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Blended Families
dragon_chica
member
Need advice for friend (Long)
dragon_chica
member
I don't go on this forum since I'm not part of a blended family but my friend has a dilemma and I don't have the experience to help her. I'm hoping someone here could offer better advice than me. TIA.
Friend: Never married. Doesn't want kids, ever. Goes as far as saying
on dates that she's so sure she doesn't ever want kids that she would
get an abortion if she did end up PG. Has a tough time meeting guys
with same choices (obviously) but has been in a few relationships. Last
one ended in infidelity and really rocked her self-esteem, self-worth,
and as a result she has built up an emotional fortress.
Guy: This
guy is almost perfect. Very caring, tends to her needs, they can spend
hours talking on the phone and it won't feel like it, has a lot of
similar interests. She finds herself unconsciously smiling when
thinking about him and giddy about the next time they go out.
Problem:
She just found out a week ago (been on 6 dates so far) that he was
divorced and has 2 kids ages 3 & 5. Now she's freaked out. She can
get past the withholding of information regarding the divorce but she's
struggling with the idea of the kids. She's looking at the possible
scenario of marriage and having to be a SM and she doesn't want that
responsibility. She builds up all these fears based on really a whole
lotta nothing and it consumes her. She really, really doesn't want to
be responsible for having to parent a child. One of her irrational
fears is the thought that if the child wants mac 'n cheese she's now
stuck having to eat that for dinner.
My advice to her: Based on
what I've heard off and on when being on the Nest and elsewhere it's not
necessarily the step-parent's job to "parent" the step-child. They are
there in a supportive role that the biological parent is the one that
is in charge of setting the expectations, laying out the discipline,
guiding the children through life etc. I felt that if she were to be
alone with the kids and they misbehaved she has the right to discipline
them according to the father's expectations but that's about it and it
really shouldn't be a big deal. If she chooses to be even more of a
parent (caring for the child, helping with homework) then that's her
choice. I also pointed out that they're both taking a risk here and I
felt that the guy was taking a bigger risk with her. If this doesn't
work out she has the mental capacity to let go and move on. Those kids,
on the other hand, may not fair as well or get past it as quickly and
the dad would have to deal with that. The fact that he's willing to
take that risk shows how sure he is of the two of them. I also told her
that she's found someone that she's really connected to and now she's
ready to throw away. Normally, I don't push her about these things
because it's her choice to want to only date people who don't want kids.
But, after seeing how happy she is everytime she talks about him I'm
afraid she might miss this great opportunity.
This discussion has been closed.
Re: Need advice for friend (Long)
Being involved with someone with kids when you don't have any of your own, or even greater, don't want any of your own is a huge consideration. I am with the love of my life and yet there are days I want to run screaming away from this situation. It's not easy and I love SS and would love to have my own children with DH as well. Even if a SM chooses to be disengaged, as you are suggesting, it's extremely hard. Those kids are, and forever will be, a part of his life and therefore hers if she stays with him. In addition, she'll be tied to the BM, like it or not, forever. I would have rather had a simpler path than this one. Just know that it does take absolute dedication to him AND his kids for it to work out. Right now, she just sees him without his kids and they are just a figment of how it could be. If she stays with this guy and falls in love and gets married, it won't be as easy as disengaging (which I don't think is fully possible as you are helping to raise them if there is any sort of custody arrangement where the kids will be there for a large amount of time). Personally, I would encourage her to follow her gut. And if her gut says she shouldn't date people with children, I would tell her to abide by that.
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As someone who dated and married a man with two boys, please don't push your friend into this. As someone who has "been there, done that" I would actually tell her to run quickly in the other direction. This is no situation for someone who doesn't want children.
Sure, it's not the step-parents job to "parent" the child(ren), but look around this board and see how many aren't involved in some capacity. I'll give you a hint... There aren't many. She will most likely have to interact with them and spend considerable amounts of time with them based on how the court order is laid out. If this man is as great as you say he is to her, he's probably good to his kids too. He is going to want them to be a "family" - that means being there and being involved. It's not easy to disengage once you are involved in something like this.
Consider the finances for a moment... Assuming this man pays child support, even if they maintain separate accounts, what happens if he loses his job and the child support still needs to be paid? He will look to her to help. If they have a joint account it will be even worse as she watches part of their income fly out the door every month to support children that aren't hers, and furthermore that she didn't/doesn't want. Not fun.
I love my husband very much, and I love my SSs, but if I had to do it all over again, I wouldn't be here. Your friend can find someone else, this is not her last resort.
To an extent I WAS your friend at one time. (Minus the mac n cheese worry LOL).
It can and does work for a lot of people, but it is NOT easy. Kudos to her for knowing what she wants and not altering to fit society's idea that women are ALL supposed to reproduce.
Let me tell you from my experience. If I could have chosen who I'd fall in love with, I'd have never picked my DH w/ kids and the BMs that are attached to those kids.
If she is just looking for a fun, no strings attached, never meet the kids relationship, than hey go for it. However if she is looking for more ,she is in for a world of change.
She'll need to know that sometimes it's not the KIDS she will have issues with but the other parent.The kids have been the least of the issue in the Blended Family situation for me. MUCH more the drama with the BM. Your friend would need to know that she will never be #1 priority if she marries into this situation. If she married into it, finances could and will be a major cause of concern. Scheduling your life around school/kid events can get hairy.
I don't mean to sound like it's all bad, but there are days I'm sure many on this board will admit, we'd all like to run screaming!
Guy: This guy is almost perfect. Very caring, tends to her needs, they can spend hours talking on the phone and it won't feel like it, has a lot of similar interests. She finds herself unconsciously smiling when thinking about him and giddy about the next time they go out. Sounds like this man is someone that can have a huge significance in her life and she could really miss out if she walks away.
Problem: She's looking at the possible scenario of marriage and having to be a SM and she doesn't want that responsibility. She builds up all these fears based on really a whole lotta nothing and it consumes her. She really, really doesn't want to be responsible for having to parent a child. I tell my friends that if you come across a blended family situation, run away. It really is a difficult situation to be in and it takes a certain person to be willing to go through it. If she doesnt want to be responsible for children, she should walk away.
My advice to her: the step-parent's job to "parent" the step-child. They are there in a supportive role that the biological parent is the one that is in charge of setting the expectations, laying out the discipline, guiding the children through life etc.I cant say I agree with all of this but you are on the right track. When SS is with us, he is DH and I's son. Decisions are made as two adults in a completed household. If the children are older this can be more difficult but I have no experience in this. SS is a toddler. The children involved in your friends situation are young and will understand what is going on. She wont be jumping into the relationship with the children disciplining them and such but she will grow into it as they get comfortable. She needs the respect of the children and her and the father need to be sure they are on the same page going through this process.
If she chooses to be even more of a parent (caring for the child, helping with homework) then that's her choice.Big disagree on this one. If someone is becoming a solid figure in a childs life they need to be there for the child. No matter what. When a person becomes involved with a person who has children, they become involved with their children. Its a package deal. This means reading bed time stories, caring for boo-boos and tears, staying up all night with a sick child... A person cant opt out physically or mentally whenever they choose to.
If this doesn't work out she has the mental capacity to let go and move on. Disagree. She will be bonding with these children even if it is at a distance. If the relationship doesnt work out, she will wonder how those kids are doing and if its ten years from now, she will miss them. If I walked away from my relationship with my SS tomorrow, I would be devastated. I joke with people Im only in the relationship for SS because I love him so much. If a breakup happens, she will be breaking up with two other people at the same time. It would hurt.
The fact that he's willing to take that risk shows how sure he is of the two of them. Agree with you completely. It sounds like he is doing the right thing by not throwing his relationship with his kids at her. Sounds like he is taking his time to work on their relationship first and introduce later. What a stand up guy! Those kids will always be his #1 and she needs to understand this.
I also told her that she's found someone that she's really connected to and now she's ready to throw away. So, to wrap it up, she needs to do a few things.
- Face her demons and find self-worth
- Understand this man is a package deal. Either face her fears of raising children (because it will be hands on) or walk away and hope in her years ahead of her she beats the odds and finds a single, child-free man.
- Understand that if she chooses to be with this man she will have to deal with the struggles of having another woman in the picture for the rest of her life.
- Understand that the love she has for this man needs to be equal for his children. They are a part of this man and will carry on everything she loves about him.
If she is uncertain, she shouldnt just run away if she believes she can get past her no-children feelings. Tell her to give the relationship some time and wait on meeting the children. If she cant get past the children she needs to step away. I hope this is helpful and I wish your friend luck in whichever she chooses.ETA~ A blended family will work when the person walking into it has too much love for someone that its not worth walking away. This amount of love should naturally extend to the children involved because they are a part of the person they love so much.
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DH SA:Normal-Low Count
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Sep 2012: Clomid 150MG CD5-9 & TI= ??
Aside from her current relationship, your friend needs counseling, IMO. Irrational fears (about mac 'n cheese)? Getting out of a relationship that ruined her self-esteem? Thinking about marriage after 6 dates? There is a whole lotta crazy going on there. I don't think her lack of interest in children is the only reason she has a hard time finding men.
That being said, if you don't want kids, it's stupid to date a man with a 3 & 5 year old. Because if the relationship becomes long-term, they WILL be a part of your life. I'm not sure how old your friend is, but there are plenty of men out there whos children have already grown and out of the house. Or men who don't want children.
I completely disagree with you about "the dad being willing to take that risk means he is sure of the relationship." The fact that he is willing to take that risk could mean anything - including that he is a sh*tty father who doesn't think long-term about what is best for his kids.
I agree with this exactly. I love my FI and his children but it is not easy being in a relationship with someone who has children and no matter what, the children are there to stay -even if they are not physically present every day. There is a whole new dynamic and added stress to a relationship with children, even if they are not yours. You don't want her getting close with this guy and close to the children and then years down the road, she finds herself unhappy and resentful in her relationship.
Tell her to keep looking for a guy that wants what she wants and do not screw with someone's kids.
This seems easy. She doesn't want kids ever. She does not want to be a parent. HE has kids. He is a parent. IT doesn't work. It would be unfair to everyone to stay with this man.
Your friend should break up with this man. It's wonderful she found a great man but she can find another great man without kids.
I don't know how someone with kids would ever consider dating someone who never wants kids.
Not wanting to birth children and not wanting kids aren't the same. Not wanting to raise kids but being with a man who has kids is not a good situation. This woman doesn't want kids. She didn't say she just didn't want to have her own kids.
I didn't say they were a monster but who would you want your kids to be partly raised by someone who really doesn't want kids?
She doesn't want the responsibility of being a step-parent. Why would someone suggest it's a good idea to enter a relationship not wanting what the relationship has. THere's nothing wrong with not wanting kids, there doesn't have to be some deep reason beyond she doesn't want kids.
It wouldn't be fair to the kids for them to just "try it out".
EDIT Sorry for all the bold.
It blows my mind that he even wants to date her after hearing how she doesn't want kids. It kind of makes me wonder about his character.
I don't think it's fair for anyone involved. It's not fair to her to have to be around kids if she never wanted them. It's not fair for him to be with a woman who possibly will never love his kids. It's not fair to the kids for them to have to ever be around a woman who doesn't even want them.
She needs to find someone who 100 percent agrees with her and will not lie to her about something so major
Sounds like on the surface this girl needs to Run though.
I am still stuck on the fact that this man purposefully hid the fact that he has two children from a woman who tells the men (on a date) that she is so anti child she would abort any fetus were she to become pregnant.
That is a whole lot of denial
I agree with all the PP.
When I met DH I was a single mom with a three-year-old son. I'd only dated casually, and I'd never introduced anyone to DS. I had no clue what I was doing.
DH's attitude from the beginning was that to date me, he had to think he would marry me. And to marry me, he had to think he could be a parent to my child.
Every blended family situation is different. In your friend's situation, maybe the man she's dating is an every-other-weekend dad. Maybe the kids have a competent, involved mother. Maybe she could somehow manage to minimize the kids' affect on her life. But if she cares about this man--and from your post, it sounds as though she does--how could she be with him and feel that way about his children?
She needs to let him go and wish him well.
I'm a lurker, child of a blended family situation, and I can tell you this:
I will never forgive my father for choosing to marry a woman who interfered in his relationship with me. What kind of good guy puts his relationship with his kids at risk for a woman he's just met?
The very fact that he hid his children from her for 6 dates and (apparently) many long conversations shows me that this man is not a good guy.
Also, if your friend does continue to date this man - and eventually marry him - and he sees his kids at all: there is a good chance that they'll want mac'n'cheese for dinner. Or they'll want to go to the water park instead of a day spa. Or they'll want to watch Hannah Montana when they're at their dad's house. Their dad, if he's a good dad, will probably let them have these things at times. Your friend will have to deal. If she recognizes that she'll resent the kids because she has to have mac'n'cheese for dinner, then she is wise to leave him now.
RUN. Fast and far.
And a big WTF to being Ok with him withholding info on kids and previous marriage.
Exactly. OP, I'm guessing that your friend was so honest and open about not wanting kids with her dates because she didn't want to get involved with someone only to find out they didn't want the same things.
Why wouldn't the father disclose his children (and previous marriage) to his dates early on to make sure he was with someone who would accept him and his children?
NOPE. It shows how little he cares for his kids that he thinks with his d!ck first. Again, she should run.
Thanks ladies for all your honest and somewhat tough responses! I knew I went to the right place. I told her that since I'm not in a blended family situation I don't think my advice is the best advice and I had suggested to her that she should go on a forum and ask but I'm pretty sure she won't do that either. Just to answer a few questions and provide more details:
- I think I'm a bit sad about the situation because she's 35 and starting to get to that point in her life where she's losing hope. I haven't seen her this happy about a guy in a very long time and I found myself getting caught up in the excitement. So when she told me what was revealed I was devastated for her.
- The guy's reason for not telling her right away was partly fear of losing her when she first said she didn't want kids and advice he got from friends that said to not tell her right away and let her get to know him better.
- He has the kids two weekdays and some weekends.
- Just like one pp pointed out, my friend isn't a "monster." She's a Kindergarten teacher who adores her nephew, dotes on my kids as well as our other friends' kids, and has a lot of love and compassion for the people around her. From what I understand her reasons for not wanting children is based on her feelings of not wanting to go through the pregnancy stage, l&d, and raising a child that may someday treat her badly like she did to her parents years ago.
- I think her biggest issue (and I've pointed this out to her) is that she overanalyzes everything to death and to the point that it paralyzes her. For example, I asked her to be DD's godmother but upon researching what it meant to be a godmother she freaked out. She thought it was way too much responsibility. I explained that I didn't expect her to guide our child on the spiritual path but that wasn't enough and she decided to bow out. She almost wasn't my maid-of-honor because, once again, she freaked out after reading the role of a MOH. She worried that the bridal shower she throws won't be up to par with the types of parties I throw (her words.)
- I do agree that she needs to seek help for how she's living her life and relationships. I know that she lets her past BFs dictate how she lives her life right now. We constantly point out her contradictions and the way she goes about things when it comes to relationships but she still continues to do it. I think this situation may be a good segue into suggesting counseling. I really do think she needs it.
- Oh, and just to comment on the mac 'n cheese scenario. If my DD wants mac 'n cheese then I'll make it for her. It doesn't necessarily mean I feel like I have to eat it as well. I just serve her the mac 'n cheese and then serve DH and I whatever dinner I had made. So I don't agree that you have to succumb to those sort of things with your kids. So when my friend brought up that scenario I told her she doesn't have to eat it if she doesn't want to.
Again, thanks everyone.
I know your referring to my post.
Pit is not so much the desire to abort a child were she to get pregnant, (I would be a hypocrit given I was prepaed to do just that at one time in my life) but to EXPRESS that to MORE THAN ONE POTENTIAL SO after a handful of dates is way out of proportion to the situation.
Telling the other person he/she HAS kids, an obligation and responsibility that is life consuming is one thing, to let the other person know that you don't want that kind of shackle is one thing, to let some POTENTIAL guy know the extent of your stance in such a graphic way is totally out there.
Why does she feel that she needs to show her convictions to such an extent?
I can answer that. In the past she has done the usual, "I don't want kids." She gets met with a lot of the same responses.
- But you're a Kinder teacher?!!?
- You mean just not right now, right?
- (in so many words) I'm sure you'll change your mind.
She got so frustrated with people not wanting to take what she says to be final and felt the need to go to that extreme. AND, she usually says this by the 3rd date if not the initial couple phone calls before meeting. Believe me, I've told her that I feel her saying that is really extreme.
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I figured this is the reason she is so strong in her convictions and the way she words this. It fing sucks to say, no I dont have/want children to then hear "oh you will change your mind" or "why not? What else will you do" or "life without children is unimaginable" or "how selfish of you" or "how sad for you. You will have such a lonely life". WTF? Yes, I have heard all Of those things. Yes, it's irritating and hurtful. At some point it just gets to be too much. I snap at people when they ask me when I am having kids. Or why I haven't had them. Or give me that oh pity you look. Or when they do the sarcastic/exacerbated "must be nice to have time to paint your nails/plan a vacation/buy a fancy purse/take a nap/etc"damn right it is.
I feel for your friend and think being totally upfront about her desires is a good thing. I think getting into a relationship where those things aren't made clear is a recipe for disaster. If the roles here were reversed and your friend was a man I think everyone would be applauding him for being upfront and not leading on a woman. I mean it's one of those things that should be put out in the open sooner rather than later. Nothing worse than getting 6 months in and realizing you two want different things in the kids department and neither is going to change their mind.