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2nd Trimester
DH in big trouble (Vent)
Sorry this got long....
DH is seriously in the dog house right now? We?ve had the SAHM discussion countless times, we?ve reviewed our finances, we?ve reviewed cost of day-care, we?ve reviewed how much money I make and how much I would make after childcare cost and WE came to a decision that if I am only bringing home $200-$300 / month, then I should just stay home because it isn?t worth it to us to work just to pay someone else for child-care? period.
Yesterday I had the discussion with my boss that once baby comes I will be trying the SAHM thing for a 6 or 12 month period to make sure it works, but I will not be returning to work. We discussed options of me working 3-4 days/week instead, and also the fact that I would need a pay raise in order to stay of at least $3-5/hr (would require at least a 25% pay raise). She is going to take it to the big boss and see if he wants to negotiate or let it rest.
So I told DH about our discussion (it also peeved me b/c my boss kept saying things like, "so you don?t think you?ll get bored?" or "you really think you can do it on one income?" or "there are so many un-expected costs of having a child?." Or "you really lose value and self-confidence once you leave the work place" - - BUT SHE was a stay at home mom for 12 years!!! Ugh!
DH then goes on and on about how she is probably right and I should at least work part-time just so we have that job-security that I can go back to full time if I need to - - umm? it doesn?t work that way and we don?t even know that it?s an option but I am so ticked off that he doesn?t seem to support me. We made this decision already and now he is worried about our budget and making it work? It will be tight, but who isn?t tight now-a-days? I know we can make it work?
It seems like he doesn?t trust me to get a job elsewhere if the SAHM isn?t working out for us financially! I feel like he has no faith in us as a family and no motivation to support our family on his own. I know it is a big job, but can?t he at least be open to it? I know it is a big scary decision but how many times can I have this conversation with him??? How many times is he going to freak out and make me feel guilty for wanting to stay at home? It is unfair when we came to this decision for him to keep nearly pulling the rug out from under me. Am I just being a hormonally crazy pregnant person? I am royally ticked off and not in the mood to make nice any time soon ? I feel like if I give in, he will just do this again and I need him to be on board 100%.
This discussion has been closed.
Re: DH in big trouble (Vent)
He is scared. Period.
You need to understand that having a kid is also a big shift in mindset for us men. Adding the fact that you very well could be staying home? That is a tremendous amount of pressure to go from a 2-income husband/wife team- to being a sole provider for 3. I think sometimes people don't get us enough credit for shouldering that responsibility (just like some people don't give SAHMs enough credit for that responsibility).
My wife and I have decided to try the SAHM thing for 3 months after my daughter gets here. Daycare will cost us $600-$800/mo depending where we go, but my wife brings in about 3k a month. However, I make far more than that and I have told my wife that if she returns to work it is up to her. I want to be able to provide that option for her even if we will be much better off with extra spending (all of her income is used for vacations, miscellaneous, etc. I pay all of the bills) and our standard of living goes down.
However- although technically we can make it on my salary alone and she can stay home... the pressure is that much greater. What if my company lays off? What if I lose my job for some other reason? Can I find one at the same annual salary? What about insurance if I lose my job? What if I didn't calculate the finances correctly? What if I didn't account for all of the costs of an infant? There is a bit of a security blanket if both of us work. If I just work- the responsibility falls squarely on me. It is an extremely heavy weight to take on, especially with a new baby brought into the mix as well.
Honestly, you will probably have this conversation multiple times untilt he baby gets here. He probably is not looking to fight with you about it or change your mind. He wants and needs reassurance that you guys can make it work. He wants to know that you are aware that your standard of living is about to go really down and that you are onboard with not going shopping with your girlfriend, not going out to eat, etc. And even if you tell him this- tell him this again.
He is looking for reassurance that you guys will make it.
Believe it or not, I'm in a similar situation. I was (and still am) planning to try out being a SAHM when LO gets here. I also put in my notice at work to be done on July 31 due to the stress and nature of my job. They talked me into part-time, which really hasn't been so bad, but then gave me a "last day" of Sept 28. Now that is here, DH thinks I should stay on until LO gets here for "job security" and in case I need to return when she gets here.
I'm interested to see other people's advice on this one. For me, I'm just trying to stand my ground about being a SAHM when she gets here. It's not just the cost that I'm trying to avoid, it's the sicknesses until she's old enough to really fight them off, and the uncertainty of someone we don't really know. References mean a lot to me, but they're not everything. I pulled the "I carry her for 9 months and I go through labor so I get some say-so in my life after she gets here" card.. which I know isn't right, but like you, I got seriously frustrated at one point. I've tried discussing things I am willing to compromise on, and explaining that this really isn't one of them. GL to you, I really hope you can make him understand!!
I agree with this. It does sound like DH is scared and overwhelmed, and I don't blame him. This is a big, life changing moment. I know that with my DH this will be the topic of many conversations until the baby is born. There is nothing wrong with revisiting the topic to explore new options. Who knows? Things may change.
Although, from what it sounds like, you didn't at least consider working part time. It was either all or nothing. It could be worth it to see if you can work part time to alleviate the cost of day care and help shoulder part of the cost for the finances. This can be another option to you if you decide to look into it further.
You are right. That isn't right and it is actually pretty low. We don't have a choice in the matter on who carries her and goes through labor.
Try having a conversation instead of getting frustrated and pulling an immature line like that. That's as bad as "Well, it's my ball and I'm taking it home" because you didn't get your way.
You don't get the option to just pick "I'm not going to work, deal with it". That isn't a marriage or a relationship. That is someone being a tyrant and not communicating. Your husband has doubts/fears about if you can make it on one income and the pressure is a lot. Try talking to him about it and reassuring him and working through it. Not laying down ultimatums about something that affects all 3 of your lives.
I've also discussed this with DH. I work full time for 10.25 an hour plus a shift premium for an extra dollar for 5 hours a day. This is not even close to covering the cost of daycare in my area. He is just scared about having to do everything on one income, because in our current situation, one income is not enough and we are barely hanging on while I'm on sick leave. He just has to remember that yes, I can go back to work so that we have two incomes, but daycare is going to cost more than what I'll be bringing in, so we'd actually be worse off. It's a big change and it's pretty frightening, but we have to do what logically makes sense and me being SAHM will make the most sense, at least for a couple of years. We'll see what happens after that.
Now if your work offers you enough of a raise that you can comfortably afford daycare and still have some extra, I'd probably go for it. Otherwise, no way. And working part time makes no sense unless you'd only have shifts while DH is home with the baby. All the daycares around me make you pay for a full time spot whether the baby is there or not.
Perhaps I made it sound like I regularly argue like this, or that we argue at all. DH and I rarely argue, and by that, I mean usually never. And this conversation was never an argument. I didn't give him an ultimatum, and I never would. I completely understand what you're saying, and I guess I didn't say everything exactly like I should have, but I'm not a tyrant. I think that's a little harsh, especially since we're talking about one conversation in an entire relationship/pregnancy. I've given up a lot for my DH... including the job and career I really wanted to live here. I am not mad about it, nor do I resent him in any way, but I do feel like with the concessions that I have made, it would be reasonable for him to allow me to SAH for a while. We've had many conversations about it, none turning into arguments and none that have ever said "my way or the highway"... I didn't mean for it to come across as such. Obviously, this is a conversation better had between each couple- with us, saying something like the "immature line" I used is not viewed as rude or abrasive, or immature for that matter, it's how we talk. Anyway, definitely not trying to get into a debate; I guess bottom line for me is, this conversation will be different for every couple in every stage of their relationship. No 2 couples are the same.
Sorry, I wasn't trying to attack you. That line is just a low blow really, that is all
Sorry if it came across as offending your entire marriage.
You are absolutely right- it is something a couple has to decide on. Not just half of the couple. While you may feel entitled to be a SAHM, maybe he isn't quite convinced yet that you guys could make it? As PP have said... it is a tremendous responsibility.
We have considered part-time work. In the post I indicate that my boss is taking it to the owner to see if he wants to make concessions by increasing my pay and approving less days/week. So if he comes back with an offer, we will re-consider the situation. Otherwise, it is understood that if we are unable to make it, I will look for a different part time position that would be an oposite shift from my husband. And it's also understood I will go back to work once we finish having kids and they are in school - stipulation being that I work closer to home (I am 45 min away right now).
I work in insurance - not an agent, just service and I make about $1700/ month right now and this to me is a job, not a career. Daycare would cost almost $1000 at a facility that I am comfortable with (I do not like the at home options... I am not comfortable with it. Period.) I spend about $300/month in gas plus wear and tear on my vehicle (my 4 and a half year old vehicle has over 90,000 miles on it), plus any expenses if I eat out and clothing costs. I would only be bringing home $200 or so per month!! I will have less time at home to shop coupons, do cloth diaper washing, make your own baby food, I'd have to pump at work etc. to me... it isn't worth the $200 to go to work full time...
PART TIME: I'd probably make $13/hr 3 days/wk Which is only $1000 or so take home and day care 3 days/week is about $700. Again with the reduced about of gas etc. it would be difficult to justify the ends to the means - I would be paying so much for day-care and expenses and to us it wasn't worth it when we discussed it.
This. It seems like you're reading him criticizing you where he's just trying to be helpful. My husband has been supportive (our plan is basically the same) but I find myself freaking out at the idea of living off one income. I'm the one who is saying that I can never quit work etc, etc even though we've been over the finances. Maybe you're having these fears as well and projecting them on to your husband?
RockyTopVols said it best, he's scared. With my first, DH and I made the decision that I would SAH for a few years while I worked through grad school. About 3.5 months before DS was born, the economy crashed, and I have to tell you, it felt really scary and a little wild to be leaving a secure job when people were losing theirs.
It all worked out well for us, but there was certainly risk involved, risk that still exist, so I can't blame your DH for being nervous about making such a big leap. I think you just have to go back over the finances with him, talk about what you want in terms of raising your children, and help calm his fears.
I am kind of on the other side of the boat. I will be working and bf will have to be staying at home w/ baby. I make more money. BF has his own business, but it is not doing well. In our current financial state, we can not afford daycare. We did agree that he is getting a part time job now to get more money and he will keep it to work when I am home once the baby comes. This will also give him something to do and give him time away, although he will be working. It is a big pressure and a lot of stress to put on one person. I admit that even now I am freaking out about money and the baby isn't here until March! We will make it work, but it definitely is nice to have reassurance. BF reassures me pretty much every other day.
I understand how you feel, but I agree that it is probably because he is scared- I am right there with him.
Sorry if that was ramble-ish, my brain isn't working correctly.
No, I know that we can do it- I am the one that does the bills... I know that we CAN live off of his income. It will be tight and we will need to do some major budgeting and stick to it tightly, but I am confident about it. He has his own insecurities but I just feel like he isn't being supportive of the plan that I thought we were settled on... Just because his parents both worked, doesn't mean it's right for everyone, his Mom was a nurse (career - not a job) and worked nights/weekends...
There is no question that if it doesn't work after 6-12 months I will find a job... but we agreed to at least try it and I feel like he keeps trying to back out and it is making me feel guilty about it for wanting to try and make this work.
That right there. You may know all of this- he may not. You can tell him but he probably needs a deep dive with you. I handle all of my household finances so that is why I am confident we can do it. That is also why you are confident you can do it.
But just because you know, doesn't mean he is as convinced. Especially considering he doesn't look at the finances and doesn't handle them like you do. I would spend some time showing him with actual math and numbers and showing him your proposed budget for you two. Not just "we can do it".
Thanks Rocky - I really like it when you comment on things (you've done so a few times before)!! It is awesome to have a guys perspective... and you are very non-biased and objective about your responses.
I'll have to put it all down and show him where the money goes and how we can make it work. Might have to tie him down to do it... I just feel like we made a decision and now he is trying to make me feel guilty about it...
I know he has self-confidence issues, but I just need HIM to be the rock every once in a while... How is it going to be when I am in labor? will I need to comfort him through that too??? I'm pretty sure I'll be too busy...
My DH is exactly the same way. It drives me nuts! I thought that we had come to a decision, I act on it, and then DH gets pissed. Men!
Hubs and I are going through the same thing, even though we're losing about $800 - $1200 a month if we lose my income, and that counts daycare. I want to stay home (or at least try it to see how well I do at it) and his career is getting more and more demanding so he has said he would appreciate having me at home to hold down the fort. Although he said he is on board with whatever I want to do.
But the money is obviously a consideration and it is stressing both of us out. We know we'll have to pinch pennies and make sacrifices like never before.
I keep focusing, and I might suggest you focus with your hubs, on the VALUE you add to the home being a stay at home mom. I see it, and imagine that you see it, not just as someone to cuddle the baby and change the diapers, but as a CEO/CFO of the household. What I would call "convenience expenses" (dry cleaning, takeout food, online shopping with shipping costs, buying prepackaged foods at the store) can be reduced or maybe even eliminated with you being home full time.
You are set on the SAHM option for now (as am I) so channel that stress and worry into thinking about ways you can add value to the home when you're not in an office, or waiting tables, or answering phones 40 hours a week. That's how I am dealing with my (understandable, rational, normal) stress and I hope it helps you and your husband do the same!
I think he was just evaluating the new information that you had already evaluated earlier in the day. Sounds like you guys came to an agreement and then work may or may not have offered you a new deal to consider. So, why not bring that up as if...what do you think about this? instead of just telling him you turned it down and be mad that he had questions and concerns. Thats just my opinion though.
Thanks! I try to stay objective. I try to maybe help some of the women here see it from the guys point of view. But I also have no problem calling out when your DH is in the wrong.
You are right- you do deserve to have his support. I think you have the right attitude about it. Just show him that you guys can physically do it. And ask for his support. And.. tell him if he has concerns, to ask questions and you can help address them. Tell him not to just say "well maybe you should keep working". Tell him to voice his real question or concern- that way you can refer back to the math you have done and have concrete evidence to show him.
And remind him that you are just as nervous as he is about the situation. But you are also confident, just as he should be, that you guys can do this together.
This.
I created two spreadsheets that displayed our bills each month. One reflected our 2 incomes and the second showed our projected budget on just DH's salary. Once DH saw the numbers and realized that my salary would only cover day care and my gas to and from work, he has been on board for me to SAH. He has his days where he gets nervous and doubtful so we have been putting my paychecks into savings. This way we have a good feel on how finances will be after the baby comes.
Personally, unless the cost of daycare is really going to overshadow what I make a month, and I don't make much so it probably would, ANY amount of extra money coming in is worth me still working, and ANY type of back up in case my FI lost his job.
Even if what I make after daycare was cut down to $300 a month, that's bills, or groceries, or diapers, or whatever. And if FI's salary already covered all that, then it's spending money for a lunch date or to buy something new for baby. I'd keep the money, always. My mom stayed at home but she worked from home for her accounting firm part-time after I was born, so she still brought in the money. I know it was a lot of work for her, I know being a SAHM is not some easy life of luxury but a different kind of full-time job. But if I was still making the money after all the costs, I'd keep doing it.
Plus, I live in CA, which is an at-will state. Meaning you can be fired or let go at the employer's discretion. I'm not willing to gamble with that
FWIW, DH and I have decided that I'll be a SAHM mom too, at least for the first year (and then we'll re-evaluate at that time) .. and I really love the point quoted above. I'm looking forward to trying to save our household as much money as possible by shopping out of the grocery flyers, managing other household expenses, finding recipes that go a long way (aka are cheap to make), etc.
I have the same constant worry that the OP's DH seems to have. I'm always second-guessing our ability to afford for me to quit my job. What if child expenses are more than we'd anticipated? What if we didn't budget correctly in the first place? What if we have a massive expense during that first year? Will we find it hard not being able to afford to eat out as much as we do now, and just be utterly miserable with everything we're giving up to afford this lifestyle? Poor DH is always telling me to quit worrying, focus on being happy and healthy, and that it will all be fine.
If you two have made a decision, stick by it. Don't let other people's doubts influence you. It's always good to leave a door open with your current employer, though. Do you have to commit to a decision before baby has even arrived? Or can you indicate that you MIGHT be interested in a part-time position once you've had a chance to spend some time at home with the baby?
FWIW, I'm also of the mindset that if it's just a job (and not a career), you can always find another. Or better yet, find something that interests or excites you and work towards a career in a different field! I've disliked my job for years. This pregnancy has offered me a wonderful opportunity to make my exit (without having to quit and sacrifice unemployment benefits), spend some time growing our family, and then if/when I return to the workforce (whether full or part-time), it will be something that I enjoy doing.
I hope you and your husband can work things out so you're both happy with the decision!
If you haven't done so already, actually physically LAY OUT your proposed budget. I take care of our budgeting, and I'll be honest, I would not expect DH to just blindly follow along with a DRASTIC lifestyle change (like going from two incomes to one), nor would I blindly follow along with it. Saying "I know we can do it" really doesnt mean much, you need to put pen to paper (or make a spreadsheet or use some other budgeting software, whatever) and lay it out.
Also be sure you are accounting for anything you DON'T take home, such as retirement savings, insurance, other benefits, etc. If you just looked at my take-home pay, it would make sense for me to stop working with 3 kids in daycare. But once you factor in all of my benefits, that is no longer the case and we'd actually need 4 kids in daycare for it to be a wash.
As others have said, he's scared, he's nervous, this is a HUGE change for your family. He can't be faulted for feeling the way he does. Spend some time really talking it over and looking at the numbers. But try not to discount his fears about this.
I just have a few small points- which may end in a whirlpool of crap but I will take it if need be.
Depending on what line of work you're in, by staying home for an extended period of time you may lose some headway with companies. In my line of work the longer I am here, the more experience I gain which makes me more valuable. When I'm out for 3 months on maternity leave there is a possibility that I am going to miss out on a huge project that could launch my career to the next level. I would never change taking the full 3 months, but I know if I took 6, or 12, that person below me would very likely surpass me and I may not be as marketable when I return to the workforce (not to mention the availability of jobs vs. job seekers for that matter).
You are completely right that living on one salary is doable, you have to plan it very carefully. Myself on the other hand, cost more money when I was at home on maternity leave because once DD was able to get out and around with me we were constantly on the move. Going places, spending money (if anything, our gasoline bill went up). Home all day during the heat of the summer upped our electric bill, our grocery bills went up because I was able to cook/bake/eat more. Again- I know I am not the norm- but staying home isn't always free.
That aside, you both need to be on the same page 100%. He may very well be scared and feel the pressure which is completely understandable. Reassure him as much as you can, because if for some reason he still has doubt and then something does happen with his job, there may be a little resentment towards you IF he wasn't on board to begin with. Lay out a budget, and if you have time maybe try doing three separate budgets- one with you staying home, one with you working part time and the last with you working full time. Show him what it would cost to continue to live as you are now (no extra skimping) and then show him one where you can save costs (skip eating out as much, getting nails done, going to movies, etc.) Try your best at the cost of the baby, there are some calculators online that can estimate formula, diapers, you'll need new clothes every few months, things like that. Just have a completely transparent conversation, show him the actual numbers and maybe that will help. I do all the budgets in our home but when it comes time to review them I can't just verbally tell DH, he needs to see the numbers. It's always fine in the end, but he feels more comfortable with the actual costs, it's more tangible that way.
I was going to suggest similar. Working another shift part time would assist with the income. My hubby works days. I work evenings. I actually got offered a coveted dayshift position recently but passed it up because of finances, more daycare costs, less shift differential.
my husband and I have also gone back and forth with this discussion. We're in the same boat-I work 30 hours a week, and unless they bump me to FT and give me a raise then it doesn't financially make sense for me to work and put our baby in daycare. But he goes back and forth saying "well, maybe yo should just stay" to "i'd like our baby to be raised by it's mother". I can see where he's scared, so I proposed until our DD gets here, we'll sock all my money into savings and live solely off his income. It'll give us a chance to see if we can make it work, or if I need to find a different job right after giving birth. So far it's been fine, and he's feeling a lot more confident about it.
For me, being a SAHM is not an option---one because I love my job and two because I make too much to justify not working at all. So not going to argue one side or the other because it was just a no brainer for us.
However my thought when reading your original post was did you tell DH that you were planning to have that conversation with your boss that day? If not I feel that you should have---it is a partnership not him just having to go with whatever you decide because you know you can make it. I think he is scared--its a ton of pressure and if you have to discuss it a million times before baby gets here then thats what you have to do to make sure BOTH of you are 100% comfortable with the decision. Its just a huge decision so deserves a lot of consideration.
Just FYI, having your child in daycare while you work does not mean you are not raising your own child.