Meeting with Principal- Advice needed.

torrey111 · May 2012

Hi Ladies,

Haven't been around much lately...now the weather is nice, my 2-year-old wants to be outside all the time. So, the computer has taken a back seat...

Anyways, I am meeting with the principal of my sons school this week. The reason I want to speak with him is that I want careful consideration given to who his teacher is next year- I actually don't know anything about them, I just want him to pick the one that will be best suited to working with my ADHD son. I feel his teacher this year jumped ship early on with him.

Also, and more seriously, I intend to have a very direct conversation with him about what our experience has been at this school (it's Spanish immersion and highly regarded in our area) as parents of a kid who is getting services. In an effort to be brief, basically that we have felt unwanted and like we're the annoying family- the annoying ADHD kid who can't stay on task, and the annoying parents that fight for more effort from the teachers. We've been told that maybe it's "not the best fit" (like, "maybe you guys should go to another school so we don't have to deal with this) and have had the teacher tell us that "it's not fair to the other students" that she has to help my DS stay on task so often.

(I anticipate Auntie chiming in here to play devil's advocate )

So my ? is, how do I tell him these things while communicating to him that I want to work to change this feeling. It's not just us. I know many parents of kids with learning issues at that school that get the same vibe. They want a school of perfect little stepford children.

far_more_than_rubies · May 2012

I have no advice on what precisely to say, but something that has helped me is to write down the things I want to say first and read them aloud a few times. When it comes to our children and how they are being treated or perceived, it's hard not to get emotional. You want to be listened to and taken seriously, and it seems like you really want to be a catalyst for change for the better for all kids with needs at your school. Walk in with a list of ideas for how you can see this change happening, and offer to be a part of what you are proposing. If you come in with some ideas for action, then it looks less like you are complaining, and more trying to be part of a solution.

I wish you the best!

mum2jack&littleb · May 2012

I really to want to echo what Auntie said and ask you to try to look at it from your son's perspective.

Even if he is not "aware" of the social stigmatism this all entails at this age (and I'd bet, based on dealing with my almost 6yo DS with ADHD in k'garten that he is WAY more aware than you think), he will be becoming aware. And sooner than you want to think.

Also, the children of those parents who don't want the SN kids around will have picked up on and think that it is OK to replicate the attitudes/thoughts/words/actions of their parents. This is an environment of intolerance and disinclusion and I only see a future where your son gets hurt in it. Kids are mean. Especially when the example that has been set for them (by parents, teachers, administrators, etc) is that it is OK to treat another boy differently. Different treatment can turn to exclusion, hateful words, and bullying in a minute.

Please try to put your son's needs first - regardless of cousins etc. He deserves to be around educators and children who value him as an individual, celebrate his uniqueness, and enjoy (OK, are at least are not resentful when they see him every day - which is how i've been made to feel in the past re: DS) helping him learn.

Please know that I write this to you only from a place of caring, as I too am a mother struggling to raise a DS that is quirky and doesn't fit in the mold at school.

torrey111 · May 2012

(Maybe you should find another school. Sure, your son has a right to attend this school since it is a public school, but at what cost to him? This school has a climate and culture of disinclusion around special needs kids. They don't want him, why would you send your son to a school where he is treated like a PITA? It's not as if he's thriving there.

The other piece is the whole notion of attempting to educate a kid with attentional issues, and likely auditory processing glitches, in a language in which he is not fluent.)

Auntie, I totally hear what you are saying, but you've never answered my "what if" scenario of pulling him from his school, inserting into the other public school (which is also a really good school, IB program, etc...) where we end up with the exact same issues AND depression and/or refusal to go (which we don't have any of now). Besides, who's to say the climate there is any more accepting? The only school that seems like it's going to be really accepting is the local 20K a year private school for kids with ADHD/learning issues. You can't fault me for not being able to afford that and you also gotta consider the what if situation.

Also, two psychologists said in their opinion, these issues would be equivalent in a Spanish or English setting.

torrey111 · May 2012

mum2jack&littleb:
I really to want to echo what Auntie said and ask you to try to look at it from your son's perspective.

Even if he is not "aware" of the social stigmatism this all entails at this age (and I'd bet, based on dealing with my almost 6yo DS with ADHD in k'garten that he is WAY more aware than you think), he will be becoming aware. And sooner than you want to think.

Also, the children of those parents who don't want the SN kids around will have picked up on and think that it is OK to replicate the attitudes/thoughts/words/actions of their parents. This is an environment of intolerance and disinclusion and I only see a future where your son gets hurt in it. Kids are mean. Especially when the example that has been set for them (by parents, teachers, administrators, etc) is that it is OK to treat another boy differently. Different treatment can turn to exclusion, hateful words, and bullying in a minute.

Please try to put your son's needs first - regardless of cousins etc. He deserves to be around educators and children who value him as an individual, celebrate his uniqueness, and enjoy (OK, are at least are not resentful when they see him every day - which is how i've been made to feel in the past re: DS) helping him learn.

Please know that I write this to you only from a place of caring, as I too am a mother struggling to raise a DS that is quirky and doesn't fit in the mold at school.

Thanks

meghans30 · May 2012

Struggling with much of the same issues here. You've received some great advice. Whatever you decide, just make sure to consider all the angles.

torrey111 · May 2012

If there's a private LD/ADHD school that may be an even better fit until your DS matures a bit behaviorally around attention and impulse behaviors. If your immersion school is looking to turf him somewhere, they could send him there on the district's dime. $20K a year is a relative bargain for this type of school; the one DS attended is up to $30K next year for middle school. You realize that in certain instances theraputic schools can be deducted as a medical expense on your federal income taxes.How!!????!!! How exactly does one make that happen? Sending him to the private LD/ADHD school would be the ONLY choice for pulling him from his school- and ONLY because I would be CERTAIN he'd be in an environment that would consider his learning challenges.Please, tell me how to get the district to pay for it.Re: your son's history with changing schools. Yes, you have told me how that went down, but the core difference is that my DS has his best friends there (albeit only 2). He has a hard time making new friends, something I am hearing himself verbalize now, I just cannot risk it when the other school could just be more of the same.And to touch on the language thing, there are moments when I am completely astonished by his Spanish ability. For instance, a couple weeks ago we were going for ice cream. We had one of the amity interns with us and they we in the back seat (the two 8-year-olds) and the intern (24 year old Spanish guy). They were talking and telling jokes and laughing so hard...all the time in Spanish, and, I don't know, it was one of the moments where I thought, it's gotta be doing him some good having this exposure!

torrey111 · May 2012

Auntie. C'mon. Really? I am SO sorry you feel that way. Jeez, now I feel just horrible- I didn't mean to imply any of what you suggested. I wasn't in any way saying any of that- although I understand it came across that way somehow.

What I was trying to say, is that during this back-and-forth we have had going on about my son's school and whether or not it's a good fit, I feel like I am the only one who feels the social-emotional piece is vitally important! "Kids are resilient!" "They will make new friends!" "He'll get over it". These are all the things I hear but you know what, I'm not so sure he'd make new friends, not at this point in his life anyways. He's not your normal kid. He's a bit quirky, sometimes socially awkward/immature, and the ADHD poses a bunch of other obstacles to him connecting with others. The friends he has, he's known and played with ALOT since age 3. They spend the weekends running back and forth between houses. They have seen my DS in all of his wonderful moments, not what kids at school see when he's stressed about the workload/bored and zoning off. It's hard for kids at school to see him for who he is, and thus, he doesn't make new friends easily.

Once again, I am sorry, I really didn't mean to do that.........

torrey111 · May 2012

-auntie-:
torrey111:

Auntie. C'mon. Really? I am SO sorry you feel that way. Jeez, now I feel just horrible- I didn't mean to imply any of what you suggested. I wasn't in any way saying any of that- although I understand it came across that way somehow.

Yeah, it really read like an attack on my kid. DH read it and thought so too. I'll assume you're just a stressed out mother who didn't realize how she came across.

What I was trying to say, is that during this back-and-forth we have had going on about my son's school and whether or not it's a good fit, I feel like I am the only one who feels the social-emotional piece is vitally important!

No true. I can completely appreciate the choice you have to make. Almost every educational choice I have made for my son has been around the social piece. It is vitally important for kids to master the social stuff, not just to keep them happy, but to prepare them for a place in the 21st century's collaborative workplace. School is the learning lab for employment.

"Kids are resilient!" "They will make new friends!" "He'll get over it". These are all the things I hear but you know what, I'm not so sure he'd make new friends, not at this point in his life anyways. He's not your normal kid. He's a bit quirky, sometimes socially awkward/immature, and the ADHD poses a bunch of other obstacles to him connecting with others. The friends he has, he's known and played with ALOT since age 3. They spend the weekends running back and forth between houses. They have seen my DS in all of his wonderful moments, not what kids at school see when he's stressed about the workload/bored and zoning off. It's hard for kids at school to see him for who he is, and thus, he doesn't make new friends easily.

I hope these friends stick by him. IME, with lots of kids- well developing, NT, those with subtle ADHD and more complicated presentations- friends change starting around 5th grade. That free spirited running around it almost at an end.

Take my buddy Alex. I've know Alex since he was 4 and in DS's preschool class. Alex has ADHD, very mild CP and is struggling socially. In elementary he was good friends with the nice, "bright" NT kids in his classes, but in middle school he was tracked into smaller classes for kids who need extra help staying on task and organized. He no longer saw his bright GATE classmates and over time the plan they made over the weekend ceased to include him. Alex loves sports and played on several teams through elementary school but come middle school the teams break into elite travel teams and school teams that have try-outs. He was able to stay in touch with some of the scouts who were also his elementary classmates, but they matured emotionally and had moved on to bands, girls and jobs while he still wanted to hang out. He's a terrific kid, but just doesn't fit in. I mention this because his mother faded his IEP and enrolled him in a few AP classes so he could be with his friends. It didn't help socially or emotionally and he's in danger of not graduating.

Auntie. I really do appreciate all you contribute here- yet sometimes I feel like there is this underlying "doom and gloom" backdrop to your stories. Now, before I come off any way and because tone is lost in type, I am only stating a thought, not making any blanket statements/judgements about anything.

As a PP said, "please consider your son's interests when thinking about this". I am. And his friends ARE his interest.

I LOVE hearing everything you have experienced- it's really helpful in processing our reality. But you know, lots of people stay friends into adulthood. My DH for example, there is a group of 10 guys- have all known each other since kindergarten- lots went away for school in their 20's, but a lot have returned to MN to settle and they all are still very good friends.

Also, guys are different- they don't (as much) have the same issues as girls do as teens, like weird friendship stuff. Sure, drifting apart happens, but when a handful of kids live 4 houses away from each other, have known each other their whole lives, ride the bus to school everyday, play together at recess, have sleepovers, go on vacation together, etc. these are the bonds that are crucial to my son's happiness- I will not tear that away- no matter how far behind in his Spanish reading the school thinks he is (he's ahead in English by the way). Moving him to another school where we are not guaranteed anything would only facilitate the demise of that bond.

I'm not living in a fantasy world, but I do believe there is power in positive thinking. Thinking that all his friendships are going to go down the tube anyways- so I should run away from the school- isn't in our cards. Instead, I'm staying positive and doing what I can to keep his life stable- friendships, school, and all.

I meet with the principal tomorrow. I know he will, like a manager at a restaurant, listen to my "complaints", smile and apologize. But I intend to have a very direct, yet non-confrontational conversation with him for the sole purpose of articulating what our experience has been and what our expectations are for 4th grade. At this moment, I can't work to change the climate of the school, I have to focus on my DS.

torrey111 · May 2012

-auntie-:
torrey111:
Auntie. I really do appreciate all you contribute here- yet sometimes I feel like there is this underlying "doom and gloom" backdrop to your stories. Now, before I come off any way and because tone is lost in type, I am only stating a thought, not making any blanket statements/judgements about anything.

I'm sorry if I don't say what you want to hear. And I'm sorry if you think I'm all gloom and doom. Perhaps that is a function of particpating in a number of ASD, ADHD and LD specific boards for 12 years. Perhaps it's a function of volunteering with hundreds of cubs and boy scouts the last 12 years (yeah, I get it, boys are different) and seeing their strengths and weaknesses play out over time. I've seen a lot and I've had a lot of parents unload on me.

It's not that you say things I don't want to hear- I like hearing other ways, tips and opinions. I just think it's difficult to maintain a healthy balance between negative and positive thinking given the circumstances we as special needs parents are under. We'd all probably be better off if we thought about the balance a bit more.
As a PP said, "please consider your son's interests when thinking about this". I am. And his friends ARE his interest.

What are his friends' interests? What will they be in 2 years?
His friends' interests? Friends. In 2 years I suppose it will be the same.

I LOVE hearing everything you have experienced- it's really helpful in processing our reality. But you know, lots of people stay friends into adulthood. My DH for example, there is a group of 10 guys- have all known each other since kindergarten- lots went away for school in their 20's, but a lot have returned to MN to settle and they all are still very good friends.

Also, guys are different- they don't (as much) have the same issues as girls do as teens, like weird friendship stuff. Sure, drifting apart happens, but when a handful of kids live 4 houses away from each other, have known each other their whole lives, ride the bus to school everyday, play together at recess, have sleepovers, go on vacation together, etc. these are the bonds that are crucial to my son's happiness- I will not tear that away- no matter how far behind in his Spanish reading the school thinks he is (he's ahead in English by the way). Moving him to another school where we are not guaranteed anything would only facilitate the demise of that bond.

But the teachers don't like your kid and wish he went to school somewhere else. They are unwilling to support him to the degree he requires to be successful. His friends can't mitigate that.

I'm not living in a fantasy world, but I do believe there is power in positive thinking. Thinking that all his friendships are going to go down the tube anyways- so I should run away from the school- isn't in our cards. Instead, I'm staying positive and doing what I can to keep his life stable- friendships, school, and all.
---I sincerely hope you are able to manage this. Just remember that so long as you remain in this school you are also protecting him against the possibility of a having teachers who truly "get" him and actually like him. The kind of teachers who can teach him strategies to overcome his areas of weakness and build on what is best about him. You also protect him against meeting other kids who might be a little different and quirky and a little bit more like him.
----
I guess I'm missing something. How is it you're so certain he'll be understood in another school? You repeat this with such certainty- the only way I'd be convinced of that is if he were at the private LD/ADHD school. Other than that, it's a total roll of the dice, and more than not, more of the same.

I meet with the principal tomorrow. I know he will, like a manager at a restaurant, listen to my "complaints", smile and apologize. But I intend to have a very direct, yet non-confrontational conversation with him for the sole purpose of articulating what our experience has been and what our expectations are for 4th grade. At this moment, I can't work to change the climate of the school, I have to focus on my DS.

Be sure and let us know how it goes.
I will for sure.

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