Breastfeeding not going great and considering EFF. Long)

kz's_girlygirl · December 2014

Hi all- some background: ( I had a c-section and have infertility issues (special shout out to other ART moms and babies!) which my LC said could be contributing to supply issues.)

DD was born on Thursday and is just about a week old! She lost 12% of her weight at discharge and had only gained 1 oz at her first weight check after 2 days of supplementing with 10 ml of formula after each feed. My pedi now has us supplementing with as much formula as she will eat after each breastfeeding session.

My lactation consultant also has me pumping after every other breastfeeding session to help boost my low supply. I only get about 1/4oz combined from 20 minutes of pumping.

I am ready to take the bridge!

DH loves getting to feed Piper, and gets so excited to tell me how much she ate, which makes me feel awful bc I can't feed her enough.

She's sleepy after just a few minutes at the breast so I have to bug her and constantly move her to keep her even remotely interested, but she is awake and alert for DH.

Pumping is not a walk in the park either.

we have another weight check tomorrow and I'm sure she will have gained bc of the formula supplementation.

I had really hoped to breastfeed but it doesn't seem to be working so formula feeding is really appealing. But, DH wants me to continue breastfeeding. It is causing me so much stress and tears though. I just want to feed my baby and her to be healthy without driving myself to tears multiple times a day.

I've been reading through the BF board and the FF board and wanted to see if anyone here is dealing with similar issues?

abenson3 · December 2014

No real advice, just sending some creepy internet stranger hugs. Just know feeding your baby is all that matters! BF or FF both give your child the nourishment she needs to grow. I EP'd for DD#1, so if that is something you are interested in learning more about please feel free to PM me. Again, lots of creepy internet hugs, hope things get better.

chicorojo · December 2014

I switched. After he lost a lb. In the hospital, we started supplementing, he wouldn't latch so I pumped every three hours for two weeks and never got anything. I was a bit disapointed but I was so stressed out that when I decided to eff I mostly felt relief. Only you can make the decision but know your child will be ok if you decide to formula feed.

stellar2325 · December 2014

Are you on any meds? My allergy medication totally wiped my supply even after my doc encouraged me to keep taking it saying low supply evidence wasn't proven. Later when I went to my allergist he was like "Oh yeah, this stuff will definitely dry you out!"

Sheesh.

Cadg0986 · December 2014

If you look back at the posts, I posted something similar last week. I had to supplement after she lost 14% of her body weight 5 days after birth. I supplemented and breastfed but now I am mostly just using formula. I pump throughout the day and only get maybe an hour a day. It sucks because I wanted to exclusively breastfeed for 6 months to a year but it just didn't work out for me. If you look back at my post, you'll see a lot of great words of help and hope from those that replied to it.

kz's_girlygirl · December 2014

Thank you all so much-I totally agree that it doesn't matter how she is fed, just that she is fed. Figuring out the best way to do that is so difficult right now with pressure from DH etc. I am eating lactation cookies by the pound- at least I have an excuse for sweets now

I did speak to two lactation consultants, one at the hospital and one private practice and luckily both are certified ibclc. They each gave slightly different advice so I am trying to go middle of the road and pump every other feeding and mix whatever I am able to pump with the formula.

The plan as of right now is to see how her weight is tomorrow then set up another in home session for next week with our consultant and I will definitely ask about a weighted feeding. I'll also ask about meds- I take levothyroxine for my thyroid (slightly hypo) so I will for sure ask about that as well.

I just really hate having to bf, then bottle feed, then pump. It seems like a crazy amount of work and time for all of us, especially if the end result is that she is primarily eating formula anyway...

My initial goal was to get to 2 weeks, so halfway there.

erien · December 2014

Fellow ART mom here. Hardly seems fair that after battling IF, we have to worry about not being able to provide enough millk for our miracles! The struggle is real.

Don't be discouraged by your pumping output. I found that pumping on one side while feeding from the other is the best way to boost my supply. I can get 2-3 oz each pumping session vs drops if I wait to pump after feeding. It's not too late to increase your supply if you want to continue BF.

BankerBSN · December 2014

I am! My supply is absolute crap. I have talked to LCs galore and even went to see a Breast specialist to see if I had a grandar tissue issue. My baby was a FET and I was never was told there was a link between ART and low supply.

We are doing SNS with ever single feeding and LO is doing well with that and gaining weight (but he is taking 2-4oz at a feeding).

I hate pumping. I most likely am not pumping as much as I should be but he is always at the Breast. When I do pump I get less than an ounce from both.

I am sure any day now we will break down and give LO a bottle. I cried and cried about my supply in the being but I am slowly getting over it and learning this whole parenthood/having a baby thing never goes as planned. The most important thing is that you feed your baby.

amedbery · December 2014

Confession: it makes me super-stabby when anyone - husbands included - puts pressure on a mother about her BF. You are doing your best. You are trying to get the right help. A lot of people put it out there that BF is so natural and easy, as if struggling with it means there is something wrong with you. It doesn't.

I'm still waiting on my first LO, but I have watched close friends struggle and struggle and it was heartbreaking. I hope you are successful. But don't forget that there are a million other ways to be a good mom - and you might miss out on a magical time in yours and LOs life because this one thing has become the only thing. Tell DH to be supportive or shut up. Maybe hit up some LLL meetings. But I hope you can keep things in perspective and realize that this struggle does not mean you are failing as a mom.

byrne15 · December 2014

I FF'ed ds#1 from day one. He is a happy, healthy, smart almost 7 year old boy.

I BF'ed ds#2 for 3 weeks and 3 days. It was the most horrible and painful experience of my life. Physically, mentally and emotionally. I had a different set of issues than you mentioned, but I was left in tears during and after almost every feeding.

I am going to FF this baby right from the start. I want to enjoy my baby and my family and I won't let anything (in my control) get in the way of that.

I know some people have great success with BFing and some people have to work at it before success, but to me it just isn't worth it.

I hope you find comfort in the fact that you are doing your best....and really your best is good enough. Whether it is EBF, EFF or a combination of the two.

caden1206 · December 2014

I just wanted to offer some support. I am sorry you have a lot of stress right now. For me I would focus more on spending quality time with your LO and throw the stress of BFing away. Any BM you offer is excellent and if you have to mix it with formula so that she grows well so be it. You are doing a great job by researching and consulting with LCs. I just hope you take the time to enjoy being a mom too. Good luck!

DoctorWorm222 · December 2014

kz's_girlygirl said:

My initial goal was to get to 2 weeks, so halfway there.

This was going to be my advice. In my experience, breastfeeding is pretty terrible for the first month or so (even in the best circumstances). Set a goal and stick with it for a reasonable trial period. If, after your trial, you find that nobody is happy and nobody is thriving, do formula. There's no sense in starving your kid and making yourself a miserable nut case. IMO, breast milk is quite beneficial, but so is having a sane mother. Good luck!

OhBaby+2013 · December 2014

I also had a CS and it was almost a full week before my milk came in fully. And it was 2 weeks before DS#2 got back to birth weight. BFing is not easy and supply issues are always discouraging. Formula isn't the devil so feed your baby what she needs. I agree with app though aout pumping the other side while baby nurses. I will also say that with DS#1 it was aout 8 weeks before both he an do for the hang of BFing to a good place. Hang in there and hopefully your appointment tomorrow goes well.

soulcupcake · December 2014

(((hugs))) Ditto @AmyG*

My LO was down quite a bit of weight after the first week. Things were okay before my milk came in, but after the point where she should have been gaining I noticed she was dropping weight (13% at 10 days). I don't normally have supply issues unless something causes it. I knew it was a supply issue because her latch and milk transfer are great. The LC confirmed what I knew. The PPH led to anemia, which reduces prolactin levels, so I don't have a full supply. I've been supplementing with donor milk and formula via SNS. I take galactogogues as well, and I did rent a Medela symphony, but have only used it a few times. I really don't like pumping. I EP'd with my last baby for 5.5 months, and while he fattened up really quickly (pumped due to his tongue tie issues), and it was really convenient for me, it was always an ordeal, and my right side didn't respond well to the pump due to the delayed letdown. I hated pumping, so I was thrilled when he returned to the breast at 5.5 months, but only the left side since I weaned the right.

I really don't have the energy for pumping on top of breastfeeding 10-12 times a day, so I totally get it if pumping isn't for you. It's a lot of work. It would be easier if I were EPing. I will be returning the pump next week and will do a weighted feed to see how much she's getting from me. I'll continue working on building my supply until six weeks, but after that, if it's still not a full supply, I'll continue supplementing. I'm completely fine with that. The LC said a full supply may come in, but sometimes with PPH it never does, which means long term supplementation.

She gets 10-12 oz of supplement a day, which is usually a mix of donor milk and formula. I supplement with 50 ml for about 8 or feedings.

I hope you're able to find a system that works for you. Struggles in the beginning can be really tough. (((hugs)))

soulcupcake · December 2014

@AmyG*

Yes! I'm always so, so tired. I've never been this fatigued, not even during pregnancy. Yesterday I got in a two hour nap, and boy did it make a difference! My midwife stresses that I need to eat A LOT of food to help build my blood supply up. I'm also taking Floradix and drinking over a gallon of water a day.

Since I bed share I nurse her in the side-lying position at night, and she sleeps on my chest a lot during the day.

I used domperidone to help boost my supply with my ds2 and it worked pretty well. I'll also look into making lactation cookies.

I lost around 800 ml, so she said it could take some time to rebuild my blood supply.

Eora3 · December 2014

I am in the same boat and it sucks. We do feedings every 2 hours during the day and every 3 hours at night. I pump after every feeding. I am taking all the herbal supplements available to help boost supply and not having any luck.

Sadly domperidone is not available in the US. U.S. mama's are stuck with Reglan. I am starting my 30 days of Reglan this week. Pray for me ladies!! I have a history of PPA and depression so it is a risky move for me, but my LO is just not doing well on the formula. He has a lot of gas and throws up much more with the formula feedings.

GustieRx · December 2014

I'll add my two cents- DD was 3 weeks early and pretty tiny/had jaundice issues at the beginning so we also had to BF/supplement/pump every 3 hours for the first 10 days or so and keeping her awake was a HUGE struggle. I was so exhausted and not pumping much out, and gave serious consideration to quitting. After about 10 days (maybe 2 weeks?) I finally was able to pump more out and she didn't want the supplemental bottle at most feedings anymore... so it did get better. It is still somewhat painful and I'm not pumping a huge supply, but enough for her to be full and gain weight. So if you're really wanting to BF, maybe try giving it just a little bit longer to see if your supply starts to regulate. If you want to FF then do that- as long as she's gaining weight that's all that matters. Hang in there!

kz's_girlygirl · December 2014

@AmyG*‌

The hospital LC recommended pumping after every feeding and supplementing with 10mls formula, the other LC suggested pumping after every other, and supplementing with pumped milk (which would be great, but I don't pump nearly enough). My pedi recommended just giving as much formula as she will eat after a bf session.

I'll be calling my dr in the morning to ask about some b/w to re heck my thyroid- thank you!!

@all- thank you all so much for the words of encouragement and support- I would be struggling even more if not for this board!!

ajlmom · December 2014

I could have written the exact same post. My LO is jaundice and had lost 13 oz after birth since Sunday. The jaundice made her sleepy and she was not nursing well. Her bilirubin is still high and the pediatrician asked me to supplement 1/2 oz of formula after every other feed. Last night was our first night home and she refused to sleep. As soon as I thought she was done eating I would put her to bed but the second I left her in the bassinet she screamed. My milk started to come in today and I tried to pump and got a few drops after 10 mins. I cried and cried. I never asked my mom to help me for anything as an adult but I called her and broke down. I also reached out to a cousin who had 3 kids and she was so supportive and helpful.

Sorry my story isn't making sense. All I wanted to say is I feel better after reaching out for help. Don't forget to rest! I took a 2 hr nap and boom! My boobs got bigger. It's okay to cry but it's important to be strong and not give up! Eat and drink lots of fluids.

soulcupcake · December 2014

AmyG* said:

Eora3 said:

I am in the same boat and it sucks. We do feedings every 2 hours during the day and every 3 hours at night. I pump after every feeding. I am taking all the herbal supplements available to help boost supply and not having any luck. Sadly domperidone is not available in the US. U.S. mama's are stuck with Reglan. I am starting my 30 days of Reglan this week. Pray for me ladies!! I have a history of PPA and depression so it is a risky move for me, but my LO is just not doing well on the formula. He has a lot of gas and throws up much more with the formula feedings.

Yeah but every other 1st world country believes Domperidone is safe, even the AAP says it's rated L1 for safety for breastfeeding moms. So a lot of moms import Dom from Canada or from in house pharmacy. In house pharmacy has been providing domperidone cheaply to american moms I know for at least a dozen years. the only complaint, aside from ocassional website changes is that sometimes shipping is slow.
Ask moms on bfing board and you'll usually hear from several that ordered without issue. If you have a heart condition is the usual caution to talk to your health care provider. The US pulled Dom from the market due to some deaths after it's use--deaths of people dying of cancers taking seriously high IV doseages of Domperidone much higher than ever used by a breastfeeding mother or used by others with the digestive difficulties it was originally prescribed for (like Reglan is used as a GI stimulant with a side effect of increased prolactin level).
Because of the high side effect risk of depression with Reglan most doctors will not RX longer than about 2 week trial. Over 4 weeks use of it tends to multiply the side effects so please please be careful!

*nods*

I got domperidone from IHP with ds2.

beachy6 · December 2014

Fellow ART mom here, too. The struggle is real, for sure. Honestly, I planned on EFF the entire pregnancy, until she was here. Then, I decided to try BF'ing. I loved it. A lot. Little miss was a latching champ. It seemed like it would actually work until she started losing weight and was at the breast for hours at a time.

Speaking as strictly an ART mom, I gave my body over to other people (doctors, nurses, surgeons, etc) for a decade. I was tired. I needed my body to be mine again. Emotionally, bf'ing was making me dread feeding time because it was as if the entire weight of the world was still on my body to perform, like with all of the treatment cycles. I decided that I was ready to enjoy this short time while my baby is so tiny by stopping bf'ing. It was the absolute best decision for me and my family. It might not be the best for everyone, but it is working so well for us.

LO is almost back to her birth weight and she is so much happier not being hungry all day long. I can enjoy long periods of cuddling with her adorable self, as she is so content now. DH and DS love feeding her and I love watching them bond with her during her feedings. Like I said, for us, it was an amazing decision.

It was my goal to make it a week at a time. I didn't even meet my first goal, but that's okay with me because the most important thing to me is that she is finally here and she is so happy! Best of luck with your decision. Don't feel guilty for whatever you decide. As your LO's mom, I'm sure you have a gut feeling as to what you should do. Just listen you your gut and things will fall into place again.

LSauer21 · December 2014

LO had difficulty latching and also lost weight we have another weight check this Friday, born 12/8. I decided to exclusively pump and feed and supplement he's eating like a champ now! Hoping he gained weight at tomorrow's check

Meether · December 2014

I had very similar issues with you for both girls. I'll tell you about my experience with dd2 since she was just born.
I got 1/4 to 1/2 oz at 1 week also at each pumping session. Formula was VERY appealing also, so I understand your frustration and tiredness. Here is what I did, I pumped every hour except the hour that she ate, I took fenugreek (3pills at 3 times a day) and blessed thistle (2 pills at 3 times a day). I would get the combined one oz pumped milk she needs, because she slept 3-4 hours at one week old (so a total of 3 sessions).
When she was up, I'd nurse her for 20 mins, change diaper, nurse again, the DH would offer pumped milk. She has lost almost a pound at 5 days, and by week 2 she had gained almost 2 lbs!! The pound she lost and another pound up from her birth weight. She was also having orange crystals uni her pee, which means she's not getting enough hydration at day 5, and that stopped by day 6-7.
My supply increased a ton due to the every hour 24h pumping, and supplements. Now I have a night over supply at one month because she sleeps 8-9 hours at nights and my body hasn't adjusted yet.
What I'd advise is to do what you're doing if you're not overwhelmed with your current routine, and also, take the supplements if you're opened to it. I think I saw a difference in my supply at day 3. I wouldn't take them for longer than 10 days. I have a ton of milk now as I mentioned, so my DH is welcomed to feed her as he likes also. I just pump if he is bottle feeding. And now at one month, dd is up 2lbs from her birth weight and 3 from her 5 day old weight.
Good luck to you, what ever you decide to do will be the right decision. Breastfeeding was challenging for both girls during the first 4-6 weeks, but then it gets ridiculously easy once the whole supply issue is sorted out.

kz's_girlygirl · December 2014

@beachy6‌ - Yes. Just Yes to all of those complicated feelings! Thank you

beachy6 · December 2014

kz's_girlygirl said:

@beachy6‌ - Yes. Just Yes to all of those complicated feelings! Thank you

You are so welcome. I feel that being an ART mom puts another dimension on the pressure we put on ourselves. We wanted to be pregnant so badly, we paid so much money, etc that we assume we need to enjoy every part of mothering, too. Mothering is amazing, but my sanity is also amazing You've got this, no matter what you decide to do!

Edited to add: For what it's worth, my DS was EFF and he is just fine. No health issues, no asthma/allergies/whatever else is rumored to be caused from not bf'ing. He is in the gifted program, so my lack of bf'ing didn't make him any less intelligent than his peers. So, while bf'ing is a great choice, not doing so won't hurt your baby. I'm certainly not saying this to bad mouth bf'ing, because like I said, I really loved doing so with LO until she started losing weight. Just knowing that my DS turned out okay with formula helped make my decision a little easier for me.

amieeyoung · December 2014

I find that when I just pump I don't have much letdown. I haven't gotten that trick down yet, but if I pump one side while she feeds I get about an ounce a time. Then I switch and get very little from the breast she nursed on, but she continues to get some from the pumped breast. I do this a few times a day. Maybe try and see if it helps- that is unless you are ready to simply formula feed and there is nothing wrong if you do. Or supplement as needed and just give what breast milk you can. As a parent you do what works for your family. Best of luck in whichever you decide. Remember the important thing is that baby is getting food and gaining weight.

S&N062009 · December 2014

Your story is very similar to mine... Stick it out! He is four weeks and is finally only breastfeeding... I totally feel for you I was there... Feeding... Supplementing with formula... Pumping ... I even weighed him before and after feedings to see how much he was getting ...I felt like as soon as I finished feeding it would start all over again with no rest. But hang in there when it all comes together it's amazing!!!

JCM285 · December 2014

Sorry I'm late to the game but just wanted to say that I had a really hard time trying to BF too and I wanted to give up. My baby lost a good amount of weight, as was revealed by our first well visit to the pediatrician. I think my milk supply had just not come in yet, because since then, I've had a much easier time at getting him to latch on and suck. I am also supplementing with formula, as per my pediatrician's advice, but I think it is important to just keep trying to BF because you never know when you might get the hang of it. I feel your pain. BFing is definitely stressful and time consuming and feeling discouraged is completely normal. But you might also regret not continuing to try later on and wonder whether it could have worked eventually. My advice is to keep on pumping and supplementing if need be, but also continue your attempts at BFing. Good luck either way!

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