no AP at daycare :(

abadab · January 2013

My daughter is 11 months old and has been in daycare since she was 6 months old. I love my daycare provider - she cloth diapers for me, she was on board with baby led weaning... but I'm having a hard time with the "she needs to learn independence" thing.

My daughter has been having a rough few days - she's teething, and kind of gassy lately - so she's been crying a lot and wanting to be held. I totally understand that the daycare provider (who has 5 other children in her care from ages 1.5 to about 2.5) cannot carry her around all day. But she says things like "well, I know she wants to be held, but it's okay to fuss a little. She'll learn independence." Um, my child can happily entertain herself for up to an hour when she feels good. This is not a matter of fostering independence. Basically, she's trying to get her to self-soothe. Isn't 11 months a little young for that? I feel like if she is climbing up the provider's leg to be held, for goodness sake, hold the child!

Am I wrong? Is she at an age where she should be able to deal with this on her own? Any tips for bringing it up with the daycare provider?

BelhurstBride · January 2013

Is that legal? Here it's illegal for one adult to be responsible for more than 5 children ages 18-36 months in a daycare setting.

If she can't pick up/hold/carry your child around because she's busy with the other children that's one thing, but to say she won't do it in an attempt to foster independence is another. IMO.

ETA: Even if it is legal it goes against what the leading authorities on child development recommend.

For example, NAEYC recommends 1 adult to every 4 children with a group no larger than 8 children for children between 21-36 months. For children 12-28 months the recommendation is one adult for every three children with groups no larger than 6 children total. With groups of mixed ages you're supposed to go by the regulations for the youngest age, so in your case that care provider should only have 3 children.

kcisthebombdotcom · January 2013

BelhurstBride:
Is that legal? Here it's illegal for one adult to be responsible for more than 5 children ages 18-36 months in a daycare setting.
If she can't pick up/hold/carry your child around because she's busy with the other children that's one thing, but to say she won't do it in an attempt to foster independence is another. IMO.
ETA: Even if it is legal it goes against what the leading authorities on child development recommend.
For example, NAEYC recommends 1 adult to every 4 children with a group no larger than 8 children for children between 21-36 months. For children 12-28 months the recommendation is one adult for every three children with groups no larger than 6 children total. With groups of mixed ages you're supposed to go by the regulations for the youngest age, so in your case that care provider should only have 3 children.

I agree with this. In your shoes I would attempt to find a different daycare setting so someone could give my child the appropriate attention. 6 children aged 1-2.5 is far too many for one person to handle and give them all adequate attention.

Ilumine · January 2013

abadab:
My daughter is 11 months old and has been in daycare since she was 6 months old. I love my daycare provider - she cloth diapers for me, she was on board with baby led weaning... but I'm having a hard time with the "she needs to learn independence" thing.
My daughter has been having a rough few days - she's teething, and kind of gassy lately - so she's been crying a lot and wanting to be held. I totally understand that the daycare provider (who has 5 other children in her care from ages 1.5 to about 2.5) cannot carry her around all day. But she says things like "well, I know she wants to be held, but it's okay to fuss a little. She'll learn independence." Um, my child can happily entertain herself for up to an hour when she feels good. This is not a matter of fostering independence. Basically, she's trying to get her to self-soothe. Isn't 11 months a little young for that? I feel like if she is climbing up the provider's leg to be held, for goodness sake, hold the child!
Am I wrong? Is she at an age where she should be able to deal with this on her own? Any tips for bringing it up with the daycare provider?

Honestly, if your 11 month old is crawling up your caregiver's leg for comfort, then she needs to be with you then.

WHY, because by 11 months, your child should be (if she is following the developmental standards) able to self-sooth. Because developmentally, they are becomding independent.

They have likes/dislikes. They are now truely communicating their wants vs needs. They have the cognitive level to understand permanance of items. ANd they can understand simple instructions. Heck, if they can now walk, they should be able to self sooth a bit.

https://www.webmd.com/parenting/baby/baby-development-11-month-old

https://www.mayoclinic.com/health/infant-development/FL00101

https://www.babycentre.co.uk/a715/your-11-month-olds-development

I understand that you are hurting because your baby is hurting. But taking apart your specific situation, your daughter is in pain. A daycare, no matter HOW AP focused it is, is not going to provide the full hands on approach you want.

However, taking the pain part out, your DCP is correct, in that by 11 mo, she should be doing more indpendent self-soothing.

JessieJH · January 2013

I agree with other posters- 6 kids is a lot for one person. Our's limit to 3-4 per person and we have been fortunate in that our LO gets held a lot as the other kids are more into doing their own thing. If your LO is in pain I would try to stay home during those rough periods and I think finding a daycare with a better ratio- perhaps also a Montessori where they are more AP friendly- would help.

aglenn · January 2013

I think some of the responses are coming across as if your child is always needing to be held 24/7, which it did not sound like was the case from your post. You did say she is fine playing independently when she is not feeling bad.

That said, I agree that the issue is the day care situation itself. It is super hard to care for that many kids of different ages with different schedules and needs on a good day, let alone the inevitable times when one or more are feeling off. It is also not reasonable to stay home from work every time your baby is less than 100%. I would be out of work more than I am in if I did that. I think you should look for a provider with a lower ratio, or potentially a center where your child would be among others her own age instead of a mixed group. The babies in the infant room in our center get a lot of holding when they are not feeling well, because they are babies and the teachers know that is what they need. They are able to juggle it all very well and there are extra hands available to them to pull into the room as needed when things get crazy (other teachers who float from room to room, directors and assistant directors, etc.). Just some things to think about.

BelhurstBride · January 2013

Really? PPs really think a teething 11 month should be capable of just dealing? That's a pretty miserably experience.

BelhurstBride · January 2013

kbruington:
BelhurstBride:
Really? PPs really think a teething 11 month should be capable of just dealing? That's a pretty miserably experience.

Most everyone has acknowledged and commented on ways to HELP with teething and not just "dealing". I think most people are agreeing that an 11 month old, aside from having an illness, should be able to self-soothe on some level.

Maybe it's just my kid but teething in this house is right up there with illness. She ends up with a fever, diarrhea, stuffiness, coughing... in fact, she's never been more sick than when she's teething. I'd be pretty POed at a daycare provider- that I pay to care for my kid- to turn around and tell me she needs to "self soothe."

Temp123197812503460 · January 2013

I'm confused as to what you want your daycare provider to do, she has 5 other kids to take care of! Surely she can't be picking up your daughter every time she is pulling at her leg. Heck, im AP with my kids and there are times one crys because I have to deal with the other and that's just two kids.I understand you would like her to pick her up and comfort her when she is sick or hurt but if that's what you want I would suggest looking for a nanny or at least a provider with many fewer kids. Her saying your daughter needs to self sooth may be partially frustration about not being able to properly care for 6 kids at once.

kcisthebombdotcom · January 2013

Ilumine:
abadab:
My daughter is 11 months old and has been in daycare since she was 6 months old. I love my daycare provider - she cloth diapers for me, she was on board with baby led weaning... but I'm having a hard time with the "she needs to learn independence" thing.
My daughter has been having a rough few days - she's teething, and kind of gassy lately - so she's been crying a lot and wanting to be held. I totally understand that the daycare provider (who has 5 other children in her care from ages 1.5 to about 2.5) cannot carry her around all day. But she says things like "well, I know she wants to be held, but it's okay to fuss a little. She'll learn independence." Um, my child can happily entertain herself for up to an hour when she feels good. This is not a matter of fostering independence. Basically, she's trying to get her to self-soothe. Isn't 11 months a little young for that? I feel like if she is climbing up the provider's leg to be held, for goodness sake, hold the child!
Am I wrong? Is she at an age where she should be able to deal with this on her own? Any tips for bringing it up with the daycare provider?

Honestly, if your 11 month old is crawling up your caregiver's leg for comfort, then she needs to be with you then.
WHY, because by 11 months, your child should be (if she is following the developmental standards) able to self-sooth. Because developmentally, they are becomding independent.
They have likes/dislikes. They are now truely communicating their wants vs needs. They have the cognitive level to understand permanance of items. ANd they can understand simple instructions. Heck, if they can now walk, they should be able to self sooth a bit.
https://www.webmd.com/parenting/baby/baby-development-11-month-old
https://www.mayoclinic.com/health/infant-development/FL00101
https://www.babycentre.co.uk/a715/your-11-month-olds-development
I understand that you are hurting because your baby is hurting. But taking apart your specific situation, your daughter is in pain. A daycare, no matter HOW AP focused it is, is not going to provide the full hands on approach you want.
However, taking the pain part out, your DCP is correct, in that by 11 mo, she should be doing more indpendent self-soothing.

In none of those articles did I read that when a child was in pain they should be able to self soothe and not require more attention. My 2 year old wasn't feeling good yesterday and requested to be held a lot more than usual. That is on par for development of an 11 month old...or significantly older.

It seems like the child is developing a sense of independence. I understand that no daycare worker is going to be able to meet a child's needs 100% of the time that exact instant--even though I'm a SAHM this happens all the time even when I only had one infant. There is a distinct difference between telling a child to wait for a minute since you're tending to another child and ignoring them to teach them the concept of self soothing when ill since you're taking on more than you can handle. If it's not illegal to run a daycare that way, it's certaintly unethical since you can't properly meet the needs of 6 children under 3 at once, AP or not.

It's not reasonable to say a parent should just stay home whenever their child is in sick/pain. If I ever had to work a full time job to support my family and I practiced this, I'd be fired in under 2 months especially with kids in the 6-24 month range. Teething was a b!tch for us.

HennieLee · January 2013

I'm normally a lurker, as I'm still pregnant with my first little one, but I would directly ask my daycare provider if she makes the distinction between when my child is sick and needs attention vs. when she simply wants to be held.

I would not expect my daycare provider to provide AP like I hope to, but I would expect her to meet the needs of my sick child. And I would worry that five other little ones are too many. I don't see how she could really meet the needs of half that many children, especially if one of them is not feeling well.

dande2129 · January 2013

HennieLee:
I would not expect my daycare provider to provide AP like I hope to, but I would expect her to meet the needs of my sick child.

I agree with this, but at the same time, if your child is truly ill, then she shouldn't be at daycare. I keep DS home on days when he isn't feeling well and needs the extra attention that I know his daycare, which I absolutely LOVE, can't give him.

I don't agree with the daycare provider that an illness should equate to self soothing. I find that it's a different circumstance, but there's only so much she can do with 5 other children in her care.

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no AP at daycare :(

Re: no AP at daycare :(

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