how do you do it?

MsDragonfly · August 2013

I have a 2yo DS. I'm recently separated and H is verbally/emotionally abusive which out of his own mouth "I don't know what your complaining about its not like I threw you to the ground and physically beat you." He doesn't work, never developed a bond with his son, never helped out, would have his outbursts in front of DS calling me names, threatening me, telling my son negative things about me, etc. I felt like a single mom. We are going through a custody fight cause I don't feel he is mentally unstable. He only wants every other weekend w/overnights and 1 day a week. However I'm trying to hold off on overnights for a number of reasons and gradually over time, when my son gets used to the change, add in an overnight cause we are still currently co-sleeping together. I can't imagine being away from my DS overnight. How do you do it? Does it ever get easy? I just cry thinking about it and don't know how I'm going to handle it when the time comes. Any words of comfort needed.

mccall0113 · August 2013

I have a friend that reminds me to do what is in the best interest of the child. Her words ring in my ears with every decision I make. It's not about you, it's about the child. Get an attorney ASAP. S/He can lead you through the process. Your son may have no choice but to visit, unless you have hard proof that he is unfit. It's difficult to let go of control. I have been dealing with this myself. I have to have faith in my children, in my ex, and with the legs system. Good luck to you and your son.

MsDragonfly · August 2013

Thanks McCall. I do have an attorney and we have an interim agreement (awaiting scheduled mediation) right now where he just gets visits without overnight stays on the days he requested. I always think of my DS through this but it's hard knowing the right thing to do especially when a 2yo before the visit is over will go get H's shoes and tell him bye bye cause he is ready for him to leave. That's why I I feel it's best to gradually work DS into these overnight stays instead of abruptly starting them.

ldmessing · August 2013

you say " I can't imagine being away from my DS overnight. How do you do it? Does it ever get easy? I just cry thinking about it and don't know how I'm going to handle it when the time comes. Any words of comfort needed." this is not about YOU.

your child is 2, he will be fine with his father, there is no gradually working him into overnight stays.

fellesferie · August 2013

I don't think you can just assume 'he will be fine with his father' when the OP states they have never formed a bond and the man is emotionally abusive.

You should at least ask to ease your DS into overnights. Maybe you'll be turned down, but it can't hurt to ask for it. But you need to start doing your part--stop cosleeping and start training him to sleep in his own room.

And when the time does come, keep the tears at bay until you're alone. You don't want to cry in front of your child or your ex. Then keep busy. Clean the house. Get a pedicure. Go out with your friends.

XH and I separated when DS was 18 months. After the first few months, I started to look forward to the kid-free weekend.

ambrvan · August 2013

fellesferie said:
I don't think you can just assume 'he will be fine with his father' when the OP states they have never formed a bond and the man is emotionally abusive.

You should at least ask to ease your DS into overnights. Maybe you'll be turned down, but it can't hurt to ask for it. But you need to start doing your part--stop cosleeping and start training him to sleep in his own room.

And when the time does come, keep the tears at bay until you're alone. You don't want to cry in front of your child or your ex. Then keep busy. Clean the house. Get a pedicure. Go out with your friends.

XH and I separated when DS was 18 months. After the first few months, I started to look forward to the kid-free weekend.

All wonderful advice. Ask for what you want. Worst that can happen is that the court says no. At the same time, though, you don't want to be the reason your son has any problems with adjusting. Start doing what you can to prepare yourself and your son for nights away. That means no co sleeping at all unless there is an odd circumstance. For instance, the only time either of our children share our bed at night is if they are sick enough to need monitoring through the night or if they have a bad dream. And even then if they are sick we normally end up on the couch. And if they have a bad dream, they always go back to their need as soon as they are reassured.

ldmessing · August 2013

how exactly do you ease a child into overnight visitation with his father?

fellesferie · August 2013

If I had a verbally abusive ex and a two-year-old child who likely can't talk to me enough to tell me if there's a problem, I'd want to start with three half days. Maybe Wednesday 4-7 (every week) and Saturday & Sunday (eow) 8-12.

When they establish that's going okay, then Saturday and Sunday become full days. After a couple months go by and dad has established a bond with the child and mom has had a chance to train the child to sleep in his own room, then the kiddo starts spending Saturday nights.

It's true that the child is either spending the night or not. But I think a 2-yo (especially in these circumstances) deserves a chance to be eased into his new living situation.

ambrvan · August 2013

While I feel that felles presents a very doable and plausible schedule, I still feel that doing it this way automatically gives the BM control. The BM is already going to have the most influence in the child's life if she has primary physical custody.

I am by no means justifying the STBX's behavior or lack of parenting while married. But is it possible that he was withdrawn during the marriage because he did not like his spouse? OP, please do not be offended. I am not trying to say anything to be hurtful.I realize this must be a painful time for you. Saying and hearing unkind things in a marriage, and that may be an understatement if what you have gone through, is always painful and damaging to everyone involved.

But if there is no reason to believe that he will or has been hostile to the child, I think it is unfair to the child to automatically assume that there has been little or no bonding and that overnights would be any more stressful now than they would be down the road.

But still ask for what you want in court if you think it is best for your child, not for you or because you think you are a better parent.

ambrvan · August 2013

However, to add, if you think the BD is, has been, and will be a detrimental influence in his life, then if course, do what you can to ensure you have the most positive influence.be sure your thoughts are coming from a truly genuine place of concern for the child and not from feelings and emotions about your X.

MsDragonfly · August 2013

Ambrvn -- In regard to the co-sleeping, due to health reason my son has had is what led us into co-sleeping. His bedroom is under construction as we speak now and as soon as that is completed I will be working on transitioning him to his bed.

As far as H's behavior, it had nothing to do with him not liking me. Come to find out he has anger/rage issues due to issues from his past, he has issues with women in general and has lashed out at his own mother, and he has other diagnosed mental issues.

I draw the line when he had his outbursts in front of my son, threatening me in front of my son and telling my son negative things about me. The bond that he did not develop with my son is very noticeable. He doesn't want to talk to him on the phone and doesn't ever talk about him. Since my H left, I set aside my feelings about my H cause it's about my son and I never denied my H time with his son when he wanted. But when he continued to blow up at me and threaten me it came to be supervised visits and somebody else had to be there if he came over to my house. But no matter what he said and done and how afraid I get being around him alone I still never denied him seeing his son or talking with his son, I just took extra precautions especially under the advisement of an attorney.

Since my husband left, I have given him opportunities to put him to sleep and it would take hours for him to get him settled down cause my son won't listen to him or he gets frustrated and leaves cause he can't get him to listen. So there are issues and concerns especially when H completely neglected both DS and I from the day he was born. The most help I got from him was him barking orders from the coach and chair. He tells me what an easy life I have sitting at home all day on my fat a** and playing with our son. He has no clue what is involved in raising a child. I could go on and on, so there is cause of concern. Plus since we had our son he has not paid for a single thing for my son cause he didn't work and he still has no job.

So per an order, he gets him the days that he wanted but only for 3 hours at a time with one of H parents present. As time goes, 1/2 days will be added then full days, then 1 overnight and so forth.

But thanks everyone for your advice and thoughts. But besides all those issues how does one prepare themselves mentally to not having their child overnight. I'm trying to prepare myself for that when the time comes but I just get severe anxiety. I just can't imagine one night without my son.

Sigir · August 2013

Wow @ldmessing, I can't remember if you are a bm or not, but that is pretty harsh. The op has an abusive ex, and has never spent a night away from her son. Her son has no relationship w the ex. I think any bm would be rightfully apprehensive about going to an overnight schedule w no 'easing in' period.

First, if you fear he may be neglectful or abusive towards your son, ask your lawyer how to best handle that. And I want to say congratulations on having the strength to get out of an abusive relationship, and doing what is best for your son.

Op, I agree w ppers. Ask for a period of easing in. Worst thing, it'll be denied, but it doesn't hurt to ask. Transition out of cosleeping. As for preparing to be apart, I know how hard it is. When my dc started the first overnight visits w exh, I would keep very busy. I enjoyed the Sunday times in the park every other weekend (chain smoking at first, but after a few weeks I quit!). I'd go out w single friends on sat nights. Id spend all day redecorating my ex's old office into a playroom for my dc to discover when she came home. Like felles said, over time I looked forward to this time apart. That will happen for you, too. You just have to take it one day at a time until you get there. Trust that you will get there.

ambrvan · August 2013

Sounds like you've had it rough. I hope things get better moving forward. As I said in my previous reply, I was certainly not trying to be harsh or hurtful. Just playing devil's advocate.

It sounds like you are doing everything as you should. I am sorry that you have to go through sending your son somewhere you fear he is unwanted. That must be very difficult.

I don't really have any word of advice on how to prepare yourself to handle this. I haven't been in exactly this situation. But I wish you all the best. Just be confident that you are doing the best you can for your son and then treat yourself to something special you wouldn't ordinarily be able to do with your DS in tow. You'll get through it.

MsDragonfly · August 2013

ambrvan said:

Sounds like you've had it rough. I hope things get better moving forward. As I said in my previous reply, I was certainly not trying to be harsh or hurtful. Just playing devil's advocate. It sounds like you are doing everything as you should. I am sorry that you have to go through sending your son somewhere you fear he is unwanted. That must be very difficult. I don't really have any word of advice on how to prepare yourself to handle this. I haven't been in exactly this situation. But I wish you all the best. Just be confident that you are doing the best you can for your son and then treat yourself to something special you wouldn't ordinarily be able to do with your DS in tow. You'll get through it.

Thanks for your reply and no didn't take it as such. I was pretty vague in my original post so I wanted to explain in more detail. Plus I am a person who likes to hear things straight up cause it helps me look at the whole picture from an outsider view cause being on the inside can get a little cloudy.

fellesferie · August 2013

At first, you do it because you have to. There is simply not another choice. You also do want your child to have a good relationship with their other parent. It's the best thing for the child. You want to be absolutely sure that you foster a good relationship with your ex.

I did come to look forward to the time. Maybe you'll never look forward to it, but you'll find a use for it.

ldmessing · August 2013

ambrvan said:

While I feel that felles presents a very doable and plausible schedule, I still feel that doing it this way automatically gives the BM control. The BM is already going to have the most influence in the child's life if she has primary physical custody. I am by no means justifying the STBX's behavior or lack of parenting while married. But is it possible that he was withdrawn during the marriage because he did not like his spouse? OP, please do not be offended. I am not trying to say anything to be hurtful.I realize this must be a painful time for you. Saying and hearing unkind things in a marriage, and that may be an understatement if what you have gone through, is always painful and damaging to everyone involved. But if there is no reason to believe that he will or has been hostile to the child, I think it is unfair to the child to automatically assume that there has been little or no bonding and that overnights would be any more stressful now than they would be down the road. But still ask for what you want in court if you think it is best for your child, not for you or because you think you are a better parent.

I was thinking exactly the same thing

ldmessing · August 2013

Sigir said:

Wow @ldmessing, I can't remember if you are a bm or not, but that is pretty harsh. The op has an abusive ex, and has never spent a night away from her son. Her son has no relationship w the ex. I think any bm would be rightfully apprehensive about going to an overnight schedule w no 'easing in' period. First, if you fear he may be neglectful or abusive towards your son, ask your lawyer how to best handle that. And I want to say congratulations on having the strength to get out of an abusive relationship, and doing what is best for your son. Op, I agree w ppers. Ask for a period of easing in. Worst thing, it'll be denied, but it doesn't hurt to ask. Transition out of cosleeping. As for preparing to be apart, I know how hard it is. When my dc started the first overnight visits w exh, I would keep very busy. I enjoyed the Sunday times in the park every other weekend (chain smoking at first, but after a few weeks I quit!). I'd go out w single friends on sat nights. Id spend all day redecorating my ex's old office into a playroom for my dc to discover when she came home. Like felles said, over time I looked forward to this time apart. That will happen for you, too. You just have to take it one day at a time until you get there. Trust that you will get there.

I am a bio mom and a step mom. I had an abusive mentally ill ex. He wasn't much of a husband but he was a good father. This is harsh but I will say it. When you choose a man to make babies with, you have to be ready for a lifetime of interactions, good or bad, you have to foster a relationship and let the child decide for himself. This man was never physically abusive according to the op so there is really no reason to keep his child from him. The law is in his side as well. The best you can do is work within the law. Fwiw my sks live with us full time due to physical abuse at the hands of their mother, she even admitted to it in court, yet she still has visitation. Don't be so quick to call me harsh, I am being realistic and giving advice based on my experience. Isn't that what the op wanted? If that is not what she wanted, she should have made herself clearer

fellesferie · August 2013

ldmessing said:
I am a bio mom and a step mom. I had an abusive mentally ill ex. He wasn't much of a husband but he was a good father. This is harsh but I will say it. When you choose a man to make babies with, you have to be ready for a lifetime of interactions, good or bad, you have to foster a relationship and let the child decide for himself. This man was never physically abusive according to the op so there is really no reason to keep his child from him. The law is in his side as well. The best you can do is work within the law. Fwiw my sks live with us full time due to physical abuse at the hands of their mother, she even admitted to it in court, yet she still has visitation. Don't be so quick to call me harsh, I am being realistic and giving advice based on my experience. Isn't that what the op wanted? If that is not what she wanted, she should have made herself clearer

Why don't you think he can emotionally or verbally abuse his toddler?

No one is suggesting that she completely withhold the child from his father. I think she should encourage & foster their relationship. And I totally agree that she should work within the law.

If I thought XH might abuse DS in any way, I would ask to limit his parenting time, ask for supervised visits, etc. I might not get it, but it's my job to do what I think is best for my kid.

ldmessing · August 2013

Never hurts to ask, but like another poster said, do what is best for the child. The op chose her husband and her child's father. This child has no choice

MsDragonfly · August 2013

ldmessing said:

Sigir said:

Wow @ldmessing, I can't remember if you are a bm or not, but that is pretty harsh. The op has an abusive ex, and has never spent a night away from her son. Her son has no relationship w the ex. I think any bm would be rightfully apprehensive about going to an overnight schedule w no 'easing in' period. First, if you fear he may be neglectful or abusive towards your son, ask your lawyer how to best handle that. And I want to say congratulations on having the strength to get out of an abusive relationship, and doing what is best for your son. Op, I agree w ppers. Ask for a period of easing in. Worst thing, it'll be denied, but it doesn't hurt to ask. Transition out of cosleeping. As for preparing to be apart, I know how hard it is. When my dc started the first overnight visits w exh, I would keep very busy. I enjoyed the Sunday times in the park every other weekend (chain smoking at first, but after a few weeks I quit!). I'd go out w single friends on sat nights. Id spend all day redecorating my ex's old office into a playroom for my dc to discover when she came home. Like felles said, over time I looked forward to this time apart. That will happen for you, too. You just have to take it one day at a time until you get there. Trust that you will get there.

I am a bio mom and a step mom. I had an abusive mentally ill ex. He wasn't much of a husband but he was a good father. This is harsh but I will say it. When you choose a man to make babies with, you have to be ready for a lifetime of interactions, good or bad, you have to foster a relationship and let the child decide for himself. This man was never physically abusive according to the op so there is really no reason to keep his child from him. The law is in his side as well. The best you can do is work within the law. Fwiw my sks live with us full time due to physical abuse at the hands of their mother, she even admitted to it in court, yet she still has visitation. Don't be so quick to call me harsh, I am being realistic and giving advice based on my experience. Isn't that what the op wanted? If that is not what she wanted, she should have made herself clearer

MsDragonfly said:

Ambrvn -- In regard to the co-sleeping, due to health reason my son has had is what led us into co-sleeping. His bedroom is under construction as we speak now and as soon as that is completed I will be working on transitioning him to his bed.

As far as H's behavior, it had nothing to do with him not liking me. Come to find out he has anger/rage issues due to issues from his past, he has issues with women in general and has lashed out at his own mother, and he has other diagnosed mental issues.

I draw the line when he had his outbursts in front of my son, threatening me in front of my son and telling my son negative things about me. The bond that he did not develop with my son is very noticeable. He doesn't want to talk to him on the phone and doesn't ever talk about him. Since my H left, I set aside my feelings about my H cause it's about my son and I never denied my H time with his son when he wanted. But when he continued to blow up at me and threaten me it came to be supervised visits and somebody else had to be there if he came over to my house. But no matter what he said and done and how afraid I get being around him alone I still never denied him seeing his son or talking with his son, I just took extra precautions especially under the advisement of an attorney.

Since my husband left, I have given him opportunities to put him to sleep and it would take hours for him to get him settled down cause my son won't listen to him or he gets frustrated and leaves cause he can't get him to listen. So there are issues and concerns especially when H completely neglected both DS and I from the day he was born. The most help I got from him was him barking orders from the coach and chair. He tells me what an easy life I have sitting at home all day on my fat a** and playing with our son. He has no clue what is involved in raising a child. I could go on and on, so there is cause of concern. Plus since we had our son he has not paid for a single thing for my son cause he didn't work and he still has no job.

So per an order, he gets him the days that he wanted but only for 3 hours at a time with one of H parents present. As time goes, 1/2 days will be added then full days, then 1 overnight and so forth.

But thanks everyone for your advice and thoughts. But besides all those issues how does one prepare themselves mentally to not having their child overnight. I'm trying to prepare myself for that when the time comes but I just get severe anxiety. I just can't imagine one night without my son.

ldmessing - Didn't know if you saw a prior post that I made so I quoted it. Never once did I say I wasn't putting the best interest of my child first. I have as stated above set all my feelings aside for my child so he can have a relationship with his father. It is not my fault the the relationship that my husband didn't build with our son nor did he learn along with me how to take care of our son. I can't make my H be a father nor will I tell him how - that is for him to figure out but I will always encourage time for my DS to spend with his father cause in the end it's still my DS's father and I will not take that away from him only his father can do that by not being a dad and putting his own son's best interest first.

I don't at all mind positive or negative advice cause everyone has their own opinions and I wouldn't ask for advice if I couldn't except some criticism. And yes I did choose my H and my child's father but I did not choose to be verbally abused, threatened, or be with a man who neglected his wife and son after the birth of their only child. The man I thought I knew and chose changed in a drop of the hat almost immediately after the birth of my son. That I did not choose and is at the fault of my H for the choices he made. So through God, I choose life - a better life for myself and my child to not live in a toxic home. And I do believe that each individual parent has their own obligation when bringing a child into this world to protect them. So if that means taking the transition slow to build up to overnight stays that doesn't make me any less of a person or mother. My H is still getting all his requested days he wanted and I encourage him to build a relationship with my son and never denied it but through his actions towards us was his choice not mine and I'm 100 percent positive if he was in my shoes he would be doing the same thing.

Sigir · August 2013

@MsDragonfly I am inspired by your strength and you are definately doing what is best for your son. Seeing your emails so far, you have the internal strength to get through this. It won't be easy, but it'll become your new normal, and you and your son will be ok.

MsDragonfly · August 2013

@sigir Thanks for the words of encouragement. Sometimes I don't feel strong but ever since I have had my son, he brings out so many qualities that I never thought I had such as strength, patience and deep understanding. I know it won't be easy and am expecting it to get worse before it gets better but my H and I had such a smart beautiful boy and I wouldn't change that for anything. I am a true believer that everything happens for a reason and I truly believe this special little boy was brought into my life for the sole purpose of being my savior.

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