Kelly321 (and anyone else who has used Ferber)

LyssRob · July 2013

So we got for real serious last night and did pretty strict Ferber. It took him almost an hour to fall asleep initially, but he was essentially up all night. I would say his only real sleep chunks were from 1130-2 (when I fed him) and 2-345. Now it's 648 and we are up. I'm a zombie, he seems fine. I feel like everyone is like "OMG I tried Ferber and my kid was sleeping in 12 minutes and we never looked back! I loveeee Ferbs!" I know you say you had (have?) a pretty bad sleeper...was it difficult for you for awhile? How long did it take? I am fully committed to three nights, at least...

theimpossibleastronaut · July 2013

We used a form of Ferber I guess. It's Jodi Mindell's Sleeping through the Night. There is crying involved.

I think it depends on the kid really. Our friends' kids went to sleep without crying after about a week or two.DD cried for a half hour for a while, like three weeks or more I'd say, then ten minutes, etc. she still fusses some nights, but is usually asleep in 15 minutes now. There were checks to soothe every five, then ten, then fifteen minutes depending on how long she cried.

Last week she went to bed several nights without a peep. She STTN most night now. But it took us a long time to get here. This is just my experience though. It may take your LO longer or a shorter amount of time depending.

I really hope, no matter what you end up doing, that you all get the rest you need soon.

Eta it totally sucked, but some nights in that three week period she would go to sleep in five minutes so that's why we had hope that it would work for her. It really does now. She usually just fusses now, but sometimes, if overtired, there's a bit of crying and then she goes to sleep. I don't want to make it sound terrible, so remember that this is just my experience.

Ps DH is telling me it was two or two and a half weeks...I think it was closer to three, but he did most of the checks, because it was hard for me, so I guess he might be right.

kelly321 · July 2013

That sounds awful, sorry.

I'll tell you our miracle Ferber story and then all the caveats.

We used Ferber with DD1. Our problem with her was that we would rock her to sleep, then put her down. Starting between 4-5 months, she started struggling and screaming in our arms for 20-40min and even if she was out like a light when we put her down, her eyes would snap open and she would start screaming again. Start the process over. It would take up to 2-3 hours to put her down at night. She still woke up every 1-3 hours, and when she woke up between about 2-4, she wouldn't just drink and fall back asleep. We would have to repeat the process, and that was absolute torture between 2-4 am. In short, it was a classic Ferber sleep association problem (fell asleep in our arms, woke up in her crib).

So when we tried Ferber when she was about 6 months old, we did his suggestions with the sleep association, and it was a miracle. The first night she cried I think 6 minutes, and the most she cried during the first month or so was 11 minutes. Compared to what we had been going through, that was so much better. I actually cried the 2nd or 3rd night because it was so freaking easy to put her to bed and I couldn't believe that I had actually been making it harder for her to sleep because I had been rocking her to sleep in my arms.

That is our miracle Ferber story. However...
- it didn't work with naps until she was 7 months old
- his night weaning suggestions never worked, or they would for a week and then something would throw things off again. She didn't sleep through the night even once until she was 13 months old.
- she did not get more worked up when we went in to her. When we went in, I would calm her down and then leave the room. She sometimes started crying again, but not worse than before I went in.

DD2 has different problems, though, and I really don't think Ferber will work for her, so we haven't even tried it. Thankfully she rarely has problems going down (although there is an occasional bad bedtime), it's more that she wakes up frequently during the night and likes to have an alert phase between 4-5am. I don't know how Ferber can help with that (well, maybe with the frequent feedings, but I'm just not ready to deal with that right now).

I will often suggest Ferber to women on this board if I feel like they're describing a sleep association problem because it helped so much with DD1's. However, I know that some babies will get more worked up if you go in, check on them, and leave again. I don't know if Ferber will work with those kinds of babies. And like I said, I don't think Ferber is a cure-all because I don't think his methods would help with DD2's problems.

So please don't think you're doing something wrong or it works for everyone but you. It was one specific part of Ferber's "program" that worked so well for us, and the other parts didn't. I do defend his methods, though, because I think that they can work really well for some people and I don't want him to have a really bad rap because there is some crying involved. For us, that was still waaaaay less crying than was going on when I was rocking her to sleep.

Good luck, and know that you're not the only one whose baby doesn't sleep well, even if it might sound like that from what your friends say.

pgros005 · July 2013

We did a form of Ferber to break sleep associations, but we also included pick up/put down at the specific intervals. She needed the cuddles to calm down. That worked really well for our daughter. Her main issue were deep rooted sleep associations.

We actually lengthened our sleep routine. At around 6:30, we go upstairs and have "family play time" on our bed. Essentially, we just lay around with her for 10 minutes to calm down before our bedtime routine. Then, it's bath, lotion, jammies, book, boob, bed. She used to fall asleep on the boob, but now I put her down drowsy. That was the most difficult part. Also, for us, it was important that she was tired enough before bed time. If she hasn't been awake for 3.5 hours before bed, I know she'll cry. I am a stickler for her awake times now. She can go 2-2.5 hours between naps, but she must have at least 3.5-4 before bedtime. Also, before we started sleep training, I experimented with different "lovies" for her. She attached herself to a tiny A&A security blanket and her wubanub. (She doesn't use the pacifier, oddly enough...I just like that it's tiny and not crib hazard). For the last nursing session before bed, she holds the blanket and we transfer her and the blanket to the bed. Some nights, she still fusses when I pull her off and put her in her crib. I don't do interval checks for fussing- only crying. I still nurse once or twice a night- usually either at 2 a.m. or if she goes to bed early, at 12 and 5.

mishka29 · July 2013

We did a sleep training program, similar to Ferber, called Sleep Sense. My LO had to be rocked to sleep or carried around to be put to sleep/nap.

The first night she cried for 55 min. This was surprising as I thought she would have gone for longer. She slept most of the night and woke up a couple of times. The bed time routine including bath really helps a lot and I think it probably took 2 weeks before she stopped crying at night. The second night it was 30 mins, then 10, etc.

Naps are a whole different story and right now they've gotten a lot worse b/c of the rolling.

Now, we go back and forth between 1 and 2 feeds a night but she puts herself back to sleep easily in the MOTN.

I agree with committing the 3 days. GL!

theimpossibleastronaut · July 2013

I should also add that DD was crying almost every night around the same time no matter what and she had negative sleep associations with food and needing to be held to fall asleep. running a hair dryer or the bathroom fan would calm her, but then she was still awake most of the time and we'd have to hope a bottle would put her in a sleepy state. When we did set her down, asleep, she was up again pretty soon most of the time. Getting the crying down to half an hour, then fifteen minutes, and now no crying most nights is a huge improvement for us. Even if she fusses a few minutes it's still better than it was and she sleeps better and longer than she did before. And as I said, I may have the time frame messed up. It seemed like it took a long time for her to get the crying down to me but I may be wrong about that. Hope I didn't scare OP.

LyssRob · July 2013

I was thinking we had bad sleep associations, too, since I would always rock DS to sleep, and then he wakes frequently in the night very much like the first case Ferber discusses in his book. My going in didn't seem to make anything worse last night...he just fights sleep so bad! He would drift off for a few minutes and then snap himself awake (and cry) all night!

I don't know what other method might be better if this doesn't work. Took him to pedi yesterday and although she was supportive and sympathetic, she didn't say much except to reassure me that he was healthy and that it probably isn't due to his reflux or teeth or whatever since it is really only a night issue and he is not crying all day...

kelly321 · July 2013

LyssRob said:

I was thinking we had bad sleep associations, too, since I would always rock DS to sleep, and then he wakes frequently in the night very much like the first case Ferber discusses in his book. My going in didn't seem to make anything worse last night...he just fights sleep so bad! He would drift off for a few minutes and then snap himself awake (and cry) all night!

I don't know what other method might be better if this doesn't work. Took him to pedi yesterday and although she was supportive and sympathetic, she didn't say much except to reassure me that he was healthy and that it probably isn't due to his reflux or teeth or whatever since it is really only a night issue and he is not crying all day...

If you going in isn't making it worse, then I would honestly try to give it more than 3 days. Doesn't Ferber give a try-it time frame in his book? It's been a while since I read it, but I think a week? I've heard several cases of it clicking on the 4th or 5th night. So maybe, if you can possibly stand it and going in isn't making it worse, then keep it up for a couple more days??

Otherwise you could try the Baby Whisperer's put up- put down method. I've never tried it, but I know others have had success with it. It seems like most methods work for some babies, a few work for almost no babies, and none works with every baby. Good luck finding the one that's right for the two of you, is all I can say!

kleigh926 · July 2013

I agree with Kelly on trying it longer than 3 days. I didn't read the book, but I researched Ferber online when DD was having issues falling asleep, and I do remember that he says to give it a week. I'm so sorry you're having such a rough time

LyssRob · July 2013

In the book he says that most are sleeping well by 3 or 4 days but you could do up to a week. He says if you see improvement at that point (even if you're not 100% yet) to continue beyond a week.

I guess I just am looking for any type of improvement by 3 days. Last night was only night 1.

LyssRob · July 2013

Also---thanks for all the sympathy! It has been SO hard to function on no sleep and to feel at such a loss...someone wrote in another post, "I can see why some people shake babies" and I totally agree. (Don't worry though, he's safe in my lap happily bumping right now...no brain damage yet!)

ETA...

Unrelated: is anyone else having a siggy problem? This is from before I updated with a new ticker, etc. When I click on the "Update avatar and signature" button what is displaying in my posts is NOT what shows...

Kelly321 (and anyone else who has used Ferber)

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