The Bump in real life...

notkateanymore · March 2014

Thought of y'all...had to post.

My best friend just texted me. Her son has Market Day at school today {where you bring/make something to sell to your classmates and they learn profit, etc.} and somebody brought FISH! Her son bought one!

notkateanymore · March 2014

Our other friend thought she meant baked fish too!

Nope, a guppy.

Cherryblossoms07 · March 2014

I Heart The 80s said:
LOL!
At first I thought it was like food…baked fish…that he bought. That disturbed me. But now I realize you are referring to actual living fish. Still upsetting.

I was thinking food at first too. I can see my kids buying one and I would not have been happy.

bhuffman · March 2014

Is your friend ticked?

notkateanymore · March 2014

She's livid. She returned it to the parents mailbox this afternoon.

Don't worry, she called and let them know she was dropping it off, no roasted guppy.

rosesandpetals · March 2014

I'm surprised people would be so mad. Guppies don't usually live for that long. And even if they did, they're not that much work. I guess I would be annoyed but not "livid".

bhuffman · March 2014

I'm surprised the school allowed it. It may not be as hot button topic in real life as it is here.

Mrs.Hizzo · March 2014

I'll bet you anything that kid's parents were dumb enough to get a male and a female and are now up to their ears in baby guppies. They probably thought this was a perfect way to get rid of them.

AimeeL85 · March 2014

roses&65335678 said:

I'm surprised people would be so mad. Guppies don't usually live for that long. And even if they did, they're not that much work. I guess I would be annoyed but not "livid".

Yeah but unless it came with whatever bowl and food it needs, I'd be annoyed, because I'd have to run right out and get that stuff.

rosesandpetals · March 2014

NandaB said:

uh-oh. Roses is the Hav of this discussion this time around.

I didn't know it was previously hashed out and flamed. I back pedal. They are assholes! Inconsiderate! Call the school! Call PETA!

bhuffman · March 2014

Fish today, puppies tomorrow...

rosesandpetals · March 2014

gwapes said:

bu bu bubble, gu gu guppies

bubble bubble bubble, guppy guppy guppy

Now it is stuck in my head.

zbeesma86 · March 2014

gwapes said:

bu bu bubble, gu gu guppies

Z started watching that this week!

notkateanymore · March 2014

I have no idea how the school allowed it but since you don't have to get approval, I assume the kid/parents sprung it on the teacher this AM.

jensriot · March 2014

hls19 said:

gwapes said:

bu bu bubble, gu gu guppies

Z started watching that this week!

Have you seen the version of Lady Gaga's Poker Face, but Pencil Case? So cute.

raraavis28 · March 2014

This reminds me of when my little sister went to a carnival w/ her friend and brought home a goldfish she won when she was 6. That thing lived for like 3 years....and then when it died my mom bought my sister a hamster. :-p

bhuffman · March 2014

Oh no! DO NOT blame the teacher ...!!!!

rosesandpetals · March 2014

Hav=Fath said:

bhuffman said:

Oh no! DO NOT blame the teacher ...!!!!

Are you a teacher? Would you send a pet home with a child without talking to the parent?!

I would have. And I would have forwarded 'll angry emails and voicemails to the parent responsible. springing it at the last second, what was she supposed to do? Not have the kid participate when everyone else was?

bhuffman · March 2014

I'm a former teacher. I used to teach middle and high school English. I get so tired when a parent makes a stupid decision and the teacher becomes responsible for managing the parent's misbehavior too.

ariel06 · March 2014

Two issues with this:

1. As a parent, why would you do this? It's creative, but why wouldn't you see the potential problems with this.

2. I'm surprised the teacher wouldn't have asked the kids what they were planning on selling ahead of time.

rosesandpetals · March 2014

Have what should she have done, kept them all herself? Because all the parents would have s aid no. What if the original parents never came back for them?

bumpuser924057 · March 2014

bhuffman said:

I'm a former teacher. I used to teach middle and high school English. I get so tired when a parent makes a stupid decision and the teacher becomes responsible for managing the parent's misbehavior too.

I agree to a point, BUT I think the teacher shares some of the blame if she didn't give clear guidelines for what was and wasn't acceptable to sell at school. If it was an assignment that the kids had to complete, then I would assume there had to be a list of what's not allowed (and live animals really should be on it!) and if there wasn't, then I bet you there will be one next time.

bhuffman · March 2014

roses&65335678 said:
Have what should she have done, kept them all herself? Because all the parents would have s aid no. What if the original parents never came back for them?

No, she should have used her planning time to call and check... (Sarcasm)

bhuffman · March 2014

thecheshirekat said:

bhuffman said:

I'm a former teacher. I used to teach middle and high school English. I get so tired when a parent makes a stupid decision and the teacher becomes responsible for managing the parent's misbehavior too.

I agree to a point, BUT I think the teacher shares some of the blame if she didn't give clear guidelines for what was and wasn't acceptable to sell at school. If it was an assignment that the kids had to complete, then I would assume there had to be a list of what's not allowed (and live animals really should be on it!) and if there wasn't, then I bet you there will be one next time.

True, but what if fish are allowed ? Maybe this teacher didn't create this lesson. It seemed like a big event , possibly grade wide. Sometimes teachers have to do activities that the school has allowed in the past. I just don't think jumping on the Teacher Is At Fault bandwagon is fair.

rosesandpetals · March 2014

Hav=Fath said:

bhuffman said:

Have what should she have done, kept them all herself? Because all the parents would have s aid no. What if the original parents never came back for them?
No, she should have used her planning time to call and check... (Sarcasm)

No, I think she would have sent the fish back home with the kid that brought it. Or called his mom and told her to come pick it up and bring something to school that wasn't alive!

I'm not saying the teacher deserves to be fired, just that I'm surprised she sent a live animal home with a kid in elementary school.

Let me tell.you.from.experience that y out cannot.imagine the bitching that would happen if she called the parents and told them to bring in something else. I'm busy, we brought something in, son never said you said no pets, I don't have tell just have him not participate, and that's if they answered at all.

rosesandpetals · March 2014

thecheshirekat said:

bhuffman said:

I'm a former teacher. I used to teach middle and high school English. I get so tired when a parent makes a stupid decision and the teacher becomes responsible for managing the parent's misbehavior too.

I agree to a point, BUT I think the teacher shares some of the blame if she didn't give clear guidelines for what was and wasn't acceptable to sell at school. If it was an assignment that the kids had to complete, then I would assume there had to be a list of what's not allowed (and live animals really should be on it!) and if there wasn't, then I bet you there will be one next time.

When have all of your students ever followed the guidelines? I've given out lists before. A student has a severe strawberry allergy, no strawberry snacks. The party rolls around and at least one parent shows up with a strawberry snack. Oh I forgot, I didn't see that, it is all we had, etc. I really don't tho k this is the teachers fault.

bhuffman · March 2014

Hav...I get what you are saying about being surprised, but I think Kate's friend handled it best by returning it to the parents who sent it in the first place; not calling the teacher and complaining to her.

bumpuser924057 · March 2014

bhuffman said:

bhuffman said:

I'm a former teacher. I used to teach middle and high school English. I get so tired when a parent makes a stupid decision and the teacher becomes responsible for managing the parent's misbehavior too.

I agree to a point, BUT I think the teacher shares some of the blame if she didn't give clear guidelines for what was and wasn't acceptable to sell at school. If it was an assignment that the kids had to complete, then I would assume there had to be a list of what's not allowed (and live animals really should be on it!) and if there wasn't, then I bet you there will be one next time.
True, but what if fish are allowed ? Maybe this teacher didn't create this lesson. It seemed like a big event , possibly grade wide. Sometimes teachers have to do activities that the school has allowed in the past. I just don't think jumping on the Teacher Is At Fault bandwagon is fair.

Believe me, I am never one to jump on that bandwagon; I'm a former teacher too, I completely get it. Here's where I am on it: if the assignment was given without any guidelines on what you can and can't sell, or if the list doesn't say anything about animals or fish, then I don't think the teacher is within her rights to tell the kid "no, you can't sell those," or call the parent and tell them to bring something else, or drop the kid's grade on the assignment, or anything like that. As much as I would think it's a terrible idea to send those fish home, if it were me and those were the circumstances, I would go ahead and do it, and in the future there would be more clear restrictions added to the list, or there would be a list in the first place.

bhuffman · March 2014

LalaMama81 said:

roses&65335678 said:

thecheshirekat said:

bhuffman said:

I'm a former teacher. I used to teach middle and high school English. I get so tired when a parent makes a stupid decision and the teacher becomes responsible for managing the parent's misbehavior too.

I agree to a point, BUT I think the teacher shares some of the blame if she didn't give clear guidelines for what was and wasn't acceptable to sell at school. If it was an assignment that the kids had to complete, then I would assume there had to be a list of what's not allowed (and live animals really should be on it!) and if there wasn't, then I bet you there will be one next time.

When have all of your students ever followed the guidelines? I've given out lists before. A student has a severe strawberry allergy, no strawberry snacks. The party rolls around and at least one parent shows up with a strawberry snack. Oh I forgot, I didn't see that, it is all we had, etc. I really don't tho k this is the teachers fault.

Yea but in that case it doesn't get served. To me it would be the same thing w/ the fish if it was in the guidelines. It's not the teacher's fault that the parents/student didn't follow directions, but they do have to enforce an existing rule, right?

Obviously, if there wasn't a no living animal stipulation, things are a lot stickier. But at the end of the of the day, if my kid came home w/ a fish that they got at school, I would expect it to be handle through the school, not just given the number of the parent who sent them in.

I agree that I hope the school didn't give the parent the address of the parents who sent in the fish. I assumed it was small town and the parents on both sides of the issue knew one another.

bumpuser924057 · March 2014

roses&65335678 said:

thecheshirekat said:

bhuffman said:

I'm a former teacher. I used to teach middle and high school English. I get so tired when a parent makes a stupid decision and the teacher becomes responsible for managing the parent's misbehavior too.

I agree to a point, BUT I think the teacher shares some of the blame if she didn't give clear guidelines for what was and wasn't acceptable to sell at school. If it was an assignment that the kids had to complete, then I would assume there had to be a list of what's not allowed (and live animals really should be on it!) and if there wasn't, then I bet you there will be one next time.

When have all of your students ever followed the guidelines? I've given out lists before. A student has a severe strawberry allergy, no strawberry snacks. The party rolls around and at least one parent shows up with a strawberry snack. Oh I forgot, I didn't see that, it is all we had, etc. I really don't tho k this is the teachers fault.

If the guidelines were there and the kid/parent didn't follow them, then yeah, that kid doesn't participate. If you bring a snack that doesn't follow the guidelines, then the snack isn't given out. That's how I would have done it in my classroom and how I would expect a teacher to handle it if I screwed up as a parent and didn't follow the rules.

rosesandpetals · March 2014

thecheshirekat said:

If the guidelines were there and the kid/parent didn't follow them, then yeah, that kid doesn't participate. If you bring a snack that doesn't follow the guidelines, then the snack isn't given out. That's how I would have done it in my classroom and how I would expect a teacher to handle it if I screwed up as a parent and didn't follow the rules.

Eh, I wouldn't have let one kid sit out by himself while all his friends are having fun and learning just because his parents are morons. I would have sent the fish home. But honestly, we're talking about a fish here... I still don't think it is that big of a deal. It's not a puppy. Put it in a bowl and throw it some food every once in awhile. It would probably take more work to bring it back to the school/parents.

bhuffman · March 2014

feffy11 said:
I'll bet there is a school-wide rule that prohibits animals being brought in, ever. The teacher probably could/should have pointed to that and said "sorry, school rules."

I wouldn't assume that. We have days where dogs are brought in for reading pals. The guidance counselor has a therapy dog. I mean, you'd hope there were rules, but you never know. Plus, fish have been at school carnivals since at least the 80's when I won one.

rosesandpetals · March 2014

LalaMama81 said:

roses&65335678 said:

thecheshirekat said:

If the guidelines were there and the kid/parent didn't follow them, then yeah, that kid doesn't participate. If you bring a snack that doesn't follow the guidelines, then the snack isn't given out. That's how I would have done it in my classroom and how I would expect a teacher to handle it if I screwed up as a parent and didn't follow the rules.

Eh, I wouldn't have let one kid sit out by himself while all his friends are having fun and learning just because his parents are morons. I would have sent the fish home. But honestly, we're talking about a fish here... I still don't think it is that big of a deal. It's not a puppy. Put it in a bowl and throw it some food every once in awhile. It would probably take more work to bring it back to the school/parents.

I am not a fish expert by any means, but those that were knowledgeable posted about how it wasn't just that easy to properly care for a fish.

It is a big deal. If I wanted a pet, we'd get one. If DD got one at school, I'd be pretty irate.

It depends what kind of fish it is, but I had a beta fish for years. It sat in a fish bowl with tap water and I put food from a little jar in once a day. The food was like $6 and it lasted awhile. It took apx 3 seconds.

It was a stupid idea but I really think people are overreacting.

rosesandpetals · March 2014

bhuffman said:

I'll bet there is a school-wide rule that prohibits animals being brought in, ever. The teacher probably could/should have pointed to that and said "sorry, school rules."
I wouldn't assume that. We have days where dogs are brought in for reading pals. The guidance counselor has a therapy dog. I mean, you'd hope there were rules, but you never know. Plus, fish have been at school carnivals since at least the 80's when I won one.

I've never seen a rule like that. A lot of classes have classroom pets.

bumpuser924057 · March 2014

roses&65335678 said:

thecheshirekat said:

If the guidelines were there and the kid/parent didn't follow them, then yeah, that kid doesn't participate. If you bring a snack that doesn't follow the guidelines, then the snack isn't given out. That's how I would have done it in my classroom and how I would expect a teacher to handle it if I screwed up as a parent and didn't follow the rules.

Eh, I wouldn't have let one kid sit out by himself while all his friends are having fun and learning just because his parents are morons. I would have sent the fish home. But honestly, we're talking about a fish here... I still don't think it is that big of a deal. It's not a puppy. Put it in a bowl and throw it some food every once in awhile. It would probably take more work to bring it back to the school/parents.

Ok, so to extend this line of thinking further...

It's a peanut-free school. One kid makes peanut butter cookies to sell. You still let him participate?

One kid brings those mini-Sharpies to sell. Permanent markers aren't allowed at school. Can she sell them?

Kid thought it was a brilliant idea to grab a pill bottle out of his parents medicine cabinet and sell those. Turns out they're just vitamins, nothing harmful, but clearly unacceptable regardless. Can he still participate?

Just wondering where you draw the line when someone is breaking the rules.

rosesandpetals · March 2014

thecheshirekat said:

roses&65335678 said:

thecheshirekat said:

If the guidelines were there and the kid/parent didn't follow them, then yeah, that kid doesn't participate. If you bring a snack that doesn't follow the guidelines, then the snack isn't given out. That's how I would have done it in my classroom and how I would expect a teacher to handle it if I screwed up as a parent and didn't follow the rules.

Eh, I wouldn't have let one kid sit out by himself while all his friends are having fun and learning just because his parents are morons. I would have sent the fish home. But honestly, we're talking about a fish here... I still don't think it is that big of a deal. It's not a puppy. Put it in a bowl and throw it some food every once in awhile. It would probably take more work to bring it back to the school/parents.

Ok, so to extend this line of thinking further...

It's a peanut-free school. One kid makes peanut butter cookies to sell. You still let him participate?

One kid brings those mini-Sharpies to sell. Permanent markers aren't allowed at school. Can she sell them?

Kid thought it was a brilliant idea to grab a pill bottle out of his parents medicine cabinet and sell those. Turns out they're just vitamins, nothing harmful, but clearly unacceptable regardless. Can he still participate?

Just wondering where you draw the line when someone is breaking the rules.

I would not allow the peanut thing because it is dangerous to a person's health.

The sharpies... well, really that depends because I taught young kids, I wouldn't let a K sell them but they're too young for that activity anyway. I would let a third grader sell them and have them keep them in their backpacks until school were over but I would remind the student about the rules and be clear this is a one time exception.

I would take the pills away and call the parents and tell them and also tell my principal just to protect myself. I wouldn't want something to happen and find out later, Oh Mrs. Roses knew he brought a prescription bottle to school and didn't tell anyone!

I think it is okay to bend some rules. Sending home a fish isn't hurting anyone. But whenever I did an activity where students had to bring things from home, I always had extra on hand in case something like this happened. I'd tell him to take the fish home and give him toy cars or something to sell. But I answered assuming the teacher didn't do that, but truthfully it would have been a non-issue in my classroom.

rosesandpetals · March 2014

And I don't mean that like Oh, I'm a better teacher obviously this would never happen to me! I just mean, I get tired of being yelled at by crazy parents and seeing the poor little kids in my classroom being unable to participate because their parents didn't send anything... which happened a lot because I worked in a town with very little parent involvement.

notkateanymore · March 2014

Yes it was a grade wide event. I think the teacher thought common sense would rule the selections...bet they won't make the mistake again. Apparently there was more than one kid who did it and more than one kid who came home with an empty bowl...guess the neighborhood cats feasted last night.

rosesandpetals · March 2014

NandaB said:

people. I didn't read most of that, but are you saying that a reading therapy dog, or a service dog in and assembly, or a class pet is the same as the children coming home from school with live animals to care for without prior parental knowledge/consent?

No, just that there is not a "no animals" rule in the school. And like PP, all classroom pets in my school were property and responsibility of the teacher, not the school. Of course it was a stupid thing to do, but there was probably not a "no animals" rule to point to. Mostly because, who would think it would be needed?

rosesandpetals · March 2014

NandaB said:

but who says the rules of this particular school are "no animals at school" and not any of the millions of variations between "unless with permission" "and free unwanted fish for everyone!" Or its not in the rules (because, duh! fish?!)

and yes. the teacher should have specified what was acceptable in the instructions for the hopefully well-planned grade wide event/project.

I can't believe that they didn't have to kids tell them ahead of time what they were bringing. I would want to know to make sure nothing was inappropriate, and that they didn't all bring the same thing.

And if the teacher DID know ahead of time and let it happen? I would be SO pissed.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if they did tell her ahead of time and then changed it last minute without telling her.

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