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D.C. Area Babies
Income for a family of four
What income would you say would be needed for a family of four to live comfortably in the metro area? (probably Bethesda or Vienna)
Two children in preschool. Just curious what everyone would say they would be comfortable with. We are moving to the area from a LCOL area and I'm afraid we aren't going to be able to make it on our income.
Eta: I'm a sahm mom so no childcare is needed. They will attend preschool a few days a week though.
Also, I forgot to mention that proximity to the metro is important as that will factor into the cost of housing.
This discussion has been closed.
Re: Income for a family of four
there are a lot of variables, do you plan on renting or buying? what other large expenses (car payments/student loans etc) do you have? How much space do you want? Do you eat out often/travel much? Because this is such a HCOL area those all play a factor. It may be easier if you told us a budget range for housing only and maybe we can help you figure out if/where that might work:-)
welcome to the area:-)
We will definitely be renting. We only have one car (one car payment). We are looking at 3 bed2 bath houses.
I am just generally curious what most folks consider an average income for a family. I feel like we are so unprepared!
There are sooooo many factors, it's hard to pin down a number.
Do you have a lot of bills? What kind of lifestyle are you used to?
Not a lot of bills other than the normal utilities and such.
I guess this is a difficult question for a generalized answer. I just feel like we've way underestimated how much it will cost to live in dc. We are used to a pretty nice life. Ie: not strapped for cash but also not having the biggest house or nicest car.
i'm new to the area and very naiive about the cola here. we're in fairfax city with three kids, and i'm actually hoping we can live on less than this so that we're still able to save. gosh, this is amazing though --- to be surrounded by folks who make so much money! my family lived on pennies compared to what i'm surrounded by these days. i really want to get back to a relatively simple lifestyle ... maybe i'm in the wrong part of the u.s. for that
Well, if it makes you feel any better, we will be living on less than $90k. The COL is insane. I think we are going to have to rethink this move. =.
I don't know, I think 90k would be OK if you don't have to pay daycare. We need a little more info to help you. I don't know if you need to reconsider your entire move, but just make a budget and run the numbers. Then tell us how much you'd have for rent and we can suggest neighborhoods.
There are so many ways you can keep costs down, for example, renting near a metro station is really expensive. Renting a 10-15 minute drive from a metro station may be more in your budget. If you have one car, you may plan on driving your DH to the station in the mornings, or have him take a bus. (This is what my SIL does - everyone seemingly has two cars in this area, but my brother and SIL do fine with just one - and they have plenty o' $$ - they just don't see why two cars are needed).
Vienna and Bethesda are pretty far outside the city - in what town/neighborhood is your DH's job? That could make a difference in commuting costs. Also there are some really $$ neighborhoods in those areas, we could suggest other areas maybe.
Can you share a little more info so we can help?
I agree with this completely. There are plenty of people, with families, who live in the area making less then six figures. In fact, in the recent past I believe "they" (whoever they is...) stated the median income in Montgomery County is around $90K (I think it was like 87 or something...). The fact that you wont be paying for childcare will save you a lot of money. If you can find reasonable housing that will be your key to success. As Wines pointed out, it won't be in Bethesda. The odds of you finding reasonable rent, for what you're looking for, is small. There are other areas that have metro access where you could rent for much less then Bethesda (I too know nothing of NOVA). You probably want to take into account gas prices and food as well.
Saying that you're used to a "comfortable" lifestyle isn't all that helpful for me to estimate whether your quality of life would be the same here. Are you used to taking international trips each year? Getting the latest fashions? Clipping coupons? Shopping sales racks? Going out to eat lots/getting takeout several times/week?
I think it's great that you're thinking about this before the move, but it can be a bit of a sticker shock. I'm originally from FL and about died when I came up here. But, IMO, it's worth every penny especially if you have older kids. Having such amazing, free activities (museums, zoos, gardens, etc.) is such an great perk. (well, i suppose we are ultimately paying for it) We just started taking my 1.5 year old downtown to the different Smithsonians & he loves them.
So, let's breakdown the monthly basics. These are probably conservative estimates (like, the groceries could maybe be cheaper.) & will be of things I believe are location-specific. You can look at your spending over the past year or so to add in things like clothing amounts, car payment, SL payments, gift spending, vacation spending, savings, hair cuts, going out to eat, etc.
-Rental home in Bethesda $3000
-Food $600 (FWIW, we spend about $400/mon on groceries alone for 2 adults, 1 toddler mostly shopping at WF. But I also garden so lots of veggies come from there)
-Commuting $200
-preschool $500 (i'm actually not positive this is a realistic number, so someone with an older kid correct me!!!)
-utilities $200
-cell phones w data plan $100
-cable/internet/phone $130
-car insurance $100
-gas $100 (this is assuming not much driving, obviously. About 2 tankfuls/month)
These very basics add up to 59,160. Again, this isn't really adding any other spending besides food, shelter & minimal entertainment and without any bills that are unknown to me (CC, SL, car payment, etc.) It's also spending AFTER taxes, retirement & healthcare so keep that in mind too.
are you planning to go back to work when the kids go to school? if so, you could live farther out in the suburbs and then move to your desirable area when you work. I think you can live on $90k but not in Bethesda and not in Vienna, at least not "comfortably."
Where do you live now?
I lived on a lot less than $90k but I don't tend to spend a lot, I only shop for necessities, don't eat out much, I am not a spender. (I save $$ for vacations, though). I also didn't have kids and daycare expenses.
Good luck with your decision!
Just FYI, out in the suburbs, we pay $1140/mo for full-time pre-school. This does not include lunch.
ETA: averages for Bethesda: https://www.city-data.com/city/Bethesda-Maryland.html
and Vienna: https://www.city-data.com/city/Vienna-Virginia.html
I know a family of 4 that lives on $65K per year, no daycare. They don't have many bills, their mortgage is pretty cheap (around $1700-1800), and the kids are not in pre-school. They take minimal vacations, make a lot of food from scratch, and don't eat out a lot. It's very tight, but they make it work.
We're in the $175'ish range (give or take $10K). If we didn't have all of the bills we have, we'd be more than comfortable - but, the bills add up - $3K mortgage, $1K student loans (approx), $500/mo credit cards, $300/mo car payment, $1300/mo daycare, etc., etc. Currently, we're comfortable - we go out to eat when we want, can walk to the metro, we go on one "big" vacation per year, an occasional weekend trip, etc., but are not really saving aggressively.
ETA: I think it will be difficult to do Bethesda on your income, but ditto PP about looking into other areas... because, if you don't have many bills, I think it's totally do-able.
I think you could live on 90k but your housing want and/or areas are going to have to change. I own a 2 bed/1 bath condo in Bethesda and rent it out for 2k a month. Also, have you used one of those cola calculators to see what your current city and salary would be here?
Where is your husband working? Everyone is super helpful on this board and can definitely give you info on other areas.
I agree, you can manage 90K but you won't be able to do it in Bethesda and it really depends on your other debt and what you consider comfortable. I live not far from there in MoCo (downtown Bethesda is about a 10 minute drive in off hours) and am a SAHM. We live what I think is comfortably on about the figure ch ch chia gave (160ish).
However, we have no debt other than our mortgage, and we're not paying for daycare or preschool. We live in a very small house and we're pretty frugal by nature but we didn't have to trim any fat from our budget in order for me to be a SAHM.
If you are open to looking in other areas, in Virginia you could check out Springfield, Burke, Annnandale, Falls Church.... in MoCo, parts of Rockville, Silver Spring, Wheaton and not be too far from metro stations, major highways and get more bang for your buck.
I would say for the areas you are looking at, with close proximity to the metro, and a feeling of living "comfortably" you would want to be at least in the $150-200k range. That said, living in the DC are on less than that is completely doable, but you will need to readjust expectations and consider areas other than Bethesda/Vienna.
For example, if you are planning on public school, then many of the good/best schools are either in 1. very expensive neighborhoods or 2. neighborhoods farther away from the metro. Private school will run you between $10-30k depending on the school.
We make between $90-115k/year, and live comfortably in a nicer, close-in community in Prince Georges County within walking distance to the metro. We own our (small!) home, two cars, and invest generously in our retirement. That said, while our immediate community is very nice and safe, Prince Georges County as a whole is not nearly as nice as Montgomery or some of the VA suburbs, and we have chosen to send our daughter to a private elementary school. So, for us the trade off of being close to the metro/downtown and being able to afford our own home was worth living in an area with a less great reputation/school system (though our community is great!). But we did need to choose.
So, I guess what I'm trying to say is that living the life you want in DC is totally possible on 90k a year, but know that there will be steep trade-offs in terms of either the location you choose, school quality, ease of commute, size of the home (apartment vs house), or ability to afford "nicer" things/experiences. Decide what is important to you and then go from there.
DC is a great place to live, and we LOVE raising our family here. Do lots of research, keep asking questions, and try not to be too discouraged.
I don't think 90K is realistic in Bethesda or Vienna. However, there are other options. If you are willing to live on the east side of the city you can probably find housing that works, but you will also find higher crime rates and worse schools. If metro is important, I would suggest you look at the MARC and VRE train systems. You can live further out with a reduced cost of living and still get into the city. Also, the metro is heading out towards Dulles (being built now, estimated 2015 completion - I think), but that is some years off and I'm not sure what you would do in the near term.
If possible I would suggest Virginia over Maryland due to the lower taxes. Not sure where your DH is going to work but it sounds like you are focusing on the west side of the region.
Finally, regardless of what you choose, you should be looking for an apartment or town home. A single family home in the region is over priced and with the coming cuts to federal government there should be a drop in home values over the next few years.
I think the City of Fairfax is a great place for that because the public schools are great, city property taxes are lower than surrounding areas, Fairfax has lots of small homes on big lots that allow for gardening, economic diversity (which means not all kids live in McMansions and get cars for their 16th bdays). At least that is why we picked to buy a small home there.
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