Afraid that I've created a monster...

ACAsomeday · April 2012

I'm having some worries about our sleeping habits lately and would love some thoughts from experienced AP mommies.

William is 4 months 1 week. Since birth, he has been bedsharing with us. He nurses on demand. Since about 1 month old he has been waking up every 2-3 hours to nurse. Sometimes every 1 and a half hours. I work 3 days a week and he goes to daycare 1-2 days per week. I'm not sure that he's reverse cycling because I didn't start working until he was 3 months and he had been waking up every 2-3 hours before that and didn't change much once I started work.

During the daytime he is a pretty easy baby. He usually goes about 3 hours between eating, but has gone up to 5 hours (when we've been travelling) without whining or fussing. Honestly he usually doesn't fuss when he's hungry, I just feed him about every 2-3 hours when awake and if he doesn't want to nurse, he'll stop and look up and me and talk to me. Because he goes so long during the day, I've been thinking a lot about whether he really needs to nurse as often at night or if he just doesn't have the ability to soothe himself back to sleep when he wakes up. The waking could be consistent with hunger or the end of a sleep cycle, right? Also, he is a big baby, measuring in 80th percentile for weight and height.

Recently I got a co-sleeper, thinking maybe we were waking him up with our moving. We don't really use it. I am thinking of side-car-ing his crib since it is at the same level with our bed and it will be like he's part of our bed, but when we move it won't jostle him. And I'm thinking I can scoot over and side-nurse him while he's still in his crib.

I used to automatically nurse him at night whenever he woke up crying. Shushing, pacifiers, and rocking has never worked. When I rock him, picking him up wakes him up. When he nurses, he is eating through at least 1 let down. Maybe more - a lot of times I fall asleep. If he's sleeping and I have another let down, he eats it, rather than unlatching. When napping during the day, if I let him suckle long enough, he will eventually unlatch directly after a 3rd or 4th let down. Does this maybe mean that I'm not giving a lot of milk per let down and he's still hungry? Could it just be that even if he's not hungry, he'll eat anyway?

I am not getting much sleep, but that isn't even my main concern. My concern is that by nursing him every time he wakes up, I might be creating/have already created a baby that can't soothe himself at night. I know having a baby is inconvenient in a lot of ways, but I am willing to do anything for William. The thing is, I don't want to do my sweet baby a disservice for his sleeping for years to come. I am not planning to nurse much past a year. How will he fall asleep once we stop nursing? I nurse him to sleep during day and night. DH rocks him to sleep when I'm not home. Daycare puts him in a swing. He occasionally (once/twice a week) falls asleep lying in the cosleeper for a daytime nap, if I allow him to whine and use the pacifier for about 10 minutes.

I'm a little stressed over this and would love some thoughts/advice from more experienced mommas!

missisue · April 2012

I have struggled with this question over and over, and I change my mind depending on whichever sleep book is on my nightstand. Every doctor/author/sleep specialist/mother is going to have their own opinion and draw their own conclusion from various studies. Parenting is so subjective, especially night time parenting. You have to decide what YOU are comfortable with. Do your research and decide what rings true for you and your LO.

FWIW, I point blank asked my pediatrician if waking up every 2 hours is detrimental to my LO's physical development. He said no. I decided that was good enough for me, so we continue to nurse all night long. I'm trusting that eventually she'll be able to sleep longer stretches. I can already see some incremental improvements over the last few months.

Spenjamins · April 2012

He is 4months old. Give him whatever he needs. You can not spoil a 4 month old baby.

boogerbearoriginal · April 2012

4m is still too little to be forming "habits" most sleep training people recommend waiting until at least 6m.

If he's going longer during the day, you could try offering more frequently to encourage daytime eating which may help the nighttime feeding.

I bedshare and LO nursed every 2-3 hrs at nighttime at that age, it has gradually decreased to about 2x per night. And last night he only woke up once to nurse. I've done nothing different, he just wakes up less now.

Babies change dramatically throughout the first year, what's happening now and what will be happening in a few months will be different. IMO future self-soothing abilities is not something to worry about at this age.

ACAsomeday · April 2012

Booger+Bear:

If he's going longer during the day, you could try offering more frequently to encourage daytime eating which may help the nighttime feeding.

IMO future self-soothing abilities is not something to worry about at this age.

I have tried doing that, especially in the evening, and it doesn't seem to make any difference in his nighttime pattern.

Two nights ago, he slept for 5 hours 40 minutes. It was like a miracle. it was the most consecutive sleep i've gotten since his birth. I got my hopes up, but it was just a fluke. In fact, in the nights since, he's woken up even more often!

I called daycare today and they say he's on a bottle strike, so I'm betting tonight won't be any better. Poor little guy I hate sending him to daycare!

3003girl · April 2012

did you post about you LO possibly reverse cycling? Eating at night to make up for missed feedings during the day while you are at work? I might have the wrong person...

Anyway, I do not think you are creating a monster at 4 months. My LO night nursed for a long time, and there was no way she would have fallen asleep without some form of help for AT LEAST the first 10 months. I believe all babies are different in this - my friends baby has always fallen asleep anyplace, anytime. My LO showed signs of wanting to self soothe at about 11 months. Before that, she just really didn't know what to do. If I left her in bed she wouldn't cry/scream, she would just stay up. for hours. So I nursed and rocked her. Around 11 months she started to pull of the breast when nursing to sleep. She would roll over, lay there for a few seconds - minutes, but then start getting really fidgety. She just couldn't figure out how to do it on her own. I do think at that point if I had let her struggle with it a bit more she would have been able to figure it out eventually. That being said, I just kept nursing her or rocking her, even though sometimes she would fight it, and I think she then developed a "habit"

I also tried the pantley pull off method - which you might want to look into. It works great for some, for me it was 50/50, but still very helpful.

We just night weaned and she is doing a great job falling asleep. We are still working on getting her back to sleep once she wakes up, but it's getting better.

I guess what I'm saying is - IMO - 4 months is really early to worry about it. And I think you will begin to know when they are ready.

ACAsomeday · April 2012

solidio:

did you post about you LO possibly reverse cycling? Eating at night to make up for missed feedings during the day while you are at work?

My LO showed signs of wanting to self soothe at about 11 months. Around 11 months she started to pull of the breast when nursing to sleep. She would roll over, lay there for a few seconds - minutes, but then start getting really fidgety. She just couldn't figure out how to do it on her own. I do think at that point if I had let her struggle with it a bit more she would have been able to figure it out eventually.

I also tried the pantley pull off method - which you might want to look into.

4 months is really early to worry about it. And I think you will begin to know when they are ready.

I didn't think we were reverse cycling because his habits didn't change when we went back to work. However, lately I've been taking a better look at his daycare progress reports and there are some days when in 7 hours he'll only eat 4 oz. They weren't telling me in person, and DH picks LO up from daycare because I work until 11pm so I wasn't seeing the reports. Today when I called they said they tried twice to get him to eat and he only took an ounce. This was 3-4 hours after I nursed him. I only work 3 days a week, and he feeds just as often at night when I don't work.

I do use the pantley pull off method, quite a bit actually, and it works well for us. If I lie down with him for a nap, he will suckle for a good 45 minutes if I don't unlatch him. (I usually unlatch him so I can get some housework done while he sleeps) Now I'm starting to wonder if that is because he's still hungry, because if I wait it out for 45 minutes, he'll usually unlatch directly after a let down around 45 min-1hr. That's what makes me wonder if my first couple let downs just don't produce an overabundance of volume.

It is very interesting to me that your LO started to show signs of being ready to self soothe. Nobody has ever mentioned that to me before and I haven't seen it in any books. That seems like it would have to be the natural way to things, as we can't nurse them forever, right? When/If he does that I will try to keep in mind your experience.

A lot of the books I've read mention 4 months as the beginning of ability to form habits, which is why I've started to worry about it lately. But, several moms on TB have been saying 4 months is too early. Hard to tell - my first time around the block!

pixieprincss · April 2012

It sounds like he is just being a four-month old. He's communicating his needs and you are responding. That is great! Tiring, but great. By continuing to recognize and respond to his cues, you are building trust and attachment that will benefit you both when he's old enough to actually need coaching in a certain direction. I think the same things apply here that applied on a post a couple of weeks ago--the "4-month wakeful" paired with hunger because BM processes in about 1.5-2 hours paired with normal baby behavior. For now, what can you change? A couple of ideas: work on changing your expectations of what baby sleep looks like (asking in posts like this is a great way to do that), change your schedule so you can get in more sleep (even if it is non-consecutive), find other ways to make life more relaxing, etc.

StefandTodd · April 2012

We're still doing all the same things at 7 months. I would try not to worry about it so much and follow your instincts. You're not doing him a disservice by responding to his night needs, IMO. And at this young age, I do believe overnight nursing, even if it's "only" for helping him get back to sleep, is a perfectly legitimate need. GL.

AB25840 · April 2012

We have been dealing with the same exact thing and have had the same questions. My DD is now 5 months and our nights are getting easier so it will get better! Unless them waking up is truly upsetting you I would continue to feed every 2-3 hours if thats what your LO wants. I have been working on getting our LO to fall asleep with out needing to nurse to sleep and what is working for me is I will nurse for maybe 10 min until I can tell she is no longer eating and I break the latch and put a pacifier in then maybe 10- 20 min later I will try and take the pacifier out. REPEAT if necessary.