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Kids with autism & sibling interaction

lemen99lemen99 member
in Special Needs
I'm at my wit's end and in discussions with my son's therapists, but am looking for any more info I can find.  My son is 5 years old was a micropreemie and has a lot of little issues, one being mildly on the spectrum.  The doc is holding out for a formal diagnosis but that would happen soon, I think.  He's in OT PT ST, developmental preschool, and attention issues, severe sensory issues & treated for anxiety. He gets outpatient OT for sensory issues and LOVES it. He does well at school.  He is very tired b/c he cannot nap. 

I'm having issues with him and his brother, who is 2 yr 9 months typical.  

I just finished washing his feet and was brushing his teeth for bed.  He'd been pretty good today.  He was in a good mood.  Ryan was helping Elliott in the 2nd bathroom.  He'd slicked Elliott's hair up all funny with water, and Elliott wanted to show Andrew.  Elliott came running in my bathroom (where I'm with Andrew) and he's so excited about his funny hair.  Andrew thinks it's awesome, he is excited, laughing, and then out of nowhere...WHAM.  Shoves his hands in Elliott's face, forcing him to fall back against the cabinet doors.  Elliott is crying, Andrew is laughing hysterically, until I of course am mad and telling him he hurt Elliott, laughing isn't appropriate and he needs to tell him he's sorry. 

The situation is usually similar.  He usually isn't frustrated or mad when it happens (although sometimes, and then he does it too, like if his brother grabs a toy he lashes out, or if his brother is sobbing in his face loudly, but I think that is more understandable) but maybe just excited.  Some days he does it literally all day long.  It does not matter how many toys I take away, or how much time he spends in time out.  He generally is a rule follower and when he isn't pushing, he's very very very sweet with Elliott. 

I talked to his outpatient OT and she thought possibly he was somewhat sensory seeking.  But I wonder if either in excitement if he doesn't know what to do with himself, or, if he can't control his "force", if he's just comfortable with his brother he's so excited but he doesn't know how to really interact socially/appropriately.  Or possibly he is just very overstimulated around his very very silly brother.  They are so so very hyper when they are together.

(He doesn't do this at all with other kids, but he's generally more reserved around other kids...however he did do it once to a 2 year old this week (and was just walking by him, so it was out of nowhere).  

When he does it, after we explain that he hurt Elliott then he generally gets really upset.  I'm not sure if he's upset because I'm upset, or if he's upset because he feels bad for hurting his brother.  

My friends tell me their siblings fight all the time, but it doesn't even really seem like fighting.  I really don't know if it's "normal" although doesn't necessarily appear normal to me at his age, and I don't know if/what to do about it.  

The only sure fire way I can get him to stop is if I am actively engaging him in something, like reading, doing his snap circuit project, having him practice letters...which is fine, but if I'm not doing that he's usually in trouble and I don't want to ignore a problem if there is something else I should do.  We are building a sensory swing in our home and getting him a compression shirt to try.

any insight or advice is appreciated.  


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Re: Kids with autism & sibling interaction

  • ksukitty1979ksukitty1979 member
    My 6 year old has classic autism.  He had a very hard time learning to understand different emotions. He would view laughter and tears in the same fashion.  A very good ot worked with him and us.  It took a long time. But now he understands crying is sad and laughter is happy, and facial expressions.
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  • Princess_LilyPrincess_Lily member
    edited February 2014
    Maybe a mix of overexcitement and impulsiveness. He may be so happy in the moment, that he isn't noticing his brothers feelings.
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  • lemen99lemen99 member
    I think that is probably the case, Princess Lily.  He does seem to recognize feelings now otherwise.  If his brother cries usually he'll say "aw, Elliott, I'm sorry you're sad" and give him a hug. 

    So what do I do about it?  He loves his brother and is so excited around him all the time it's a constant issue. 
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  • lemen99lemen99 member
    I talked to his ST today.  She has seen what I'm talking about (although doesn't push kids at school, he's more passive and backs away) and thinks primarily it's a sensory issue and happens when he's overstimulated . She gave me some suggestions to try and we're going to try a reward chart since he doesn't respond well to punishment. Thanks!
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  • Princess_LilyPrincess_Lily member
    I would just keep reminding your older son to "use gentle hands," help show him through examples, and supervise their interactions.

    Since the younger one is old enough to interact, maybe have them engaging in play which doesn't require a lot of contact (IE bubbles, cooking/baking together, puzzles...) things that encourage teamwork.
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  • lemen99lemen99 member
    Great idea. Thanks! We do a lot of puzzles because it eliminates the issue so you're totally right.
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  • abbym715abbym715 member
    If you're looking at it from a behavioral standpoint (very different than the sensory/OT view) you can look at what is happening before he displays a behavior and what occurs immediately after. In this case he had one on one time with you and then his brother interrupted that. He then displayed an aggressive behavior and was immediately "rewarded" with attention from you. By reacting to his aggression by scolding or explaining what he has done wrong (if the function of the behavior is attention) your son has gotten exactly what he wanted. Applied Behavior Analysis, or ABA, is an evidence based approach to dealing with behaviors that might be helpful for you to research.
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  • lemen99lemen99 member
    They believe that it is sensory related because little brother was too close to him.  Also, another example of when he would lash out would be - little brother asks for a boy Andrew is holding - Andrew tells him no -  little brother is sobbing/tantrum 10 inches from Andrew's face, Andrew starts clenching his jaw and swings at brother.  

    At school, what they see is when he is very excited about something, the jaw and fist clinching and oral outbursts. 
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  • lemen99lemen99 member
    Brother is NT.  He was a preemie with mild delays and I do think he has OCD tendencies but otherwise he's bright and navigates very well socially.

    We haven't done ABA and his doctor was waiting to formally diagnose Andrew.  He says he is mildly on the spectrum.  A friend of mine does ABA and she agreed with rewarding him for good behavior which we started doing.  She also said to try heading off the problem and teaching him to say "too close" if little brother is too close.  Then maybe expand on that to having him back away.  He seems to need to clench something if someone steps up too close, so I told him if he has to do something with his hands, to grab his shirt instead of the person.

    However when he DOES push, what would an appropriate reaction be? Frequently it happens if I'm out in another room and they are free playing, let's say I stepped away to get the laundry, what would you do?  
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  • lemen99lemen99 member
    Thank you Auntie!
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  • changingnameschangingnames member
    I'm chiming in with a totally different problem. Our 5 yr old who has a mild spectrum disorder has spent so much time w me and his therapists teaching him to use his words- not his hands that his almost three yr old nt brother will be in a crazy mood (think toddler with no nap on a melt down mission) and start attacking big brother and I'll here from the other room "Mom ds2 is hitting me, he is about to poke me in the eye. I used my words but he isn't listening. Ouch, mom he is kicking me." You get the picture it's almost hilarious that he has gone so far in the other direction. Most of the time the two of them give as good as they get and beat each other in a mutually agreed upon and enjoyed manner. Recently they discovered how fun it is to whack each other with these nerd covered bowling pins I bought, they take turns laying on the ground and being gently whacked all over or they have jousting matches. Sorry that is no help except to say that hopefully your boys will work it out and eventually have a relationship that works for them both- I wasn't always sure we would get there. :)
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