Anti-sperm Antibodies — The Bump
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Anti-sperm Antibodies

Can someone help me decipher this?  DH's final results came back for his S/A.  Total motile was 17 mil with 7% morph.  We are so excited about this and because of the higher counts, they FINALLY did an immunobead assay on the sample based on the sperm mar resluts-IgG of 80%.

So the assay came with IgA: 88% binding (51% head, 41% tail, 6% mid-piece, 2% tip-tail) and IgG: 86% binding (45% head, 24% tail, 19% mid-piece, 12% tip-tail).  What does this mean and is there anything they do for it?

They have already done the chromosome testing early on and it all came back normal.
TTC #1 Since May 2011 ~ Everyone Welcome
Me (34): DOR d/t chemo/radiation, Immature Endometrial Lining, Hypothyroidism
DH (35): MFI d/t testicular torsion and removal, Low T, Oligospermia, Anti-Sperm Antibodies, Currently on T supplements
Sept '11-April '13 ~  Testing, failed multiple MFI treatments, saving & TONS of praying
January 2014 ~ IVF/ICSI & PGS ~ no response to stims ~ converted to IUI ~ BFN
February 2014 ~ On to donor embyros ~ 5 blasts!!! 
March 2014 ~ FET #1 ~ Transferred 2 blasts ~ BFN
July 2014 ~ Kliman's mock cycle with endometrial function test
Sample too small for EFT, HE slide showed immature cells
New protocol planned, saving for another biopsy for EFT
January 2015 ~ Considering adoption options
April 2015 ~ Privately arranged adoption of planned pregnancy
DD#1 ~ Lillyana Violet Marie born 6/15/16, Finalized adoption 12/20/16
July 13, 2018 ~ BFP....WTF?!?!
7/16 Beta #1 ~ 466...7/18 Beta #2 ~ 1,077...7/23 Beta #3 ~ 5,291
7/23 US #1 ~ 1 gestational sac seen and yolk sac
7/30 US #2 and 1st OB appt ~ 1 perfectly round gestational sac, 1 perfect yolk sac and 1 teeny tiny heart beat seen!!!
Lilypie Maternity tickers


Re: Anti-sperm Antibodies

  • I thought ICSI took care of the anti sperm antibody issue-- that it just made natural conception or IUI impossible/unlikely....

    TTC #1 since 8/1/10; Me:41 and BRCA1+, DH:46
    DOR (FSH 24.3)/ terrible egg quality ; homozygous MTHFR c677t
    5 IUI's: 2/11 to 6/11 and 1/12= BFN
    OE IVF#1-4 8/11-6/12= all BFN
    DE IVF#1 11/12 bad embryos= BFN
    DE IVF #2 2/13 BFP/Beta hell: m/c 5w6d
    CFNBC 7 months, not doing well; decided on guarantee program at RBA w/frozen DE
    DE IVF #3 1/14  ET 4BB; BFP;M/C 5w1d, incomplete m/c; MVA extraction in ER 7w1d

    DE FET#1 ET 3/1714; BFP, beta 1 3/27= 197, beta 2 3/31= 1586, beta 3 4/7= 13879!!
    First u/s= Twins with HBs at 6w2d! We are Team Pink x 2!!

    K & K born 11/21/14 at 38wks 4 days

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    SAIF/PAIF Welcome


    http://waitingforraintostop.wordpress.com

  • I second pp
    Me: 37, DH: 38: ttc 7 years, dx: unknown
    10/11: after 2 years, saw a RE, FSH 5.4
    11/11: BFP! (surprise after thyroid & normal hsg),
    12/11: missed m/c after 7 week u/s, 1/12: D&C
    6/12 IUI#1-IUI #3: clomid = BFP!, C/P
    IVF #1(10/12) FSH 5.4, AFC: 16 long Lupron, 5R/5M/4F, all 4 made it to 5dt, 1 blast/1-8 cell transferred=BFN
    IVF #2(12/12)AFC 21, MD lupron, 4R/4M/3F, 5dt of 1 blast and 2-8cell. BFN.
    IVF#3(4/13) Natural start antagon protocol, 12R,11F. one PGS normal at day 6 transfer. BFN.
    IVF#4 (11/13) C.CRM (ODW.U normal 8/13 Still no Diagnosis) EPP/antagonist. ER 13R/7M/6F. Only 1 made it to freeze. Abnormal. Looking into options of DE, Fresh vs frozen.
    10/14 new local RE to look into what's next. CD3 FSH 4.7, AMH 0.9. Met with DE agencies and exploring options for feb/march 2015.
    Surprise natural bfp (4 days before donor is signed). Beta #1 at 9dpo: 51.8, 2nd beta: 195 (25 hours doubling) @11dpo. 3rd beta (12/15): 516 (35 hrs doubling) 4th beta(12/17): 895 (58 hours doubling) 5th beta(12/19): 2120. U/S at 5w0d(12/22): one gestational sac with yolk sac. U/S #2 (6w0d)12/29. One little bean measuring 6w0d with HR 124. 3rd u/s(1/4)7w0d: baby measuring 7w2d. HR 134. 3/30: A/S at MFM went great except for low lying placenta. Verifi results are normal! Team Blue! Please send any positive thoughts our way! EDD:8/24/2015
    Baby Will born 8/18. He's perfect.
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  • ***Lurker*** (Sorry, hope it's OK!)

     

    Washing the sperm is supposed to weed out the sperm affected by the antibodies, so it shouldn't affect anything if you're doing ICSI anyways. Antibodies usually affect motility first, so I'm assuming that he had a very high count prior to wash if he had 17mil motile with that high of antibodies?

    Unfortunately, there isn't really much that they can do about antibodies. There has been some success with steroid treatments (much like with autoimmune issues dealing with other types of antibodies) but there are some nasty side effects, which our urologist explained wouldn't be worth it, considering we'd still need ICSI. There are a few places (around the world) that will do a special wash that is supposed to actually wash the antibodies off of the sperm, making those affected, effective again, but it's not used by even the places that used to do it, since the advent of ICSI has bypassed the need. (Even though it's so much more bloody expensive!!!)

    There are also a few TCM treatments that are supposed to help with antibodies, but we didn't have success with them. It might be worth looking into if you're interested, but obviously it takes awhile to see results, so it may or may not be worth it to you.

    image imageimage
    image

    ***EVERYONE WELCOME***
    TTC #2 with assistance since 03/11
    Me: 33, Autoimmune (Hashimotos and FMS/CFS)
    Treated with Synthroid, acupuncture, TCM and supplements
    DH: 33, MFI (very low on all counts, high antibodies, hemochromatosis)
    Many treatments tried, none successful

    IVF/ICSI #1 05/14 - EPP/Antagonist, Gonal-F and Luveris, 18R, 14M, 13F - SET of 1BC, all arrested on day 5 - C/P
    Genetic testing = normal, DNA Frag = excellent
    IVF #2 03/15 - Long protocol with Suprefact, Gonal-F, and possibly Luveris, adding in PICSI
     
  • tptbabe said:

    ***Lurker*** (Sorry, hope it's OK!)

     

    Washing the sperm is supposed to weed out the sperm affected by the antibodies, so it shouldn't affect anything if you're doing ICSI anyways. Antibodies usually affect motility first, so I'm assuming that he had a very high count prior to wash if he had 17mil motile with that high of antibodies?

    Unfortunately, there isn't really much that they can do about antibodies. There has been some success with steroid treatments (much like with autoimmune issues dealing with other types of antibodies) but there are some nasty side effects, which our urologist explained wouldn't be worth it, considering we'd still need ICSI. There are a few places (around the world) that will do a special wash that is supposed to actually wash the antibodies off of the sperm, making those affected, effective again, but it's not used by even the places that used to do it, since the advent of ICSI has bypassed the need. (Even though it's so much more bloody expensive!!!)

    There are also a few TCM treatments that are supposed to help with antibodies, but we didn't have success with them. It might be worth looking into if you're interested, but obviously it takes awhile to see results, so it may or may not be worth it to you.

    The 17 motile was just counted, the sample wasn't washed as far as I know.  The total concentration was 23 million, the highest he's had.  I guess I'm wondering, other than motility, does ASA affect the number of sperm actually produced or is it just what attaches to the sperm after production to "kill" them?
    TTC #1 Since May 2011 ~ Everyone Welcome
    Me (34): DOR d/t chemo/radiation, Immature Endometrial Lining, Hypothyroidism
    DH (35): MFI d/t testicular torsion and removal, Low T, Oligospermia, Anti-Sperm Antibodies, Currently on T supplements
    Sept '11-April '13 ~  Testing, failed multiple MFI treatments, saving & TONS of praying
    January 2014 ~ IVF/ICSI & PGS ~ no response to stims ~ converted to IUI ~ BFN
    February 2014 ~ On to donor embyros ~ 5 blasts!!! 
    March 2014 ~ FET #1 ~ Transferred 2 blasts ~ BFN
    July 2014 ~ Kliman's mock cycle with endometrial function test
    Sample too small for EFT, HE slide showed immature cells
    New protocol planned, saving for another biopsy for EFT
    January 2015 ~ Considering adoption options
    April 2015 ~ Privately arranged adoption of planned pregnancy
    DD#1 ~ Lillyana Violet Marie born 6/15/16, Finalized adoption 12/20/16
    July 13, 2018 ~ BFP....WTF?!?!
    7/16 Beta #1 ~ 466...7/18 Beta #2 ~ 1,077...7/23 Beta #3 ~ 5,291
    7/23 US #1 ~ 1 gestational sac seen and yolk sac
    7/30 US #2 and 1st OB appt ~ 1 perfectly round gestational sac, 1 perfect yolk sac and 1 teeny tiny heart beat seen!!!
    Lilypie Maternity tickers


  • As far as I've seen/heard/read, it only affects the sperm after they're produced. ASA usually come into play after a groin injury or VR, when the membrane separating the sperm from the blood supply is compromised, so that the body starts attacking itself. I suppose that if a man were to injure himself so severely that it affected sperm production, that it would likely have torn the membrane as well, but I don't think that the antibodies affect production directly.

    FWIW, my DH has no history of injury, infection or VR, so it's a huge mystery as to where they came from? His other numbers are affected by his liver disease, but it's unrelated to the antibodies.
    image imageimage
    image

    ***EVERYONE WELCOME***
    TTC #2 with assistance since 03/11
    Me: 33, Autoimmune (Hashimotos and FMS/CFS)
    Treated with Synthroid, acupuncture, TCM and supplements
    DH: 33, MFI (very low on all counts, high antibodies, hemochromatosis)
    Many treatments tried, none successful

    IVF/ICSI #1 05/14 - EPP/Antagonist, Gonal-F and Luveris, 18R, 14M, 13F - SET of 1BC, all arrested on day 5 - C/P
    Genetic testing = normal, DNA Frag = excellent
    IVF #2 03/15 - Long protocol with Suprefact, Gonal-F, and possibly Luveris, adding in PICSI
     
  • Interesting.  Thank you so much!  My husband did have an injury, testicular tosion, and had one testicle removed.  His hormone levels show that the remaining testicle has worked twice as hard and he still produces obviously.
    TTC #1 Since May 2011 ~ Everyone Welcome
    Me (34): DOR d/t chemo/radiation, Immature Endometrial Lining, Hypothyroidism
    DH (35): MFI d/t testicular torsion and removal, Low T, Oligospermia, Anti-Sperm Antibodies, Currently on T supplements
    Sept '11-April '13 ~  Testing, failed multiple MFI treatments, saving & TONS of praying
    January 2014 ~ IVF/ICSI & PGS ~ no response to stims ~ converted to IUI ~ BFN
    February 2014 ~ On to donor embyros ~ 5 blasts!!! 
    March 2014 ~ FET #1 ~ Transferred 2 blasts ~ BFN
    July 2014 ~ Kliman's mock cycle with endometrial function test
    Sample too small for EFT, HE slide showed immature cells
    New protocol planned, saving for another biopsy for EFT
    January 2015 ~ Considering adoption options
    April 2015 ~ Privately arranged adoption of planned pregnancy
    DD#1 ~ Lillyana Violet Marie born 6/15/16, Finalized adoption 12/20/16
    July 13, 2018 ~ BFP....WTF?!?!
    7/16 Beta #1 ~ 466...7/18 Beta #2 ~ 1,077...7/23 Beta #3 ~ 5,291
    7/23 US #1 ~ 1 gestational sac seen and yolk sac
    7/30 US #2 and 1st OB appt ~ 1 perfectly round gestational sac, 1 perfect yolk sac and 1 teeny tiny heart beat seen!!!
    Lilypie Maternity tickers


  • Ouch! That could absolutely explain the antibodies though. I'm glad the other one is still going strong! Good luck, and sorry for invading your board :)
    image imageimage
    image

    ***EVERYONE WELCOME***
    TTC #2 with assistance since 03/11
    Me: 33, Autoimmune (Hashimotos and FMS/CFS)
    Treated with Synthroid, acupuncture, TCM and supplements
    DH: 33, MFI (very low on all counts, high antibodies, hemochromatosis)
    Many treatments tried, none successful

    IVF/ICSI #1 05/14 - EPP/Antagonist, Gonal-F and Luveris, 18R, 14M, 13F - SET of 1BC, all arrested on day 5 - C/P
    Genetic testing = normal, DNA Frag = excellent
    IVF #2 03/15 - Long protocol with Suprefact, Gonal-F, and possibly Luveris, adding in PICSI
     
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