NEED ADVICE- naps- are schedules a must????

nschuetz01 · September 2013

Hello. FTM here. I wouldn't say I follow the AP style of parenting, but I also don't not follow it. I guess I just do what feels right, but I am easily influenced by others. Before having my LO I was very convinced of certain parenting strategies, in particular schedules. LO will be 1 year in a week and we have yet to have a schedule or even a routine in many aspects. We nurse on demand when home and I just follow all his cues for naps/bedtime. He started STTN around 9 weeks and then started waking again around 5-6 months due to teething. Now we go through streaks. Right now he is teething again and I find ourselves co-sleeping more and more.

I guess my concern is, is not having a schedule ok??? Im finding it harder and harder, especially with LO going to daycare part time. I guess what really sparked this worry is nap time. At home i just nurse him to sleep for naps, but at daycare i recently found out that she was letting him CIO (i don't know how much he actually cried) and I was upset and asked her to not do this anymore. Since then, nap time has been a little more of a struggle. Also, lately at home if i miss his window for nap time it is becoming more and more of a struggle to get him to nap. What do you experienced ladies do for naps? Do you have your kids on a schedule? How do your daycares handle naps? TIA ladies!

Emerald27 · September 2013

Following your baby's cues, nursing and napping on demand, is a wonderful way to care for LO. It's easiest and most natural for both of you.

We do this, and whereas DS nurses at all different times of day, his naps are pretty regular. He typically is ready for a nap between 11 and 12. If we've had a particularly active morning, sometimes he'll nap earlier. He'll nap a little later if we've had a relaxed morning.

Are your LO's nap times at all predictable? If you know he naturally is sleepy/ready to nap at a certain time of day, maybe you could ask his caregivers to help him nap at that time.

I would be beyond upset if they had let DS CIO. You might want to meet with his caregivers to discuss what you expect from them sleep-wise, and suggest some gentler ways to help him fall asleep (e.g. rocking him to sleep). If they're concerned about having to care for other children at the same time, would they consider wearing him in a carrier? If they're not willing to help him adjust to napping at daycare gently, you could look for a new daycare.

It's also really common around a year for babies to fight their naps more. DS still has phases where he'll actually ask to go "night night" every day at naptime and bedtime, and then he'll go through phases where he is super tired and grumpy but cannot fall asleep. I lay with him and nurse on and off sometimes for nearly an hour trying to help him go to sleep. Thankfully, those phases aren't as common for us as easy sleep.

When he's having trouble going down for a nap, I try to stay very quiet with him and even if I can't make the room dark, I explain that this is time for sleep, and I don't let him play or get out of bed. I also try to keep him laying with me. The more still and quiet I can keep him, the faster he'll settle, nurse and fall asleep.

Good luck! It really sounds like you're doing everything right, and that daycare needs to shape up.

nschuetz01 · September 2013

Thanks ladies, I feel better about not having a schedule, but like you both suggested babies tend to fall into their own schedule. LO actually seemed to be on a pretty noticeable schedule/routine around 5-6 months, but then we went on a vacation and it hasn't been the same since. We are gone/traveling a lot which doesn't help our situation. We are also experiencing a long period of teething right now so its hard to tell what's going on that may be attributed to that.

Right now LO goes to bed anywhere between 8 and 10p, up btwn 6 and 7a, ready for a nap btwn 8:30 and 10a and then has an afternoon nap, but I haven't really noticed a specific time frame for that one yet. We use an at home daycare and she seems to have him on a schedule for feeding and napping. I'm sure we are somewhat similar in times things are done, but she has 2 infants now on top of my child and anywhere from 2-3 2 year olds so Im not sure how much time she can devote to getting my child to sleep each day. We aren't necessarily happy with her, but we will be moving soon. She lets the kids run her daycare.

Back to the original topic. So I guess this would be a loose schedule right? Is nursing LO to sleep going to create a problem later on? At what age do kids typically start napping on their own? Ive never really felt like we have had bedtime sleep issues, but naps seem to be a different story. And as he is getting older, falling asleep while nursing is getting a little harder. Do most of you still nurse your lo's to sleep for naps?

Emerald27 · September 2013

I do still nurse DS to sleep for naps and at bedtime. More often, though, he'll nurse and then roll over and go to sleep, whereas he used to fall asleep latched. Most kids age out of nursing to sleep before they turn 2, but all babies are different, and some need it longer than others.

It's not likely a problem for you to continue nursing to sleep, because children adjust to different caregivers' ways of doing things. If he's with mama, he'll want to nurse to sleep. With daddy or a sitter, he's fine with being rocked to sleep or walked in a carrier until he falls asleep. So your LO can nurse to sleep with you and do fine with another caregiver's method.

aglenn · September 2013

Every kid is different, and with both of mine it would be a major battle to force them into a clock-based schedule. I had to follow their cues and let their own schedules emerge (and change, over and over again, as they got older). They are different at day care for whatever reason, perhaps just the routine and seeing the other kids nap, and they do fine with a more regular schedule there. It never hurts to try to nudge him towards more of a schedule but I personally wouldn't turn it into a big deal or a struggle.

As far as nursing to sleep, both of my kids grew out of this gradually by still nursing at nap time and bedtime but just until sleepy. DD took longer (she is my #1 sleep fighter) but when DS was a young toddler he started to sit up and point to his crib after a few minutes of nursing.

blu-eyedwife · September 2013

I'm a big fan of watching cues, but I'm also a big fan of kids having some sense of structure/routine and I don't think the two are incompatible.

With naps before 1, we were much more interested in watching cues than what the time on the clock said. And for the most part, our daycare did the same. He moved on to 1 nap a day at 11 months at daycare, at a set time, and they had no problem keeping him busy until that time. At home, he would fall asleep in his food if we tried to keep him up till after lunch, so we stuck with 2 naps, watching his cues. Eventually the two (home and daycare) synced up in terms of time, giving us a schedule of sorts. He eats lunch and goes down for a nap sometime between 11 and 1. (variable depending on if we're out, when he's hungry for lunch, etc.)

At the same time, he's on a "schedule" in that he takes a nap during that time period. No ifs, ands or buts. And we try to make sure we're home within that window (or somewhere he can nap - in the car going somewhere, in a carrier, in a stroller). Because as his mom, I'm the one that deals with his cranky, crazy, overtired self if he doesn't nap. And if I let him "decide" we'd get into that overtired period you're discussing where it becomes increasingly difficult to get him down.

Bedtimes are a little more structured for the same reason. I'm not a giant clock watcher, so it varies (last night he was asleep by 7 because he was sick and napped poorly during the day) but I know if we don't get him asleep by 8, he's going to be really difficult, overtired, and not sleep as well.

TiffanyBerry · September 2013

I found patterns to be super critical for a while, which is not quite the same as a schedule. I then found schedule *was* important (really, it was still the pattern that was important, but it was such a time-consistent pattern that I could use the clock).

But the same is not true for some of my friends' kids. They don't seem to care nearly as much about set schedules.

Heck, the same is true of adults.

So, listen to your kid! If what you're doing is working, then don't change it. If what you're doing isn't working, then change it!

nschuetz01 · September 2013

Thanks ladies! It's nice to hear how other ladies run their households. My work schedule is not the same every day and DS goes to the sitter only 24 hours a week and its split up so im sure that and our inconsistency of being home is messing with us right now. To top it off he is transitioning between the baby and toddler stage...ahhh!!!! Hopefully once the move happens we can settle down into a little more of a routine/schedule/pattern.

Thanks again!

nanabanana06 · September 2013

I'm not 100% AP either. I love this board though for a good perspective since I agree with it and implement it the best of my ability. Anyways, we are very baby led in our house. I completely follow the babies cues for things. When he wakes up, I wake up. We go to sleep together. He naps when he naps and eats when he eats. I feel this makes for a more calm house. If we need to go out then he's usually OK with it. I still follow his cues and I baby wear since it reduces his stress (same at home as well). I personally feel like schedules are silly for babies. Things are constantly changing with them. So, what would of been a morning nap, may now be a snack time 2 weeks later. I feel that just following the babies lead reduces stress for all parties. It's worked great for me.

My toddler on the other hand is older and we do have some thing scheduled. We do homeschool preschool for a few hours a day. Plus things like meals, snacks, "quiet time", and bath all scheduled in. I'm doing this now to help her get used to how things will be in 2 years with school though (or less if we get into a private preschool). At 3 I think it's expected to have a little bit of a schedule down, but I'm flexible with it.

The only thing that I have a schedule for that I follow is cleaning. If I don't then all goes to hell. LOL. Goodluck!

JJ_13 · September 2013

I second what blu-eyed wife said. We have found that loose schedules work for our LO (9 months old). She gets up between 7 and 8 am, is then awake for 2 - 2.5 hours before first nap. First nap lasts 40 - 60 minutes. Then she's up for closer to 3 hours. Then second nap is usually 1 - 2 hours. Then she's up for 3.5 - 4 hours before bed, which falls between 7 and 8 pm. Usually around 7:30. Nights are still variable. Some nights she only wakes once, but more likely she wakes twice. The times vary.

I know a lot of babies who drop that first nap around 1 year old.

If your child is in daycare, I think it is important to teach your child how to go to sleep on their own. It is not realistic to expect a daycare provider to rock/wear to sleep after they are in a toddler room. It is also more normal for daycares to implement a schedule (i.e. everyone takes a nap at X time). I don't like CIO and we don't do it at home, but we did spend a long weekend teaching our LO to go to sleep without needing to be held or nursed. I got her drowsy, put her in her crib, stayed by her side, patted her back, picked her up when she got upset, but made sure that she eventually went to sleep in her crib. We basically followed the sleep lady shuffle in Kim West's book except we never stopped going to her if she got upset - if our LO cries, we respond. Luckily our LO adjusted quickly and I can now put her down, walk out and she goes to sleep. Sometimes she "fusses" a little, but rarely does she cry, and if she cries, as I said, we respond.

I know a lot of folks on this board might think this isn't totally AP-friendly, but as a working parent, I felt like it was more important to teach my LO to put herself to sleep than to go through the stress of that every day at the provider's. Since doing this, our provider (it's an in-home thing) can put LO down and she'll go to sleep. OUr provider knows to respond if LO gets upset, but that is very rare now. It is definitely a personal choice though, but I do think there are different factors at play when your LO is in daycare.

musicalmama5 · September 2013

We don't have a hard and fast schedule, but he naps twice a day, usually around 9 or 10 and then again around 1 or 2. He's down for the night around 7 or 8, depending on how his naps were.

I don't have any advice for daycare since DS doesn't go to daycare. However, he does have someone else watch him a few times a week (either MIL or one of our friends). When he needs to take a nap for one of them or for DH, they usually just take him for a walk in the Ergo since I usually nurse him to sleep.

jk382 · September 2013

Lurker here. We hired a sleep consultant when DS was 14 months because his sleep was a mess. We didn't CIO, but we modified the schedule and it worked wonders. At 14 months, DS was up between 6-7, first nap at 8:30 (goal was 1 hour nap), second nap at 12:30 (goal was 1.5 hours), bedtime at 6:30. I was missing his sleep window, which was why we had trouble getting him to sleep. Once he was getting the proper sleep, he was like a different kid! Good luck!

Oasismomma · September 2013

I tracked DS's sleep with an app (Total Baby, if you're interested. It tracks EVERYTHING and I luvvvv it) and noticed when he started putting himself on a schedule (around 6-8 months, if I remember correctly).

I tried to make his environment as sleep-friendly as possible leading up to his usual nap times and I was amazed how quickly he put himself on that schedule. It ended up being a 2-3-4 sleep schedule; he stuck to it for over 9 months, when I went back to work full time and he went into day care.

We had a bit of a struggle at that point, because his age group schedule only allowed for one nap a day. However, his providers are fantastic and will lay next to him and rub his back if he has issues falling asleep. We're going on 6 months of daycare and he is a phenomenal, scheduled napper. Overnight sleep is a totally different beast.

ncbelle · September 2013

I've never done a strict schedule with either kid - even bedtime is a window at our house vs. a time. Naps were roughly in the same window but it just depended on how tired they were and what was going on that day. They weren't in daycare so not much help there but you are paying a daycare so they should absolutely follow your directions 100%.

nschuetz01 · October 2013

Thanks everyone, great feedback!

opheliainwaders · October 2013

LibraryChica said:

You say that you're finding it harder and harder to not have a schedule, so maybe a loose one would be worth a try. We started by writing down when LO did things for a week and found that she was partway to a schedule by that point. Then we just nudged her here and there. It isn't strict, but it helps tremendously since she is with a variety if caregivers (h&I, my mom, nanny) and now she knows what to expect and is happy. As for daycare, you are approaching older baby/toddler rooms and most daycares will expect a schedule. It is just not feasible to do things on demand as you get to the larger ratios. But CIO would not be acceptable to me either! I would talk to the caregiver and request that instead of CIO they do x,y,z to help LO nap. Maybe rocking or reading or whatever. This is likely to go over better than "no CIO!" Also, if you do track LOs sleep and decide to shift towards a routine, share that info with the caregivers. The more information they have, the more they can help.

We did this, as well, and DD basically put herself into a routine (it's truly not a "schedule"). She is much happier when she's up around 7, naps 2x per day, and is asleep again around 7pm. If she wakes up much earlier than 7am, we add in another short "cat nap" in the morning. She seems to thrive on routine, but when there are days where the "typical" routine doesn't work, we just roll with it.

sugarbear0524 · October 2013

JJ_13 said:

If your child is in daycare, I think it is important to teach your child how to go to sleep on their own. It is not realistic to expect a daycare provider to rock/wear to sleep after they are in a toddler room. It is also more normal for daycares to implement a schedule (i.e. everyone takes a nap at X time).

I second this. Put yourself in the daycare provider's shoes--she has, say, 5 kids in her care. You want her to rock/wear your child, but she has to tend to the other 4 as well. Also, what if you were the parent of one of the other 4? She can't wear 5 kids. She can't rock them all to sleep at nap time either. I wouldn't like it if I felt like one child was taking her away from the others, including mine. That's part of daycare.

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