what makes you believe in God?

ridesbuttons · October 2012

I honestly don't get it. What moves you to accept the notion of a God?

Ms5586 · October 2012

IrishCoffee7:

Well this is out of left field.

Quite! But to answer, faith, and hindsight. It's as simple as that for me.

klondikebar · October 2012

IrishCoffee7:

Well this is out of left field.

If by left field you mean a post about God with 60 replies halfway down the page:)

Mrs.Dreamy · October 2012

Faith.

ridesbuttons · October 2012

twatley:
When I was a believer I believed partly because I was raised to, but mostly out of fear. I was terrified of dying and the thought of going some place "better" appealed to me much more than just being dead.

I always said that I believed because there was nothing to lose in believing if God doesn't exist, but everything to lose if he does. Then one day I realized that I was just afraid of dying and that if Heaven really was real that my half-assed faith wasn't going to get me there.

I'd be willing to bet most people who believe in God do it out of fear of death. I doubt many believers would admit that though.

I have thought this as well. That if I pretend to believe, and there is a God, He would obviously know and so I'd be done for anyway.

But I don't believe. I can't make myself believe even though it is far easier to argue for the existence of a God than against.

pearblossom · October 2012

twatley:

I'd be willing to bet most people who believe in God do it out of fear of death. I doubt many believers would admit that though.

This doesn't seem like a very fair thing to say. It seems like you're implying that if one would just think better or hard enough, they would come to the right (your) conclusion. I do get where you're coming from, but I would not go so far as to tar most believers with that brush.

Personally, I'm torn. Sometimes I think I can see God in the beauty and order of life, and in squishy babies that grow up to be people with the wondrous workings of a human mind. But it could very well be that we just live in an amazing world, and there isn't anything more to it than that.

ETA the word not.

klondikebar · October 2012

twatley:
When I was a believer I believed partly because I was raised to, but mostly out of fear. I was terrified of dying and the thought of going some place "better" appealed to me much more than just being dead.

I always said that I believed because there was nothing to lose in believing if God doesn't exist, but everything to lose if he does. Then one day I realized that I was just afraid of dying and that if Heaven really was real that my half-assed faith wasn't going to get me there.

I'd be willing to bet most people who believe in God do it out of fear of death. I doubt many believers would admit that though.

I was raised to believe, but I never did. I kept that to myself as a child. I felt scared and obligated to go along with my family. I think DH held onto his beliefs longer than I did b/c he has a tremendous fear of death.

alli&dan · October 2012

twatley:
When I was a believer I believed partly because I was raised to, but mostly out of fear. I was terrified of dying and the thought of going some place "better" appealed to me much more than just being dead.

I always said that I believed because there was nothing to lose in believing if God doesn't exist, but everything to lose if he does. Then one day I realized that I was just afraid of dying and that if Heaven really was real that my half-assed faith wasn't going to get me there.

I'd be willing to bet most people who believe in God do it out of fear of death. I doubt many believers would admit that though.

Pretty much this, word for word. There are a lot of time that I want to believe, but I can't. It would be much easier if I was a believer.

ridesbuttons · October 2012

With nothing to back me up on this, I feel fairly certain that Hell is not on many Christian's minds. I reckon they think God will be forgiving if they simply ask for forgiveness and all will be good.

ridesbuttons · October 2012

ashleysyn2:
Pascal's wager, pretty much.

That's the one!

MrsGoodkat · October 2012

I think it really does just come down to faith. I believe in a higher power of some sort. I'm very spiritual. I believe in life after death. I don't necessarily believe that the Bible is the word of God to live by. I don't believe that not knowing Jesus Christ means you're doomed to hell. I find some comfort in the Christian faith but it comes more from wanting to be like Christ was, to be kind and help those in need. Not live by the word of the much-interpreted Bible.

There are many reasons I'm spiritual but one that always comes to mind is when my grandmother died. We'd held a bed side vigil for days in the hospital. She died around 5 a.m. on a Saturday morning, at a time when everyone in the room (my mom, sister, aunt, and uncle) had all fallen asleep. At the moment she died both my brother and I were woken at home. We both got up out of bed and it was shortly after that my mom arrived home and told us she'd passed. I'll always believe, whether it's true or not, that her spirit came to our house at that time and it's why we both woke up at the exact same time. It may sound silly to some people but I find a lot of comfort in it. And there are a lot of other instances that I can just feel the presence of my loved ones there, guiding me. I think the way I feel them is the way some people feel God.

EVA116 · October 2012

I hate when people say that God is just a false sense of security for people who are afraid to die.

Death is a huge deal and I believe that a human soul does not just end. I think that each person can have an individual relationship with God. I do not believe you have to practice religion a certain way in order to get to heaven.

I think it is just as hard for me to try and understand how someone can believe that we just stop exisiting.

Did any of that make sense? Did I even answer the question?

Oh and I do not think that God intended for anyone to be an agnostic. He allows free will and he will make himself known to you many times in your life. He allows for you to choose Him. He does not hide. ie: this post

pearblossom · October 2012

twatley:
pearblossom:
twatley:

I'd be willing to bet most people who believe in God do it out of fear of death. I doubt many believers would admit that though.
This doesn't seem like a very fair thing to say. It seems like you're implying that if one would just think better or hard enough, they would come to the right (your) conclusion. I do get where you're coming from, but I would not go so far as to tar most believers with that brush.
Personally, I'm torn. Sometimes I think I can see God in the beauty and order of life, and in squishy babies that grow up to be people with the wondrous workings of a human mind. But it could very well be that we just live in an amazing world, and there isn't anything more to it than that.
ETA the word not.
You're right, it's probably not fair for me to say, but I do really believe that. Christians are so focused on what is going to get them to Heaven and keep them out of Hell. I just have a hard time believing the afterlife not to be a huge driving force behind their beliefs.
How many followers do you think Christianity would have if you took Heaven and Hell out of the equation?

That's a good question, and I have no idea what the answer would be. I don't really care about Heaven or Hell. So I'm guilty of the same thing, assuming that a bunch of believers are coming from the same place I am.

alli&dan · October 2012

twatley:
ridesbuttons:
With nothing to back me up on this, I feel fairly certain that Hell is not on many Christian's minds. I reckon they think God will be forgiving if they simply ask for forgiveness and all will be good.

Oh, but not if they don't believe! Which is why I believe they believe.

And then there's purgatory, which I have a really hard time reconciling with.

klondikebar · October 2012

EVA116:

I hate when people say that God is just a false sense of security for people who are afraid to die.

Death is a huge deal and I believe that a human soul does not just end. I think that each person can have an individual relationship with God. I do not believe you have to practice religion a certain way in order to get to heaven.

I think it is just as hard for me to try and understand how someone can believe that we just stop exisiting.

Did any of that make sense? Did I even answer the question?

Oh and I do not think that God intended for anyone to be an agnostic. He allows free will and he will make himself known to you many times in your life. He allows for you to choose Him. He does not hide. ie: this post

There is absolutely nothing that indicates there is life after death. That's why I believe our existence ends when we die.

pepomntpat · October 2012

Faith, prayer, conversation, study, thinking hard, personal experiences. I find it impossible not to believe.

That said, I do not believe everything the church believes. I've had to form my own set of beliefs and faith and values that are mostly based on Christianity. But, I am far, far, far from a fundamentalist. I just can't believe that way.

ridesbuttons · October 2012

I consider death to be a certainty and since every living thing is destined to die, it is the opposite of a huge deal. It is inevitable. We are all going to die. Our brains will stop functioning, we will all rot away down to our elements no different than a tree or a squirrel or a cockroach.

Believing that we are somehow omnipotent because our souls have a perpetual existence seems to suggest that we are infinite, just like God is infinite. How can that be?

EVA116 · October 2012

KlondikeBar:
EVA116:

I hate when people say that God is just a false sense of security for people who are afraid to die.

Death is a huge deal and I believe that a human soul does not just end. I think that each person can have an individual relationship with God. I do not believe you have to practice religion a certain way in order to get to heaven.

I think it is just as hard for me to try and understand how someone can believe that we just stop exisiting.

Did any of that make sense? Did I even answer the question?

Oh and I do not think that God intended for anyone to be an agnostic. He allows free will and he will make himself known to you many times in your life. He allows for you to choose Him. He does not hide. ie: this post

There is absolutely nothing that indicates there is life after death. That's why I believe our existence ends when we die.

Are there things to indicate there isn't?

pepomntpat · October 2012

ridesbuttons:
I consider death to be a certainty and since every living thing is destined to die, it is the opposite of a huge deal. It is inevitable. We are all going to die. Our brains will stop functioning, we will all rot away down to our elements no different than a tree or a squirrel or a cockroach.

Believing that we are somehow omnipotent because our souls have a perpetual existence seems to suggest that we are infinite, just like God is infinite. How can that be?

That's a question of faith and is often where the conversation breaks down between believers and non believers. It is really hard to explain faith logically. I do think it is a mistake to think that faith is based only on what happens after we die. It has a lot more to do with what happens in our lives right now. At least for me.

EVA116 · October 2012

ridesbuttons:

I consider death to be a certainty and since every living thing is destined to die, it is the opposite of a huge deal. It is inevitable. We are all going to die. Our brains will stop functioning, we will all rot away down to our elements no different than a tree or a squirrel or a cockroach.

Believing that we are somehow omnipotent because our souls have a perpetual existence seems to suggest that we are infinite, just like God is infinite. How can that be?

That is God's gift to you as a believer. That is what Christians wish to attain. Life after death is what is preached because we will spend eternity there....death is a big deal to Christians because life becomes eternal after death.

EVA116 · October 2012

pepomntpat:
ridesbuttons:

I consider death to be a certainty and since every living thing is destined to die, it is the opposite of a huge deal. It is inevitable. We are all going to die. Our brains will stop functioning, we will all rot away down to our elements no different than a tree or a squirrel or a cockroach.

Believing that we are somehow omnipotent because our souls have a perpetual existence seems to suggest that we are infinite, just like God is infinite. How can that be?

That's a question of faith and is often where the conversation breaks down between believers and non believers. It is really hard to explain faith logically. I do think it is a mistake to think that faith is based only on what happens after we die. It has a lot more to do with what happens in our lives right now. At least for me.

yes

ridesbuttons · October 2012

EVA116:
pepomntpat:
ridesbuttons:

I consider death to be a certainty and since every living thing is destined to die, it is the opposite of a huge deal. It is inevitable. We are all going to die. Our brains will stop functioning, we will all rot away down to our elements no different than a tree or a squirrel or a cockroach.

Believing that we are somehow omnipotent because our souls have a perpetual existence seems to suggest that we are infinite, just like God is infinite. How can that be?

That's a question of faith and is often where the conversation breaks down between believers and non believers. It is really hard to explain faith logically. I do think it is a mistake to think that faith is based only on what happens after we die. It has a lot more to do with what happens in our lives right now. At least for me.

yes

Faith seems to be impossible to explain logically which is odd since it is very easy to explain God through logic and most of the great Western Thinkers have done so.

jcsumm0 · October 2012

I will preface this by saying that I have a lot of doubts. I not a perfect Christian. I was raised Catholic, and while I have a lot of problems with things the church has done and believes, that is where I feel most comfortable going to church.

There are a lot of things that go into my faith. But I'll mention 2 of them. One is that a human being is not the same as a bug, as twatley said. We have conciousness, we have a "spirit" that is more than just flesh and blood. What happens to that spirit when we die? Do we go to heaven and sit around and sing with angels on white fluffy clouds like in the movies? I don't think so. But I think our spirit doesn't just disappear either. I think that spirit goes to be with God, in a way that humans can't understand right now.

The other thing I'll say is that when my daughter was extremely sick after she was born, and we didn't know what was wrong with her or what was happening, I experienced what I can only describe as a "peace that passeth understanding." I just had this peace that God was holding her in the palm of his hand. And no matter what happened, things were going to be ok. That is the only time I've experienced something like that, and my faith tells me that was God.

I also agree with pemonpat when she said that is very much about our lives right now and not just what happens when we die.

EVA116 · October 2012

twatley:
EVA116:
ridesbuttons:

I consider death to be a certainty and since every living thing is destined to die, it is the opposite of a huge deal. It is inevitable. We are all going to die. Our brains will stop functioning, we will all rot away down to our elements no different than a tree or a squirrel or a cockroach.

Believing that we are somehow omnipotent because our souls have a perpetual existence seems to suggest that we are infinite, just like God is infinite. How can that be?

That is God's gift to you as a believer. That is what Christians wish to attain. Life after death is what is preached because we will spend eternity there....death is a big deal to Christians because life becomes eternal after death.

See, I feel like this is all that was ever preached to me. Eternal life. Christ died so that I could have eternal life. God is giving me the greatest gift, eternal life.
This is where my belief that a lot of Christians believe because they want to go to the eternal life party comes in. I don't mean it to be offensive, it's just that this was drilled in my head.

Do unto others .... so you get eternal life
Thou shall not kill ...you wanna go to Heaven, right?

Actually eternal life scared me a lot when I was younger. I read books on Heaven and talked to my preacher. I just couldn't comprehend living forever. I have finally been able to come to terms with what it means. I don't know everything about what will happen but I have faith.

I guess it is just hard for me to understand the whole "must have evidence" thing.

Do people really think there was just a big bang. I think there are too many questions that science just can't answer.

numeria11 · October 2012

It's way easier to say why you don't believe in a religion than why you do believe in something you can't see or hear or touch that you have to rely on your faith to get you to.

That said, I believe because as others have said I have experienced things that to me can only be explained by God and by his forgiveness and love. I believe because when I pray I find a sense of peace that I never truly feel otherwise. I do care about heaven and certainly hope I go there some day but it's not the driving force behind my faith, it's an element of it.

I believe that sometimes our prayers are answered in ways we don't understand or like just as we as parents don't always grant every request our children make of us as hard as they may beg for it. God is there to help give us solace, to help us gather our strength or lend us his so that we can keep going no matter how impossible it may seem. He created free will so that we could choose to believe or not so that we could come to him willingly. To blame him for the actions of people who do horrible things because they have that free will says we wish he would have made everyone automatons to do only as he chose.

EVA116 · October 2012

numeria11:

It's way easier to say why you don't believe in a religion than why you do believe in something you can't see or hear or touch that you have to rely on your faith to get you to.

That said, I believe because as others have said I have experienced things that to me can only be explained by God and by his forgiveness and love. I believe because when I pray I find a sense of peace that I never truly feel otherwise. I do care about heaven and certainly hope I go there some day but it's not the driving force behind my faith, it's an element of it.

I believe that sometimes our prayers are answered in ways we don't understand or like just as we as parents don't always grant every request our children make of us as hard as they may beg for it. God is there to help give us solace, to help us gather our strength or lend us his so that we can keep going no matter how impossible it may seem. He created free will so that we could choose to believe or not so that we could come to him willingly. To blame him for the actions of people who do horrible things because they have that free will says we wish he would have made everyone automatons to do only as he chose.

Very well said.

iheartsippycups · October 2012

I'd like to know the reasons why you don't believe in God. Do you believe in anything? How do you think the universe came to be? Do you not believe because bad things happen? If you do believe, or not, maybe you know the story of Adam & Eve? They were put in the garden of eden, and satan tempted them with the apple, and God told them not to eat it- well, Eve did, and thus created "sin" in a what was perfect world. I don't know where I'm really going with this, but I just wanted to throw that out there...I swear, I NEVER discuss religion IRL

numeria11 · October 2012

twatley:
So what about the people born in areas where Christianity isn't practiced? Why would God place them in a place where they have zero chances of knowing Him and making it to Heaven? Doesn't that seem particularly cruel?

To my understanding (and what I believe) is that God wouldn't hold ignorance against you you would still go to Heaven. Having heard the word of his child suffering and dying for us to have eternal life and still turning away is the only thing that would stop you from coming to his side in Heaven.

Please don't get me wrong I question my faith and have 1000's of times when I see something horrible on the news and I think "God you are going to let this person go to heaven as long as they believe in your son and ask forgiveness for their sins?" That's a hard pill to swallow. However t's just one of those things I remind myself that people change, they have free will and they can decide anywhere along the way that they need to atone for their sins and believe in Christ. Just as I hope I will and that is enough according to God. Who am I to say what's enough to get into Heaven, I didn't make it so I don't get to make the rules.

jcsumm0 · October 2012

twatley:
So what about the people born in areas where Christianity isn't practiced? Why would God place them in a place where they have zero chances of knowing Him and making it to Heaven? Doesn't that seem particularly cruel?

You don't have to be a Christian to know and experience God. IMO.

ridesbuttons · October 2012

iheartsippycups:
I'd like to know the reasons why you don't believe in God. Do you believe in anything? How do you think the universe came to be? Do you not believe because bad things happen? If you do believe, or not, maybe you know the story of Adam & Eve? They were put in the garden of eden, and satan tempted them with the apple, and God told them not to eat it- well, Eve did, and thus created "sin" in a what was perfect world. I don't know where I'm really going with this, but I just wanted to throw that out there...I swear, I NEVER discuss religion IRL

As I've already said, it is far easier to argue for God than against God's existence.

I'm not sure how not believing in God makes it impossible to believe in anything. I believe the sun will rise tomorrow, I believe that rainbows exist even though I can't touch them. It's not either/or as far as I'm concerned.

I am more curious to know what makes a person believe. Summing it up with the idea of 'faith' almost seems a cop out. Personal epiphanies hold more water with me.

But I still don't believe.

lildevil968 · October 2012

pepomntpat:

Faith, prayer, conversation, study, thinking hard, personal experiences. I find it impossible not to believe.

That said, I do not believe everything the church believes. I've had to form my own set of beliefs and faith and values that are mostly based on Christianity. But, I am far, far, far from a fundamentalist. I just can't believe that way.

+1.

iheartsippycups · October 2012

ridesbuttons:

iheartsippycups:
I'd like to know the reasons why you don't believe in God. Do you believe in anything? How do you think the universe came to be? Do you not believe because bad things happen? If you do believe, or not, maybe you know the story of Adam & Eve? They were put in the garden of eden, and satan tempted them with the apple, and God told them not to eat it- well, Eve did, and thus created "sin" in a what was perfect world. I don't know where I'm really going with this, but I just wanted to throw that out there...I swear, I NEVER discuss religion IRL

As I've already said, it is far easier to argue for God than against God's existence.

I'm not sure how not believing in God makes it impossible to believe in anything. I believe the sun will rise tomorrow, I believe that rainbows exist even though I can't touch them. It's not either/or as far as I'm concerned.

I am more curious to know what makes a person believe. Summing it up with the idea of 'faith' almost seems a cop out. Personal epiphanies hold more water with me.

But I still don't believe.

I meant do you/anyone believe in a higher power other than god

pepomntpat · October 2012

Spooko:
twatley:
EVA116:
ridesbuttons:

I consider death to be a certainty and since every living thing is destined to die, it is the opposite of a huge deal. It is inevitable. We are all going to die. Our brains will stop functioning, we will all rot away down to our elements no different than a tree or a squirrel or a cockroach.

Believing that we are somehow omnipotent because our souls have a perpetual existence seems to suggest that we are infinite, just like God is infinite. How can that be?

That is God's gift to you as a believer. That is what Christians wish to attain. Life after death is what is preached because we will spend eternity there....death is a big deal to Christians because life becomes eternal after death.

See, I feel like this is all that was ever preached to me. Eternal life. Christ died so that I could have eternal life. God is giving me the greatest gift, eternal life.
This is where my belief that a lot of Christians believe because they want to go to the eternal life party comes in. I don't mean it to be offensive, it's just that this was drilled in my head.

Do unto others .... so you get eternal life
Thou shall not kill ...you wanna go to Heaven, right?

For me, and the flavor of Christianity I grew up with, this doesn't even factor in. The only thing you have to do to go to heaven is belive Jesus died for us. That's it. If you believe, you go to heaven. So by believing that, it take the eternal life aspect out of the equation...There's nothing left to do. It isn't works or good deeds based. There's no reason to be further focused with it.

ETA, Twats, I think you're being very respectful in your position and don't worry about offending anyone. I think it's so important to have an open discourse with people who are different than you. I also enjoy discussing religion

That is true that all you have to do is accept Jesus into your heart and you will go to heaven. However, accepting Jesus changes you and from that comes the good works. So, there is a bit more to it than saying, "yeah, sure, I'll accept Jesus." It's a daily even hourly acceptance, not a one time deal.

klondikebar · October 2012

EVA116:
KlondikeBar:
EVA116:

I hate when people say that God is just a false sense of security for people who are afraid to die.

Death is a huge deal and I believe that a human soul does not just end. I think that each person can have an individual relationship with God. I do not believe you have to practice religion a certain way in order to get to heaven.

I think it is just as hard for me to try and understand how someone can believe that we just stop exisiting.

Did any of that make sense? Did I even answer the question?

Oh and I do not think that God intended for anyone to be an agnostic. He allows free will and he will make himself known to you many times in your life. He allows for you to choose Him. He does not hide. ie: this post

There is absolutely nothing that indicates there is life after death. That's why I believe our existence ends when we die.

Are there things to indicate there isn't?

I have no proof that there is no afterlife. But I also don't have proof that we weren't created by aliens in a distant galaxy.

I was just stating my reason.

pepomntpat · October 2012

numeria11:
twatley:
So what about the people born in areas where Christianity isn't practiced? Why would God place them in a place where they have zero chances of knowing Him and making it to Heaven? Doesn't that seem particularly cruel?

To my understanding (and what I believe) is that God wouldn't hold ignorance against you you would still go to Heaven. Having heard the word of his child suffering and dying for us to have eternal life and still turning away is the only thing that would stop you from coming to his side in Heaven.

Please don't get me wrong I question my faith and have 1000's of times when I see something horrible on the news and I think "God you are going to let this person go to heaven as long as they believe in your son and ask forgiveness for their sins?" That's a hard pill to swallow. However t's just one of those things I remind myself that people change, they have free will and they can decide anywhere along the way that they need to atone for their sins and believe in Christ. Just as I hope I will and that is enough according to God. Who am I to say what's enough to get into Heaven, I didn't make it so I don't get to make the rules.

I agree with this and it is one of the places where I really stumble with Christianity. I remember when I was in a Bible study and one of the women in class said she refuses to believe God would allow anyone to die without hearing His word. The minister gave her a blank stare and said, "But people do!" Christ does preach to the living and the dead and we are all given multiple chances to accept Him into our hearts even after they stop beating.

Maybe faith is a cop out to some, but that is what it is. You have faith that the sun will rise because it does. I have faith that God is here for me, because He is.

ridesbuttons · October 2012

@iheart

If by higher power you mean some entity that is intimately involved in the daily minutiae of my life then, no.

If by higher power you mean there are things that are currently unexplainable or the idea of the infinite and it's existence then yes. And therefore, it is very easy to argue, I must believe in God since the infinite would include God.

But again, I don't.

iheartsippycups · October 2012

twatley:
iheartsippycups:
I'd like to know the reasons why you don't believe in God. Do you believe in anything? How do you think the universe came to be? Do you not believe because bad things happen? If you do believe, or not, maybe you know the story of Adam & Eve? They were put in the garden of eden, and satan tempted them with the apple, and God told them not to eat it- well, Eve did, and thus created "sin" in a what was perfect world. I don't know where I'm really going with this, but I just wanted to throw that out there...I swear, I NEVER discuss religion IRL

I don't believe because:

- I think it's illogical. 100% completely and totally lacking in logic.

- If the Christian God really existed and was all powerful and awesome it seems like he could stop just a few things. Yes, I still think that we need disease to keep the cycle of life flowing, but really, do we need children born with diseases like EB? Seems pretty unnecessary to me.

- I don't believe in Adam & Eve. I don't believe in talking snakes and I don't believe in gardens of good and evil. I don't think any of it happened, I consider it to be just like any other fable.

- I believe there was a flood, but I don't believe that a man named Noah built a gigantic ark that held two of every species (except those pesky dinosaurs of course) because I don't believe that to be humanly possible.

- I don't believe that anyone has lived for hundreds of years.

- I don't know how the universe came to be, but I believe that science is smarter than me. If they can put a man on the moon, then I trust that they know a shitton more about the earth's existence than I'll ever know. Also, it's not something I am really all that concerned with.

- I definitely think a lot of my non-belief stems from seeing bad shiit happen to great people.

- I believe in lots of things. I believe in kindness, humility, humanity, equality, sympathy, empathy, treating others the way I want to be treated, helping others, sacrifice, patience. I believe in many things, God just isn't one of them.

I can completely respect that. Trust me, I have had many times where I have questioned my beliefs, but even though some people say it is a cop-out, it's my faith that keeps me going. It's coming to an understanding that everything happens for a reason, I might not always get what I want, and things might happen that I don't agree with, but I have faith that God will help me handle anything. I don't feel like you have to go to church every week, or even pray every day for that matter to believe/trust in God. I also know plenty of christians that give christianity a horrible name, I have never been a believer in the church itself only because I grew up in it & saw the crap that went on behind closed doors. My Uncle was a minister for years, and finally walked away from the church because of the things he witnessed. I also don't believe that if you always make the right choices, and are a good person, your life will be perfect-crap happens. A friend of mine (believer) just lost her twins at 21 weeks. She has such a peace about it that many people she know's just don't understand. Is she sad, of course, but she knows that God has something else planned for her. It is a very hard thing to believe, understand, or explain, unless you do have tehe faith in God. I don't know how else to explain it. I respect anyone else's beliefs, and hope they respect mine too.

Smootchy · October 2012

Let me bold this part: TO ME it's not "what I believe" it is just pure fact.

pepomntpat · October 2012

Spooko:

For me, and the flavor of Christianity I grew up with, this doesn't even factor in. The only thing you have to do to go to heaven is belive Jesus died for us. That's it. If you believe, you go to heaven. So by believing that, it take the eternal life aspect out of the equation...There's nothing left to do. It isn't works or good deeds based. There's no reason to be further focused with it.

ETA, Twats, I think you're being very respectful in your position and don't worry about offending anyone. I think it's so important to have an open discourse with people who are different than you. I also enjoy discussing religion

That is true that all you have to do is accept Jesus into your heart and you will go to heaven. However, accepting Jesus changes you and from that comes the good works. So, there is a bit more to it than saying, "yeah, sure, I'll accept Jesus." It's a daily even hourly acceptance, not a one time deal.

I completely agree that it isn't a set it and forget it kind of thing. I mean more along the lines of the afterlife not being the intention behind every action like Twatley was saying. I think that you're exactly right in that there is a change in you that inspires you to act differently. I think it's the change driving the good actions, not the hopeful reward at the end, though. Does that make more sense? I'm not sure I got my point across.

Yes, exactly.

EVA116 · October 2012

KlondikeBar:
EVA116:
KlondikeBar:
EVA116:

I hate when people say that God is just a false sense of security for people who are afraid to die.

Death is a huge deal and I believe that a human soul does not just end. I think that each person can have an individual relationship with God. I do not believe you have to practice religion a certain way in order to get to heaven.

I think it is just as hard for me to try and understand how someone can believe that we just stop exisiting.

Did any of that make sense? Did I even answer the question?

Oh and I do not think that God intended for anyone to be an agnostic. He allows free will and he will make himself known to you many times in your life. He allows for you to choose Him. He does not hide. ie: this post

There is absolutely nothing that indicates there is life after death. That's why I believe our existence ends when we die.

Are there things to indicate there isn't?

I have no proof that there is no afterlife. But I also don't have proof that we weren't created by aliens in a distant galaxy.

I was just stating my reason.

I wasn't trying to be snarky. I was really wondering.

EVA116 · October 2012

Irish: I know you weren't attacking me and I did not mean to offend anyone with what I said....I think I felt a little on the defense after the question was posed; "Did God mean for me to be agnostic?" It just felt a little like sarcasm and I jumped the gun with posting.

I wasn't trying to preach to the board. It is just what I believe.

what makes you believe in God?

Re: what makes you believe in God?

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