Natural IVF -- crazy?

brooklynesque · February 2013

So, despite my recent complete fail, my new RE still recommends that I try a cycle or two of natural (no stim) IVF to see if my eggs mature on their own in a normal cycle -- if so, this might be a path that could actually work for me. Part of me really wants to know what happens, so I just signed on for an April cycle. The other part of me thinks I'm completely nuts to want to spend serious money ($10k per cycle, or slightly less for a package of 3) on something that has a relatively low chance of success even under the best circumstances. I'm scared I'm deluding myself continuing to try with my OE and worried about prolonging the heartbreak. Have any of you ladies ever tried the so-called natural IVF or have thoughts about it? I know that New Hope and some others specialize in it. My new RE only does it in a small percentage of cycles.

PrettyAccountant · February 2013

Did you dr give you a reason why he wanted to try a natural cycle? Is it just to see if they mature on their own? To me it sounds counter-intuitive but I am the "throw everything you got at it" type of person. We just had success on the board with a low dose cycle (again sounds counter-intuitive to me) but the proof was in the results. How many eggs does he think he will get with a natural cycle?

Obviously I have no experience with natural IVF cycles since all of my cycle was high dose cycles but I wish you luck in whatever you choose.

hootie123 · February 2013

Personally I've never been a fan of the concept of it. But in certain circumstances - severe DOR or severe MFI I can see its usefulness. But once you said $10K per cycle I think its crazy - especially since you would most likely need to do multiple cycles.

brooklynesque · February 2013

PrettyAccountant:
Did you dr give you a reason why he wanted to try a natural cycle? Is it just to see if they mature on their own? To me it sounds counter-intuitive but I am the "throw everything you got at it" type of person. We just had success on the board with a low dose cycle (again sounds counter-intuitive to me) but the proof was in the results. How many eggs does he think he will get with a natural cycle?
Obviously I have no experience with natural IVF cycles since all of my cycle was high dose cycles but I wish you luck in whatever you choose.

Yes, it's to see if my eggs mature on their own with natural stim and natural surge. I think the expectation is that we'd only get one egg per cycle, maybe two if we're really lucky. The theory pushed by the places that specialize in natural IVF is that the egg that reaches maturity each month tends to be the best one, so for DOR women who don't produce many eggs anyway it's actually not that much less effective than regular IVF. I'm not severe DOR but I've got a similar problem of only producing 1 mature egg per IVF cycle (along with 5-8 immature eggs, sigh) even on full stims. Of course, some REs think it's not worth doing at all. But the reason I picked this new RE and practice is their reputation for being a bit creative.

brooklynesque · February 2013

hootie123:
Personally I've never been a fan of the concept of it. But in certain circumstances - severe DOR or severe MFI I can see its usefulness. But once you said $10K per cycle I think its crazy - especially since you would most likely need to do multiple cycles.

It is crazy, right? It's around $20k for three cycles, so that's a bit better, but still ... I had always been under the impression that one of the big advantages people cite for natural IVF was that it was a lot cheaper than regular high-stim IVF. Of course I won't be paying for drugs (which in my case are $6-8k) but the base fee doesn't seem a lot lower than regular IVF.

DoublePortion · February 2013

I have no advice on natural IVF, but that does seem expensive to me too. I hope you are able to find someone who has done it before. Best of luck & hugs!

joules12 · February 2013

I'm not sure if you know my story or not...if so, I apologize for the rehash! I've never done natural IVF, but I did recently do a low-stim IVF and had our best cycle ever.

I'm DOR...my numbers (in siggie) aren't awful, but I seem to respond more poorly than many others on here with numbers equal to/worse than mine. The details for all my cycles are also in my siggie. Although the protocols for my prior IVF cycles each varied, I always stimmed with 600IU of Follistim. The outcomes ranged from cancellation for poor response to BFP with a chromosomally abnormal embryo to BFN. Our retrieval/mature egg rate was always pretty bad and our fertilization rate was always lousy -- never more than 1 fertilized embryo.

Our old RE had already started talking DE while I was in the midst of stimming for my final IVF cycle there. DH and an IFVet friend convinced me to get a second opinion from a new RE prior to moving on to DE. New RE specializes in DOR and high FSH (which I'm actually not) patients and, for these patients, he usually opts for low-stim cycles (not sure if he does natural cycles as well, but I would guess he does). A few other Vets have cycled with him both in- and out-of-state. I truly had little to no faith that the low stim cycle would work (why would it if the high stims didn't?!). Well, apparently in my case, I was wrong and low stims were the ticket for me. As for E2 levels and follicle counts while stimming, I responded same as or better than my prior cycles. We got a great haul of eggs (5, all mature) and that's without them being able to my right ovary (which had several mature follicles). We also had the best fert rate we've ever seen -- 4 embryos. We transferred 3 and I'm just over 6 weeks pregnant with twins (still a long way to go, but everything is already going remarkably better than during my missed m/c cycle). I have no idea if this cycle was a fluke, or if my RE (who is, admittedly, rather eccentric) is correct and my body really does produce better eggs with low stims.

Of note, my low-stim cycle (excluding meds, including ICSI and AH) was significantly less than $10,000. DH and I figured that, as long as I could handle it emotionally, we were probably willing to try a few low-stim cycles since it cost so much less than our other options.

I know it's not quite the same as a natural cycle, but I hope this might help a bit. Wishing you all the best, brooklynesque, and hoping that a natural cycle is your ticket to a sticky BFP!

kinarlva · February 2013

I'm sorry that you are having such a tough time.

I have DOR 0.01, so undetectable, and I'm currently about 6 weeks pregnant thanks to my first Natural Cycle IVF. It was so easy, and you can do it month after month if you need to. Hopefully you won't need to!

I never did any stimulated cycles, but I did 3 clomid + triggers when I was trying for my son 3 years ago. I never got more than 1 or 2 follicles with the Clomid.

My RE has been doing it for years, and it's a good portion of his practice. I do think that $10k sounds like a high price. I paid $4400 for all monitoring, the retrieval, ICSI, and transfer. They had to do assisted hatching, so that was an extra $500. Where are you located? Can you travel? I'm in DC.

brooklynesque · February 2013

joules12:
I'm not sure if you know my story or not...if so, I apologize for the rehash! I've never done natural IVF, but I did recently do a low-stim IVF and had our best cycle ever.
I'm DOR...my numbers (in siggie) aren't awful, but I seem to respond more poorly than many others on here with numbers equal to/worse than mine. The details for all my cycles are also in my siggie. Although the protocols for my prior IVF cycles each varied, I always stimmed with 600IU of Follistim. The outcomes ranged from cancellation for poor response to BFP with a chromosomally abnormal embryo to BFN. Our retrieval/mature egg rate was always pretty bad and our fertilization rate was always lousy -- never more than 1 fertilized embryo.
Our old RE had already started talking DE while I was in the midst of stimming for my final IVF cycle there. DH and an IFVet friend convinced me to get a second opinion from a new RE prior to moving on to DE. New RE specializes in DOR and high FSH (which I'm actually not) patients and, for these patients, he usually opts for low-stim cycles (not sure if he does natural cycles as well, but I would guess he does). A few other Vets have cycled with him both in- and out-of-state. I truly had little to no faith that the low stim cycle would work (why would it if the high stims didn't?!). Well, apparently in my case, I was wrong and low stims were the ticket for me. As for E2 levels and follicle counts while stimming, I responded same as or better than my prior cycles. We got a great haul of eggs (5, all mature) and that's without them being able to my right ovary (which had several mature follicles). We also had the best fert rate we've ever seen -- 4 embryos. We transferred 3 and I'm just over 6 weeks pregnant with twins (still a long way to go, but everything is already going remarkably better than during my missed m/c cycle). I have no idea if this cycle was a fluke, or if my RE (who is, admittedly, rather eccentric) is correct and my body really does produce better eggs with low stims.
Of note, my low-stim cycle (excluding meds, including ICSI and AH) was significantly less than $10,000. DH and I figured that, as long as I could handle it emotionally, we were probably willing to try a few low-stim cycles since it cost so much less than our other options.
I know it's not quite the same as a natural cycle, but I hope this might help a bit. Wishing you all the best, brooklynesque, and hoping that a natural cycle is your ticket to a sticky BFP!

Joules: Thanks so much for responding. First of all, HUGE congrats on your twins; sending sticky, healthy, and happy vibes your way. I'm so glad the low-stim method worked for you; the difference in response you describe is amazing. I'm going to ask my new RE about this option. Do you go to Dr. C.heck? What was your dose of stims? All Follistim/Gonal-F, or Menopur too?

brooklynesque · February 2013

kinarlva:
I'm sorry that you are having such a tough time.
I have DOR 0.01, so undetectable, and I'm currently about 6 weeks pregnant thanks to my first Natural Cycle IVF. It was so easy, and you can do it month after month if you need to. Hopefully you won't need to!
I never did any stimulated cycles, but I did 3 clomid + triggers when I was trying for my son 3 years ago. I never got more than 1 or 2 follicles with the Clomid.
My RE has been doing it for years, and it's a good portion of his practice. I do think that $10k sounds like a high price. I paid $4400 for all monitoring, the retrieval, ICSI, and transfer. They had to do assisted hatching, so that was an extra $500. Where are you located? Can you travel? I'm in DC.

Thanks for posting, and congrats. I'm in NYC, so DC would be kind of a haul. Are you at Dominion? I know they specialize in natural IVF.

joules12 · February 2013

brooklynesque:
Joules: Thanks so much for responding. First of all, HUGE congrats on your twins; sending sticky, healthy, and happy vibes your way. I'm so glad the low-stim method worked for you; the difference in response you describe is amazing. I'm going to ask my new RE about this option. Do you go to Dr. C.heck? What was your dose of stims? All Follistim/Gonal-F, or Menopur too?

Certainly!!! (and thanks so much for the congrats and wonderful vibes!) Yeah, we were very surprised by how well things went -- I was in a bit of shock when the embryologist called with our first fert report. Yes, I go to Dr. C.heck. I started on 150IU of Follistim which was bumped to 225IU after a few days. I eventually added in 75IU Menopur and a syringe of Ganirelix (I don't have my notes here for details on how many days on each; if that's something you'd be interested in, please let me know). He had me use Follistim vs another product and Menopur vs another product purely because I already had both on hand.

kinarlva · February 2013

Yes, I'm at Dominion. According to my Dr., most of their patients who get pregnant, do so within two transfers.

Maybe you could check into monitoring in the city, and then come to DC for the retrieval. They do a 3dt. I've seen others who have done this on their blog/website. It's called fertile grounds, if you want to check it out.

Good luck!

Natural IVF -- crazy?

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