Babies napping in sub-zero temperatures

Stargirlb · July 2014

I love learning about how babies are raised in different cultures. This article talks about babies napping outdoors in Nordic countries.

We have cold winters here, and I love baby-wearing outdoors in the winter. Looking forward to doing that again. My son loved being out in the freezing cold, next to my body when a newborn.

https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-21537988

Stargirlb · July 2014

But don't do this in the USA, you'll get your kids taken away! Fuck the United States, seriously:

https://m.thelocal.com/20110817/35592

NatureLovers · July 2014

CrazyMonkeyBear said:

bookworm92 said:

I'm more afraid of kidnapping here in the US. And almost everything is considered child abuse/neglect here now.

That it is. I have no idea what I'm going to do if I have to pay for gas with cash one day and have the baby in the car. Seriously, who's going to pull the kid out of the warm car to run in and pay strictly for gas or to go get the change.

Someone who doesn't want their kid to be taken away, kidnapped, or car jacked. That exact scenario happened recently. The baby was later found abandoned by a jogging trail, where the carjacker dumped her.

motherboy · July 2014

CrazyMonkeyBear said:

bookworm92 said:

I'm more afraid of kidnapping here in the US. And almost everything is considered child abuse/neglect here now.

That it is. I have no idea what I'm going to do if I have to pay for gas with cash one day and have the baby in the car. Seriously, who's going to pull the kid out of the warm car to run in and pay strictly for gas or to go get the change.

------------probable Quote fail--------
I absolutely think about this too. People have taken fear mongering to the next level. I recently read this article:

https://www.salon.com/2014/06/03/the_day_i_left_my_son_in_the_car/

(Child lives and is fine.) But it shows how extreme people and the courts have become and seem to have lost some common sense.

kolaczka · July 2014

It seems weird that the adults are inside drinking their coffee (example in article) and the babies are outside. By their logic shouldn't their cafe tables be outside so that the adults can gain the health benefits of the fresh air as well?

Also I have been reading that leaving kids in their car seats is less optimal then baby wearing for a number of reasons. Seems as though some of the same concerns would apply here with time in prams.

https://onyababy.com/2012/06/benefits-of-babywearing-vs-carseat-carrying/

Last thought...here in CO we joke about all the warm weather transplants who don't know how to drive in the snow/weather. With highly diverse climate zones in the US and worker mobility it seems as though the chance for bad decisions/mistakes goes way up.

nah82 · July 2014

NatureLovers said:

bookworm92 said:

I'm more afraid of kidnapping here in the US. And almost everything is considered child abuse/neglect here now.

That it is. I have no idea what I'm going to do if I have to pay for gas with cash one day and have the baby in the car. Seriously, who's going to pull the kid out of the warm car to run in and pay strictly for gas or to go get the change.
Someone who doesn't want their kid to be taken away, kidnapped, or car jacked.

This. I live in a tiny rural town and someone left their baby in the car and went in the house to grab something quick, and someone drove off with their car, baby included, when I was in high school. Debit/CC at the pump or get one of those fleece infant seat covers that zips up and protects baby from the elements so you can just zip it up, grab the carrier, and go in without struggling with coat, hat, mittens, etc.

amiej1227 · July 2014

I find it interesting that Swedes can just leave their babies outside without fear of abduction. My sister would leave her kids in the car while it was running to grab quick things from the store but my mom would give her an earful on it saying how irresponsible it is.

Cbeanz · July 2014

Please, never, under no circumstances, leave your baby alone in a car. No matter what the weather is or if you think you'll only be gone "a second".

ETA: @CrazyMonkeyBear‌ you take the baby from the car seat, carry him/her inside to pay, then buckle baby back in when you're done. Every single time.

jennyhatt · July 2014

Stargirlb said:
I love learning about how babies are raised in different cultures. This article talks about babies napping outdoors in Nordic countries.

We have cold winters here, and I love baby-wearing outdoors in the winter. Looking forward to doing that again. My son loved being out in the freezing cold, next to my body when a newborn.

https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-21537988

My daughter has had countless naps on my front porch after a walk outside in her stroller. Winter or summer. I leave my window open so I can hear her and check on her every few minutes or simply sit outside with a book myself. I live in a small town, safe neighbourhood.... In canada

Never thought twice about it. She loves it.

LaBellaVida · July 2014

I livedin Europe for 3 years. You don't need to watch your kids like you do here in America.
It is not nearly as common to have your kids taken over there. People don't worry about it as much, and everyone watches out for eachothers kids. It's actually comforting knowing my kids are safe, (to an extent) with a "stranger" watching.
I've heard Canada wad the same.

Beauxbaton · July 2014

I used to have take DS outside cause he would get too hot. As far as leaving them outside for a nap I think it just depends where you live. We could probably be safe in our neighborhood. But other parts of the city nope. As far as leaving them in the car to psy for gas, nope never. I know the chances are slim (especially depending on your area) but too much could happen. When my DH was little his mom left him in the car with his infant brother so she could pay for a car wash. In the 2 minutes she had her back turned two dude broke into the car and stole a bunch of shit. Fortunately him and his brother were fine, but it easily could have been worse

thompnia · July 2014

The only time my son is ever left in the car alone for any period of time is in our own driveway. For example, if he falls asleep on the way home I will leave him in the car while I let the dogs out, so they will not wake him up when I bring him in. Only a minute, and I bring the keys with me and my car is within sight the whole time.

It's not just abduction to be feared. How would you feel if someone ran into your vehicle while you were in the store, injuring your baby? My dad's car was hit at a gas pump, luckily no one was inside and it missed the pump by inches. My dad was holding the gas nozzle at the time and was able to move it out of the way. Or what if there is a long line and you run into someone you haven't seen in a while? Hot car?

I also live in a small, safe community. That didn't stop a girl in my husband's class from being abducted in the fifth grade as she rode her bike home from school. We will allow bike rides at that age, reasonable distances and with phone calls on arrival.

It is so easy to bring a baby into the gas station, especially when you compare it to the possible anguish over a very preventable tragedy.

MahriM23 · July 2014

I leave my kids in the car when I pay for gas, usually I only go to places where I don't actually have to go inside to pay though. I would never even think about getting 3 kids out of my car and bringing them inside with me to pay for gas, never mind when I have 4. Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever seen any mom do that. You can see your car from the window. A kidnapper could break in my kid's window while I'm sleeping and steal all of my children, I could easily prevent this by sleeping in the same room as them, but I'm not going to do that either.

thompnia · July 2014

CrazyMonkeyBear said:
As for getting hit at a gas station, might as well not drive with the baby at all since accidents happen that way, too.

While I do always pay with a DC/CC, some places I've been to recently don't let you pay at the pump. You can see the car and windows from the register, and I take my keys with me, locking the door, as I'll leave my purse on the front seat.

I understand that car accidents happen. My point was that it is perfectly preventable by bringing the baby in. Avoiding driving is simply not practical, at least not where I live.

That being said, the gas station by my home has a cash pay window which I have used. There is a pump directly across from it, and I always have exact change when I use it. (I do not consider this leaving my son alone because I am mere steps from the car with no barriers.)

I do not consider myself a paranoid parent. I am very laid back in most of my methods. This is the one thing I stick on. Well, other than not giving my child pop, but that's for another thread.

Stargirlb · July 2014

culture of fear in the usa. yes it's sad that some people can be neglectful or evil, but why does that turn people into fear-mongering militant pricks about parenting choices?

MahriM23 · July 2014

ICarriedAWatermelon said:

As for getting hit at a gas station, might as well not drive with the baby at all since accidents happen that way, too. While I do always pay with a DC/CC, some places I've been to recently don't let you pay at the pump. You can see the car and windows from the register, and I take my keys with me, locking the door, as I'll leave my purse on the front seat.
Sorry, quote fail in my last post... but you may want to check your state laws. It's illegal to leave unattended children in vehicles (age varies by state) in lots of states. https://www.kidsandcars.org/state-laws.html ETA: I don't think that site is comprehensive as it is illegal in NYS since 2013 for kids under 8.

My state is the only little blue one that says police are authorized to provide a verbal warning. Interesting.

Stargirlb · July 2014

here is one of my newborn out with us to cut down a xmas tree. very cold out. we were outdoors for a few hours, and he could nurse in the sling easily. I normally prefer the moby wrap for longer periods of baby wearing and nursing, but thought this would be a quick trip so used the sling.

Maebb · July 2014

I think baby-wearing in the winter (and other seasons) is great. DS was born Nov 30, and I loved snuggling with him as an infant. Now he's almost 20 months and just wants to run around.

As far as leaving your baby in the car, no. I am generally not a fear-mongerer, but that is a risk I choose not to take.

I've read that Salon article linked above by @motherboy‌, and while I would not have called the cops on that lady, I probably would have waited outside near the car to make sure the kid was ok until she got back. Yes, it might be a slight inconvenience to take your child with you inside, but I just don't feel comfortable leaving DS in the car unattended.

Maebb · July 2014

CrazyMonkeyBear said:

I, seriously, still sometimes wonder how I survived to 24/ almost 25 with all the laws now-- like sitting in the middle front seat of a 6 seater to go to dinner (pretty cars aren't even made that way anymore) and never using a booster seat

This mindset - "I survived with the car seat safety laws (or lack thereof) in the 1980's, so it must be ok" - it drives me crazy. My parents tried to tell me the same thing when my mom improperly strapped infant DS into his car seat.

Here are some statistics on it from 1979-1984, when I was a baby:

https://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/regrev/evaluate/806890.html

Yes, if my parents didn't have me properly strapped into a car seat, I really am lucky that I survived when they were in an accident. Improper use of carseats is another risk that I just don't see the benefit of taking.

motherboy · July 2014

Maebb said:
I think baby-wearing in the winter (and other seasons) is great. DS was born Nov 30, and I loved snuggling with him as an infant. Now he's almost 20 months and just wants to run around.

As far as leaving your baby in the car, no. I am generally not a fear-mongerer, but that is a risk I choose not to take.

I've read that Salon article linked above by @motherboy‌, and while I would not have called the cops on that lady, I probably would have waited outside near the car to make sure the kid was ok until she got back. Yes, it might be a slight inconvenience to take your child with you inside, but I just don't feel comfortable leaving DS in the car unattended.

Yeah I agree with all that. I don't think it was a great move what the mom did but I think the punishment was way out of proportion to what she did. It is just crazy because of course she is going to plead guilty with the threat of getting her kids taken away.

I have never and probably would never leave my kid in the car to slap a 20 down on the coubter, but I can see why parents do or would want to. Everything in life carries risks and I do think the culture of parenting in America is getting slightly obsessive about danger and safety. I know my kids won't get to experience some of the freedom I had as a kid growing up, and i feel a little sad about that.

MNgirl326 · July 2014

I left LO in the car once while I was having trouble with the pump and I need them to authorize it manually. There was no one else at the station- it was 6:30 am.

I have also left him in the car on our own driveway many times, while I ran back into the house to get something.

Other then that, I bring him with me. Is it ideal? No. It sucks in the winter. but you do what you gotta do. I also just usually pay with my card at the pump.

No I don't leave him in the car- but as he has gotten older I have found ways to foster his independence and freedom. I let him go to friends houses and play, and I don't helicopter around him. So, I guess in my world if I have to take away a nostalgic childhood memory I would rather take away leaving a kid in the car, then having the freedom to go play with friends when they want.

bustysinclare · July 2014

The napping outside seems interesting. In the US though the leaving the children outside alone is the risky part. In other countries that might be much less as risky. It's so tough to haul the kids out of teh car to run in somewhere when the babies are small. I beg people to pick things up and frequent any drive throughs for milk things to pick up

MNgirl326 · July 2014

bustysinclare said:

The napping outside seems interesting. In the US though the leaving the children outside alone is the risky part. In other countries that might be much less as risky. It's so tough to haul the kids out of teh car to run in somewhere when the babies are small. I beg people to pick things up and frequent any drive throughs for milk things to pick up

The day I discovered a drive through Starbucks was the happiest day of my life.

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