Yearly review=Mom shaming

*~Krystin1119~* · May 2014

Hi Ladies! I recently had my yearly review and am not sure what to do. My supervisor told me I am a good worker, but not a good enough employee because I have DD (she does not have any children) I'm her only employee that has a child and do not work as hard as she does because I need to leave on time to pick DD up from daycare by 6pm. I've been looking for a job in my "chosen" field but have not had any luck. After that, I'm ready to move on to another job where I can hopefully use my degree, but not sure if I will encounter this if I find another employer who isn't anti-child, anti-parent. Is this something normal?

djm31012 · May 2014

i dont find this to be normal at all, i think it sounds like you just have a crappy boss and you could potentially talk to HR about this. Sounds a little like discrimination to me. Your work should speak for itself. If she is concerned about the number of hours you are logging is there a way to work from home for an hour at night, or maybe come in a bit earlier? I am in work at 645am but i consistently leave at 445pm, usually one of the firsts to go. i have never been penalized for that. I hope you find a new job that is more family friendly.

PSU_Texan · May 2014

If you are not meeting deadlines or not producing quality work because of your time constraints, then that is a problem. You need to figure out how to be more productive while there or work after your DD goes to bed. If there is no issue with your work quality or quantity based on the directions/expectations given to you, then this is a load of crap. There are still a lot of people out there who think hours in the office = more work or better employee. This is not the case. Go back and clarify where you have not met expectations in terms of actual work output and quality. If she can't answer, then take this up the line or to HR. You should not be given negative feedback for simply being a parent.

BabyHope2013 · May 2014

That is awful. I would certainly consider going to HR if she actually mentioned or eluded to the fact that you are not being a good employee and therefore not getting a good annual review because you have a child. It's call work-life balance. If she has real reasons why you are doing poorly then she should point those out. I would approach her once more and ask for clarification about what specifically that you can do to improve during the work day. Give her a chance to give you something meaningful and if she doesn't definitely take it up with HR.

*~Krystin1119~* · May 2014

Thanks ladies! She said that I'm an exceptional employee who exceeds what is expected of me, but that I need to spend more time here (I'm assuming to help her with her work since she's too busy researching juvederm and face-lifts). Unfortunately, HR is her neighbor and going to her isn't any help. I have had nothing but compliments from our General Manager and was credited with helping us to receive a 15% bonus last year. I'm not sure what more she would like me to do--we work 8-5, I'm here by 8, she strolls in around 9:30 and might stay until 8. I take 15-20 min lunch rather than 60 min and some days I work straight thru lunch. I take home work from a different department to do a few evenings a month because she wants to be doesn't want to. We have a sheet that we sign in/out everyday at the receptionist desk--receptionist informed me that boss asks if I sign in at 8 or if I'm just marking myself here early. Receptionist hates my boss, but wouldn't lie she notes that I'm always in by 8. But bringing my child into anything seemed like she was just fishing for some reason to give for an issue on my review. I leave 30 min early Tuesday to take DD to dance class, but I work through lunch and instead of leaving at 4 leave at 430. I will ask her what she meant by her comments and what more she thinks/feels/expects me to be doing that is not being met to her specifications/satisfaction.

mlee116 · May 2014

K3am said:

Even before I had a child, I didn't consistently work late hours. In my mind, a full time position typically has an expectation of 40 hours a week. If you're consistently working longer than 40 hours a week, either you're not working efficiently, or your office is not staffed appropriately.

If you're not working efficiently, then that's a problem. If you're not staffed appropriately, how is that your problem?

This. I get that there are times I need to stay a little later to finish something up or take it home to work on it, but if its all the time, then there's a problem IMO.

I think your boss is an idiot for saying what she said. Not only is it rude, its discriminatory. I don't know, that kind of culture isn't one that I'd want to be a part of as a parent. I work hard and give my best when I'm at work, but my family is important and I need a work environment that respects that. Personally, I'd bring it up to HR but I'd probably start looking around for a job that is more family friendly.

welly01 · May 2014

*~Krystin1119~* said:

I'm not sure what more she would like me to do--we work 8-5, I'm here by 8, she strolls in around 9:30 and might stay until 8. I take 15-20 min lunch rather than 60 min and some days I work straight thru lunch. I take home work from a different department to do a few evenings a month because she wants to be doesn't want to. We have a sheet that we sign in/out everyday at the receptionist desk--receptionist informed me that boss asks if I sign in at 8 or if I'm just marking myself here early. Receptionist hates my boss, but wouldn't lie she notes that I'm always in by 8.

This pisses me off. Just because she is choosing to work later hours, she is seemingly upset that you do not match her hours. I've worked with people who prefer to work later in the day, but I prefer to start work earlier. 8-5 is a very reasonable, typical office schedule. I hope you're able to find something else soon, I would not want to work for someone like that.

ss265 · May 2014

*~Krystin1119~* said:

Thanks ladies! She said that I'm an exceptional employee who exceeds what is expected of me, but that I need to spend more time here (I'm assuming to help her with her work since she's too busy researching juvederm and face-lifts). Unfortunately, HR is her neighbor and going to her isn't any help. I have had nothing but compliments from our General Manager and was credited with helping us to receive a 15% bonus last year. I'm not sure what more she would like me to do--we work 8-5, I'm here by 8, she strolls in around 9:30 and might stay until 8. I take 15-20 min lunch rather than 60 min and some days I work straight thru lunch. I take home work from a different department to do a few evenings a month because she wants to be doesn't want to. We have a sheet that we sign in/out everyday at the receptionist desk--receptionist informed me that boss asks if I sign in at 8 or if I'm just marking myself here early. Receptionist hates my boss, but wouldn't lie she notes that I'm always in by 8. But bringing my child into anything seemed like she was just fishing for some reason to give for an issue on my review. I leave 30 min early Tuesday to take DD to dance class, but I work through lunch and instead of leaving at 4 leave at 430. I will ask her what she meant by her comments and what more she thinks/feels/expects me to be doing that is not being met to her specifications/satisfaction.

I would clarify what she means by "more time". It could be that she expects you to be there from 8-5pm regardless of whether you take a lunch or not. I typically work through lunch but where I work, working through lunch doesn't mean that you can leave an hour earlier. My manager doesn't keep track of whether I take a lunch or not so if I happen to leave earlier, he might just think that I am leaving early and not that I worked through lunch.

Given that you have to sign in when you get there (which to me is bizarre and super old school), it sounds like you just happen to work somewhere, where face time is important. I would start looking for another position and be up front during the interview process of the number of hours you are willing to work.

jasminelorraine20 · May 2014

I have a boss that has 3 children and still chooses to work later hours. I have 9 hours throughout the day to get everything done that needs to and therefore, I leave work on time to have ample QT with DS in the evenings. Unfortunately, there are those days that I have to miss because DS is sick or because DC is closed due to a stomach bug- but when I return to work I catch up on everything and then some. I still get those snarky remarks from my boss though and it pisses me off. I'm sorry that you received that kind of feedback. It is very frustrating.

*~Krystin1119~* · May 2014

ss265 said:

*~Krystin1119~* said:

Thanks ladies! She said that I'm an exceptional employee who exceeds what is expected of me, but that I need to spend more time here (I'm assuming to help her with her work since she's too busy researching juvederm and face-lifts). Unfortunately, HR is her neighbor and going to her isn't any help. I have had nothing but compliments from our General Manager and was credited with helping us to receive a 15% bonus last year. I'm not sure what more she would like me to do--we work 8-5, I'm here by 8, she strolls in around 9:30 and might stay until 8. I take 15-20 min lunch rather than 60 min and some days I work straight thru lunch. I take home work from a different department to do a few evenings a month because she wants to be doesn't want to. We have a sheet that we sign in/out everyday at the receptionist desk--receptionist informed me that boss asks if I sign in at 8 or if I'm just marking myself here early. Receptionist hates my boss, but wouldn't lie she notes that I'm always in by 8. But bringing my child into anything seemed like she was just fishing for some reason to give for an issue on my review. I leave 30 min early Tuesday to take DD to dance class, but I work through lunch and instead of leaving at 4 leave at 430. I will ask her what she meant by her comments and what more she thinks/feels/expects me to be doing that is not being met to her specifications/satisfaction.

I would clarify what she means by "more time". It could be that she expects you to be there from 8-5pm regardless of whether you take a lunch or not. I typically work through lunch but where I work, working through lunch doesn't mean that you can leave an hour earlier. My manager doesn't keep track of whether I take a lunch or not so if I happen to leave earlier, he might just think that I am leaving early and not that I worked through lunch.
Given that you have to sign in when you get there (which to me is bizarre and super old school), it sounds like you just happen to work somewhere, where face time is important. I would start looking for another position and be up front during the interview process of the number of hours you are willing to work.

Signing in is definitely odd, they say in case of an emergency, but I think they just want to track who comes in and when. Not sure what my boss' issue is. There is a gentlemen who comes in at 6 and leaves at 2. He admits that he doesn't work and just simply is here for a paycheck. I'm not like him. I come in, work, go home. But both he and my boss are salary and I'm hourly. As long as I'm clocking in my 40/week there shouldn't be any issues. Not more than 5 min ago I shipped out an order (I work in purchasing) that was 110lbs which had to leave today no matter what and she said what took so long...seriously? I have a copy of my review and all crazy emails in a folder at home, but I need to really start researching new companies and finding out their family policies.

molisar · May 2014

That is awful. I would find another job. Even if you bring it to your boss/HR, etc. - it'd be hard IMO to change your boss's true beliefs on this, leaving you in a crappy situation.

I'd recommend going on websites like Glassdoor.com or even google searching for best companies for working moms. They are totally out there. I work for a great company that has never, ever, questioned my hours.

MommaP12 · May 2014

Time to start looking for a new job because it sounds like she has some sort of vendetta against you between asking the receptionist if you're lying, using the child card against you, etc. That is really awful and I'm sorry you're dealing with it.

QueSrah · May 2014

I am also hourly, and also work 8-5. My boss comes in around the same time as I do and stays until 6:30 or 7 most nights. And he doesn't blink an eye that I work my 8 hours every day and then leave. I'm sure he wouldn't want to pay me overtime to work his hours, but he's also able to see that I'm usually here before him and that I stay late on occasion if I need to address something that's happening late in the day.

It sounds like your boss's issue is lack of trust - that you're working for that time in the morning before she shows up. I've seen that with my boss (who has issues with teleworkers because one person openly used her work from home day to do personal stuff over TEN YEARS AGO). So the guy who strolls in at 6 to collect his paycheck might be on your boss's radar and making her question your work as well, as unfair as that is. But I don't think bosses everywhere are like that. Next time this comes up, you could ask her whether she wants you working overtime every day to stay late with her because you're there working at 8. Or whether she has a problem with your 8-5 hours, even though those are the office's normal hours.

*~Krystin1119~* · May 2014

PrivacyWanted said:

Wait...you're hourly and she wants you staying late?
Is there an overtime policy in place? Does she want you to change your hours to reflect hers? I would be asking for clarification here

We have an overtime policy, but the way it is written, it only applies to hourly employees who work in manufacturing, not the rest of the hourly staff. Not sure if she wants me more on her schedule or if she just wants me here earlier/later. She lives 10 min away while I live 20 miles away excluding the miles to daycare to pick/drop off DD. Gas is too high to be running back/forth. It's bad enough if you do overtime that it is on the next check since we're paid monthly. I'm not doing overtime to see it nearly 2 months from when I did it.

Meeshe · May 2014

Just because your overtime policy is written in a way that "only applies" to manufacturing doesn't mean that it's legal to do that. The Department of Labor has very specific rules about who is excluded from overtime, may times are hourly people qualify for overtime pay. You should look at the rules for your state. They could get into major fines and penalties if they are failing to pay overtime appropriately. I would also document anything she says about how your having a child means your less good employee. Not sure that's a protected category per se (your state laws would probably have to dictate) but you could make an argument that it violates marital status and gender laws at a minimum.

*~Krystin1119~* · May 2014

I will look into the state laws and international as well since our company is owned by a company in the UK. If I'm going to try to beat her at her own game, I better have all my bases covered. Our Plant Manager set up for employees from different departments to play board games...a kind of bridging departments and she flipped out on me after a game...my mom has NEVER screamed at me like that and I definitely did some stuff back in high school that probably warranted it. She actually waited until after the GM left to scream in front of half our company.

I try to send her emails as close to 8 as possible as she likes to send emails at 11pm for myself and engineering to do first thing in the morning. She is a severe micromanager, but just with me. She sent the other lady in our department and I to a conference and I swear I had about 5 missed texts from her, the other woman didn't have any. I get that I'd been out all week with the stomach flu and maybe she thought I didn't go, but wouldn't she have just asked the other lady if we met up since we were carpooling?

mae0111 · May 2014

I may be wrong, but aren't there state laws regarding the payment of overtime for nonexempt employees? I'm pretty sure there are in MA - it's not up to the company.

OP - I'm sorry that you're going through this. This is NOT the norm. Find something else as soon as you can.

*~Krystin1119~* · May 2014

ClaryPax said:

It sounds like that she knows that she doesn't have to pay you overtime, so she wants you to work longer hours because she doesn't have to worry about overtime. Just because you skip lunch in most places doesn't mean you can leave early, so there is that. It also sounds like she is mad about the leaving early on Tuesdays thing- are you putting PTO in for that or is it just flextime? If it just flextime, maybe you can start using PTO for that so you don't have to make it up elsewhere. I think working 8-6 is really enough hours, so I don't get her being mad at you by leaving at 6. I think it is more that she wants you there until she leaves just because- but that she is being unreasonable in that.
I would definitely start sending her e-mails at 8 am- ha I am here. I would also stop taking work home, since she said the problem is that you aren't at the office, then I feel like the work you take home is not being appreciated because she doesn't actually see you do it. Ditto for showing up at 8, since she doesn't see you doing the work/ being here at 8 am then she doesn't count it. If you do work from home. I would send her an e-mail right after you finished with your work stating that you worked 2 hours from 8pm-10pm at home doing XYZ and here is your work that you finished, please see the attached document. I might also start doing that every day from 8 am-10 am I worked on XYZ etc. Over communicating (don't be passive aggressive) is not a bad thing in the case of micro managing non trusting bosses.
Is your company large enough for a time clock or sign in software? We use Time Force, and it is allows you to punch in and out. You might suggest that to HR for those people that aren't trusting their employees enough for the sign in sheet. I don't think a sign in software is necessarily a bad thing, and it may even help them with payroll- so don't think of it as a solving her obvious trust issues, but also of solving an operational problem.

ETA- no this is not normal at all. My boss is great. I changed my hours because of the kids, and he would prefer that I work 1 evening a week but I can't because of DH's job, so my boss is good with it for now. If things change I will definitely go back to the 1 evening a week, but when DH travels there is no one to watch the kids.

I'm using flex-time for leaving 30 min early Tuesdays. I also cleared it with the Plant manager who is her boss and HR just to make sure I wasn't overstepping. They're fine with it, but they are also parents and leave for things for their kids.

shannm · May 2014

Whether this thought is normal or not depends on the specific employer. Where I work now, if a manager said that, it would be grounds to fire said manager. That attitude, while people may feel that way, is very frowned upon.

VegasGal1978 · May 2014

She has no right to say what she said. Your family life is not having a negative impact in your job performance. If your hours are set to a certain schedule than that is what you should be responsible for working. You shouldn't be penalized for not working more. Sorry you are dealing with this.

*~Krystin1119~* · May 2014

Thank you ladies so much! I talked to DH last night and since I don't feel comfortable going to our in-house HR I will be contacting HR's boss. I don't think that my family should have been any factor in my review, she had no right to insinuate that only employees without families are harder working. I do my job, a portion of her's and another employee's in another department whom are both salary while I am hourly and not being properly compensated and yet I'm told I'm being penalized for having a child. I hope it doesn't take me a long time to find a new job cuz now I'm very uncomfortable being at work. I have never felt like I needed to watch/document every word and action at a job until now.

kmh2201 · May 2014

OP- You are doing the right thing by reporting it. I've had this happen to me (I was told by a former manager (former employer) during a performance evaluation, while I was pregnant, that I really needed to decide if work or family was my priority, with the insinuation that if family was my priority, I wouldn't be moving up and may be moving out), and I wish I would have submitted an EEOC claim. (There was a similar pattern for this manager with other PG moms.) She went unpunished for completely illegal activity, and even more shame on her because not only was she an HR manager, but a mom of young kids also. Would love to hear an update after you meet with HR's boss.

cecilyandgautam · May 2014

When HR gets back to you, can you ask them what approvals are required for overtime hours? Where I work, overtime needs to be approved & documented ahead of time. I can't just announce that I'm staying late and my boss can only ask me to stay late by requesting it in writing, and therefore documenting, her approval. So, your company probably has a process in place because overtime work is expensive - they don't want just anyone deciding to stay late & get paid 50% more. Find out what your company's policy on this is.

That way, if/when you have a follow up conversation with your boss, you can seek clarification on exactly what she meant by you should work "more" and if she says you need to put in more hours, you can say "ah, okay, here's the approval form for that," making it clear that your time will be documented and you're not going to stay late off the books.

Mustardseed2007 · May 2014

mae0111 said:

I may be wrong, but aren't there state laws regarding the payment of overtime for nonexempt employees? I'm pretty sure there are in MA - it's not up to the company.

OP - I'm sorry that you're going through this. This is NOT the norm. Find something else as soon as you can.

Actually there is a federal law-the FLSA. Yes there may also be even more employee friendly state laws but at minimum federal law would require that you be paid for working at home and that you be paid overtime for hours that you work over 40. Failing to follow the FLSA can definitely be a "bet the company mistake" if you do it for enough employees.

skibunny59 · May 2014

kmh2201 said:

OP- You are doing the right thing by reporting it. I've had this happen to me (I was told by a former manager (former employer) during a performance evaluation, while I was pregnant, that I really needed to decide if work or family was my priority, with the insinuation that if family was my priority, I wouldn't be moving up and may be moving out), and I wish I would have submitted an EEOC claim. (There was a similar pattern for this manager with other PG moms.) She went unpunished for completely illegal activity, and even more shame on her because not only was she an HR manager, but a mom of young kids also. Would love to hear an update after you meet with HR's boss.

Wow! This is awful.

*~Krystin1119~* · May 2014

I finally just got a reply from the US HR director. I have to submit any issues/documentation regarding my boss. She assured me that my boss was out of line and sent me a new employee handbook for this year directly to my house with sticky tabs on what is/is not allowed to be said to an employee.

I just hope something comes out of this and I don't lose my job until I find a new one.

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