Would you freeze your eggs for your career?

dragonfly1809 · October 2014

Is anyone else horrified by this latest news from Apple and Facebook - that they are paying for their female employees to freeze their eggs?

I think the impact, and precedent, is very scary. Encouraging women to wait to have children only begs for bigger problems.

As we all know, getting pregnant - staying pregnant - even with the help of intervention is often a long, miserable road. What happens if these women have trouble in those later years? What happens when they run out of time?

It's so easy to live in that naive world of "when I want to I'll just go off the pill and get pregnant and have a family" ..IF you've never experienced a loss, or know anyone who has lost. I used to be one of those people.

Now, here I am at 41.. told by many that I'm "too old" to be doing this (many more say I'm not) ..but that "AMA" stigma is pretty heavy. Without complication I'm still considered "high risk" simply because of my age.

It's frightening to think that more women will put off having children with this sort of encouragement - or even that more will choose a medicated route before even attempting to become pregnant on their own.

What do you think? Scary or safeguard?

:S

Nikolie93 · October 2014

I haven't read or heard about that but...what?? o_O

I agree with you though. I am a late bloomer. Having gotten married at 19 and sticking around for 12 years, never having kids, left me at age 30. I never wanted kids with him, I guess I just knew it wasn't right. I didn't meet my now husband until I was 34, we just married a year and a half ago and I just turned 39 in June.

I think that there are way too many people getting pregnant so young but to freeze an egg and wait? Too many risks there in waiting until much later in life I think. It's hard for me to say I regret waiting becuase I know it wouldn't have been right with my first husband but being 39 with multiple miscarriages in a year and a half is rough.

I finally understand the saying "your clock is ticking".

E&B0811 · October 2014

It's not for me - for many of the reasons you mention @dragonfly1809‌ - but I applaud any effort to (a) attempt to "equalize" the career playing field for women and (b) provide coverage for reproductive assistance.

dragonfly1809 · October 2014

I agree with you @Happyin14‌ in that trying to find ways to help women in the workforce - especially in some professions. ..and true, many people want and choose to wait and can be helped significantly by this sort of thing.
But I think it's also a little bit of "playing God" with our biology.

I'm really torn about the "right age" to have children @Nikolie93‌ .. I have to give the side eye to girls (and I mean girls) when they are 18/19.. But if be a hypocrite if I criticized anyone in their early mid twenties.
I have a daughter from my grad school years, born when I was 24. I was never with her father for any length of time. He was a bad boyfriend and has proven to be a deadbeat dad. I raised Hannah on my own, struggling with life/career/childcare/motherhood..
A little more support from my colleagues and societal image would have been helpful.

I had always imagined my children growing up together, siblings close in age.. but as the years pressed on life just didn't give me that. I didn't meet my husband until I was 35 and H was going on 11.
We knew we wanted children and did not put off trying ...and here we are 6 years later, with miscarriages and infant loss to our names.

I think I was at a tough age/place when I had Hannah. I was so busy working hard to build my career that a lot of her childhood was a blaze of running from step to another. That said, we both learned a lot about priorities and quality time spent over the years.
In many ways I feel so much more at ease having a baby "later in life"...no more career ladder climbing, settled, money in the bank.. This time I can be a SAHM without pressure. It is ideal..

But look at what I've had to go through.. And if, god forbid, anything happen tragically with this pregnancy..my chances are pretty much up.
My children are going to be 17 years apart, and the chances of little Oliver having a sibling his age are minimal (I don't know if I could physically or emotionally go through this again).

There are definitely pros to having children later in life, but relying on intervention to "make it happen when it's convenient" is not, in my mind, a wise move.

Mom2anAngel2 · October 2014

this really turns me off. I feel as though they are asking us to choose our careers or a family. Why can't we have both? Personally, I find this to be a bit if a "set back" for women in the workforce.

classicstar28 · October 2014

Oh hell no. If someone suggested to me that I freeze some eggs and wait, I'd probably TP them. I've read a lot about fertility and pregnancy over the years, in part to defend myself against other people who implied I was crazy for worrying about it. I even wrote a very long blog entry about it when I was 25 because I was tired of my "friends" all telling me to relax and about their plans to wait until their mid to late 30's. I think it might be a bit judgey now and full of possibly outdated statistics, but if anyone is interested you can read it. Just please take it with a grain of salt and an understanding that I hadn't been through any of this yet.

My main issue with this idea is that women should make their own decisions about when they feel they are ready to start having children. The implication here is that women should only focus on their career and then have babies later if they want to. Be more like a man or something. Are they offering to pay men to freeze their sperm, too? I doubt it. People never talk about the fact that men do not stay equally fertile their entire lives and can have fertility issues, too. I feel like women are targeted because we are the ones who become pregnant and stay home for some period of time when the baby is born. Society seems to be saying to women that they have to make a choice between career and family and I think the one you're supposed to pick is clear. When you do what I am doing, people mostly look down on you.

"Are you working?"
"No."
"Why not?"
"I want to stay home for the year."
"What about money? You can't possibly live on one teacher's salary."
"Pretty sure that's our personal business."
"Ah." *implied sense that we're irresponsible*

Ok, I'm definitely going off on a rant here, but seriously, I hate this idea. People need to a) be more educated about fertility and pregnancy and b) stay out of other people's families and their decisions.

christia10 · October 2014

I didn't "wait" too long but always said I would. I used to think finishing grad school, traveling etc needed to be done before kids. Now I just wish I would have realized what's really important in life. I do worry that freezing eggs because the company offers it. The reason being that there are already so many things in America that pressure women to place so many things over motherhood and make motherhood look like a fall back choice. I wonder if these women will feel pressured to freeze and delay motherhood to advance their careers if the company offers this. I am curious if these same companies pay for IVF etc. I also feel there is a lot of pressure to be "equal" with men in the career etc, but yet today I am growing a human being. How many men can say that? There are so many things you can do as a woman that men never can why does everything have to be exactly equal when we are so very different? I am not calling for the dark ages or anything. I consider myself a feminist but part of my feminism is my ability to choose my path. I choose motherhood

I feel that comes with so much talk by so many people. Why pursue higher education to "just be a mother"? Anyway that's just my two cents on the matter.

longcat07 · October 2014

Mom2anAngel2 said:

this really turns me off. I feel as though they are asking us to choose our careers or a family. Why can't we have both? Personally, I find this to be a bit if a "set back" for women in the workforce.

these are my thoughts, pretty much verbatim.

NoeliaV · October 2014

No, no, no. A hundred times no. Personally, I'm getting a bit sick at the societal impression that a woman's fertility can just be put "on hold." It's not that easy, and I think it's irresponsible to portray it as so-- I'm looking at you, Hollywood and Corporate America.

I heard that the company's offering this were trying to spin it as "family friendly" policy. Yeah, right. I'd believe that line more if they also offered a year of *paid* family leave for men and women, but I don't see that happening.

It's all about the bottom line and at the expense of women.

(Sorry. This hits a nerve.)

classicstar28 · October 2014

NoeliaV said:

I heard that the company's offering this were trying to spin it as "family friendly" policy. Yeah, right. I'd believe that line more if they also offered a year of *paid* family leave for men and women, but I don't see that happening.

I completely agree. Considering how expensive freezing your eggs and going through the process of then using them later, you'd think companies offering this would be able to pay for men and women to take a year of paid leave instead.

And also offering affordable (or free if possible) day care/preschool for employees. Day care is ridiculously expensive and if you are EBF, having your baby somewhere else makes that very challenging. I know there are places that have them, but even as a teacher this type of day care is incredibly hard to find.

ETA: Obviously this hit a nerve for me, too. Maybe being all worked up will help get labor going. Ha.

dragonfly1809 · October 2014

Well said - all of you. I wish I had time to fully respond right now but I have to run to my acupuncture appointment.

I honest thought it was a joke - or some satire concocted by The Onion when I first heard it.. Then I heard it on our radio news show this morning and just about fell off my chair.

Playing God with women's bodies.. yeah, what about men? And that paid maternity thing (which we do have here in Canada and I don't know how you manage without it).. There are so many other ways to support women in the workforce than buying their fertility.
I'd be curious to know if anyone knows the answer to "do they pay for the IVF" later on? question..

Just mind boggling.

ToriGirl2014 · October 2014

IMO the decision was more of a publicity stunt than anything. Setting aside what PP have said, I think it's a benefit only the most privileged/highly compensated in the company would ever consider using.

I just don't see most women opting into egg freezing just because it's free for a number of reasons:

(1) most people wouldn't want to undergo the pain, discomfort, and complications that could arise from the procedure;

(2) from what I understand, the company is only covering the costs of the first $20,000, so after the egg collection procedure plus a couple of years of storage, that money would easily run out, leaving the woman with a ton of out of pocket costs to continue storage if she wasn't ready to use the eggs.

(3) I haven't read anything stating that the company covers the costs of fertility procedures like IVF (maybe they do; I just haven't researched it), so assuming those procedures aren't covered (most places they aren't), the policy would again cater to the most privileged employees in the company who can afford fertility treatments to reimplant those eggs as embryos.

Certainly there are a small minority of women who for a variety of reasons choose this option, but I feel like for most, this is just such a ridiculous idea that they would never realistically consider it.

They would be better off simply offering full coverage for multiple fertility treatments for women with IF. And I'm sure many more of the company employees would appreciate and take them up on that benefit.

luciddreamer106 · October 2014

I haven't heard about this before. While it seems like a nice benefit for those women who are interested, I think it sets an expectation that they SHOULD be choosing between career and family. I'm sure there are some women in the company who would take advantage of this, but I don't think money is the only issue that's holding most women back from freezing their eggs.

Edited to clarify.

peggels24 · October 2014

snegde said:

Link? If it's an option I think that's great. If it's encouraged/suggested that's a bit different.

This. Everything I have read on it is that it is an option. No one is forcing a woman to make this choice. In fact, no one is encouraging it - it's just an option that is there. As a PP mentioned, there could be a variety of reasons for freezing eggs including necessary medical procedures. I was also under the impression (and I have not done intense research on this) that Apple has a pretty good parental leave policy.

Even knowing what I know now (including egg quality issues and the age at which I would start TTC), I would not have chosen an egg freezing option when I was in my 20's but I think it's fine for the option to be there.

As far as playing God with a woman's body: (a) I don't think it's playing God and (b) Apple (and Facebook) isn't making the choice to freeze the eggs so they are not "playing God" - it would be the choice of the woman freezing her eggs.

peggels24 · October 2014

Also - many of the articles read "freeze eggs and other infertility treatments." One article (and I'm sorry but I lost the link but I can probably find it again if you want) said:

"Apple's and Facebook's reproductive benefits policies could also appeal to gay and lesbian couples who want to use a surrogate or a sperm donor to have a baby, or heterosexual couples who incur in vitro fertilization costs not covered by insurance. Apple also reimburses adoption costs."

It seems to me that there is a high likelihood that the media is picking out one aspect (egg freezing) and focusing on that. I want companies to have programs that would reimburse infertility treatments and adoptions.

classicstar28 · October 2014

Here is a link to the NPR story:
Women Can Freeze Their Eggs For The Future, But At A Cost

Now that I read the article, I don't feel quite as pissed off about it. Basically they are saying that they'll pay $20,000 for women who WANT to do this anyway since it isn't covered by most insurance companies. I suppose if you are already looking into it, then it's great that the companies recognize that it's expensive and are offering to help offset the cost. It's not like they are offering to pay women to do it or are encouraging women to choose to do it to focus on their careers.

That said, I still think that people need to be seriously educated on fertility and pregnancy. Most people understand it on a basic level, but I think not nearly enough to make informed decisions. Maybe I am biased because my friends seem to know basically nothing about it and are constantly shocked when I explain how it all works to them.

And, I still am a bit irritated because freezing my eggs doesn't help me with balancing my career and my family. I feel like it's still saying that there is more value to wanting to wait than not. I would like to see money being put towards helping with child care costs and longer family leave options as well.

Yaz14 · October 2014

I would absolutely not do this. Yes sometimes you don't meet the right man until later in life or you have fertility issues but asking women to deliberately delay having kids just so they can continue working for longer is just asking for trouble. Plus millions of women have babies and continue to work in high powered careers everyday anyway. I'm definitely no career girl though so having a family would always come before work no matter what industry I was in.

nohalo21 · October 2014

I think this is ridiculous. To me, it makes the whole process of freezing eggs sound like its easy and a magic cure for all. I would not do it for my career. I agree that we need to look at maternity benefits for working parents. The US sucks at this.

jap618 · October 2014

peggels24 said:
Also - many of the articles read "freeze eggs and other infertility treatments." One article (and I'm sorry but I lost the link but I can probably find it again if you want) said:

"Apple's and Facebook's reproductive benefits policies could also appeal to gay and lesbian couples who want to use a surrogate or a sperm donor to have a baby, or heterosexual couples who incur in vitro fertilization costs not covered by insurance. Apple also reimburses adoption costs."

It seems to me that there is a high likelihood that the media is picking out one aspect (egg freezing) and focusing on that. I want companies to have programs that would reimburse infertility treatments and adoptions.

All of this. I will admit I haven't read the articles but if this is just part of their fertility coverage I think it's great. I think of my SIL who is 36 and would LOVE to have kids but isn't in a relationship and doesn't know if/what her childhood cancer did to her reproductive organs. She's been talking about looking into egg freezing but it's so expensive.

I'm all for companies offering more benefits. I don't think it's playing god and I think a woman has the right to make those decisions about her body. I feel like people are trying to argue that this wouldn't be the women's choice. I would not personally put my career off for this but just because someone else chooses to doesn't make it a wrong decision. I agree that it would be nice if people were educated on the issues but the reality is that until you have complications you likely won't do more than the basic research.

So I guess I'm team yay for benefits and a women's right to choose what she does with her body.

mandi195 · October 2014

I never would. My "career" is not something I would ever put before my family in that way.

KMW08 · October 2014

I don't view this as the companies trying to force a woman to put her family-wishes on hold. With those companies I believe they are probably pretty man-dominated. This benefit is a great ploy to pull women employees into the doors of their company. Even families, as I'm assuming this benefit would be spouse eligible if on the husband's insurance.

I think it's a great thing to offer. I'm 30, but I have plenty of friends (25-35) who are single with marriage being nowhere in their near future. A benefit like this would be a dream for some of them.

I do like that it supports female rights. I also hope it sparks some thoughts and encourages more women to empower themselves about reproductive knowledge. I know I was pretty clueless about my body until finding my way here for support.

carlsonbaby2014 · October 2014

I heard this come through on NPR a few days ago and thought it was a great option for those interested in it. Honestly, the way the story was shared made it seem like it was another way FB was trying to leverage a better compensation package for recruiting efforts and employee satisfaction. They, and their competitors, already have a lot of family-centered perks: daycares, paid maternity leave, great insurance, etc. and this was an area they recognized they could step up and help out with where others aren't. If women are interested in investing a little more time into their career and waiting to start a family this might give them a sense of peace that they can make that happen. I thought it was a really great, no-strings-attached perk.

stefani103 · October 2014

It sounds like I might be in the minority, but I think this is great for companies to offer. I don't like the media coverage that makes it sound like it's only for women to continue to work longer. Even if that is their unwritten reasons, it is also an option to those who PPs have mentioned (single women and women with health issues that could affect fertility, such as cancer). Hell, even if a woman chose to wait for her career, that is her choice. However, I agree with those on the other side that freezing does not equal a promise of fertility down the road. Waiting is a risk. As with any medical procedure, especially something that could be elective, it is up to the woman to educate herself to the risks, both physical risks and the potential for failure down the road.

I also agree that sending money this way would also be nicely balanced with offering on-site child care and benefits to both parents for maternity/paternity leave.

Personally, I work in a very female-dominated field. Pregnancy is common and understood. I am also starting my family in my early thirties, and wanting additional children down the road. But my work is also very small and public sector, so if I did want to freeze eggs, that's all out of my own pocket. Still, I am career-minded. I never see myself as a SAHM; I love what I do, and I know I'll be a better mother if I have something for myself away from home too. It's about knowing yourself and what is right for you.

CliffNotes: Companies can offer it. Still a woman's choice. And still a woman's duty to educate herself about anything she chooses to do to her body.

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Would you freeze your eggs for your career?

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Began trying for a baby January 2012BFP 4.25.2013 EDD 1.3.2014 MMC 6.3.2013 D&C 6.19.2013BFP 11.3.2013 CP 11.6.2013BFP 3.31.2014 EDD 12.10.2014 Baby boy Carlson born 12.19.2014

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Began trying for a baby January 2012
BFP 4.25.2013 EDD 1.3.2014 MMC 6.3.2013 D&C 6.19.2013
BFP 11.3.2013 CP 11.6.2013
BFP 3.31.2014 EDD 12.10.2014 Baby boy Carlson born 12.19.2014