Circumcision Disagreement

tbone_bride · October 2012

This has probably been posted a million times, but I can't seem to find any old posts. DH & I have differing opinions on circumcision. I don't want to do it, he does. He is circumcised and doesn't want our son to be laughed at in the locker room. I just don't see the point in doing it - there's no real medical reason (I don't think lowered risk of STDs is a valid risk - that's what condoms are for) and most importantly for me, I just can't bear to put a 1-day old baby through that kind of pain.

Anyway - this post isn't intended to be a debate - what I'm really looking for are resources out there that will help educate us both to help make the right decision for DS.

TIA

sschwege · October 2012

The AAP recently revised their stance on circumcision, that might be a good place to start:

https://www.aap.org/en-us/about-the-aap/aap-press-room/pages/Newborn-Male-Circumcision.aspx?nfstatus=401&nftoken=00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000&nfstatusdescription=ERROR%3a+

I think in terms of your DH's concerns about your son being laughed at, I wouldn't worry about that. I think the circumcision rate nation wide is about evenly split now. So in other words there should be just as many circumcised boys as not.

sschwege · October 2012

Here is some info from Dr. Sears on it. It's a bit outdated though because as I said the AAP recently changed their stance:

https://www.askdrsears.com/topics/pregnancy-childbirth/whether-or-not-circumcise

tbone_bride · October 2012

Thank you! The AAP website is exactly what I was looking for.

oliversmommy32912 · October 2012

My husband and I were in the same boat. I didn't want to to and he did. I showed him a video of a baby being circumcised and it changed his mind. He started looking at the facts and realizing its not as uncommon as it once was. Now he has become quite the "intactivist". It's pretty funny. He has actually thanked me on several occasions for convincing him to leave our son intact. Good luck.

JuneBug86 · October 2012

Where I live it isn't common at all. I personally don't know anyone IRL that had it done for non-medical reasons. When I was a kid I remember boys being teased if they were circ'ed! In Canada, the medical community actually recommend against it.

WaitingOnTwoPinkLines · October 2012

If you do a Google search for circumcision, you'll come up with plenty on both sides of the debate.

We were/are in the same position you are. I don't want to, he does. I outlined my reasons & asked that he look into it. I passed on a few websites that supported leaving him intact.

After looking at the resources I sent him, DH still wants to circ. One of use has to compromise, & since he has more experience with a penis than I do, I've decided that I will be the one to compromise. Do I like it? Not in the least, & DH knows that. But someone has to give - & since there is no clear-cut argument for either side, there isn't necessarily one person who is right & one who is wrong.

I will be absolutely THRILLED if DH suddenly changes his mind. But I'm not counting on it, so I've started to work on accepting it & preparing for it. I've called our insurance carrier to find out coverage, called the MW's office to find out what they charge, & started thinking about using fleece liners in our newborn dipes until he's healed.

AmyRI · October 2012

Well, you just addressed all the arguments I've read on pro-circ.

We did circ DS and have no regrets. I personally believe that the lower risk of STDs is a valid medical reason, but this is subjective and to each their own. DH wanted it done because he was glad his parents had done it and wanted DS to be the same as he was. Luckily for us, we were in agreement. And I'm sure it hurt at the time, but with 1 dose of tylenol and a 3 hour nap, he woke up just fine. I am glad it was such a fast recovery for him as opposed to having it done when he was older.

Honestly, if there's any debate between parents, I think it should end with NOT doing it. As painful as it is to do later in life, it is possible to have a circ done later. It's not possible to undo it.

Good luck with your decision.

tbone_bride · October 2012

AmyRI:
Honestly, if there's any debate between parents, I think it should end with NOT doing it. As painful as it is to do later in life, it is possible to have a circ done later. It's not possible to undo it.

This is exactly how I feel. You can't undo it, but you can do it later. I personally think it's a choice that our son should make later in life. I know it's not easy to circumcise later in life, but I don't want to be the one to decide for him. I'm leaving DH with some websites tonight when I go to bed and I HOPE that he sees my side. If not, I'm not sure what will happen, but I don't want to back down.... ugh... thanks for the luck ladies, I will need it, esp since I'm due next week!

KelliLynee · October 2012

We don't have boys, but had planned not to circ if we did. My thoughts for couples who are undecided, why not let the baby decide? You know, later in life when they are grown.

shutupanddance07 · October 2012

We did a ton of research before deciding to circ. We looked at the pros and cons, and decided that they kind of outweigh each other. My biggest worry was doing it so early, because all the risks I found were related to doctor error or a clotting issue. Newborns don't clot properly until they are about a week old. We're having him circumcised in our birth center by a pediatrician who does circumcisions for them once a week. He has a ton of experience so I don't worry about the doctor error, and it'll be done at about 1 week old, so I'm not worried about the clotting issue. I couldn't find a good reason NOT to do it.

memo9 · October 2012

I so don't look forward to this if our next child is a boy. We briefly discussed before finding out that our LO was a girl and it turns out that my husband is pro and I am not. I'm hoping his opinion has changed as we are much more naturally minded now. I don't really want to have to tell him that there's no way in hell our son will be circ'd. I am all about compromise, but when it comes to protecting my baby from unnecessary surgery I'll do whatever it takes.

*LrCg* · October 2012

DH & I were in this same spot 4 years ago when we had our son (I was against; he was for). In the end, I backed down and let my DH make the final choice however, if he was going to have it done I would only allow a Mohel to do it (we are not Jewish but most will still perform it). There are various reasons why I trusted and felt more comfortable with that decision vs. a doctor which I won't get into now. DS didn't even cry during the procedure and we had no issues. The Rabbi was wonderful, we got to hold our son during the entire procedure and he checked up on him daily for about a week. I have nothing back to say about it. However, I still regret the choice- its a choice that I made for him that cannot be taken back and I feel that I never had that right to make that choice. We are now due with baby #3 (baby #2 is a girl) and after some talk this time I stood up for my child (sex unknown ) and told my DH no. I do not believe a circumcised man is any cleaner than an uncircumcised man- that part of the body is self cleaning- just like vaginas. I guess I don't understand how the US goes about still recommending it when its not done in other countries and they don't have issues.

I really like the mothering.com boards and they do have an against circumcision board and I found these two links very helpful:

https://www.noharmm.org/anatomy.htm

https://www.circumstitions.com/completeman/

Having never seen an "uncut" man before I was very surprised (as ignorant as that sounds) that there was no difference in appears. And yes if this baby is a boy it will be different from his father and brother but I figure no one in my house is identical and I'm not worried about when he goes to school because of other boys are looking at his penis, he has things that he can tease back about then.

This is obviously a very person choice however, I do feel looking back its a very easy choice to make: its one that can always been done later if your son decides to (then it would be under general anthesisia and given pain medication following and your son could indicate whether he was in pain or not). Good luck with your decision.

StefandTodd · October 2012

I didn't want to circ our boys, and after doing just a little bit of research, my H agreed it was totally unecessary for them/us. Neither of us have the tiniest bit of doubt we did/will be doing the right thing for us by leaving them both in tact. My H is circ'd, fwiw, and he has never brought up the argument about a boy looking like his dad, as he can't recall ever comparing penises with his own dad. He was also on competetive swim teams from age 8 to 22, so he's most definitely spent a lot of time in locker rooms. Zero issue for him. Whenever I read about these arguments between couples, I am SO SO grateful that my H was in agreement with me...it would be hard (knowing myself, I would say maybe even impossible) for me to compromise on this.

Also, the AAP's revised stance is only to say that the health benefits outweigh the risks, but the benefits are not great enough to recommend it routinely. It really didn't affect my personal feelings on circ'ing b/c I didn't choose not to b/c I was afraid of the "risks" of doing so, but rather for other personal reasons.

Good luck, OP with your discussions and decisions with your H.

sschwege · October 2012

ICarriedAWatermelon:
sschwege:
The AAP recently revised their stance on circumcision, that might be a good place to start:
https://www.aap.org/en-us/about-the-aap/aap-press-room/pages/Newborn-Male-Circumcision.aspx?nfstatus=401&nftoken=00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000&nfstatusdescription=ERROR%3a+
I think in terms of your DH's concerns about your son being laughed at, I wouldn't worry about that. I think the circumcision rate nation wide is about evenly split now. So in other words there should be just as many circumcised boys as not.

I interpreted the AAP's statement as a political move to get insurance companies to pay for circumcision.
I also feel like yes, on the whole in terms of public health, blanket circumcision for all might make sense. But on an individual level, if parents are teaching proper hygiene and safe sex practices, this "benefit" is diminished.

I really like what you said here, particularly the part about public health decisions vs. individual.

qtssima · October 2012

We were split on this as well, and after talking to my midwives group and the pediatrician who will be performing the procedure, I feel more comfortable. Pain was my concern, as well as the skill of the doctor. Numbing agents are used, just so you know.

The lowered risk of HPV also was important to me, as that is not something that they can accurately test for.

I also happen to know two men who had to have the procedure done later in life for medical reasons - one at age 12, one at age 15. Neither has anything positive to say about that experience.

Either way, I think it is a very personal decision -good luck whatever you decide!

PansyPants · October 2012

This isn't really helpful but I'll tell you anyway. The hospital won't do anything to your son unless YOU consent to it. Fathers are considered secondary and have little to no say in the care and procedures done to the child unless you are unable to speak for the baby. If you end up feeling strongly and having different opinions, you can make a choice contrary to him and deal with it later on at the pediatricians office.

It won't be good for your marriage, but it is an option.

AngieB90 · October 2012

Thankfully the babys dont feel it. My son is 6wks old and when he got it done that doc said he slept through the while thing. I work at an assisted living, and sadly some bad things that can come from not being circumcised. They do have a higher risk of infection and what not. And yes I know you will always clean it when you change their diaper and teach them how to clean it. However, when they become elderly it can cause issues if they are no longer able to take care of it. And its actually a lot more painful for them to have it done at an older age rather than have it done when they are born.

I hope this helps.

nosoup4u · October 2012

AmyRI:
Honestly, if there's any debate between parents, I think it should end with NOT doing it. As painful as it is to do later in life, it is possible to have a circ done later. It's not possible to undo it. Good luck with your decision.

Yep, this.

nosoup4u · October 2012

AngieB90:
Thankfully the babys dont feel it. My son is 6wks old and when he got it done that doc said he slept through the while thing. I work at an assisted living, and sadly some bad things that can come from not being circumcised. Th
ey do have a higher risk of infection and what not. And yes I know you will always clean it when you change their diaper and teach them how to clean it. However, when they become elderly it can cause issues if they are no longer able to take care of it. And its actually a lot more painful for them to have it done at an older age rather than have it done when they are born.nbsp;I hope this helps.nbsp;

The "babies don't feel pain" thing is a myth. They fall asleep as a response to trauma.

bikramgirl · October 2012

There is no valid medical indication for circumcision. You ultimately have to make the best choice for you and your child at the end of the day.

I am having a boy and it was an easy decision in my household thankfully. Although my husband is circumcised, he recognizes circumcision for what it is...genital mutilation...plain and simple. The foreskin is an essential part of the penis with bundles of nerve endings and like a pp mentioned it is self cleaning for the most part.

Mrs.A&J · October 2012

Hubby and I are having the same debate. I don't have any answers for you, but I can commiserate!

SunnyMuffin · October 2012

This is a really good article comparing the differences of a circumcised and intact penis. I suggest you send it to him to look at on his own https://www.drmomma.org/2011/08/intact-or-circumcised-significant.html

Also have him consider the fact that his feelings and ego may be getting in the way here and clouding his judgement. Intact fathers don't insist that their sons be circumcised at birth. Despite what anyone says, circumcision is mainly done because fathers want their sons to look like them, not because it's healthier or cleaner. If circumcision had any proven health benefits, all parents would want it done for their sons, not just children with circumcised fathers.

People just like to do what they are already familiar with. A woman with a circumcised husband and 1 circumcised son is mostly likely going to follow the pattern and circumcise any future children. It takes a very strong woman to realize her mistake and do better in the future. There is a whole support group dedicated to this and there are some compelling stories of people healing from regret and realizing their mistakes. That would be good for him to read as well, it's not always about facts and numbers. https://www.facebook.com/FutureSons?fref=ts

SunnyMuffin · October 2012

Here in Canada where I live, only 9 percent of boys are being circumcised at birth, and 91% are being left intact. We aren't that different from you guys down south!! We dont have rampant penile infections and penile cancers, and horror stories of toddlers needing circumcisions. It really honest to God is about fathers wanting their sons to match, not about health benefits.

SunnyMuffin · October 2012

Also if you cant watch this video, don't do it. Plain and simple. Why do something to your precious baby boy that makes you whither and squirm to watch on youtube... and it's not even your baby.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=MDuDhkiDdns

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