please help, experienced side nursing bed-sharers!

ACAsomeday · March 2012

I have been bedsharing and side nursing for LO's whole 4 month life I love it. But he still wakes up every 2-3 hours. For a while he would sometimes take a pacifier. He can't figure out the thumb thing. So now, he will only go back to sleep if I nurse him. If I pick him up and rock him he'll go back to sleep, but it takes a lot longer.

Any ideas for figuring out how to nix this habit? I don't mind nursing him, its just that I'm trying to get him to sleep longer stretches and sometimes I think he slightly wakes up and then suddenly searches for boob and needs me to fall back to sleep. If he doesn't find the boob he wakes himself up thrashing his head around to find it. If he could just fall back to sleep on his own, even once during the night, I might get a little more sleep.

He is going to daycare 2 days a week when I have to work 12 hour shifts, so part of it could be that he's trying to make up for missing me during the day, but he pretty much has the same pattern every night. Almost always 2 hour stretches.

Thanks

Aloe0l · March 2012

Are you sure he's not actually hungry? Everyone's milk capacity is different, and every baby's needs are different. It could be that he actually does want to eat every 2-3 hours. Especially if he's reverse cycling like you said.

Also, are you not able to sleep while he is nursing? I used to fall asleep (and still do sometimes) when I side nurse DD in bed. In fact, it was the only way I got any sleep for awhile. She used to nurse entirely through a nap, so I'd just nap too.

Personally, I think 4 months is too young to try and break any "habits" - but, maybe someone else will have a suggestion that will work for you.

ACAsomeday · March 2012

No, I'm not sure - a couple of times I tried the pacifier and he took it, but lately he won't...so maybe that just means he is hungry? There have been a couple times where I move and I'm awake and I notice that I wake him up and then he won't go back to sleep without nursing, but that doesn't happen very often. That said, we are trying to transition to a co sleeper for the first part of the night.

Maybe 4 months is too early to think about habits forming. I'm not sure - this is my first time! Everything I read said that around 4 months is when you think about establishing patterns....???

ACAsomeday · March 2012

ps. congrats on your new pregnancy!

3003girl · March 2012

You can look up reverse cycling on Kellymom.

My LO was a reverce cycler and nursed every 2-3 hours up until, oh, a week ago. I finally night weaned her because it was getting worse.

When she was little - especially under a year - I didn't mind at all. I was working part time, and she refused to drink anything except water out of a bottle or cup. So night nursing it was.

When she passed the one year mark there was a period of a few months where she went to bed at 7, woke up at 2 and then at 6 am. It was great. Then teething started and she got sick and we traveled and it went downhill - she started nursing every 2 hours. And I just night weaned her.

I tried the pantley pull off method and it worked sometimes. But if she was hungry, she would wake up if she wasn't able to nurse.

3003girl · March 2012

I would also say, for some babies, waking up that much is normal at that age.

Aloe0l · March 2012

ACAsomeday:
ps. congrats on your new pregnancy!

Thanks!

And, I don't remember when they start remembering patterns/develop habits, etc. My best advice would be that if what you are doing is working for you, then there is no reason to change it. However, if it's not working, then, definitely explore other options, because everyone needs to be happy & rested.

I know as a new mom you hear things like, "your baby should be _____" or "when my kid was that age he/she _____" or "you really ought to ____." Basically, don't let others pressure you to change. Let the needs of your DS and the needs of your family dictate what you do. And I'm not even sure if this is the case, but I know first time mom's (and even veteran's) always seem to get bombarded by advice from others.

Good Luck - I know we could all use a little more sleep!

ACAsomeday · March 2012

Thanks girls. Bedsharing is working for us *most* of the time. However, we only have a queen, can't fit a king in our room, and DH is feeling cramped because LO and I hog the bed. :P Also, some nights I feel convinced that he's only waking up because we're moving, and waking up every 2 hours when I have to do a 12 hour in the ER the next day and DH is in nursing school can sometimes be very trying. Other nights we seem to have no problem. (it depends on how wiggly he is!)

In all, I love the cuddles, and LO loves being in bed with us. He doesn't nurse the whole time he's sleeping, and if he's not eating anymore I unlatch him and he stays asleep most times. I guess you're right, I am feeling pressure from others to get him out of our bed. I am also a little nervous about when the time comes that he can roll out of bed. He's not there yet but he's 4 months, so its not far away.

I think part of me is afraid because I'm not sure if I want a 1 year old in my bed, but by the time he's one, the habit will already be formed and it will be difficult to get him to sleep anywhere else, right? At the same time, I LOVE having him in our bed, so why do I think I wouldn't want him in our bed at 1 year old?

Two things that would help:

1. a king bed

2. if people would support instead of discouraging me with bedsharing. My mom bought us an incredibly expensive crib that is one of those lifetime beds - you know, turns into a toddler bed, then a double bed. And she keeps asking me..."so where is he sleeping these days?" She never discourages me, but I know when she asks that she is thinking to herself "sheesh I spent all that money on the crib and she's not even using it!"

Thanks for hearing me out - I'm a FTM so my thoughts are all jumbled on this and I'm not sure what we should do/what we want/what is right

pixieprincss · March 2012

This is normal. Tiring, but normal! Your baby very well may be hungry. BM processes in about 1.5-2 hours. Also, at 4 months many babies experience the "4 month wakeful" where increased social desire keeps them awake as well as the transition from NB sleep (deep then light) to normal sleep (light then deep). Beyond this phase, new sleep disruptors will soon settle in--teething, waking because of peeing, separation anxiety, etc. Night waking peaks at about 9-12 months. (Kellymom has great sleep studies on their page). Now, that all said--as your baby gets bigger and stronger he wil be able to self-latch if that is something you are up for. My DS woke every two hours from 7 months to 12 months, but I was only awake for a minute or two as he latched on, then I went back to sleep and he unlatched when ready (or just stayed on). Obviously, catering to that many not work for every family--in which case you can try some other things--but, going with the flow was something that worked for us. And right now, you baby is still very young--too young for even gentle sleep training methods until 6 months in the advice of many--so here's to trying to make the sleep you do get sleep extra-restful!

poison489 · March 2012

Definitely agree that it is a little early to worry about this. My son nursed every 2-3 hours throughout the first year. Especially if you are not getting the nursing sessions in during the day. What you could do is make sure that he is awake throughout the feeding so that he eats more during the time he is nursing. It would at least give you a little more time before feedings. I was always to tired to do this and could sleep through nursing DS, so it didn't bother me. Also make sure that you are limiting LO access. Don't sleep topless, keep distance between yourself and LO, etc. so that the smell of yummy milk is not waking him up to feed.

3003girl · March 2012

ACAsomeday:
Thanks girls. Bedsharing is working for us *most* of the time. However, we only have a queen, can't fit a king in our room, and DH is feeling cramped because LO and I hog the bed. :P Also, some nights I feel convinced that he's only waking up because we're moving, and waking up every 2 hours when I have to do a 12 hour in the ER the next day and DH is in nursing school can sometimes be very trying. Other nights we seem to have no problem. (it depends on how wiggly he is!)

We started out bed sharing and moved to side-caring the crib at around 6 months. It worked wonders. Plus, they are on their own mattress so movement doesn't matter as much. I highly suggest it if you have the room.

I, too, was an unexpected bed sharer. I still enjoy it at 22 months, and she is showing signs of wanting her own space and I'm not sure I'm ready! But I think we are going to try to move her sometime around her 2nd birthday. It really is great when you work - the extra snuggles at night make me feel closer to her.

StefandTodd · March 2012

I could have written your posts exactly, omgoodness.

Right down to the two things that would help being a king bed, or supportive mother (for my MIL)...not that my MIL says much, but she bought us the co-sleeper for our room, and we tried to use it and eventually just found it so much easier to have him in our bed. When she saw the co-sleeper out in the family room being used as a changing station...well, yeah. "Ooooh....so he's sleeping IN your bed? WITH you? Ooooh, okay."

Anyway. I know for 100% certain I also would've been posting that our room was too small for a King. Our room is tiiiiiiny. Soooo tiny. Actually, our bedroom is smaller than our guest bedroom and people comment on it all the time (but unlike our guest bedroom it has a bathroom). Anyway, it was 3 am and in desperation and crampedness and tiredness that we researched King beds to learn that they are only 16" wider than a Queen. We measured the next day, and figured out that if we lost one of our nightstands, a King would fit. It's VERY snug in that room now. And our nightstand situation is undesirable, lol. But it fits. We have no fancy bed frame like we had for our Queen (just takes up room), but we are so much happier in the King. Soooo much happier.

Anyway, just wanted to say that I had all the same concerns as you and eventually I decided to do what worked best for us, other's advice aside. And I'm really happy I did. When we started bedsharing, I told myself (and others) that we'd transition LO to his crib at 4 months. Then 6 months. Now I realize that *I* LOVE the bedsharing and it's easy and convenient and what works the best for us. I don't know...habits schmabits...if it's working for you today, let it work for you today. Deal with tomorrow tomorrow. That's what I think anyway.

Good luck to you

Izybel18 · March 2012

If you're feeling pressure or want some reassurance about your decision to bedshare, I just finished a great book on the subject, "three in a bed" by Deborah Jackson. It gave a lot of researched-based information about different cultures who bedshare, and also some interesting theories about why Western cultures don't. I was already on board with bedsharing (also being an accidental adopter) but it helped me feel like I had some ammo to combat the inevitable disapproving comments.

That said, I do have a king-sized bed and don't know if it would work as well without one. As PP said, the Arms Reach Co-Sleeper may help you since it just attaches onto the bed and could give you some more space. Personally, I also worry about moving LO out some day, but I'm trying to tell myself that I have no idea what life will be like when she's older, so no use worrying about it now.

ACAsomeday · March 2012

Stef, its so nice to know that I'm not alone

I'm thinking of bringing the side crib thingy in that others were talking about. I think my husband has had it with me because I keep insisting on trying all these things (PNP, cosleeper, crib) only to find out that we still just keep him in bed with us :P

The crib would fit next to our bed, but its a really fancy solid wood one and DH would have to use power tools to take it apart to fit it in our room. I'm nervous that he'll be annoyed at me just asking because in the back of his head he knows LO will end up in bed with us lol

I'm starting to realize that the way america does parenting these days tends to be in a way that is most convenient for them rather than what the baby might need. Sure we need to raise independent, successful kids, but that doesn't mean they need to be that way as babies.

I'm just realizing that raising a baby in a way that is convenient is just not natural to me. Its more natural for me to give my own conveniences up because its all about LO now. I know that doesn't work for everyone, but its what comes naturally to me. I think it'll be interesting to see how we do things with #2 when that time comes!

3003girl · March 2012

look up some pics on side caring the crib. I have an old "banned" drop side crib. We took one side off and pushed it up agains the bed - same height. So LO has her own space attached to the bed. Not sure if you are thinking the same thing, or just shoving the crib intact next to the bed.

LO does roll over in bed a lot, but she is kind of half on the crib/ half in the bed. So at least DH has a little more room. I put a blanket then sheet over the crib mattress and the bed mattress so the gap is not an issue. The online tutorials do a good job of explaining it.

I just wanted to clarify, in case you didn't know what i was talking about in the above post.

I agree - parenting for me is not so much about my convenience - but it kind of is in a round about way. It's convenient for me to have a happy kid! KWIM? Our kiddo is so much more well adjusted and happy than so many kids in the playgroups we go to and I have no doubt it's partially because of the close bond she has with me and DH (he's a part time SAHD) And she was super high needs as a baby, and still a very demanding toddler. But we listen to her and treat her with respect instead of just dragging her around places, and it makes life so much easier, even when you have to do something they don't like or don't want to. sorry to ramble!

amatistajoy · March 2012

I am sorry you don't feel supported by your mother in your decision to bed-share. I just want to share my experience, to hopefully ease any worry that you are establishing patterns now that won't be broken. We started out with LO in a co-sleeper. Then around 3-4 months we had LO in a rock n' play because of reflux issues. H Then I realized I wasn't getting enough sleep to function at work, but reflux was under control. LO went into the bed with me so I could side nurse and get more sleep. About 7 months, this became dangerous. I looked into different options since he would wake up and fall off the bed if no one was nearby (like putting railing up, one of us laying down with him when he goes down). I decided it was time to put LO in the crib until I came to bed. We had a little bit of trouble with the transition to the crib... but I figured out what worked best for him. Now we have no problems.

So every baby and family is different... but my LO has slept in lots of different places and I am glad now that I have the crib.

rosiemomma · March 2012

I would suggest going to be earlier, or taking a nap on the days you work... so you won't feel as tired. It sounds like the 4 month wakeful! We side-carred it was great.

I can tell you that the 'no-cry sleep solution' by elizbeth pantley was one of the few 'sleep' books that actually made a difference, 'happiest baby on the block' did too but that was more for newborns. (I tried traditional ones like 'babywise' and ferbers stuff and they didn't work)

here are some links:

https://www.askdrsears.com/topics/sleep-problems/8-infant-sleep-facts-every-parent-should-know

https://www.drmomma.org/2010/01/turn-your-crib-into-cosleeper.html

https://www.phdinparenting.com/2009/02/28/gentle-baby-and-toddler-sleep-tips/

https://www.askdrsears.com/topics/sleep-problems/5-reasons-why-high-need-infants-sleep-differently

https://www.askdrsears.com/topics/sleep-problems/31-ways-get-your-baby-sleep-and-stay-asleep

PrincessPeach13 · March 2012

https://kellymom.com/parenting/nighttime/4mo-sleep/

katiewhompus · March 2012

DD still wakes up every 3 hours so thank goodness for side nursing (and the King bed we bought last month)

Sometimes I can get away with paci pop, then cuddle her close to my chest. If she isn't hungry she is content with the paci and closeness where thr paci just wouldn't cut it.

PayolaCrayola · March 2012

ACAsomeday:

Stef, its so nice to know that I'm not alone

I'm thinking of bringing the side crib thingy in that others were talking about. I think my husband has had it with me because I keep insisting on trying all these things (PNP, cosleeper, crib) only to find out that we still just keep him in bed with us :P

The crib would fit next to our bed, but its a really fancy solid wood one and DH would have to use power tools to take it apart to fit it in our room. I'm nervous that he'll be annoyed at me just asking because in the back of his head he knows LO will end up in bed with us lol

I'm starting to realize that the way america does parenting these days tends to be in a way that is most convenient for them rather than what the baby might need. Sure we need to raise independent, successful kids, but that doesn't mean they need to be that way as babies.

I'm just realizing that raising a baby in a way that is convenient is just not natural to me. Its more natural for me to give my own conveniences up because its all about LO now. I know that doesn't work for everyone, but its what comes naturally to me. I think it'll be interesting to see how we do things with #2 when that time comes!

This is exactly the issue i had....DD has her own bedroom with her big fancy crib AND we have a cosleeper but she just stayed in bed with us....i thought about having DH bring the crib in our room but he would just give me that look like Hmm and id drop it lol Also i just had to tell ppl that WE were raising DD in the way that worked for us and everyone learned to stop commenting on it....All that matters is she is healthy and happy and loved and thats it! She is VERY independent so i know its not creating a "dependent needy child" as my MIL would say...ugh

ACAsomeday · March 2012

PayolaCrayola:
ACAsomeday:

Stef, its so nice to know that I'm not alone

I'm thinking of bringing the side crib thingy in that others were talking about. I think my husband has had it with me because I keep insisting on trying all these things (PNP, cosleeper, crib) only to find out that we still just keep him in bed with us :P

The crib would fit next to our bed, but its a really fancy solid wood one and DH would have to use power tools to take it apart to fit it in our room. I'm nervous that he'll be annoyed at me just asking because in the back of his head he knows LO will end up in bed with us lol

I'm starting to realize that the way america does parenting these days tends to be in a way that is most convenient for them rather than what the baby might need. Sure we need to raise independent, successful kids, but that doesn't mean they need to be that way as babies.

I'm just realizing that raising a baby in a way that is convenient is just not natural to me. Its more natural for me to give my own conveniences up because its all about LO now. I know that doesn't work for everyone, but its what comes naturally to me. I think it'll be interesting to see how we do things with #2 when that time comes!

This is exactly the issue i had....DD has her own bedroom with her big fancy crib AND we have a cosleeper but she just stayed in bed with us....i thought about having DH bring the crib in our room but he would just give me that look like and id drop it lol Also i just had to tell ppl that WE were raising DD in the way that worked for us and everyone learned to stop commenting on it....All that matters is she is healthy and happy and loved and thats it! She is VERY independent so i know its not creating a "dependent needy child" as my MIL would say...ugh

I'm glad to be hearing this from someone who has a baby that is older than me. I am a little nervous about creating a monster that won't sleep on his own ever. Most of all I want to do what's right for DS and I know for a fact that he'd rather sleep with me than alone in a crib! lol

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