MFI Question?

Hollowvic · August 2014

Been MIA for a while. Had my first IUI this morning and my DH's numbers were awful, 1.7 million post wash. Way worse than his first SA back in May. He is scheduled to see a urologist next week. I feel like IUI's are a waste at this point, especially since we're paying OOP. Anybody have any advice or some insight on MFI? Anybody's DH have this issue and know what the reason is? I'm just at a loss.

Waterlily234 · August 2014

I'm sorry about the disappointment today. Was that p/w number total sperm, or total motile sperm? I hope you find some answers! Good luck!

TLooney17 · August 2014

I am sorry. I know exactly how you feel. Our first iui we had 3 million post wash and our second we had 900,000. We don't know what is causing our MFI. My DH did have somewhat low testosterone, but he has been taking clomid since December and his testosterone is normal now. The clomid and supplements ( recommended by our uro) have helped my DH's counts, but unfortunately not enough to make an iui successful. Our RE did tell us that if you have poor morph ( ours is 2%) that you will typically lose a lot of sperm in the wash.

We have a consult for ivf on Wednesday. Sorry, it sucks!

Hollowvic · August 2014

Thanks so much, I have a question that might be stupid, do they do the same "wash" when doing the SA as when they do it before the IUI? His numbers weren't great with the SA but not anywhere near the numbers today, I was actually shocked. He goes to see a Urologist on Monday, in the meantime I'm terrified of IVF but I don't think we'll have success any other way.

MrsLolaSky · August 2014

Hi! I hear you… we're going through the same thing!

We found out in June. My DH went to see a urologist that has some knowledge about infertility (only one in the area… if you can find one that specializes in infertility, that's even better).

The urologist found a varicocele that he thinks might be contributing to my husband's numbers, and he's recommending that we do a varicocelectomy. DH can't wrap his mind around how one varicocele could possibly cause his sperm-quality issues, so we're doubtful that the surgery will improve things. The studies on the surgery are mixed--some men see improvement (with IUI being a real option), but not all men. That said, we do want to try to do something about our situation, so we're tentatively thinking about doing the surgery in the late fall.

The urologist also put my husband on clomiphene for three months to see if his numbers improve. DH doesn't have low testosterone, so we don't think this will help.

I also have DH on a slew of vitamins, including L-Carnitine, which is one of the few vitamins that has been associated with some sperm improvement. (If interested: https://www.clevelandclinic.org/reproductiveresearchcenter/docs/agradoc392.pdf)

My DH has a hard time believing the vitamins will help, but he is dutifully taking them every morning!

Basically, we are getting mentally prepared for the fact that we will likely need IVF-ICSI to get pregnant. But, nonetheless, we have (tentatively) decided to take a year to see if we can improve his numbers with the clomiphene, the vitamins, and the varicocelectomy surgery.

I have asked other MFI girls for advice on this forum. They've been super helpful and supportive. Many received similar diagnoses as us and were told IVF-ICSI. Many also decided to take a year to try to improve things--and some were glad they took the time but others regretted taking the time. I think it depends on how old you guys are and how you feel about IVF mentally and financially. For us, I think the year makes sense (although it is painful to keep getting pregnancy news from others as we wait and hope).

Last thing: The urologist wanted us to do two SAs to confirm the situation because apparently sperm can vary quite a bit. Unfortunately for us, there was little variation. Maybe there will be more variation in your husband's sperm--though I'm not sure that's very helpful since the timing of a good batch has to still work out.

Ah, MFI is a tough diagnosis…. They don't really seem to know the details of what happens with the sperm. But, thank goodness we live in a time in which IVF-ICSI is an option, so there is definitely hope. (And, of course, some people get really lucky and still get pregnant with low counts (as long as you ovulate, then there is a nonzero percent chance)--but we haven't really found that to be too comforting given our numbers.)

Good luck to you! I will be watching out for you to see how things are going. Feel free to contact me anytime.

catlover790 · August 2014

Just wanted to offer support; I hope you can see the urologist soon and get things figured out. I'm sorry about the numbers.

Hollowvic · August 2014

@MrsLolaSky‌ thank you for all the advice and info. I would like to wait and see what the Urologist says, he is going to someone who specializes in MFI. My issue is that I'm 38 (almost 39) so time is not on my side even for IVF. Basically I have to decide whether to do IVF or not at this point. I'm terrified of needles, and we're paying OOP so cost is an issue.

curve31 · August 2014

Maybe this isn't comforting but my husband doesn't produce sperm at all. I'd do anything to be able to have 'his' baby, including IVF. I hope that doesn't come off as bitchy, but there is a bright side to your situation.

Hollowvic · August 2014

We're going to the Urologist on Monday and hoping for some answers. TMI warning, he admitted to me that he has been having mild discomfort in one of his testicles, it happens once in a while but the past couple of days it's been bothering him. I can't help but to think he has something going on, hopefully we'll get to the bottom of it. In the meantime we're seriously considering IVF, even though it terrifies me. I'm in the TWW after this IUI but with his numbers so bad I not that hopeful. They told me to have TI tonight, I'm like really? How in the hell would that benefit me at all at this point? Ugh, just one of those days. I appreciate everybody's help and support on this board.

Hollowvic · August 2014

@curve31‌ I'm sorry that your DH has such a severe issue, I don't think you're bitchy at all. I guess I should be happy for the little bit he does have. I try to count my blessings but some days I'd rather feel sorry for myself, even though I know I shouldn't.

thirtyninetoforty · August 2014

I don't have any advice but just wanted to wish you luck!

janelledk · August 2014

@hollowvic I'm in the same boat! First IUI = BFN. Before the RE even did the IUI procedure he shared DH's numbers and recommended IVF. We're also paying out of pocket, so I don't feel like it's worth it to even do another. We are also going to try to see if a Urologist can be of any help. At least it's nice to not feel so alone in all of this.

SweetieShellieH · August 2014

***prev loss mentioned***

Hello! Our primary dx is MFI, the last IUI we did DH's post wash was just as bad as your DH's. His post wash recovery for our IUIs was always reallly low. Only a small percentage of his motile sperm (which was already low) would make it through the wash. DH's bloodwork was fine, and his scrotal ultrasound did not show any abnormailities.

If your DH doesn't have any other known causes for the SA results perhaps your RE might suggest something like Clomid or Arimidex (or any other meds I'm not aware of) to see if it helps improve his numbers. My RE says it doesn't help everyone, but it's worth a shot. You can see the improvement in my siggy.

You should definitely still try TI (easier said then done especially when ur feeling defeated, I know). I don't know how bad your DH's motility and morph is, but it is not impossible. With my DH's poor results, we did conceive once before we knew he had poor motility and morphology.

Also a wash isn't usually done when it's just an SA, at least not when I did them at the lab I used to work for. It's possible some clinics do.

I hope you'll get some answers next week and can figure out a new plan

kristyn831 · August 2014

I'm sorry this happened on your first IUI. The same thing happened to us, but our numbers were worse. I think seeing a urologist is a good first step. We are going ahead with a second IUI and seeing what those numbers are (I'm very nervous). If it's bad again, we will be moving on to IVF next cycle and figuring out how to fix MFI so we can have better chances conceiving on our own in the future.

BunnyBerry · August 2014

So sorry about that news.

We have MFI as well, though our RE is hopeful for us trying a few IUIs.

MH was pretty deflated as well when he heard his post-wash #'s for IUI. They don't wash at all for our SA, but they double wash for IUI to prevent uterine cramping and to improve morphology concentration. We were surprised that motile sperm % was lower after the washes, and I wondered if the whole process was just hard on his sperm? Who knows.

MH is on hCG shots for 3 months to see if they make a difference. He had low/borderline T (I think it 269). I've also got him on a vitamin cocktail, including a multi, B12, C, D, E, selenium, and zinc. All of the above have been shown to help in some study or another. Who knows if we're going overboard but the urologist didn't advise either way, when he saw DH's med list.

Since you mentioned you're AMA, I think in your place I would be thinking IVF rather than wait and try, since it takes months for a sperm treatment to take effect, and then on average months for IUI to work. But I would also ask the RE and probably let him make that decision for us.

The uro thought MH had a varicocele, but the ultrasound showed it was a hydrocele and not impacting anything they said, so now I am actually relieved that he doesn't have to go through surgery and we don't have to wait the 6 months for best results.

But I do hope the urologist has some great and hopeful ideas for you guys! Good luck at the appointment.

steen9713 · August 2014

My sister had a similar issue with her husband, they were suggested to take a male fertil aid supplement, like a male type Of vitamin to help boost count and what not. Ask your dr if they have any supplement suggestions.

best of luck!!

MrsLolaSky · August 2014

We're paying $120 for each SA, and it's unwashed!

Do they just make these prices up???

Hollowvic · August 2014

Ugh, we $175 OOP for the SA, nobody ever explained to us that the wash was different from the SA. This is all so aggravating. I feel bad for my DH, he's really upset. I'm going to talk to my RE today about IVF. IDK how we'll afford it.

WishUponAChild · August 2014

@Hollowvic is your DH seeing an RE? My DH RE is helping improve his sperm count. We don't know how it is working for another 10 days. I hope they can help. This is so hard to go through.

Hollowvic · August 2014

@WishUponAChild‌ he was just referred to a Urologist so hopefully they can help,us get to the bottom of what is going on. His numbers have just gotten so bad over the past 2 months.

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