Opinions please...

Sunday924 · June 2013

Let's say BM and BF are never married. They split during pregnancy, after, or when ever. Who is responsible for BM's medical bills. Not baby's only BM's ( OB visits and hospital stay). Do you think it should be split 50/50?

Ginlyn0 · June 2013

No, It's the mother's medical bills no matter what way you look at it. It's her responsibility. I've never heard of a case in which a father was ordered to pay for bills during pregnancy. I think it falls back on the whole "her body, her choice" thing.

ETA: I have been in similar situation and I paid my medical bills for DD's birth. BD and I were not married.

Annplus1 · June 2013

I personally believe if is related to the pregnancy it should be 50/50. I divorced while pregnant, and the judge did grant it. If its not related then its herresponsibility.

mom2one · June 2013

Ever case I have ever seen it's been split 50/50.

Ginlyn0 · June 2013

Were these divorces? Or court orders after the birth? I'm talking about a non-married father being court ordered to pay for something during the pregnancy. I don't see how that is possible without an invasive DNA test. OP specifically asked about non-married BD's.

MommyEllenSue · June 2013

DH and BM were never married. He was ordered in the CO to pay half of all prenatal and postnatal expenses.

hopanka · June 2013

Definitely fifty fifty. The care the woman is getting is RELATED to pregnancy, if it wasn't for the baby, which is responsibility of BOTH parents, these bills wouldn't incur. If you said, it's the womans body, you would be able to say the same in relation to the baby. As in, it was my choice to keep the baby, not yours, therefore I decide how the baby is raised, what medical care it gets....etc. Since you cannot say that, that argument doesn't hold up during pregnancy either. It is both parents'responsibility.

twister22 · June 2013

hopanka:
Definitely fifty fifty. The care the woman is getting is RELATED to pregnancy, if it wasn't for the baby, which is responsibility of BOTH parents, these bills wouldn't incur. If you said, it's the womans body, you would be able to say the same in relation to the baby. As in, it was my choice to keep the baby, not yours, therefore I decide how the baby is raised, what medical care it gets....etc. Since you cannot say that, that argument doesn't hold up during pregnancy either. It is both parents'responsibility.

While I agree with that mind set, it's not like a BD has any say what a BM does during pregnancy. A BM can smoke, drink, exercise, whatever else you can think of, as much as she wants, and the BD can't stop the BM. So the BM gets to call all the shots while pregnant, but the BD still has to pay half the bills. Like, what is a BM has an elective c-section? Should the BD have to pay for half of that or should he have to pay half of what a vaginal birth would have been since the c-section was elective?

coopsbaby · June 2013

In my own case, exH and I were not married when our oldest child was born and he was court ordered to pay 100% of the medical bills. Wasn't really a big deal since we were engaged and living together. And since I had a c-section with complications (11 day hospital stay!) we were paying that bill off until ds was 7! 50/50 seems fair to me.

Ginlyn0 · June 2013

In pregnancy, the woman gets all the say as that is the law. While a baby is legally both parents a fetus is not according to the current laws. So it seems hypocritical to order a BD to pay for a fetus that isn't his legally. When like PP said a BM makes ALL decisions for a fetus.

And a note just in case anyone wondered, BD and I both wanted DD once we found I was expecting. I just think the ways in which the laws are its hypocritical to expect payment for a pregnancy when a father has no say in any of the care decisions whereas they do once a baby is actually born. That is why my answer is that no it shouldn't be 50/50 that is unless the law were different, which it is not.

Ilumine · June 2013

NOPE. Given that the current laws and ever growing public opinion say that a fetus is not a human being and that the mother alone can decide whether the fetus is brought to birth or not....then it is extremely hypocritical to demand that the father pay for said birth.

Now, I am pro-choice. But with being pro-choice comes the consequences. We cannot demand both.

Pamelacake · June 2013

I was responsible for everything, however I never took BD to court or anything. And I'm sure the laws have changed since then. DD is now 13.

SimpleJane · June 2013

Ilumine:
NOPE. nbsp;Given that the current laws and ever growing public opinion say that a fetus is not a human being and that the mother alone can decide whether the fetus is brought to birth or not....then it is extremely hypocritical to demand that the father pay for said birth.nbsp;Now, I am prochoice. nbsp;But with being prochoice comes the consequences. nbsp;We cannot demand both. nbsp;

I completely agree. We can't say that a woman's body and the fetus inside of it is only her choice and responsibility, and then go ahead and say BD is actually responsible for the cost of medical care.

The way laws are written a man has no legal rights until there is actually a child born. How can we then turn around and say he has legal responsibility to pay for a fetus he has no rights to? You can't have your cake and eat it too.

SimpleJane · June 2013

Ilumine:
NOPE. nbsp;Given that the current laws and ever growing public opinion say that a fetus is not a human being and that the mother alone can decide whether the fetus is brought to birth or not....then it is extremely hypocritical to demand that the father pay for said birth.nbsp;Now, I am prochoice. nbsp;But with being prochoice comes the consequences. nbsp;We cannot demand both. nbsp;

I completely agree. We can't say that a woman's body and the fetus inside of it is only her choice and responsibility, and then go ahead and say BD is actually responsible for the cost of medical care.

The way laws are written a man has no legal rights until there is actually a child born. How can we then turn around and say he has legal responsibility to pay for a fetus he has no rights to? You can't have your cake and eat it too.

fellesferie · June 2013

In my ideal world, since a woman can choose to terminate, I think a father should be able to choose to terminate his paternal rights & responsibilities. But he has the same window of opportunity as the woman.

To answer the OP, I'm kind of of two minds. I think the woman should be 100% responsible since her choices (smoking, poor nutrition, drinking) can increase or lessen the costs associated with her pregnancy. But if the guy wants to have a say, then I think he should pay.

MrsHetzel · June 2013

fellesferie:
In my ideal world, since a woman can choose to terminate, I think a father should be able to choose to terminate his paternal rights amp; responsibilities. But he has the same window of opportunity as the woman.To answer the OP, I'm kind of of two minds. I think the woman should be 100 responsible since her choices smoking, poor nutrition, drinking can increase or lessen the costs associated with her pregnancy. But if the guy wants to have a say, then I think he should pay.nbsp;

Agreed. If a woman can terminate motherhood and its called "pro choice," why can't a man terminate fatherhood without it being called "deadbeat dad".

SimpleJane · June 2013

fellesferie:
In my ideal world, since a woman can choose to terminate, I think a father should be able to choose to terminate his paternal rights amp; responsibilities. But he has the same window of opportunity as the woman.To answer the OP, I'm kind of of two minds. I think the woman should be 100 responsible since her choices smoking, poor nutrition, drinking can increase or lessen the costs associated with her pregnancy. But if the guy wants to have a say, then I think he should pay.nbsp;

I disagree with the first part a lot. Once there is an actual child, both parties who chose the have sex and make that child should be responsible for that child. I don't believe a parent should ever be allowed to sign away rights unless there is another party willing to adopt. It's a human child FFS, someone needs to be held accountable monetarily for its needs. Otherwise we just have more children depending on state and governmental benifits.

As far as before the child is born, a woman gets to decide what she does with her body. Period. She should also be held responsible for the cost of those choices.

fellesferie · June 2013

SimpleJane:
fellesferie:
In my ideal world, since a woman can choose to terminate, I think a father should be able to choose to terminate his paternal rights amp; responsibilities. But he has the same window of opportunity as the woman.To answer the OP, I'm kind of of two minds. I think the woman should be 100 responsible since her choices smoking, poor nutrition, drinking can increase or lessen the costs associated with her pregnancy. But if the guy wants to have a say, then I think he should pay.nbsp;
I disagree with the first part a lot. Once there is an actual child, both parties who chose the have sex and make that child should be responsible for that child. I don't believe a parent should ever be allowed to sign away rights unless there is another party willing to adopt. It's a human child FFS, someone needs to be held accountable monetarily for its needs. Otherwise we just have more children depending on state and governmental benifits. As far as before the child is born, a woman gets to decide what she does with her body. Period. She should also be held responsible for the cost of those choices.

I'm not sure whether we agree or disagree, since I'm not sure of your definition of 'once there is an actual child.' Once the child is born (actually once the abortion window closes) I think both parents are equally responsible. No one should be allowed to abdicate responsibility.

Once a woman can no longer legally terminate, I think a guy should not be able to terminate his rights either. But when women beg for equality, I don't think we should have options that a man doesn't have.

SimpleJane · June 2013

fellesferie:
SimpleJane:
fellesferie:
In my ideal world, since a woman can choose to terminate, I think a father should be able to choose to terminate his paternal rights amp; responsibilities. But he has the same window of opportunity as the woman.To answer the OP, I'm kind of of two minds. I think the woman should be 100 responsible since her choices smoking, poor nutrition, drinking can increase or lessen the costs associated with her pregnancy. But if the guy wants to have a say, then I think he should pay.nbsp;

I disagree with the first part a lot. Once there is an actual child, both parties who chose the have sex and make that child should be responsible for that child. I don't believe a parent should ever be allowed to sign away rights unless there is another party willing to adopt. It's a human child FFS, someone needs to be held accountable monetarily for its needs. Otherwise we just have more children depending on state and governmental benifits.

As far as before the child is born, a woman gets to decide what she does with her body. Period. She should also be held responsible for the cost of those choices.
I'm not sure whether we agree or disagree, since I'm not sure of your definition of 'once there is an actual child.' Once the child is born (actually once the abortion window closes) I think both parents are equally responsible. No one should be allowed to abdicate responsibility.
Once a woman can no longer legally terminate, I think a guy should not be able to terminate his rights either. But when women beg for equality, I don't think we should have options that a man doesn't have.  

For me the difference is if a woman chooses abortion, there is no child being born that will need to be monetarily supported. If the man chooses to sign rights away during that time frame, there will still be a child born who needs to have there needs met, and deserves to have two parents contributing towards them.

hopanka · June 2013

All these people that are advocating for a man's right to not have to pay during pregnancy, or even to have a window of opportunity to terminate his rights after birth are only looking after the ADULTS' rights. Thank goodness we have laws that do not allow them to actually get away with it. Because you are forgetting someone has to be there to protect the innocent CHILD's rights that really don't have the ability to protect their interests. That is why judges order BDs to pay half the medical care during pregnancy and don't allow them to terminate their rights unless somebody is ready to adopt their child. These safety nets are their in order to protect those that cannot protect themselves - innocent babies. Really, douche bag, you made a baby , take care of it. Can you imagine how many more women would have been dead or negatively affected, if they knew nobody would help them pay for half the bill, so they would compromise their care? How many babies would be born with lasting health complications that possibly could have been prevented or helped, if proper care was exercised? How many more kids grown up in poverty because BD had a window of opportunity to terminate his rights after birth and there was no other man willing to adopt them?

CurlyQ284 · June 2013

I think the people who are saying the bills should be only the moms responsibility are nuts. The argument is that mom has total control, dad has no say in the pregnancy. Well he has no say in whether the child is born or not either so...no child support? No? I didn't think so.

If both parents are responsible after he child is born, both parents are responsible for the medical bills as well.

2chatter · June 2013

Very situational for me. If the two are in a consentual relationship and BD agrees the child is his, I think he needs to fund 50% non-elective medical care. If he does not agree that he fathered the child, the court should be able to order 50% of non-elective care after paternity is established. If the woman poked holes in condoms or lied about BC she should be on her own and sterlized (sort of kidding, wish that could happen). Anything elective should be on the mother unless the father agrees (like a 4D US or an elective scheduled C). I would not consider pain management elective, though, and I bet legally it would be. NOT fun.

So I guess for me it comes down to if Dad says "that's my baby" he cannot have his cake and eat it too by saying "but I am not paying the medical expenses for the mother".

2chatter · June 2013

Very situational for me. If the two are in a consentual relationship and BD agrees the child is his, I think he needs to fund 50% non-elective medical care. If he does not agree that he fathered the child, the court should be able to order 50% of non-elective care after paternity is established. If the woman poked holes in condoms or lied about BC she should be on her own and sterlized (sort of kidding, wish that could happen). Anything elective should be on the mother unless the father agrees (like a 4D US or an elective scheduled C). I would not consider pain management elective, though, and I bet legally it would be. NOT fun.

So I guess for me it comes down to if Dad says "that's my baby" he cannot have his cake and eat it too by saying "but I am not paying the medical expenses for the mother".

Annplus1 · June 2013

So if it's the mother's choice, and she should have to pay all the medical expenses relating ONLY to the pregnancy, why should said man have to pay child support? It's the same argument. She chose to have this baby, and he disagreed. So he's completely off the hook for the child?

I believe that if the BM decides to have elective anything that's not in the best interest of the child, that's on her. But normal/emergency incurred costs pertaining directly to the pregnancy should be split. This has nothing to do with pro-life/pro-choice. It's about accepting responsibility for having sex. There is risk with sex, no matter how awesome your birth control is, and every person, man or woman, is aware of that risk.

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