Interesting Read...

Virgo17 · April 2014

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/grown-and-flown/why-i-regret-being-a-stay-at-home-mom_b_3402691.html?utm_hp_ref=fb&src=sp&comm_ref=false

Thoughts?

mlee116 · April 2014

I've read this too. I think she sounds bitter and unhappy with her life in general and is blaming it on her decision to SAH. I don't think this is truly reflective at all of SAHMs. You should read this article in response to hers:

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/jamie-davis-smith/why-i-dont-regret-being-a-stay-at-home-mom_b_3849263.html

Virgo17 · April 2014

mlee116 said:

I've read this too. I think she sounds bitter and unhappy with her life in general and is blaming it on her decision to SAH. I don't think this is truly reflective at all of SAHMs. You should read this article in response to hers:

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/jamie-davis-smith/why-i-dont-regret-being-a-stay-at-home-mom_b_3849263.html

What a great response! It truly is about each woman making the best choice for her and her family.

mlee116 · April 2014

LibraryChica said:

I think it's really strange that some people are just so hell bent on assuming SAHMs or WM who otherwise scale back are going to have the regrets or find themselves so screwed someday.

Frankly, working 60 hours a week sounds hellish to me. I definitely didn't have kids to work 60 hours a week. That's not how I am wired. No amount of money or recognition is worth that to me. But I can easily wrap my head around how it is fulfilling for lots of parents, and don't assume they will eventually regret their decision to work so much. It's the same thing with staying at home.
Oh, come on. I work regular hours and I can't count the number of times I've heard, "you'll never get these years back!" And "no one ever put, 'I wish I'd spent more time at work' on their headstone, har de har." Heck, the second writer said she made her decision when she realized she couldn't get the early years back , which def implies the potential for regret. What I don't get is why the woman who has regrets and points out the trade offs of her decision in hindsight (and I know people like her, IRL, so I don't think she's alone) has her experience dismissed as abnormal and blamed on her personal issues and the woman who is content with her decision is seen as the only "legitimate" view.

I think its because she decided to SAH for many years being unhappy and then wrote a long article about how much she regretted it instead of making changes along the way.

MommyAtty · April 2014

I don't know a single woman with potential for a true career (not just a job) who chose to stay at home who doesn't regret the decision. I know one who mommy-tracked who is okay with her decision. And every one who quit to stay at home is having a nearly impossible time returning to the workforce because they can't get hired. To be perfectly honest, twice with attorneys I've hired SAHMs returning to the workforce. I won't do it again. Neither one worked out, for exactly the same reasons. They couldn't balance work with outside of work life and had husbands who were utterly useless as co-parents. They also micromanaged their daycare, which meant every time I tried to speak with them, they were on the phone saying things like, "Make sure there isn't too much jelly on Marin's bread or she will make a mess." (Not things like, "Remember Marin is allergic to peanut butter and her epipen is in the diaper bag," which I totally would have understood.). So when friends who are trying to re-enter the workforce complain about how hard it is, I have a really hard time answering them.

MommyAtty · April 2014

Actually not discriminatory. I would not hire a SAHD either. Or anyone who takes years off a career on purpose. I just don't think it's likely a person can do that and then return to the workforce with the kind of focus you need to have on your job.

I concur flexibility is vital for all working parents, and I pity people whose jobs don't allow for it. (And I give my people a ton of flexibility and work hard inside my company for programs that help employees achieve balance.)

I work a lot of hours. And it's hard. But I can choose my hours so that I also have a lot of time for my family. Evenings from the time I get home until DD is in bed and weekends are ours. Occasionally something pops up, but mostly it works for us. Would I like more time with my family? Sure. I would also like more time to accomplish things at work and more time to exercise and more time to watch bad television. Hell, I just want more time.

CarrieB. · April 2014

I work in finance and our company actually has a program to recruit women who left finance to stay home with young children to come back to the workforce. I really like working for a very large global company that has it's priorities in order.

One of my colleagues stayed home for a few years with her daughter and she's one of the hardest working, creative awesome people I know.

I don't see what's the point of always starting these mommy wars.

*sparky* · April 2014

I have also read this article before. I have a hard time believing that as smart as I am guessing she is with the educational background and job experience she had, that she really did not consider any of these things when she made the decision to drop out of the work force or at any point along the way. I mean, it doesn't take a genius to figure out that if you don't work for a couple of decades it will impact your life in a major way, and that as some point your kids will be out of the house.

I also think that as you are making these decisions, you have to know yourself and in some cases be creative about how to move forward with your personal and professional life. I have friends who have degrees, and had careers but are happy to never think about working again and other friends who dropped out for a while but knew they would want to return to the workforce at some point and so they did what they could to keep themselves current and in touch with the professional world.

I also think that if this woman is smart and resourceful she can find something to do with herself now that her kids are grown. Maybe not in the high-powered job she was in before, and it may take a little while, but surely there is something out there for her.

I have hired people that are re-entering the workforce after a period of time and it has worked out fine. But I do agree with a PPs comment that the spouse of the SAHP often loses the ability to co-parent or co-manage the HH responsibilities when the SAHP has taken care of it for a time. I have seen this with friends and also with my own DH, as I have been working PT while he is OOT a lot. Then when he is home, he literally does not know what to do to help out.

He has had to get better with this lately, as my PG has progressed and I was completely exhausted, but it was a rough realization for both of us that he really had become uninvolved in the day-to-day stuff. So I think it can be hard to transition back, for both spouses.

I do feel bad for the author of the article somewhat, as she seems lost and unhappy with her life, but I also give her responsibility for letting things get to this point.

MommyAtty · April 2014

Kimbus22 said:

MommyAtty said:

Actually not discriminatory. I would not hire a SAHD either. Or anyone who takes years off a career on purpose. I just don't think it's likely a person can do that and then return to the workforce with the kind of focus you need to have on your job.
How exactly is it not discriminatory to disregard entire groups of applicants because they made a different decision than you did when it came to family and work? You're refusing to hire presumably qualified applicants because of your assumptions about their life decisions. Would you refuse to hire military veterans? They can have trouble reentering the workforce too.

There is a legal definition of "discriminatory." I can "discriminate" based on what school you went to, or whether you practiced in the areas where I think we need help, or how you answered a stupid question like what kind of tree would you be, or, yes, what career decisions you've made. I can discriminate based on the fact that you job-hopped or stayed in the same job too long. Any time you choose one applicant over another, you are "discriminating" between the applicants. But it's not legally discriminatory. I would, btw, hire veterans. I've done that too, and it's worked well. I have not had good experiences with people who purposely opt out of the workforce and then decide to get back in. If I see others successfully hire people who fit in that category, I might reconsider, but so far every lawyer I've seen take that chance on someone has regretted it. And it's harder to get rid of a crappy employee than it is just to not hire an applicant. (I will say if they had taken off time and already re-entered the workforce and proven themselves, I would consider them. But I don't have time to re-acclimate a re-entering employee.)

*sparky* · April 2014

@KimBus22 - What @MommyAtty is describing is not discriminatory - it is a hiring decision that she is legally able to make. Phasing in and out of the work force is easier in some professions than others and if, in your profession, you have decided it doesn't work to hire people who have been out of work for a period of time (for whatever reason) that is perfectly reasonable.

I am not an attorney, but I understand it to be generally a pretty demanding profession and can understand that it would be difficult for someone to come back in after years of not having a grueling schedule like that.

Similarly, you can decide not to hire someone for not having enough relevant experience, not having enough years of experience, etc.

skibunny59 · April 2014

LibraryChica said:

My mom SAH and never once have I thought that she did nothing or wasn't working
Eh. My mom was mostly a SAHM, working occasionally as the family needed, and I guess now she's retired, but as a child I often thought she "wasn't working." I actually told people she was a secretary because I was embarrassed in the 2nd grade. Obviously I am an adult now and can see that she worked hard to care for us and that there were challenges for her, but it's not an unusual thought for kids to have. I don't see this as degrading to SAHMs. Many of these issues -- social isolation, loss of sense of self, loss of career skills, marital changes -- can happen to parents, generally, but do happen even more to SAHMs. Pretending otherwise would be more degrading, I think. This woman has regrets and is kind of bitter sounding, but she's in a rough place right now. As for the rebuttal, that woman still has young kids and she has done things that the original author advocates -- namely kept up with her field. I would be interested in her perspective in another decade or so.

I had to chuckle at the bolded a little. My mom always worked (she was a teacher) so I can't speak from my own experience but as far as my students in school, if I ever ask them in conversation "What does mommy do?" or anything similar they often say "Oh. She doesn't do anything." To which I reply "Well, she probably does do a lot of things. You just mean she doesn't work outside the home."

skibunny59 · April 2014

skibunny59 said:

LibraryChica said:

My mom SAH and never once have I thought that she did nothing or wasn't working
Eh. My mom was mostly a SAHM, working occasionally as the family needed, and I guess now she's retired, but as a child I often thought she "wasn't working." I actually told people she was a secretary because I was embarrassed in the 2nd grade. Obviously I am an adult now and can see that she worked hard to care for us and that there were challenges for her, but it's not an unusual thought for kids to have. I don't see this as degrading to SAHMs. Many of these issues -- social isolation, loss of sense of self, loss of career skills, marital changes -- can happen to parents, generally, but do happen even more to SAHMs. Pretending otherwise would be more degrading, I think. This woman has regrets and is kind of bitter sounding, but she's in a rough place right now. As for the rebuttal, that woman still has young kids and she has done things that the original author advocates -- namely kept up with her field. I would be interested in her perspective in another decade or so.

I had to chuckle at the bolded a little. My mom always worked (she was a teacher) so I can't speak from my own experience but as far as my students in school, if I ever ask them in conversation "What does mommy do?" or anything similar they often say "Oh. She doesn't do anything." To which I reply "Well, she probably does do a lot of things. You just mean she doesn't work outside the home."

I also wanted to add that even though I would love to stay at home and not work at least my daughter will never say that I don't do anything.

skibunny59 · April 2014

MommyAtty said:

Actually not discriminatory. I would not hire a SAHD either. Or anyone who takes years off a career on purpose. I just don't think it's likely a person can do that and then return to the workforce with the kind of focus you need to have on your job. I concur flexibility is vital for all working parents, and I pity people whose jobs don't allow for it. (And I give my people a ton of flexibility and work hard inside my company for programs that help employees achieve balance.) I work a lot of hours. And it's hard. But I can choose my hours so that I also have a lot of time for my family. Evenings from the time I get home until DD is in bed and weekends are ours. Occasionally something pops up, but mostly it works for us. Would I like more time with my family? Sure. I would also like more time to accomplish things at work and more time to exercise and more time to watch bad television. Hell, I just want more time.

MommyAtty said:

Actually not discriminatory. I would not hire a SAHD either. Or anyone who takes years off a career on purpose. I just don't think it's likely a person can do that and then return to the workforce with the kind of focus you need to have on your job. I concur flexibility is vital for all working parents, and I pity people whose jobs don't allow for it. (And I give my people a ton of flexibility and work hard inside my company for programs that help employees achieve balance.) I work a lot of hours. And it's hard. But I can choose my hours so that I also have a lot of time for my family. Evenings from the time I get home until DD is in bed and weekends are ours. Occasionally something pops up, but mostly it works for us. Would I like more time with my family? Sure. I would also like more time to accomplish things at work and more time to exercise and more time to watch bad television. Hell, I just want more time.

I just think parents (moms mostly) aren't focused at work after having kids. I haven't felt 100% focused at work since being a mom. I think that's natural and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Sorry, but once you have a child and a family that becomes more important than your job. I get my job done just fine. Do I go above and beyond? No way.

emberlee3 · April 2014

skibunny59 said:

MommyAtty said:

Actually not discriminatory. I would not hire a SAHD either. Or anyone who takes years off a career on purpose. I just don't think it's likely a person can do that and then return to the workforce with the kind of focus you need to have on your job. I concur flexibility is vital for all working parents, and I pity people whose jobs don't allow for it. (And I give my people a ton of flexibility and work hard inside my company for programs that help employees achieve balance.) I work a lot of hours. And it's hard. But I can choose my hours so that I also have a lot of time for my family. Evenings from the time I get home until DD is in bed and weekends are ours. Occasionally something pops up, but mostly it works for us. Would I like more time with my family? Sure. I would also like more time to accomplish things at work and more time to exercise and more time to watch bad television. Hell, I just want more time.

MommyAtty said:

Actually not discriminatory. I would not hire a SAHD either. Or anyone who takes years off a career on purpose. I just don't think it's likely a person can do that and then return to the workforce with the kind of focus you need to have on your job. I concur flexibility is vital for all working parents, and I pity people whose jobs don't allow for it. (And I give my people a ton of flexibility and work hard inside my company for programs that help employees achieve balance.) I work a lot of hours. And it's hard. But I can choose my hours so that I also have a lot of time for my family. Evenings from the time I get home until DD is in bed and weekends are ours. Occasionally something pops up, but mostly it works for us. Would I like more time with my family? Sure. I would also like more time to accomplish things at work and more time to exercise and more time to watch bad television. Hell, I just want more time.

MommyAtty said:

Actually not discriminatory. I would not hire a SAHD either. Or anyone who takes years off a career on purpose. I just don't think it's likely a person can do that and then return to the workforce with the kind of focus you need to have on your job. I concur flexibility is vital for all working parents, and I pity people whose jobs don't allow for it. (And I give my people a ton of flexibility and work hard inside my company for programs that help employees achieve balance.) I work a lot of hours. And it's hard. But I can choose my hours so that I also have a lot of time for my family. Evenings from the time I get home until DD is in bed and weekends are ours. Occasionally something pops up, but mostly it works for us. Would I like more time with my family? Sure. I would also like more time to accomplish things at work and more time to exercise and more time to watch bad television. Hell, I just want more time.

I just think parents (moms mostly) aren't focused at work after having kids. I haven't felt 100% focused at work since being a mom. I think that's natural and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Sorry, but once you have a child and a family that becomes more important than your job. I get my job done just fine. Do I go above and beyond? No way.

As a blanket statement, I think this is completely wrong. There are plenty of women in high-risk jobs where we are definitely not phoning it in.

emberlee3 · April 2014

amy052006 said:

I would also argue that The Bump can take focus away from your job too.

True and, for the record, I am non-clinical today, so no lives are at stake while I Bump.

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