Need Opinions - Overgifting and how to deal...(long, sorry)

CheezeFace · April 2013

So I need to know if I'm being ridiculous and I know you ladies will tell me (gently) if I am.

Background: My BIL/SIL (H's brother and wife) live across the country. We see them maybe once every couple of years. I've never been the biggest fan of BIL but I've always kept it cordial and friendly b/c I rarely see them. H and his brother are friendly enough - talk 3-4 times a month. BIL had a baby boy 3 months after we did. That was an entirely bizarre thing in itself - they didn't tell us they were PG - I found out accidentally when looking at my FIL's photos on his phone and came across an 18wk sonogram that wasn't mine. SIL was about 30 weeks when I found that picture. It was sooo weird. Just strange. Their explanation of not telling us was that they "didn't want to steal our thunder." Because, you know, their genius, perfect child would take all the limelight off of my average-Joe baby. And if you really get to know me you know that I would totally hate you for getting PG at the same time as me. No, I wouldn't want to celebrate this with you, I will choose to be angry with you instead. Seriously? Could they be anymore condescending? But I digress...

(OMG...I just read through that rant. That is either some serious anger I've been holding on to or I need to slow down on the wine)

So, back to my original question...These guys over-gift. By a lot. To the point that it makes me uncomfortable. For example, on DS's 1y bday, they sent about $500 worth of items from his Amazon list. For their DSs 1y bday, I sent a daycare care package (he was beginning daycare for the 1st time) - a cute doggie backpack with his name stitched in it, a matching thermos, and reusable snack containers. I sent custom labels with his name on them for items that he will take to day care. I also sent a "Hi! Cousin" picture of my son wearing a cute locally made Tshirt and sent a matching T-shirt for their son so they could be twins! On top of that I found these really cool Chinese character blocks (his mom is Chinese and he is bi-lingual). So, all in all, a nice gift. Right? Right??

Apparently, there is drama because they feel like they always send more than we do. Which is true. They do. Every time. They spend more than we do. I suppose I could spend $500 on their son but I just feel like it is inappropriate and I don't want to. We aren't destitute but they have 2 incomes vs. our one and I know they out earn us by a pretty big margin. Even if they didn't, I still wouldn't spend that much.

So, do I just let this go and continue to send what I feel like are appropriate gifts? Do I bump up the extravagence? Do I address their generosity? If so, WTF do I say? My H is about as helpful as a bump on a log with this one.

Anyway, thanks for reading....sorry this got so long. Apparently I needed to vent.

CheezeFace · April 2013

Holy cow...Now that I see this in TB form, let me apologize once again. Loooong post. Sorry!

SunAndRain · April 2013

The problem isn't the lopsided gift giving, it is the gossip.

I'm assuming that they have not expressed any feelings on the matter directly to you and that you are going off hearsay. If this is the case I would respond to the gossiper, "perhaps you can encourage sil to speak with me directly if she feels slighted in any way. I don't know what to make of hearsay as misunderstandings happen so easily. Also, next time I talk to her I'll be sure to let her know that you shared her feelings about the gifts with me. I do so appreciate your concern."

And no, you should not give gifts that are outside your comfort zone.

CheezeFace · April 2013

SunAndRain:

The problem isn't the lopsided gift giving, it is the gossip.
I'm assuming that they have not expressed any feelings on the matter directly to you and that you are going off hearsay. If this is the case I would respond to the gossiper, "perhaps you can encourage sil to speak with me directly if she feels slighted in any way. I don't know what to make of hearsay as misunderstandings happen so easily. Also, next time I talk to her I'll be sure to let her know that you shared her feelings about the gifts with me. I do so appreciate your concern."
And no, you should not give gifts that are outside your comfort zone.

Not really gossip. BIL expressed this to H ( who has relatively little to do with any kind of gift sending, etc...). My H just sat there like a deer in the headlights b/c he has no clue what we've received vs. what we've sent. Seriously, if it were up to him, he'd just hand everyone $50 and call it good.

I feel like I need to react in one form or another but I just don't know what to say. It's awkward. And I'd like to avoid the drama.

Good answer if had been gossip though.

JilliansMoma · April 2013

Wow I thought my SIL was strange! Not finding out they are expecting until she is 30 weeks is odd and shame on your MIL snd FIL for not encouraging better communication between their children. ( In my everybody in your business Italian family that would not fly!)

I think that you shouldn't send gifts that are outside your comfort zone. As long as your gifts continue to be well thought out and appropriate I would stick with that. I think your BIL needs to remember the definition of the word gift. It's not your fault they want to spend extravagantly.

GL Cheeze dealing with in-laws can be tricky!

JM

Smudges*Mom · April 2013

It's unfortunate that your BIL & SIL are more concerned with the monetary value of the gifts than the gesture, care and purpose of the gifts. Great values they are modeling for their child. (That was meant to be read with sarcasm, just in case that wasn't clear!)

Continue gifting as you are comfortable. You might want to come up with a response with your DH for the time that his brother revisits this topic--as you know he will because he (BIL) is keeping track.

Good luck. FWIW, it sounds like I'd rather be your kid than theirs!

BrideBuddies · April 2013

Time for your husband to stop being a "deer in headlights" and talk to his bro about this. Lay out some ground rules on spending. $50 for birthdays and the holidays sounds very reasonable to me. Anything over and above will be regifted to a local charity. That might get their attention.

MesmrEwe · April 2013

BrideBuddies:
Time for your husband to stop being a "deer in headlights" and talk to his bro about this. Lay out some ground rules on spending. $50 for birthdays and the holidays sounds very reasonable to me. Anything over and above will be regifted to a local charity. That might get their attention.

I think for your DH to have a discussion like this (flex on the $$ for both parties to agree on) would be totally appropriate!! We've had tight times and we've had generous times when it comes to the gift giving, and as the PP mentioned, only spend what you're comfortable spending. I've got a SIL with two (comfortable) incomes but decided the adults are no longer on the gift list even though we all are "easy" people to shop for. That's HER choice!! We just roll with it... There also have been times when she has overspent and we couldn't afford to do so and had to listen to her wrath about my DH being cheap...

It just sounds like there needs to be a discussion, any discussion, about the elephant before it leaves the Circus!

ELF4321 · April 2013

Your ILs sound even more bizarre than mine. My ILs are definite over-gifters, but not to that extent. Do not change what you are doing. If they feel things are lop-sided, they can cut back on what they spend to an amount that is less obscene.

I also wouldn't say anything about it unless they bring it up to you directly and if they are stupid enough to do that, then just say something like "Of course we/DS appreciate every gift, but we're not in a financial position to reciprocate at that level. We totally understand if you choose to scale back your gifts in the future."

Also, the whole thing about not telling you when they were PG is totally weird. You deserve a good vent!

CheezeFace · April 2013

Thanks, ladies. DH and I had a long drive and time to talk today. I explained the difference in receiving vs. giving and he was a bit shocked. He really didn't know. I suppose he will talk to his brother about it and I'll never hear the outcome...

Not sure how we will handle the situation but I like the suggestion of putting a $ limit on gifts. Maybe we can even take adults off the list?? But I LOVE shopping for people and wrapping and sending off packages! I love it! It is seriously one of my favorite things to do.

I'm sure I'll be on here re-visiting this issue as the Holidays approach once again...yeah, I didn't even mention what happened at Christmas.

Ms.Jade · April 2013

Here's what I would do;

1. Continue to send whatever you feel is appropriate.

2. Be thankful and gracious when you receive huge gifts from them. If they send you kid a pony you would be blown away right? It's ok to express this.

3. Give your husband the following talking points, "We love the gifts you send to DS, but we're just not willing to spend that much on gifts. I hope you'll like what we send even if it doesn't match up to what you send. Do whatever makes you comfortable, and we will do the same."

Especially that last sentence. As long as he can get that out, you're golden.

stever · April 2013

It's lame that they're making drama and I don't think for a second that you should feel bad or expected to send more.

You'd think that they'd be couth enough to just stop getting so much if it made them uncomfortable instead of running around all "OMG! CheezeFace didn't didn't spend as much as I did!!!1!"

anchiba · April 2013

I wonder if there's a cultural thing going on here? I say that because I'm Asian, and although I'm not Chinese (I'm South Asian and China's an East Asian country), there are lots of common elements throughout Asian culture when it comes to pregnancy, raising children, etc.

The gift giving thing is something I've never heard of, though. People might complain about other people's gift giving habits in private, but it's never aired out in public! I would try and ignore your sil's dissatisfaction about your not giving comparably expensive gifts and continue giving gifts in the way that YOU are comfortable with! If you do that, I think it will get the point across that you're not going to participate in her drama. If it continues, then have your husband have a heart-to-heart with his brother. It's ridiculous that you have to be the one addressing all these issues when you're not doing anything wrong!

One thing I do know about pretty much every Asian culture I've ever encountered (and again, I'm Asian myself so I've known many people from around the continent my whole life) is that they're super-duper competitive and people like to out-do each other in all aspects of life, whether it's work or raising a family, so I wonder whether there's that competitive element when it comes to gift giving? I'm not familiar with that, though, so that may not be the case. But it's something to think about.

As for the pregnancy thing, well, that's extremely common! I know that in Southern Asian (Indian subcontinent and surrounding countries) pregnancies are just NOT announced or revealed at all, unless you're showing and someone asks you outright about it. I didn't know about the pregnancies of any of my cousins back in my native country until they were in the hospital getting ready to deliver! It's a bit different here in the U.S. when people like to have baby showers and things like that, but even here no-one talks about being pregnant except with immediate family. This is because there's this long-standing superstition that revealing a pregnancy will leave it open to other people's jealousy, anger, etc., negative emotions which are thought of collectively as the "evil eye" ... seriously! It's kind of funny but this is how it is in pretty much every Asian culture I'm familiar with. In fact, I found out that's the case even in Middle Eastern countries like Egypt. So you find that mindset all over the place. We didn't tell our immediate relatives about being pregnant until I was in the second trimester, and we never told anyone else unless they asked.

Scramblersmom · April 2013

Ms.Jade:
Here's what I would do;
1. Continue to send whatever you feel is appropriate.
2. Be thankful and gracious when you receive huge gifts from them. If they send you kid a pony you would be blown away right? It's ok to express this.
3. Give your husband the following talking points, "We love the gifts you send to DS, but we're just not willing to spend that much on gifts. I hope you'll like what we send even if it doesn't match up to what you send. Do whatever makes you comfortable, and we will do the same."
Especially that last sentence. As long as he can get that out, you're golden.

This is almost exactly what I was going to say so I will just say "ditto". For #3 though I would probably add that you do not have the funds to send gifts that cost that much. I would maybe suggest too that since you are unable to reciprocate at that level that maybe it would be best if they didn't spend as much. If they keep sending gifts that cost $500 regardless of your efforts then just stick with #2.

jlw2505 · April 2013

No way do you meet what they spend and if they have an issue, its THEIR issue. They are making the decision on what to spend. I personally don't even spend as much as you do on gifts. On my side of the family, giving gifts is a very minor thing and we spend around $40 on a gift for the nieces/nephews between 3 families - do the same for siblings and my parents. My parents spend around $60 gifts. On my DH's side, there are less people and they spend more on gifts but DH and I tend to not. We spend around $30-$40 max on each of the nephews and DH and his sibs have never exchanged gifts. I just don't feel that gift giving is a competeition and you spend what you can and what you want to spend.

CheezeFace · April 2013

anchiba:
I wonder if there's a cultural thing going on here?
One thing I do know about pretty much every Asian culture I've ever encountered (and again, I'm Asian myself so I've known many people from around the continent my whole life) is that they're super-duper competitive and people like to out-do each other in all aspects of life, whether it's work or raising a family, so I wonder whether there's that competitive element when it comes to gift giving? I'm not familiar with that, though, so that may not be the case. But it's something to think about.
As for the pregnancy thing, well, that's extremely common! It's kind of funny but this is how it is in pretty much every Asian culture I'm familiar with.
We didn't tell our immediate relatives about being pregnant until I was in the second trimester, and we never told anyone else unless they asked.

Thank you for this. I've wondered about the cultural differences myself. I guess that's part of the reason that I think, maybe, I should bump up the extravegence for this family...I don't want to offend.

Aside from cultural differences, there is a vast difference in socio-economic backgrounds. She is from an extremely wealthy family and is an only child. Mix that upbringing with my loud, brash Irish-Catholic chaotic mess of a family and, well, you can see where things can go sideways very quickly. (Apparently there was a HUGE scene with her at my wedding - I don't even remember the details - I didn't find out about it until weeks afterwards.)

I hope she doesn't feel the need to compete with me. I suppose if you look at us on paper she is the hands-down winner. So, ok. She wins. I'm OK with that. I've always had a much nicer relationship with her than with BIL and it would really bother me if she felt the need to compete with me. I'd rather be friends and supportive of each other.

The pregnancy thing is really interesting and I certainly hadn't thought of it that way. I didn't announce my pregnancy until 5 months and never put it out on social media so I guess I can understand not telling everybody. It still doesn't sit well with me, though. This is probably "Ugly American" syndrome but we aren't just anybody - this is my husband's only surviving brother...we are family. It's good to know that it may not have been so personal, though.

anchiba · April 2013

CheezeFace:
anchiba:
I wonder if there's a cultural thing going on here?
One thing I do know about pretty much every Asian culture I've ever encountered (and again, I'm Asian myself so I've known many people from around the continent my whole life) is that they're super-duper competitive and people like to out-do each other in all aspects of life, whether it's work or raising a family, so I wonder whether there's that competitive element when it comes to gift giving? I'm not familiar with that, though, so that may not be the case. But it's something to think about.
Thank you for this. I've wondered about the cultural differences myself. I guess that's part of the reason that I think, maybe, I should bump up the extravegence for this family...I don't want to offend.
Aside from cultural differences, there is a vast difference in socio-economic backgrounds. She is from an extremely wealthy family and is an only child. Mix that upbringing with my loud, brash Irish-Catholic chaotic mess of a family and, well, you can see where things can go sideways very quickly. (Apparently there was a HUGE scene with her at my wedding - I don't even remember the details - I didn't find out about it until weeks afterwards.)
I hope she doesn't feel the need to compete with me. I suppose if you look at us on paper she is the hands-down winner. So, ok. She wins. I'm OK with that. I've always had a much nicer relationship with her than with BIL and it would really bother me if she felt the need to compete with me. I'd rather be friends and supportive of each other.
The pregnancy thing is really interesting and I certainly hadn't thought of it that way. I didn't announce my pregnancy until 5 months and never put it out on social media so I guess I can understand not telling everybody. It still doesn't sit well with me, though. This is probably "Ugly American" syndrome but we aren't just anybody - this is my husband's only surviving brother...we are family. It's good to know that it may not have been so personal, though.

I'm glad it helped! Don't get me wrong, I'm not an expert on Chinese culture by any means, but many of the things you described about her brought to mind stuff done in other families in my own culture and Asian friends' families.

But cultural differences do NOT excuse her behavior! There's something almost jaw-droppingly manipulative (if that's the right word ... I can't figure out what else it would be) about someone who'd spend $500 on a child's birthday gift and then get ticked off that you didn't do the same. When I first read that I was totally stunned. That just sounds cray-cray to me!

And just because she wants to keep the pregnancy secret from others doesn't mean that her husband has to keep it from his own brother. The only people my husband shared our pregnancy with were his siblings in our native country, as well as his aunt who was like a mother.

So, if I were in your shoes and my husband wasn't doing anything to help the situation, I would just not say anything and go about my own life. Sometimes I think these kinds of people just thrive on the drama. We have so many relatives who seem to need major drama in their lives that we have nothing to do with them -- this is a big no-no in Asian cultures but we figure our peace and sanity is worth more than giving into them.

I just feel sorry for your brother-in-law and your nephew. Imagine having to live with someone like that.

KateLouise · April 2013

Personally I wouldn't set $$ limits with them, or anyone. What you spend on any gift is entirely your affair, and your own choosing. Plus if you're like me, it quite possibly varies from year to year, for all sorts of reasons.

If it was me, I would say, "We spend what is a comfortable amount for our budget. It is no reflection of our love and care for nephew. We appreciate any gift we receive and we have no expectations of how much you should spend. We have noticed the imbalance in spending and we've been uncomfortable with it, but not known how to address it, but again we have a budget for gifts that we stick to."

FWIW I think it's insanely rude for them to comment to you on how much you spend. They get to choose how much they spend. If they feel slighted and prefer to reduce their spending on gifts as a result, that's up to them, but to actually tell someone off for not spending enough on gifts is just rude..

LaurelBee · April 2013

Fwiw, I think the gift you sent sounds absolutely adorable and I would've loved to receive something so thoughtful.

Bigboneded · April 2013

I am an overspender, I have always done it when I can. It gives me joy. But I never expect the like in return. 1 exception. The millionaire boyfriend who told me how successful he was frequently then mentioned he pawn store shopped my jewelry. It is the only time I've taken offense. Seriously. I felt he had just bargain shelved the girlfriend, ME! Give what is comfortable. Talk to them or send the message back through BIL that you are great full and can't hope to keep up. That they are important to you and their son is loved. And hope for the best.... They live far away, right?::smiles::

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Need Opinions - Overgifting and how to deal...(long, sorry)

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