same...cluster feeds from about 9-11 or 12....it's exhausting since that's the time I'd like to be going to bed myself....he will go about 3-4 hours typically after that, maybe 2 on a really bad night....

mommymeg143 · January 2015

Wolkie said:
I'll say it again. They are babies. Newborn still. They are too young to manipulate you. If they need to eat, give them food. Even if it means you get no sleep. You're the adult. Deal with it.

How is this real life?? Is it really that shocking that babies can't sleep for 8 hours at a time or need to be fed when hungry???

DisneyDee1984 · January 2015

mommymeg143 said:

Wolkie said:
I'll say it again. They are babies. Newborn still. They are too young to manipulate you. If they need to eat, give them food. Even if it means you get no sleep. You're the adult. Deal with it.
How is this real life?? Is it really that shocking that babies can't sleep for 8 hours at a time or need to be fed when hungry???

You mean all that crying is for a reason? Geez...learn something new everyday...

Carebella · January 2015

DisneyDee1984 said:

mommymeg143 said:

Wolkie said:
I'll say it again. They are babies. Newborn still. They are too young to manipulate you. If they need to eat, give them food. Even if it means you get no sleep. You're the adult. Deal with it.
How is this real life?? Is it really that shocking that babies can't sleep for 8 hours at a time or need to be fed when hungry???
You mean all that crying is for a reason? Geez...learn something new everyday...

I think you're pretty stupid if you go into having a child and expect to have LO let you sleep, eat, or breathe for more than a few minutes at a time. Yes some babies are super easy going but 99.9% of them are going to have a bad night or day every now and then. Like PP have said, our LOs are helpless and depend on us. Whether we give them "habits/crutches" now or not, once that baby is outside, you should do your damnedest to care for them.

Have I been frustrated, tired, or hungry? Hell yes. But I know it's temporary and I'd do anything to care for LO and try to keep him from ever being upset. So for now if that means not sleeping well, feeding every hour on the hour, a messy house, or being stinky, that's what I signed up for and it's worth it a 1,000 times over.

Snuffy007 · January 2015

Wolkie said:
@ClrkKntismyAE‌ yes so much. I feel like I'm trying to tell a joke to Mr Monk

Totally off topic, I apologize, but I just have to say @Wolkie‌ your Monk reference just made my night!!!

fyreandblood · February 2015

About BFing on a schedule: i EFF and schedules were made for formula fed babies because with bottles, it's possible to overfeed. Some pediatricians rec schedules with BF babies and that's just wrong! You cant even calculate how much baby is getting at certain points! Feed them as they wish; it's impossible to overfeed unless you have a huge letdown! I wish nursing had worked out for me so i could be that for my daughter. The bond is beautiful.

With my baby, food is still part of bed. I dont feed her to sleep because no matter what she's eaten (i EPed for the first 6-7 weeks), she spits up horribly and i want to watch her, so it's bottle (that takes 30 mins), lights off/projector on, book, lullaby/prayer time (we're jewish, so we say night blessings) and then swaddling and down. That gives me enough time to watch her. Routine really works for us but routine depends on the baby and parents: some routines are time based like ours, others are loose, etc. Find your own routine and it will help baby differentiate between times of day, etc and comfort them/give them something familiar every day.

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Snack feeders?/nurse to sleep

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Mama to sweet baby girl, Emerson Rose, born November 7th, 2014

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