Sperm Worries.

Mommalawyer · March 2014

Let me start by saying if you're easily offended or super sensitive, stop reading..... Yes, this is a warning.

Ok. I worry constantly about my DH sperm. I've actually thought about NOT doing iui cause I'm convinced something is wrong with his sperm and because we are forcing the issue by doing iui, natural selection or survival of the fittest or whatever you call it doesn't prevail and we end up with an "unhealthy" baby. His count is low. His motility is low. That's it. But I can't seem to stop obsessing about it. And frankily, while I'd love to have a baby, We couldn't give the right life to that child, if cause his sperm isn't up to par. Please don't judge, I love all children. But we could never afford to have one of us quit working to be a full time caretaker, if that makes sense. Does anyone else worry about this if it's MF that's the problem?

annibes · March 2014

With all of the shit that can go wrong with reproduction, it's a friggin' wonder any of us is ever "normal." Seriously- look at the million and one things that have to go just right to get a healthy baby from start to finish.

pettycrocker · March 2014

Well, it's a risk you take when you are TTC, period, not just TTC with treatments, you know? So of course I worry about this happening, I think all moms-to-be worry about this at one stage in their pregnancy, it can really happen to anyone, and not just because your H has low sperm count, you just never know what mix of DNA you're gonna get, all you can do is hope for the best.

I think it's kind of weird you are hyper focused on your H's sperm causing a potential problem, how would you even know it wasn't an issue with YOUR chromosomes, unless you had in depth testing done?

I was so worried through my first pregnancy, what if something was wrong and they didn't see it on the scans, etc? I thought everyone had those worries? Maybe I just have a lot of anxiety. Pregnancy is hard.

You can always do IVF with PGD, then you'd know you're dealing with genetically normal embryos.

annibes · March 2014

As for the question, I do believe genetics played a role in DS's disability (autism). I do not think sperm morphology (part of our 2if issues) played a part.

Edited for typo

Mommalawyer · March 2014

Yes. Can certainly happen with any pregnancy. I guess I just worry cause I know HE is the reason we arnt getting pregnant, rather than me. I have found myself at a point where I'm frustrated & want someone to blame for us not getting pregnant. And he's the one targeted. Especially now that we know. I know. It's awful. Sadly it's come to that. Then, while PMSing, like now, I begin to obsess about stupid stuff. I'm really good at it!!

Mommalawyer · March 2014

annibes said:
With all of the shit that can go wrong with reproduction, it's a friggin' wonder any of us is ever "normal." Seriously- look at the million and one things that have to go just right to get a healthy baby from start to finish.

Right?!! I learned the other day you're not supposed to eat lunch meat while pregnant!!! Thank God I didn't know that when I was pregnant with DD. I would have obsessed about her missing an ear or buttcheek cause I are freaking lunch meat!!!

KC1212 · March 2014

There are so many factors that play a role in conception- sperm, egg quality, lining, etc. that it's hard to pin IF on just one issue. I agree with @mrscastillo it's a risk you're going to take regardless and if you don't want to them I suggest IVF / ICSI and PGD. I know you said in the past you did not want the emotional toll of IVF but, at this point I would imagine it has to outweigh your worries of a.) getting pregnant with MFI and b.) having a child with zero issues.

And plus: science works :-bd

freakyfast · March 2014

Let me start by saying if you're easily offended or super sensitive, stop reading..... Yes, this is a warning.

I really don't think you should produce any more kids. You sure don't consider your audience very well or have been here long enough to spout some shit like that. Especially when some of the lovely women here have beautiful children with disabilities. Shame on you. Maybe you need to address the ugly inside you first before putting the blame on your poor DH.

KC1212 · March 2014

=D> =D> =D> I

u @freakyfast‌ !!

Mommalawyer · March 2014

freakyfast said:
Let me start by saying if you're easily offended or super sensitive, stop reading..... Yes, this is a warning.

I really don't think you should produce any more kids. You sure don't consider your audience very well or have been here long enough to spout some shit like that. Especially when some of the lovely women here have beautiful children with disabilities. Shame on you. Maybe you need to address the ugly inside you first before putting the blame on your poor DH.

First off, I didn't say ANYTHING at all about the appearance of a child or that children who have disabilities are not beautiful. In fact, I find that to be the complete opposite. My comment was as to the WORRY of being able to provide the right life for a child and knowing full well that we financially couldn't because one of us would have to stop working. My comment was to the WORRY about blaming DH because the fertility problem lies within his swimmers to meet the goal. If you're going to be nasty, at least don't misquote me or put words in my mouth. Personally attacking someone is also not cool. I am not an ugly person. You know nothing about me to even warrant saying something as rude as I "shouldn't produce more children." Last time I checked, having concerns about all of these kinds of things were posted on these boards. I've seen things numerous times that I didn't agree with, but I don't say anything, because I recognize some people may have a different opinion or experience than mine. And saying hateful things isn't a way to treat people when they have concerns about sensitive topics. Also, last time I checked, there was no time frame for us "ugly" people to be allowed to post things on the board.

freakyfast · March 2014

The part I did quote you on was precise and that was your first sentence otherwise I didn't quote or put words in your mouth. I simply made a statement on your ignorant thread.

You came in here blaming your husband because you are convinced there is something wrong with him. Your words not mine, and worried about caring for a child with disabilities. (ETA: my bad "unhealthy baby") You knew this was wrong or else you wouldn't have started your thread with a warning the way you did.

Every time you come in here you say stuff that is inappropriate. Quite frankly it seems like you don't want anything getting in between you and your louboutins.

That's right, 2IF never forgets.

KC1212 · March 2014

It is common sense etiquette to lurk and learn before you post. You started off on the wrong foot with not wanting to do IVF for due to the emotional toll of it however- for many women here they have NO CHOICE and have to suck it up and do it anyway because it's the only craps shot they have at completing their family.

I 100% agree with @freakyfast‌. As for the time short time you've been here- we've all been here 1+ years and KNOW each other.

I love my son and any future children I may or may not be blessed with unconditionally no matter what. I don't care if my next baby is conceived via alien donor sperm and is born with 3 heads and purple eyes.

Mommalawyer · March 2014

Right. Everything I've posted has been inappropriate. And it seems to me that others have had a similar concern, while it may not be 100% directly on point to my exact issue, it's related. I'm pretty certain shoes have nothing to do with anything, but again, thanks for trying to make your point in the nastiest way possible. Noted. Good luck to you & your journey.

annibes · March 2014

There were definitely things in your posts that earned a shout out in a Side-eye Saturday post. I really don't think you consider your audience. I get that everyone needs an outlet, but there are multiple issues at play here. Nerves were struck, despite your "here's a train-wreck, but don't look" warning.

You're privy to a treat here, because I rarely toot my own horn or try to defend myself on forums, but here it is: I provide an amazing, enriching life for my child, because I work full time in the career that I chose. I afford his therapies, I provide an outlet for his energy through extra activities, and after a full day of doing speech and play therapy with children with special needs, I come home and do more speech and play therapy with my own child to give him a chance at a better outcome than many, many children with his diagnosis. It is HARD work, but we do it and it works for us.

If you don't want to do treatment cycles because you're worried (right or wrong) that your husband's sperm is going to cause you to have a special needs child, then that is your decision. But think about how you present that to a group of women who are actively pursuing treatments (and this is coming from a woman who is not actively pursuing treatments).

annibes · March 2014

And no, you did not say kids with special needs are not beautiful. But you did mention natural selection not prevailing (I will spare us all the discussion on what is wrong with a statement like that in the evolutionary sense). So should my kid have been selected out of the gene pool? How? Should he not be here at all? I disagree. Should he be selected out by never marrying or having kids? That's a concern I have because of his social delays. Audience.

AprilDrew04 · March 2014

I just want to say that yes there is a need sometimes to want to blame someone, however Infertility is no ones fault. You should try to refrain from blaming DH for his issue. I understand that it is related to a previous decision he made, but I assume he made that decision before you came into his life.

Anyway my point is that laying blame on your spouse or yourself in this situation is extremely unhelpful. Infertility is extremely hard to deal with on the part of both parties.

Mommalawyer · March 2014

@KC1212‌ - I'm pretty sure my post about not wanting to do IVF wasn't my first post, but if that's the first one you read, which gave you the wrong impression, I believe I explained it wasn't intended to be as such. I wish I had the strength to go thru IVF, I just know I don't. Women who do are better than I. Hands down. I'm terrified of even doing iui. I'm afraid of a lot of things when it comes to conceiving, however that may come about, being pregnant, having a healthy pregnancy, having a healthy delivery, having a happy healthy baby. My pregnancy with my DD left me with a lot of fears. It was a rough one. I was in & out of the hospital, and had one emergency surgery (my issue not DD) and almost another. And while I'm sure that someone will bash me on this, not knowing I was pregnant for the first 9 weeks of the pregnancy, I partied a lot. Drinking. Not drugs. (I hadn't had a period for 9 months, so lack of one wasn't a red flag) So even then I was terrified that something would be wrong with her and it would be all my fault. It doesn't help that I had a miscarriage in November and everyone likes to comfort you by telling you "well it's just your bodies way of telling you something was wrong." Not helpful. Also not helpful that I'll be 38 (which we have all decided is not old!) and every comment seems to be "you're too old. You're baby is at risk for more issues. Just be happy with what you have." That too is equally un-reassuring. If that is even a word. This is all probably over sharing, but I don't care. It gives more context, however slight. I love my DH. I'm lucky to have him. And I want to have a baby with him. My DD was conceived with a guy I wasn't married to. So it's important to me to do it with DH. Bad sperm. Bad eggs or not. At the end of the day, don't we all just want to hear, "It's going to be ok."

I'm sure some of you have been on here for over a year, maybe longer. It hurts my heart for all of you. I imagine that you could be more frustrated & confused than I am. Frankly, I wish I would have found this board sooner cause I've learned so much from others tid bits of info & experiences than I could have ever learned from my RE. I'm sorry if I offended you with my concern, I just wonder if others go through the same irrational mindset when DH appears to be the issue & you feel like you're already being punished by being put in infertility
hell..... Some days reading what others go through makes me feel more normal cause someone else is going through it, and a lot of times happy, cause one can lose hope in the process.

Mommalawyer · March 2014

AprilDrew04 said:
I just want to say that yes there is a need sometimes to want to blame someone, however Infertility is no ones fault. You should try to refrain from blaming DH for his issue. I understand that it is related to a previous decision he made, but I assume he made that decision before you came into his life.

Anyway my point is that laying blame on your spouse or yourself in this situation is extremely unhelpful. Infertility is extremely hard to deal with on the part of both parties.

Very true. And issues or not, he did go through a reversal to help us have a baby. I shouldn't blame him & it's something I've clearly got to work on. I guess it's just hard for me, for whatever reason. We have only been trying since June/July, so I'm still new at it & adjusting to dealing with all of the emotions and worries and stress that go with it. I literally want to hug every single person I've ever known that has went through this cause now I know what it's like.

AprilDrew04 · March 2014

IF is hard for everyone. It's just that playing the blame game can make it that much harder. The emotional roller coaster of ttc with IF is horrible. Just try to remember that many of us here have been at this way too long.

Momarazzi007 · March 2014

So.... I haven't read through all the posts- but let me just say this- I too have zero reproductive issues- we are MFI all the way (but you don't hear me bragging about it every other post either- bc there are women on here who are struggling and I love them and I wouldn't insult their hardships like that- another lesson in etiquette between us). Hence my rage last time you back hand slapping ivfers and the whole money thing too (really you let you kid wear your $2,000 shoes but dread to use that kind of money to have a child?) and now? So my brother had a aneurism when he was two and has been mentally disabled his whole life- born a perfectly healthy child- what do you do? And circling back- we are MFI too- and ladies help me out here- I know I've bitched about him doing the laundry and other stupid shit- and I'll admit I've pity partied myself that bc if MFI the sympathy goes to him and not US when we are in It together- but have I ever come on here questioning the quality of the little he produces? No- we have an incredible dd and I love my husband more than anything in the world- I want to have his children- I want to share this life with him. I want to have HIS kids. If that means the hard road of IVF so be it. If we have a special needs child they will be loved bc they are wanted- and I have been a prek teacher- making less than minimum wage (and with that 16 hours or less I get paid for) not lawyer salary. I feel bad for you husband bc there are clearly issues YOU need to work through and repair your marriage BEFORE you dare procreate again. Also, I didn't join this board till we tried (knowing it wouldn't happen) for almost a year, you might want to lurk a bit longer, shut up unless you have sat in the corner and truly thought about what you are going to say and realize that your petty passing thoughts are some of our lives. Funny thing is I think we all pity you- at least your husband- and it is good you are starting to think you shouldn't blame him- but that you blame him at all- when he had reversal and is trying? There is something wrong with the wiring of your brain. What if you had dwindling egg supply? And he was asking people if your kids were going to have severe problems because his sperm count and all were perfect? Clearly you were the issue! Doesn't sound like he is that kind of guy. Screw your head on, learn some empathy and the definition of a marriage.

CeCe8579 · March 2014

My DH and I both have IF issues and my daughter has special needs. I agree with @Momarazzi007‌, playing the blame game is just going to make dealing with IF much more difficult and possibility ruin your marriage. Either way, you could have a child with a disability no matter what so if you can't handle that, I would think about reconsidering having children until you can!

bcw2009 · March 2014

I realize I am late to this conversation...and most everything has already been addressed.

But, I just wanted to mention something that jumps out at me...
Your husband had a vasectomy reversal and NOW his sperm count and motility are low. The medical reason his counts are low is scar tissue and mechanical issues with his sperm being adequately released. Honestly, I would think that would bring you some comfort. There is a reason why these counts are low. I don't think it is related to "survival of the fittest" at all! He has two (I assume "healthy") children from a previous relationship before this vasectomy. Did he and his previous partner have difficulty conceiving them? If not, I would find peace in knowing you have an answer to why you are having difficulty and why he has low counts. Good Luck!!

Mommalawyer · March 2014

Thank you to all the ladies who said something encouraging to me or a kinder version of wake the eff up. I appreciate it. My child doesn't wear $2000 shoes, nor do I, so I'm not sure why that is being mentioned, again. I don't know if he has scar tissue or not. And maybe I'm wrong, but I thought that when you only have 30% motility, that meant that the others were no good & you didn't want them. At least that's what my RE communicated. There's a lot of things that I guess we don't know. My RE has been pretty frank with us regarding everything, but I still fear an "oh, by the way" is coming. I think my DH and I have a different relationship than most. Cause we have had the conversation many times in a logical, no emotion sense about our fears, and wanting to blame the other person. I'm not mad at him for expressing his feelings, it makes me love him more, even if it's the thing I don't want to hear. Yes, sometimes it hurts. We have those open discussions about the dirty dark thing in the back of our minds. If we had 20-30k laying around to pay for IVF, I'd probably do it. But we don't. I certainly don't fault anyone who has the option & ability to do IVF, I wish I had it too. Our insurance doesn't cover it, as most don't appear to. Which is beyond baffling to me to begin with. Insurance will pay for boob jobs for self esteem, but not IVF for a couple who has documented medical issues? WTH.

CeCe8579 · March 2014

Please just lurk a lot more and then come back. I think you need to have a better idea of what is best for you and your family. The uncertainty you seem to have makes it look like you 're sticking your foot in your mouth. I've been on the board for almost 2 years so I have some pretty good experience. This is the most supportive, helpful group of ladies ever!

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