the "what next" talk - join in

BzeetyD · May 2012

We are very hopeful and excited about this next round of IVF but last night we started the "what next" talk regarding what we'd do or try next if IVF with our own biological parts doesn't work. We're not giving up on IVF yet, but I think it's wise for us at least, to start to think about our options and what feels "right" to us.

It's a lot to think about and right now we're just talking and not making decisions about anything, just sharing our feelings and thoughts.

Have you had that talk? If you know, what's your "what next?" Care to share?

Enndea · May 2012

We have. And I haven't even started IVF! While I feel optimistic, I'm the type that wants a plan. So....we will try IVF (probably 2 rounds) and if that doesn't work we have agreed that we will start looking into adoption at that point. I have a strong desire to have a child of my own--but I realized recently I have an even stronger desire to be a parent. Now, beyond that--I wouldn't even know where to start. Foreign or Domestic? Costs, timeframes? That's all considerations for another day. I'm trying very hard to take one step at a time.

BzeetyD · May 2012

Enndea:
We have. And I haven't even started IVF! While I feel optimistic, I'm the type that wants a plan. So....we will try IVF (probably 2 rounds) and if that doesn't work we have agreed that we will start looking into adoption at that point. I have a strong desire to have a child of my own--but I realized recently I have an even stronger desire to be a parent. Now, beyond that--I wouldn't even know where to start. Foreign or Domestic? Costs, timeframes? That's all considerations for another day. I'm trying very hard to take one step at a time.

Agreed, I will need to grieve not having a bio child, if it comes to that. But I/we would really love to be parents and I feel like I/we would be missing something in my/our life if we didn't.

There is so much info to absorb and, like you, I'm not totally ready to do that. I may start lurking on some other boards here or poking around the interwebs just to get a sense of the journey.

delino · May 2012

We've discussed it because of people making the comment that we could adopt. We both agree that we don't feel adoption is right for us, but we haven't discussed what we'll do if IVF is a total failure.

DoublePortion · May 2012

My DH has said we can only afford 1 round of IVF and then we would have to save a few years for adoption. I don't think he's being realistic, considering he doesn't manage our finances or have a clue about the costs of adoption. I'm avoiding the topic & KMFX that IVF #1 works. If not, then I guess we'll have to have that talk afterwards. We'd be able to afford IVF again, but it might mean that he can't play golf 3 times a week & spend money like there's no tomorrow. He's a very odd man...when it comes to golf his pockets know no limits, but he is pretty tight with money otherwise.

BzeetyD · May 2012

delino:
We've discussed it because of people making the comment that we could adopt. We both agree that we don't feel adoption is right for us, but we haven't discussed what we'll do if IVF is a total failure.

I think this is how we feel about donor egg, that it isn't right for us. Right now we're not crossing off any roads, but I think there are some things we're less comfortable with.

maggie2324 · May 2012

Right now we don't have a next step. We are pretty sure that IVF will work for us. While we didn't get pregnant from IVF #1, it was still somewhat successful as we got 5 usable blasts of which 3 were expanded and perfect quality. Well, 2 of those are gone now, but you get my drift.

I'm banking on a similar result for IVF #2, and if that fails we will start working on our frosties. I don't think we will make back up plans until we are farther into it. I always thought we would do DS next, but since we got good quality embryos it doesn't seem like that would help.

rebaann · May 2012

We have. This DE cycle will be our last effort to have a child.

Due to the cost of further treatment and the cost of adoption, which is about the same as more IVF, and our age, we have decided that this will be it. If it works, we will be beyond excited. If not, we will be disappointed, but we have a very full and happy life that we will continue to enjoy together. If we were younger, I think that our answer would be different and we would keep trying or move to adoption.

maryoosa · May 2012

We are not going to move on to IVF. I'm barely making it through the injectables for IUI's and it's not pretty. We will adopt. I have never been gung-ho on pregnancy and having a biological child. I told my parents I'd be adopting at age six. So, this was just a "well, if it works great" I figure the cost of IVF nears the cost of adoption often. So, I'd rather adopt and not put m body through more hell.

hugmonkey · May 2012

As our issue is MFI, we have already discussed trying donor sperm if needed. So far, our RE doesn't think we'll need to go that route, but DH is completely open to it. Our goal is to ultimately have several children, and we realize that biologically that is unlikely. So, we are going to continue with our IVF cycles, but also pursue adoption as well.

LuvWIfootball · May 2012

We already have a "what next" plan in place for our IVF cycle. If they don't find any quality sperm in DH's biospy (done day of ER), then we'll use donor sperm. My guess is that if DH's sperm is used and doesn't work for IVF, we may try IUI w/DS. But that would be last ditch effort due to finances.

We've discussed adoption, but because DH was dx w/cancer, I don't think our chances are very good, at least for the next several years. Plus, it's really expensive and I don't like the idea of "marketing" ourselves in hopes that we're picked. I also don't like that several of the area adoption agencies are religion based (we are not religious at all).

Guess we're just trying to focus on the plan we have right now and hoping that it works.

AngnShaun · May 2012

We havent had this discussion... but my sister asked me what if IVF doesnt work either. I couldnt even answer her... its too upsetting to think about it.

winofairy · May 2012

We knew due to finances and our age that we would be trying IVF 1x. The success rate at my age isn't very favorable. I just keep kicking myself for not going the IVF route sooner. Did we really need to try IUI 8x's before realzing it wasn't going to work. Or that I completely trusted my 1st RE and maybe should've gotten a 2nd opinion sooner (since all he did was IUI's). So many what if's and I'm driving myself crazy! cuckoo! CUCKOO!

Maybe our finance situation will change in the next 2 years before I'm not allowed to use my own eggs and we can give it another go.

I've tried talking to DH about donor eggs and he's not game at all. I keep telling him it will be our child. My blood and body doing all the nourishing and his sperm = our child but he says no. And the DE costs are astronomical to us.

Neither of us are big on the adoption idea. One because it's so extremely hard and would seem to be more stressful than IVF. And two (as I've mentioned before) I'm not sure I would pass the psych evaluation with my long LONG history of MAJOR depression.

DH keeps telling me that if it doesn't happen for us that he is completely ok. Now I just have to come to peace with it.

I found this quote on pinterest today and made it my tweet/fb post of the day:

Dear God: I have tried my best, and if today I lose my hope PLEASE tell me that your plans for me are better than my dreams.

MrsNukem · May 2012

It will depend on what my RE has to say at my WTF. I have a feeling she will let me try again with my OE. If that is the case, I am willing to do 1 more IVF with my OE. If that doesn't work, we will go to DE. I just feel that I've put so much effort and research into IVF that I am more comfortable going with DE vs adoption. I lurked on the adoption board and started doing a little research on it and just feel so overwhelmed by it. Adoption isn't cheap either! I hate how some people say "well you can just adopt". Like it's as simple as going to the grocery store and picking out the child of your choice.

winofairy · May 2012

MrsNukem:
It will depend on what my RE has to say at my WTF. I have a feeling she will let me try again with my OE. If that is the case, I am willing to do 1 more IVF with my OE. If that doesn't work, we will go to DE. I just feel that I've put so much effort and research into IVF that I am more comfortable going with DE vs adoption. I lurked on the adoption board and started doing a little research on it and just feel so overwhelmed by it. Adoption isn't cheap either! I hate how some people say "well you can just adopt". Like it's as simple as going to the grocery store and picking out the child of your choice.

I got the "well you can always adopt" from my mother in law the other day. Really!? WTH!! If we can't pursue another IVF cycle where does she think we would get the money to adopt!? I just let DH have it because she made this comment to me and I have been holding it in for a few days. It's not his fault and she is clueless what it's like to be infertile.

Enndea · May 2012

LuvWIfootball:
We've discussed adoption, but because DH was dx w/cancer, I don't think our chances are very good, at least for the next several years. Plus, it's really expensive and I don't like the idea of "marketing" ourselves in hopes that we're picked. I also don't like that several of the area adoption agencies are religion based (we are not religious at all).

YES. I understand this totally. Like I said, I haven't given it too much thought yet, but it is very expensive, and I completely agree with the marketing aspect. I lean toward thinking we would likely do a foreign adoption for this reason, and also to avoid the religious affiliations as we're agnostic.

chicagobride_07 · May 2012

At first, DH wasn't willing to talk about options as he was convinced the IUIs wouldn't fail. He said I was being pessimistic. We now have 3 failed IUIs and he is more willing to talk about options. He sees the time and money we are spending, for no result. We (due to lack of insurance coverage) have only one attempt at IVF. Given my age, I'm seriously considering DE. I have researched adoption just a bit as DH's company has a generous adoption benefit (but no IVF coverage). I am not putting it off the table completely, but it seems like a very long road. I've looked at some agency websites and get a bit put off about the whole concept of so aggressively marketing yourselves to a birth mother. Not sure why- my sister is a birth mom (very successful open adoption- son is now 17!) and thought the same thing when she saw some of the websites. Also, fine now, but have seen a therapist/psychiatrist in the past. Not sure if people are aware, but that pretty much almost rules out completely the possibility of international adoption (at least per the agencies I've spoken to).

JBDamonM · May 2012

We have never had this chat, but in my eyes it's pretty obvious what direction it would go.

We're not even at the start line for IVF, which is probably why we have not had it.

But I don't see how we could afford to adopt. And I whole heartedly agree with all the PP's about the marketing factor.... That being said DH's family adopted twice when they were told they'd never have biological children, so something tells me he'd want to explore it....

We have MFI - and I suppose there could always be the option of Donor Sperm - but I don't foresee that either, I'm definetly not ready to think about that and am sure DH isn't either.

rebaann · May 2012

winofairy:
I found this quote on pinterest today and made it my tweet/fb post of the day:

Dear God: I have tried my best, and if today I lose my hope PLEASE tell me that your plans for me are better than my dreams.

I'm going to steal this.

joules12 · May 2012

MrsNukem:
It will depend on what my RE has to say at my WTF. I have a feeling she will let me try again with my OE. If that is the case, I am willing to do 1 more IVF with my OE. If that doesn't work, we will go to DE. I just feel that I've put so much effort and research into IVF that I am more comfortable going with DE vs adoption. I lurked on the adoption board and started doing a little research on it and just feel so overwhelmed by it. Adoption isn't cheap either! I hate how some people say "well you can just adopt". Like it's as simple as going to the grocery store and picking out the child of your choice.

All of this!!!

Our next cycle will be with my OE (RE has yet to even mention DE, but it's been on my mind for some time now). Even if this next cycle fails, we hope that it will give us some more insight to help decide our next step. We already know from prior cycles that 1) I'm a poor responder and 2) my egg quality seems to be pretty crappy. However, we also know that I can *get* pregnant and, most likely, maintain a pregnancy -- first/only ET resulted in BFP and the resulting miscarriage was likely due to chromosomal abnormalities of the embryo.

If our next cycle fails, I'm pretty sure we will try one more cycle -- just not sure if we will do it with my OE or DE (depends on what this next cycle shows us). Over the past months, I've become much more comfortable with the idea of DE. However, I still know relatively little about all the costs and processes involved with DE. Will need to do some research and decide whether we'd actually prefer to put that money and time towards adoption instead. That said, the adoption process still scares the heck out of me (even after speaking first-hand with various friends who have successfully gone through it). Like you, MrsNukem, I am now wayyy more comfortable with IVF than adoption...I've been so overwhelmed every time I start research!

JBDamonM · May 2012

winofairy:

We knew due to finances and our age that we would be trying IVF 1x. The success rate at my age isn't very favorable. I just keep kicking myself for not going the IVF route sooner. Did we really need to try IUI 8x's before realzing it wasn't going to work. Or that I completely trusted my 1st RE and maybe should've gotten a 2nd opinion sooner (since all he did was IUI's). So many what if's and I'm driving myself crazy! cuckoo! CUCKOO!

Maybe our finance situation will change in the next 2 years before I'm not allowed to use my own eggs and we can give it another go.

I've tried talking to DH about donor eggs and he's not game at all. I keep telling him it will be our child. My blood and body doing all the nourishing and his sperm = our child but he says no. And the DE costs are astronomical to us.

Neither of us are big on the adoption idea. One because it's so extremely hard and would seem to be more stressful than IVF. And two (as I've mentioned before) I'm not sure I would pass the psych evaluation with my long LONG history of MAJOR depression.

DH keeps telling me that if it doesn't happen for us that he is completely ok. Now I just have to come to peace with it.

I found this quote on pinterest today and made it my tweet/fb post of the day:

Dear God: I have tried my best, and if today I lose my hope PLEASE tell me that your plans for me are better than my dreams.

I have not gotten a chance to tell you how sorry I am that this didn't work out for you - but my heart has been aching for you guys since the weekend....

I'm keeping you in my thoughts and prayers and hoping there are (MUCH) better days ahead for you.

And I absolutely love your quote. So well said.

Hang in there! ((HUGS))

kaf7 · May 2012

Our IVF plans are limited by only being in the same province as our sperm for one more year. We are willing to try as long as that is the case and can probably afford 3 cycles if we get to embryo retrieval/transfer. We could do 6 I guess (time wise) if cancelled before ER since that only had us out about $1500 total but I don't think the RE would encourage that many if we don't get past stims!

We had always thought that we would foster/adopt in addition to bio children so that would still be on the table, but we would have to wait and live in our new province for over a year before registering and then it is up to a 6 year wait. Previously we discussed DI, but neither of us were comfortable with it and now that I have a diagnosis too I think that's likely off the table. I think we had always been open to having bio babies and then adopting some older kids. But if we only adopt I think I'd really like to hold out for a baby at some point.

BeckyP005 · May 2012

If DE doesn't work on the first try then we are done I'm not sure if MH would want to try a FET for only few thousand more. I feel like if I wanted to adopt we should of did that first but it's also expensive and the process seems scary to me. I went on some adoption sites to read "profiles" of other couples and jeez...I felt like it was some contest to see who could outdo who!

I will be 44 this month so that also plays in the back of my mind. By the time any of this goes into motion I will probably be 45 before even being PG. It's all too sad to think. Will somehow have to learn to live child free maybe. Oh well....time will tell.

Eibhlin1 · May 2012

We have decided to do our three cycles of IUI and then look into adoption rather than going through IVF. Both options are not cheap and we feel that at that point adoption would be more of a "sure thing" for us than doing IVF. We'd rather put our money in the process that had a greater option of ending up with a baby, and we'd be able to give an adopted baby a very good and loving home.

I know that not everyone thinks the same way we do but it took a lot of soul searching and discussion on both of our parts to reach our decision, and I feel comfortable with it.

Who knows though, IUI may work and this whole thing would be moot! Keeping my hopes up...

PurpleIris30 · May 2012

If this IVF doesn't work, I think our next step is donor sperm. My husband doesn't seem to have qualms about doing that, but I think it's hard to know until faced with that situation for sure. All of our PGD expenses add so much onto a cycle (we're looking at 25-28,000 for one cycle of IVF alone), that I just don't think we can spend that much twice in a row. Right now donor sperm is more appealing than adoption because it's cheaper (wouldn't need to do IVF) and I'd at least be able to have control over the fetal environment. I think adoption is a great option . . . but I'm just not sure if it's the right option for me (don't want to sound negative about adoption and pursuing that option).

fabulouspinkmady · May 2012

LuvWIfootball:

We've discussed adoption, but because DH was dx w/cancer, I don't think our chances are very good, at least for the next several years. P

I haven't done much research on adoption so far, so I am wondering why this is an issue? My DH had a cancer dx and we know we want to adopt whatever happens with IVF, so I am curious to know. Thanks!

That being said, we are trying to be very optimistic that IVF will work; however DH only banked 3 vials of sperm before chemo. With the one failed IVF we are down to 2, so we are limited with how many times we can try IVF (at least going all the way to retreival and transfer).

If it doesn't work, DH does not want to do DS, which I totally get. I suggested a donor embryo, which he didn't like either, but he seemed to be more open to it. I don't see much of a difference between that and adoption (ie the child will not be biologically linked to either of us), but I would get to be pregnant. If we get to that point, we'll discuss the donor embryo idea with the RE.

Of course, I haven't looked into the cost of using a DE, and I've only looked a little into the cost of domestic adoption, so we'll see. In the meantime, come on ovaries!

BOTB32010 · May 2012

Our plan is IVF 2x and then move on to domestic adoption. I want a baby more than anything but I don't care how I get it. DH on the other hand wants to try for a biological child first.

ThereBeDragons · May 2012

One of the reasons I've pulled back so much from the bump boards is that it's becoming more obvious that "What next?" has gone from being something we didn't think would ever happen to... being something we feel is likely to happen.

We have no answers as to why this isn't working. I am physically capable of carrying a child. Our embryos are visibly ideal and reliably make it to day 5 and freeze. We've had one c/p, one miscarriage, 4 transfers (of 7 embryos total), and we have agreed to stop after two retrievals. We have three embryos left and the only thing we haven't done is testing the embryos. Which is a dead end as DH isn't open to any donor situation- so even if our embryos are hopelessly scrambled they're all we're ever going to have.

Adoption isn't for us.

This is the end. So we've certainly had that talk- and started to accept. Once we know- I've mentioned to DH that I want to travel. I'm uninsureable so we have a large sum set aside for pregnancy and delivery/complication costs. I've asked to go to India, maybe Russia. I want to road trip to Canada and Mexico.

We've discussed moving- the only thing holding us here is that we both come from very strong family and wanted to raise our children with that kind of family nearby. Without children- maybe we move to somewhere with a more agreeable climate.

But first, we need to know if those three embryos could be our children.

Maybe Joleisa · May 2012

I've had the "what's next" talk in my head, but I don't want to have it out loud with DH because in my head that means whatever we are doing right this moment isn't going to work. Tongue Tied

We're planning on a 2-pack multi cycle at our clinic using my OE. Again, we haven't discussed anything past that, but in my head I'm prepared to become crazy baby lady and go all-in and move to DE-IVF if necessary. Adoption can be just as or more expensive than IVF and is not a sure thing either. We don't have time (I'm 39) or money (we're OOP) on our side, but I've had so many other regrets in life--I don't want this to be one of them.

I truly wish the best of luck to every one of you beautiful ladies. IF sucks.

kmkaull2 · May 2012

Please take this in the spirit in which it is intended . . .

If you are at all considering adoption in the future, please come and at least lurk on the adoption board. There are a lot of great women over there--many of whom have walked a similar path. I've read a lot of misconceptions about adoption here. (Totally expected--we were completely clueless before starting the process.) The FAQ over there might help answer some questions. Adoption is not for everyone, but cost does not have to be prohibitive.

We adopted after our scary diagnosis 5 years ago. We're now doing IVF and if no luck, will go back to adoption. So that's our chosen path.

AmCheri · May 2012

Our "what next" convo is evolving almost daily. After two losses, two canceled cycles and a failed IUI, the truth is finally revealing itself. Deep down, I've always felt there's a problem. Turns out, there is. We've had one successful IVF which sadly ended in a m/c, but that alone gives us enough hope to give my OE one more shot. At the same time, we're getting educated about and preparing for DE. That is our next step. Never thought we'd be here, but our perspective and thought is evolving to accommodate our circumstances.

jessi1988 · May 2012

We have kinda had the talk. We know for sure we would do 2 rounds of IVF, if they don't work... I honestly don't know what we will do. I'm not sure that I want to adopt, while I know it's a wonderful thing after IVF I'm not sure we would be in a financial situation for a while to start the process. Our RE also discussed donor sperm, but I don't think I'm comfortable with that either.... There's a lot of emotion regarding these other options, I'm just trying to have lots of hope that IVF works for us.

Mitzi Bishi · May 2012

I am a serious planner, so I always try to get my DH to open up and think a few steps ahead, especially since IF takes so much time. It's a massive waiting game and as you know it's dreadful to experience. He doesn't like talking about if we have another failure, which is a grim reality to face.

We are currently 2/3 through our fresh 50% insurance IVF cycles. We were lucky enough to get one frostie, so we'll have our FET in early June with roughly a 20% success rate and then IVF-ICSI 3 would be soon after.

Once we run out of IVF coverage here we're talking about moving to the US where we would: pursue another IVF in a less conservative environment (hopefully in an IF mandated state), gestational surrogacy in India, or perhaps a "snow flake adoption" of another couple's unused embryos.

There are quite a few reservations for us about adopting or using DS, so I'm not sure that's going to be in the cards for us.

I've really been focusing on enjoying life while child free. I don't want becoming a parent to rule my life with or without a child, so we make it a priority to travel, go out to dinner, and just enjoy life together.

PennyLane26 · May 2012

This is a great conv BzeetyD, thanks for planting the seed.

Its been really eye opening reading everyone's responses. I want to first say that I respect and admire everyone's decisions, in writing this I do not want to offend anyone who has different views than I.

DH and I have decided to move right onto IVF#2 and save our frostie for future use. We have made the joint decision to try as many as 3 fresh cycles and use any frosties that are available. While IF is difficult, I know we are very lucky that we found out about our issues so young. I will be 28 and if this doesn't work we will take a much needed break by this time next year.

Adoption will definitely be a conversation, but probably in 5 years or so. Donor sperm is not an option. As I've explained to DH, I want "our" baby, not my baby. He has offered the idea, but I know he is not comfortable with it and neither am I.

We've tried our best to get comfortable with the idea that it could be just us for a while. We've talked about relocating to Paris for a year or two just to clear our heads and plan for a different path than we had originally expected. We lived in London for a brief period and have always wanted to do it gain. IF may present the opportunity.

Niki64 · May 2012

If our next IVF cycle fails and we do not end up with any frozen, my DH and I have somewhat of a plan...

I had 2 friends offer to be a surrogate for me...my DH and I have not really discussed this option.

We would attempt to adopt, we always hoped to adopt someday (I'm adopted, and back when all it meant to get pregnant was get off the pill, we talked about adopting after having 2 of our own...or become foster parents).

And finally, if nothing works out and it looks as if we will never be parents, we are moving to Hawaii. We love it there and would never move there with kids because we would want to stay close to family. But if it is going to be the two of us, we would move there for a few years at least. But I hope this doesn't happen, and we just continue to vacation there every year with our children...

lovekatespade · May 2012

DoublePortion:
...when it comes to golf his pockets know no limits, but he is pretty tight with money otherwise.

This is my DH, but in regards to motorcycle racing. Not that odd

We are committed to 2 more IVF cycles, but we'll see how we feel if those don't work. We may do more, we may just be done. Right now, we plan to live child-free if IVF fails. But adoption is not off the table, its just not something we would think of pursuing until we work through the emotions of not being able to have our own. We would definitely reassess our life situation, maybe take some time off to travel, maybe relocate to a warmer climate, idk. Just something different, since we are all set up for a family that includes children right now.

Seagull2012 · May 2012

I have had the "what's next" convo with my wife when i was diagnosed with DOR. before then she was kind of in denial that IUIs wouldn't work and that all my stressing and thinking what-if was pointless and pessimistic.

Then we got the diagnosis and she was like "Okay, let's really talk about this."

so our plan is to go to the end of the road with my eggs. I kind of think that IVF#1 might be the only one for me, though, b/c if it doesn't turn out favorable, i think i may jump ship and use my wife's eggs (me carrying) for IVF#2. Of course, her fertility is untested and she is 2 yrs older than me so who knows. Depending on the outcome of ivf#1 for me, i don't know if i'd want to do another round with my eggs if the outcome still looks poor. i guess we'll see.

after those two options, adoption is definitely on the table. and i think while i'd be sad not to have a bio-kid, i would be able to jump into the idea of adoption - it's something that has always been in the back of my wife's and my mind. but, like everyone said, that comes with its own set of challenges.

So...we'll see. Right now i'm putting my energy and positive vibes for a my Aug IVF to = BFP!!

Double portion: can you tell me about your Royal Jelly and Tang Kuei & Peony Formula protocol? I see that your AMH jumped a lot from it! i am using DHEA and COQ10 and a bunch of supplements my acupuncturist put me on but haven't hard about using the ones you mentioned in your sig. Thanks!

jessical0604 · May 2012

we have discussed it and we haven't started any kind of medical treatments yet were still getting our ducks in a row as far as finding out exactly what we are working with....i think the overall consensus is that we WILL have a family one day whether its biologically ours or someone else's baby that the good lord will bless us with. so long as we are together and raising the baby together thats all that matters....of course we would be over the moon if we have a biological child together but we also know there are tons of kids out there looking for good homes and if thats what is in our cards then so be it.

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