Kindergartner arrested/handcuffed at school

CarlaAndJames · April 2012

I stole this from the 12-24 month board since we need more posts.

https://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/04/17/11245913-kindergartner-handcuffed-taken-to-police-station-after-allegedly-throwing-tantrum-and-furniture?lite

thoughts?

CarlaAndJames · April 2012

Seems to me like the school was in the right. My first thought was that it seemed way extreme, why didn't they call the parents and take her to the office first. Then I kept reading and saw they called the mom 6x with no answer and she was in the principals office fighting and tearing it to shreds.

TCUFrogMom11 · April 2012

She deserved to be restrained. The mom says she was having a bad day... please... if you cannot control your child and you think that it is ok for her to throw violent tantrums you both need to get help. This type of behavior shouldn't be tolerated. I get so upset when parents want to blame everyone else for their child's misbehavior... "It's such and suches fault" "People should pay attention to her"... no, if my child goes crazy like that (which she wouldn't because we teach respect and discipline) then please... do whatever is neccassary in order to contain the situation within reason. My mom works with students who hit, bite, cuss, fight and all of that and their parents use these excuses. But I tell you what, if one punches my mom hard enough to leave a mark... we're pressing charges...

maddiemoon43 · April 2012

I transition students that age with special needs (and specifically autism) into school, and work with their schools to create plans to proactively prevent such behaviour, though inevitabley we end up reacting to it instead. I have no idea what that school district's policies are so I can't comment on what steps were taken before calling the police, but I do raise an eyebrow to mom saying she has mood swongs and who doesn't. If that is a common mood swing, I think they ought to check out what might be going on with her DD.

chuicafina · April 2012

I think that's totally absurd. I was sure this article was mistakenly published on msnbc when it should have been posted on The Onion.

Even if this girl was throwing furniture, there are ways of intervening that don't involve the police. I have dealt with violent students while working in special ed, but never have I needed to involve the police. Maybe for a junior high or high school student when they become physically stronger than you, but for a 6 year old?? IDK, I guess I wasn't there to see the extent to how violent she was becoming. But I just don't buy that handcuffs were necessary.

Honestly, she should probably be assessed by the school psychologist. I have trouble believing that this was just a tantrum, without some underlying issue going on with the girl.

Sunidaze · April 2012

Before we went on leave, DH was a DARE officer. In a school in one of the more affluent suburbs. He could not believe the behavior of some of these kids...so out of control. And then of course, the parents are all like "my child would never do that blah blah blah". I can pretty guarantee that Stella will not act like that if DH has anything to say about it.

chuicafina · April 2012

TCUFrogMom11:
She deserved to be restrained. The mom says she was having a bad day... please... if you cannot control your child and you think that it is ok for her to throw violent tantrums you both need to get help. This type of behavior shouldn't be tolerated. I get so upset when parents want to blame everyone else for their child's misbehavior... "It's such and suches fault" "People should pay attention to her"... no, if my child goes crazy like that (which she wouldn't because we teach respect and discipline) then please... do whatever is neccassary in order to contain the situation within reason. My mom works with students who hit, bite, cuss, fight and all of that and their parents use these excuses. But I tell you what, if one punches my mom hard enough to leave a mark... we're pressing charges...

Oh I totally agree with you that the parent should not blame the school for what happened. I also agree that most children wont have tantrums that crazy if respect and discipline are taught. I just think that this child probably has other issues going on and needs help. Of course, I haven't seen the child, but if her mom is saying that this kind of tantrum is "normal" for her child and that she was just having an "off" day (meaning this happens regularly), I would seek professional help.

RClaffee · April 2012

chuicafina:
I think that's totally absurd. I was sure this article was mistakenly published on msnbc when it should have been posted on The Onion.
Even if this girl was throwing furniture, there are ways of intervening that don't involve the police. I have dealt with violent students while working in special ed, but never have I needed to involve the police. Maybe for a junior high or high school student when they become physically stronger than you, but for a 6 year old?? IDK, I guess I wasn't there to see the extent to how violent she was becoming. But I just don't buy that handcuffs were necessary.
Honestly, she should probably be assessed by the school psychologist. I have trouble believing that this was just a tantrum, without some underlying issue going on with the girl.

I used to work with special needs students as well, and I have seen a third grader flat out assault three teachers and the principal. She broke one of my co-worker's wrists and kicked the principal in the groin. I couldn't even believe that that was possible, but it was.

vanessa999 · April 2012

I think the police did the right thing. If she was being violent enough to hurt someone and was causing destruction to school property and could not be restrained by any of the adults, the other children shouldn't have to be put in danger.

I worked at a school with children with autism, where most of them were highly aggressive and had to be restrained on a daily basis and transported for their own safety and the safety of others. Now I works as an in home therapist with kids that are not violent and it's so different. But I definitely know there is a need to restrain children if they are putting other and themselves in danger.

vigurl · April 2012

She was having a bad day? Seriously, the mother is an idiot. The school did the right thing. They called the mom and the mom didn't answer. The child was destrying property and biting a doorknob. This child has issues. I sure as heck would not want to restrain her. The school did the right thing.

MrsSparklesMcGee · April 2012

I agree that she needed to be taken from the school and I agree that the parents do not seem to be taking her "mood swings" seriously enough, BUT I do not believe that the police should have been the ones to remove her or that they needed handcuffs to do so. I don't buy the excuse the PD made that she had to be in cuffs because anyone in a police car has to be in cuffs. That's absurd. I feel like that is the kind of experience that this child will internalize and learn from, but not in a positive way. She and her family need the help of mental health professionals NOT police.

I think someone from the Dept of Children & Families should have been called to pick her up. Someone from that department should be assigned to the family to see that the child is tested, monitored, etc. because that sort of behavior is not acceptable in general and certainly not acceptable in a school.

M&M227 · April 2012

RLH315:
chuicafina:
I think that's totally absurd. I was sure this article was mistakenly published on msnbc when it should have been posted on The Onion.
Even if this girl was throwing furniture, there are ways of intervening that don't involve the police. I have dealt with violent students while working in special ed, but never have I needed to involve the police. Maybe for a junior high or high school student when they become physically stronger than you, but for a 6 year old?? IDK, I guess I wasn't there to see the extent to how violent she was becoming. But I just don't buy that handcuffs were necessary.
Honestly, she should probably be assessed by the school psychologist. I have trouble believing that this was just a tantrum, without some underlying issue going on with the girl.
I used to work with special needs students as well, and I have seen a third grader flat out assault three teachers and the principal. She broke one of my co-worker's wrists and kicked the principal in the groin. I couldn't even believe that that was possible, but it was.

I too have worked with special ed. students, some who were pretty violent. The district I worked for was a receiving district and only had self contained classes (however some of these were in regular ed schools), however, everyone who worked in the district was trained to restrain children in the proper manner and all parents knew that if the child became out of control or was a danger to himself or others that he / she would be restrained. Also, if the student was clearly out of control and the parents could not be reached the police would be called.

In these situations you have to think of the safety of others. In many schools / districts no one in the building in trained to restrain children, therefore, when then get out of control adults are NOT allowed to touch them at all, this makes a very dangerous situation.

From reading the article it seems no one was trained to properly restrain this child so she was left to completely destroy an office, someone can get hurt badly.

justme04 · April 2012

Mood swings. The mother called it a mood swing? Only if she bi-polar....wtf? I don't think I have ever seen a child act like that.

Quoting from the article:

Johnson's aunt, Candace Ruff, said the girl "might have misbehaved, but I don't think she actually misbehaved to the point that she should have been handcuffed and taken downtown to the police department." and "Call the police? Is that the first step? Or is there any other kind of intervention that can be taken to help that child," she asked.

She did way more then misbehave. The article stated that they tried to contact the parents but no one answered. This girl was acting in a manner that was clearly a danger to herself and others...what did they want the school to do lock her in a closet?

maddiemoon43 · April 2012

vanessa999:

I think the police did the right thing. If she was being violent enough to hurt someone and was causing destruction to school property and could not be restrained by any of the adults, the other children shouldn't have to be put in danger.

I worked at a school with children with autism, where most of them were highly aggressive and had to be restrained on a daily basis and transported for their own safety and the safety of others. Now I works as an in home therapist with kids that are not violent and it's so different. But I definitely know there is a need to restrain children if they are putting other and themselves in danger.

Still with kids with ASD? IBI therapist?

kimbo1216 · April 2012

At first, I thought it was way absurd. However, after hearing the mother's rather casual reaction, I'm beginning to think they were stuck between a rock and a hard place. Did they do what was right? Idk. I honestly don't think it was that black and white and there is not a clear answer.

I agree that the child needs help. It sounds like the parents do to.

chuicafina · April 2012

Mrs.SparklesMcGee:
I agree that she needed to be taken from the school and I agree that the parents do not seem to be taking her "mood swings" seriously enough, BUT I do not believe that the police should have been the ones to remove her or that they needed handcuffs to do so. I don't buy the excuse the PD made that she had to be in cuffs because anyone in a police car has to be in cuffs. That's absurd. I feel like that is the kind of experience that this child will internalize and learn from, but not in a positive way. She and her family need the help of mental health professionals NOT police.
I think someone from the Dept of Children & Families should have been called to pick her up. Someone from that department should be assigned to the family to see that the child is tested, monitored, etc. because that sort of behavior is not acceptable in general and certainly not acceptable in a school.

Okay maybe this is closer to what I'm thinking. I agree with the other special educators speaking up that there is a time and place for restraint. And, I don't remember who said it, but it's true that if there was no one trained to retrain her, the priority is the safety of the other individuals present. I do still think, though, that use of hand cuffs was extreme. I agree with MrsSparklesMcGee that Dept of Children & Families would have been a more appropriate phone call to make. But in the craziness of the moment, I don't blame the principal for calling the police.

I still think the article sounds like something out of The Onion.

JuneBug0611 · April 2012

I don't know if cuffs were necessary, but some system of restraint was, and if they didn't have anything else on hand, then I am not going to fault them for using the cuffs. I know some elementary schools roll kids up in giant yoga mat-type things or blankets when they are acting violent. I don't know that that's much better. It's all pretty extreme... as is these kids' behavior. It's so sad that at such a young age something is so wrong in her life that she acted that way. Her parents' reaction is unconscionable, though... not admitting that she has a problem (that they are likely a huge part of) and chalking it up to "mood swings" or a bad day. Ugh.

jporqueler · April 2012

100% agree with the outcome. If it were a teenager people would be demanding the police be called, why should it be different for an out of control 6 yr old? If the school did have the qualifications to restrain her then this was necessary. What possibly could a soc worker from child services do differently?

MammaBear81 · April 2012

TCUFrogMom11:
She deserved to be restrained. The mom says she was having a bad day... please... if you cannot control your child and you think that it is ok for her to throw violent tantrums you both need to get help. This type of behavior shouldn't be tolerated. I get so upset when parents want to blame everyone else for their child's misbehavior... "It's such and suches fault" "People should pay attention to her"... no, if my child goes crazy like that (which she wouldn't because we teach respect and discipline) then please... do whatever is neccassary in order to contain the situation within reason. My mom works with students who hit, bite, cuss, fight and all of that and their parents use these excuses. But I tell you what, if one punches my mom hard enough to leave a mark... we're pressing charges...

All of this, and maybe, just MAYBE that girl with think twice before throwing sh!t around the room again. Kids don't know respect anymore.

vanessa999 · April 2012

Yes I am still working with children with Autism as well as other disorders, but as a behavioral therapist in the home and no longer working in a school setting.

maddiemoon43 · April 2012

vanessa999:
Yes I am still working with children with Autism as well as other disorders, but as a behavioral therapist in the home and no longer working in a school setting.

I used to do in home, and now I transition students from there into school.

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